Celebrate Religion here
Quote: S2dbakerMay you be touched by His noodly appendage.
I rather hope you are both touched by an angel.
Quote: FrGambleI rather hope you are both touched by an angel.
Unfortunately, for young boys, the odds are better that they will be touched by a priest.
Quote: WongBoUnfortunately, for young boys, the odds are better that they will be touched by a priest.
Do the clergy make prop bets on that kind
of thing? I mean, touched by an angel is kinda
out there, in a Twilight Zone sorta way..
Quote: FrGambleHappy Feast of St. Francis of Assisi! Finally a saint who we can all agree is awesome!
I don't think so. For one thing I've heard of this person, but I've no idea who he was or what he did.
There is one "religious" person I admire, and that is Thomas Aquinas.
Quote: FrGambleHappy Feast of St. Francis of Assisi! Finally a saint who we can all agree is awesome!
I thought Jesus was pretty cool.
Well, at least until he let it all go to his head.
Quote: EvenBobOh horse pucky. Its a well known fact that if a
person decides there is a god, and doesn't join
some cult religion like Christianity or Mormonism,
there's a 90% chance he'll go back to his old ways.
He needs the constant input of people who believe
like he does or it just won't stick. Its not god
working, its people working.
Actually I think it is quite the opposite. I imagine an atheist has to constantly fight against natural inclinations coming from somewhere deep inside him/her that there is more to life than meets the eye. That beauty and life have more to say to us than infinitie random possibilites coming together, as exciting as that might be for some people. I reckon that when an atheist encounters death or suffering they wish they had some type of idea, belief, or philosophy that gave them real and lasting hope and peace. No I think you atheists better stick together because left alone the crazy idea that there is purpose and meaning all around us keeps sneaking back in.
Quote: FrGambleI think you atheists better stick together because left alone the crazy idea that there is purpose and meaning all around us keeps sneaking back in.
We're not sticking together now, why should we start.
Its real simple, padre. God is important to you because
you choose it to be. The Church is important to you
because you choose it to be important. There is nothing
outside of you compelling you into action, the action comes
from inside you.
I was a member of a young church group when in my early
20's. I thought it was changing my life because I was always
bombarded by the fellow believers around me. I felt cozy
and cared about and god was great. After a few months I
started seeing the cracks in the foundation. The more I got
to know these people, the more I saw how messed up they
were. They were born followers, unable to think for themselves.
Because I'm not that way, in just a few weeks some of them were
already gravitating towards me, asking for advice, asking for
scriptual meaning. I went hey, I'm new here, I don't know crap.
I backed away and got out, and ever since then I always look
for a long time before I jump into anything.
Quote: FrGambleHowever I have to say that just like the first debate Romney won this event too.
Romney was very relaxed and his timing was
impeccable. Obama was much funnier in 2008.
He seemed strained tonight, detached. Like he
wasn't even trying. What I'm amazed at is how
likable Romney is, not at all like Obama tried
to paint him. He smiles with his eyes, something
Obama almost never does.
George Burns
(EvenBob, this is the the thread where you sneer at GOD,
not one of the multitude where you sneer at Obama.)
So it's clear: god hates football.
singing and praying to some of them.
How do these long dead people, some from the 1600's,
know they are now saints? Is there a saint waiting room
in heaven? There are over 10,000 saints. Overkill anyone?
Saint Kateri Tekawitha...pray for us!
The deification of other extremely religious and fanatic believers,
The manipulation of the religious beliefs of conquered people,
The self perpetuating stories that offer so little evidence of anything,
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
Quote: WongBoI find this to be one of the most deeply disturbing aspects of any religion.
Its a way of rewarding parts of your flock for
any reason you like. Its like giving an award,
it makes the ignorant masses happy. Thats
why there are so many saints, the masses
have to be constantly placated. There are
priests in the Vatican who's only job is to
comb the records fro possible saints. Its a
very political process, like everything else
in the Church.
Quote: EvenBobHow do these long dead people, some from the 1600's,
know they are now saints? Is there a saint waiting room
in heaven? There are over 10,000 saints. Overkill anyone?
According to Catholic dogma, not all saints are canon saints, nor will the majority ever be. You're a saint the moment your tribulation's through, as long as you're saved; we here on Earth just weren't sure. The only difference from their alleged perspective is that they're now being explicitly asked to intercede, and their intercessions officially recognized.
Quote: 24BingoAccording to Catholic dogma, not all saints are canon saints, nor will the majority ever be. You're a saint the moment your tribulation's through, as long as you're saved; we here on Earth just weren't sure. The only difference from their alleged perspective is that they're now being explicitly asked to intercede, and their intercessions officially recognized.
Jeez, its worse than the army. Imagine how many
hundreds of years it took them to perfect this
nonsense. Its all politics.
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Quote: FrGambleHey everybody I just wanted to say I recently returned from an amazing mission trip to Vietnam where my parish established a sister parish relationship with a Catholic community of minority peoples in the central highlands of Vietnam.
The fact that such a relationship is possible is a good sign. There was a good chance the government would persecute them, as they were enlisted to help fight the war against the north. Thanks for the update and good luck!
Quote: FrGamblein the central highlands of Vietnam.
Cool, Father. Did you get into Pleiku, An Khe, diddy over to the Chu Pong Massif?
Extortionists extending tentacles into foreign lands? I would think the return on the investment is so little? Well atleast you can now arrange junkets with your sister parish. And visit the booming casinos in Vietnam and Cambodia. Churches must be strong in the Orient because many people already believe in an afterlife so running a protection racket for them won't be all that difficult.
Quote: chickenmanCool, Father. Did you get into Pleiku, An Khe, diddy over to the Chu Pong Massif?
Yeah I did get to Pleiku and spent most of our time in Kontum and the areas around it.
Quote:A religious group believes it has an idea that could "complement and contrast" the Ten Commandments monument located on Oklahoma state Capitol grounds: a 7-foot-tall statue of Satan, depicted as a Baphomet -- a goat-headed figure with wings and horns -- sitting on a pentagram-adorned throne with smiling children at its side.
http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-satanic-monument-oklahoma-20140107,0,4198928.story#ixzz2prtWiiVW
There will be a statue of L. Ron Hubbard? People who worship SpongeBob. Who knows?
Oh, ye of little faith! Our Minions Are Just Starting To Take OverQuote: rxwineThere will be a statue of L. Ron Hubbard? People who worship SpongeBob. Who knows?
"The open, obvious, democratic thing is to believe an old apple-woman when she bears testimony to a miracle, just as you believe an old apple-woman when she bears testimony to a murder. The plain, popular course is to trust the peasant’s word about the ghost exactly as far as you trust the peasant’s word about the landlord. Being a peasant he will probably have a great deal of healthy agnosticism about both. Still you could fill the British Museum with evidence uttered by the peasant, and given in favour of the ghost. If it comes to human testimony there is a choking cataract of human testimony in favour of the supernatural. If you reject it, you can only mean one of two things. You reject the peasant’s story about the ghost either because the man is a peasant or because the story is a ghost story. That is, you either deny the main principle of democracy, or you affirm the main principle of materialism—the abstract impossibility of miracle. You have a perfect right to do so; but in that case you are the dogmatist. It is we Christians who accept all actual evidence—it is you rationalists who refuse actual evidence being constrained to do so by your creed. But I am not constrained by any creed in the matter, and looking impartially into certain miracles of mediaeval and modern times, I have come to the conclusion that they occurred. All argument against these plain facts is always argument in a circle. If I say, “Mediaeval documents attest certain miracles as much as they attest certain battles,” they answer, “But mediaevals were superstitious”; if I want to know in what they were superstitious, the only ultimate answer is that they believed in the miracles. If I say “a peasant saw a ghost,” I am told, “But peasants are so credulous.” If I ask, “Why credulous?” the only answer is—that they see ghosts. Iceland is impossible because only stupid sailors have seen it; and the sailors are only stupid because they say they have seen Iceland."
Quote: FrGambleI like this quote for G.K. Chesterson:
"The open, obvious, democratic thing is to believe an old apple-woman when she bears testimony to a miracle, just as you believe an old apple-woman when she bears testimony to a murder. The plain, popular course is to trust the peasant’s word about the ghost exactly as far as you trust the peasant’s word about the landlord. Being a peasant he will probably have a great deal of healthy agnosticism about both. Still you could fill the British Museum with evidence uttered by the peasant, and given in favour of the ghost. If it comes to human testimony there is a choking cataract of human testimony in favour of the supernatural. If you reject it, you can only mean one of two things. You reject the peasant’s story about the ghost either because the man is a peasant or because the story is a ghost story. That is, you either deny the main principle of democracy, or you affirm the main principle of materialism—the abstract impossibility of miracle. You have a perfect right to do so; but in that case you are the dogmatist. It is we Christians who accept all actual evidence—it is you rationalists who refuse actual evidence being constrained to do so by your creed. But I am not constrained by any creed in the matter, and looking impartially into certain miracles of mediaeval and modern times, I have come to the conclusion that they occurred. All argument against these plain facts is always argument in a circle. If I say, “Mediaeval documents attest certain miracles as much as they attest certain battles,” they answer, “But mediaevals were superstitious”; if I want to know in what they were superstitious, the only ultimate answer is that they believed in the miracles. If I say “a peasant saw a ghost,” I am told, “But peasants are so credulous.” If I ask, “Why credulous?” the only answer is—that they see ghosts. Iceland is impossible because only stupid sailors have seen it; and the sailors are only stupid because they say they have seen Iceland."
FrG, I wish you'd stop in more often. I don't always agree with you, but you're always worth a read, even if it's a quotation.
"Eventually, his father had to go to hospital. That’s where it happened.
‘It sounds like…’ Kravitz begins, and then says, ‘It’s going to sound like whatever it sounds like, but this is what it was. I mean, spiritually hospitals are very intense places. It’s like death’s doorstep. And he was in his bed one night and he looked at me, and he wasn’t on drugs, and he said to me, “There are these things flying around my bed, and these things crawling on the floor.” I said, “What are you talking about?” This is from my dad. He doesn’t do with any kind of spiritual thing. No heebie-jeebie kind of thing. And he’s, “There’s black-winged things and they’re flying around my bed… the things that are crawling on the ground, they look like they’re rats and they’re not… I see them.” I didn’t quite know how to take it. And he then began having this revelation and he accepted Christ – this is a non-religious Jewish man – and somehow the spirit world opened up to him. Almost like he had spiritually been bound his whole life and now this thing was released.’
After this spiritual experience, his father started answering some of the questions Kravitz would never get answers for. When Kravitz asked him before, “Why did you do what you did? Why did you do this to Mom?”, his father would stonewall. ‘That’s just the way it is,’ he would say. But a couple of nights after the experience, sitting in hospital with Lenny and his two half-sisters, Sy started talking. ‘He apologised to us in the most sincere, heartfelt manner. “I am sorry for what I’ve done, how I’ve been, how I’ve treated you, and I love you.” Real. And it was shocking… And what he said to me is that he always wanted to change his life, and he felt there was this thing on his back and he couldn’t get it off. His whole life, he knew inside himself that he wanted to change. But, he said, “I couldn’t.”?’
There would be one further unexpected moment: ‘As he got closer to his death, another night in the hospital, he was really tired and he looked over at me and he goes, “There’s angels all around the room. Because of Jesus.” And that was it. He turned and looked away. If you knew my dad – it was the furthest thing from him.’"
Which Jesus though? Was it Catholic Jesus or Episcopal Jesus or Born Again Jesus or Republican Jesus or Hippy Jesus? Which Jesus did he say it was? If I am to believe a super credible eye witness like Lenny Kravitz's dying dad then he should have told us which Jesus is the correct Jesus!Quote: FrGambleThere would be one further unexpected moment: ‘As he got closer to his death, another night in the hospital, he was really tired and he looked over at me and he goes, “There’s angels all around the room. Because of Jesus.” And that was it. He turned and looked away. If you knew my dad – it was the furthest thing from him.’"
The non-believers are wrong because they're blinded by their beliefs.
Quote: FrGambleAnd he was in his bed one night and he looked at me, and he wasn’t on drugs, [..]
You see, this is such an incompelte picture one cannot take it seriously. What was the man's age, what was he dying of, what was his physical condition, what was his mental condition?
I've never been on drugs, but I've had hallucinations from high fever and once or twice from fatigue. And each time I recall feeling perfectly rational about them (of course I wasn't, but that's how it feels). So any "visions" by a dying man in a hospital are of absolutely no value.
Besides, my upbringing would signal conversion to something as patently false as Christianity to be a grave betrayal of God, not to mention tradition and family.
Talk about a credible witness; here is all of Christianity around the world testifying to same Lord Jesus Christ who is the way, the truth, and the life.
Quote: gpac1377Thread summary:
The non-believers are wrong because they're blinded by their beliefs.
Either that or blinded by the devil.
Well, I don't know if that is actually the case, but there does seem to be something that blinds some non-believers from realizing the truth. Some of these truths are quite obvious, like the existence of God, aka Higher Power, Prime mover, uncaused cause, etc. Then there is the truth about Jesus Christ that does need revelation, prayer, and faith to discover. However, negative comments or immature ones like "Christianity is blatantly false" shows a real blindness to the facts and an unwillingness to actually discover or talk about them.
Quote: FrGambleThere is only one Jesus and it is one of the wonderful things that all Christians believe whether you are Catholic, Episcopal, Fundamentalist or a Christian Hippie. Jesus is the incarnate Son of God who came to save humanity by sacrificing His life for the forgiveness of sins and salvation of all.
Talk about a credible witness; here is all of Christianity around the world testifying to same Lord Jesus Christ who is the way, the truth, and the life.
Interesting, so you worship this Jesus or some other Jesus?
Quote: FrGambleTalk about a credible witness; here is all of Christianity around the world testifying to same Lord Jesus Christ who is the way, the truth, and the life.
I caution you I'm at work fixing someone else's mess and in a really foul mood, so please don't take this personally:
If you went back to, say, the year 60 BC, you'd get as much testimony for such gods as Jupiter, Athena, Baal, Ra and countless others. And you'd probably find such beliefs hilarious and pathetic. So what is such belief worth as evidence?
Quote: FrGambleHowever, negative comments or immature ones like "Christianity is blatantly false" shows a real blindness to the facts and an unwillingness to actually discover or talk about them.
Immature? for starters I said "patently" not "blatantly."
But to continue, if you read the Hebrew prophecies about the Messiah you'll realize none of that came true either before, after or during the time of Jesus. Ergo the Messiah has not come. Ergo Christianity is patently false, according to the Jewish scriptures. BTW, any number of devout, semi-devout, and even non-practicing Jews will testify to the effect that God is one, and that belief in God being three, or there being three gods, or God being some kind of three-in-one entity is just wrong.
Quote: FrGambleJesus Christ who is the way, the truth, and the life.
The Church should get that TM'd, it identifies
their brand.
My dad's sister was dying of a terminal decease in the 1940's. She was cared for by my Grandparents in their house. One day she asked if anyone else saw the angel standing in the corner ? She dies that evening.
No, I don't believe in angels.
My daughters are named SUSANN, MARYJO ANN, & MELANIE ANN.
