Having to tip dealers is ridiculous

Quote: Nareed

I'd like to see stiffs go into a store and say "I refuse to pay for your staff's salaries. I want a discount equivalent to labor costs."

You wouldn't have to go far to see that Nareed. Every Fortune 500 company has exactly this policy when dealing with vendors. They demand arbitrary percentages of cost cutting every year even though the cost of everything RISES for everyone else. Are you going to tell Wal Mart you don't want their mega volume business? Heck no, as a vendor, you suck it up until you have less than a 1% margin just for the privilege of servicing them. Again, proof positive there is no such thing as entitlement in the real world.

Quote: WongBo

your post was totally irrelevant.
i'm moving on. this is silly.
like you said, we will just agree to disagree.

Totally irrelevant? I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that too. I thought it was spot on relevant because I took most of what you originally said and gave it right back to you. Seems you don't like the taste any better than anyone else does. What a surprise.

Oh cool, you edited your post (who didn't see that coming?).

Quote: WongBo

i had not gone to any lengths, but will now...
i can't resist:

That's ridiculous. To do anything (which you did), is to go to some lengths.

Quote: WongBo

"dude is an address term that is used mostly by young men to address other young men;
however, its use has expanded so that it is now used as a general address term for a group (same or mixed gender),
and by and to women."...
Published in American Speech, Vol. 79, No. 3, Fall 2004, pp. 281-305.
A PDF version of the paper (copyright 2004 American Dialect Society) is available here.

If nothing else the quality of your research has risen, so I consider that a success.

Edit: Oops, I just realized you picked this link up from the Wikipedia article. I guess we still have some work to do.

Quote: WongBo

i consider this issue closed, if you want to return the discussion to tipping

I can certainly understand why you'd choose that position. And let's be clear, it was you that took us on this tangent when you cried Racism and pointed a finger at Nick.

you quoted my unedited post.
if you go back you can see my citation.

american dialect society vs. "the maven"
yeah you really gave it back to me.
FAIL

Quote: WongBo

yeah you really gave it back to me.

There's another reason you're backing away as quickly as possible?

I'm pretty sure anyone bored enough to read all of this crap knows where the FAIL lies.

I'm confident enough that I don't have to declare victory, I'll just stand by what I said.

Quote: WongBo

your post was totally irrelevant.
like you said, we will just agree to disagree.
i had not gone to any lengths, but will now...
i can't resist:

"dude is an address term that is used mostly by young men to address other young men;
however, its use has expanded so that it is now used as a general address term for a group (same or mixed gender),
and by and to women."...
Published in American Speech, Vol. 79, No. 3, Fall 2004, pp. 281-305.
A PDF version of the paper (copyright 2004 American Dialect Society) is available here.


i consider this issue closed, if you want to return the discussion to tipping

My wife and I dine out frequently and are routinely addressed as "guys". It seems to be more prevalent with blonde waitresses whose names end with the letter i.

Quote: MonkeyMonkey

There's another reason you're backing away as quickly as possible?

I'm pretty sure anyone bored enough to read all of this crap knows where the FAIL lies.

I'm confident enough that I don't have to declare victory, I'll just stand by what I said.

lol, typical. you and the maven are a couple of funny dudes.
i think the american dialect society know a little more about it than either you or i.
i defer to their conclusion.
unisex.
case closed.

Quote: WongBo

lol, typical. you and the maven are a couple of funny dudes.
i think the american dialect society know a little more about it than either you or i.
i defer to their conclusion.
unisex.
case closed.

So, after having brought to your attention the potential offensive nature of your statement, you've not only failed to apologize but you continue to make excuses for why it's ok, and you did it again.

Perhaps you should review some of the statements you made in the "What does a gal have to do to get a glass of dihydrogen monoxide around here?" thread regarding sensitivity.

I'm glad no one bet me, I would have put up a sizable amount that we would have by now had Godwin's Law kick in on this thread

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

you never made it clear it was offensive to you, and IF it TRULY was then i am sorry.

So let's recap:

Tipping dealers is ridiculous because they are air-headed, childish, racist, hucksters with a bloated sense of entitlement.

Granted I know few dealers, but you'd think one of them would come withing a billion light-years of the stereotype defined by this thread. I must conclude Dan and Nick and Croupier and MonkeyMonkey and others deserve to have the Nobel Prize foundation grant them all a new Noble Prize for Acting.

Either that, or the prejudices come to light on this thread are wrong.

But that would be ridiculous.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to see a doctor about a tongue impacted in my cheek.

Quote: RonC

... One white guy, one African American, and five or so Asians.

Don't you mean "One European American, one African American, and five Asians"?

Quote: RonC

... only the African American and White were tipping, the Asians were not. ...

What part of Africa were they from? If you can't bring yourself to say "black guy", but you are able to say "white guy", you're probably racist yourself.

Here's a fascinating site by waiters and for waiters on who they think the worst tippers are.

Waiter Rant

Quote: zippyboy

Don't you mean "One European American, one African American, and five Asians"?

What part of Africa were they from? If you can't bring yourself to say "black guy", but you are able to say "white guy", you're probably racist yourself.

I'm so sorry if using the term "African American" as opposed to "black" offended you in any way and I am equally annoyed that using that term somehow gave you the idea that you should cast me as "probably racist." I consider that a personal insult. Without a shred of evidence other than the use of a term used every single day to describe black people and another term used every day to describe white people, you have cast me as "probably racist"...

Did I encourage someone to treat people of different races differently?
Did I claim superiority over other races?
Did I show hatred towards another race?

Some of you have an overly broad imagination of what racism really is. Racism isn't talking about differences and similarities between groups of people. Looking for a white suspect when a white person committed the crime is not racism. Not liking the President is not racist unless the person that doesn't like him does not like him simply because he is black. Climb down from that high horse and stop trying to make "racism" the cause of everything.

Talking about the tipping habits of different cultures is not racist...it is an observation...and, if the sample size is too small (as I alluded to in my case) it could even be the wrong observation. It could also be an observation detrimental to a dealer's employment if they make it here and someone figures out who they are. It isn't racist.

methinks thou doth protest too much.

He's black, I'm white, so what. I'm not racist. I just wonder why you're comfortable saying "white guy" but not "black guy". Go ahead...say it. black guy

Reminds me of a few years ago in the wintertime, the weather man says "Look out for black ice on the roads tonight", and my girlfriend had just come into the room and asked "Why do I have to watch for black guys on the road?"

And now back to the topic of tipping dealers.....

Quote: zippyboy

methinks thou doth protest too much.

He's black, I'm white, so what. I'm not racist. I just wonder why you're comfortable saying "white guy" but not "black guy". Go ahead...say it. black guy

Reminds me of a few years ago in the wintertime, the weather man says "Look out for black ice on the roads tonight", and my girlfriend had just come into the room and asked "Why do I have to watch for black guys on the road?"

And now back to the topic of tipping dealers.....

Like I said, you don't know me. I use both "black" and "African American" and I don't see how anyone could imply from my use of one or the other today that I might somehow be racist. I didn't protest "too much"--I just asked why you would think that of me without any real demonstrated reason to do so.

You were wrong to make that comment. Whatever.

Quote: RonC

Why is that any time race is mentioned, it is suddenly racist? If Nick is being honest in his observations (and I am assuming that), how is it racist to name the groups of people that tip the best and worst (as a group)? Interestingly enough, I have seen similar information elsewhere regarding tipping...there are some African American servers who don't like getting African American customers because, as a rule, their experience is they get less tips... That also goes for folks from backgrounds where tips are not customary...

This crap of calling any mention of differences between groups of people "racist" is totally out of hand. The TV folks won't say a suspect is ____________ because someone calls it racist.

Racism would be a dealer or casino treating a group of people badly because of their race. Racism isn't observing that certain groups of people tend to tip less.

Exactly - everything in this country has turned into political correctness to the point of not being able to accurately describe a situation in the news, print or in casual conversation without looking over one's shoulder to determine if one's use of "white, black, hispanic, gay, straight" etc etc etc will offend someone or be deemed racist - it is not racist if there is an accurate description of the facts!

Quote: RonC

I'm so sorry if using the term "African American" as opposed to "black" offended you in any way and I am equally annoyed that using that term somehow gave you the idea that you should cast me as "probably racist." I consider that a personal insult. Without a shred of evidence other than the use of a term used every single day to describe black people and another term used every day to describe white people, you have cast me as "probably racist"...

Did I encourage someone to treat people of different races differently?
Did I claim superiority over other races?
Did I show hatred towards another race?

Some of you have an overly broad imagination of what racism really is. Racism isn't talking about differences and similarities between groups of people. Looking for a white suspect when a white person committed the crime is not racism. Not liking the President is not racist unless the person that doesn't like him does not like him simply because he is black. Climb down from that high horse and stop trying to make "racism" the cause of everything.

Talking about the tipping habits of different cultures is not racist...it is an observation...and, if the sample size is too small (as I alluded to in my case) it could even be the wrong observation. It could also be an observation detrimental to a dealer's employment if they make it here and someone figures out who they are. It isn't racist.

EXCELLENT!
I remember a few years ago at a blackjack table a black dealer called the pitboss over to take someone's card and the pitboss asked, "Which gentleman"" and the dealer stated "The African American guy right there" - at this point, the "African AMERICAN" guy stated 'I am from England, I am not AMERICAN in any sense of the word, nor am I African, I am English, thank you"
I love how we have become so obsessed to not wanting to be racist that we do not even realize there are blacks outside of our own country

A good example is our president. He is 1/2 African, 1/2 American, yet not African-American...

Quote: 1BB

[in discussing Nick's quote and observations on tipping table games]
I'm going to say it again. I hope your boss doesn't see this. You asked why before so I'll explain. By boss, I was not referring to your buddy in the pit but to the CEO or casino owner.

You are identified on this site by name,casino,job description and shift. You may not be representing the casino when you post but you will certainly be associated with it.

You have told us that players who tip at the end of a session are not as appreciated as those who tip during play. You told us how much you enjoy taking some people's money. They will see that no matter how you try to hide it. You said ,"If you don't tip don't play." That's bizarre because you guys are the ones who said that only 10% of players tip. You're telling 90% of the players in your casino not to play because they don't tip you. Tip or no tip the casino still gets their money unless players take your advice and don't play. Now, in your very limited experience, you are categorizing people based on race and nationality.

I doubt that top casino executives read these forums but they have people who do and I can't imagine that they would appreciate your comments. To avoid driving yourself crazy over tipping, I suggest that you adopt the attitude of the more experienced dealer on this forum and for goodness sake don't say anything that would put you in a bad light with your bosses.

Some top casino execs do read this forum, more from game distributors than operators, I would assume.

I don't think this would be an issue with the boss or CEO if it were seen. And if seen, it would probably be agreed with quietly, as mere observation or point of view in a discussion that is not at all of an intentionally hostile nature, very similar to waiters discussing their patrons on a waiters' forum.
Nothing in Nick's posts was "anti-Industry," and nothing in his posts espoused anti-casino acts such as hole-carding, etc. - which is common on this board. In fact it can be pointed out that Nick is a fine supporter of the gaming industry who gave us observations on what dealers and floormen experience.
Unlike facebook, this is a subset gamblers' and workers' forum that is not at all a part of the wider general public media, and where a bit of open discussion and honest opinion and observation can hopefully be expressed while "refusing to be paranoid" about 100% adherence to manaical standards of political correctness. If a worker had specifically said "Casino 'X' sucks ass/is a ripoff," (business character assassination) or makes a claim of "We cheat customers - and this is how we do it," (impugning business integrity/legality), then yeah, that would look bad.

The simple fact of the matter is that pit personnel work directly with the general public just like waiters, etc., and expressing opinions and observations that many from the general public are rough, even horrible to deal with at times is not only a resonable observation, but arguably true as the factual downside to the service job.

Expressing the sentiment of "don't tip, don't play" is exactly what many dealers, cocktail waitresses, and all other service workers feel
at times, in the sense that we wish all players/customers would "carry their weight" when THEY are using the resources of the table games pit or the restuarant for their own recreation. Basically it is the sentiment of "pay your way, to include a fair tip, don't be a stiff." Certainly a waiter who rants about customers who stiffed him, on a specific "waiters' forum," can't be criticized if he didn't do it at work, and if he didn't slander or blame his employer for that behavior in any demonstrable way.

Indeed, if the CEO or big boss did read such things, he might have a renewed appreciation for what his front line service workers have to put up with on his behalf, especially if we vent in proper settings far "off the floor."

Quote: Paigowdan

Quote: 1BB

[in discussing Nick's quote and observations on tipping table games]
I'm going to say it again. I hope your boss doesn't see this. You asked why before so I'll explain. By boss, I was not referring to your buddy in the pit but to the CEO or casino owner.

You are identified on this site by name,casino,job description and shift. You may not be representing the casino when you post but you will certainly be associated with it.

You have told us that players who tip at the end of a session are not as appreciated as those who tip during play. You told us how much you enjoy taking some people's money. They will see that no matter how you try to hide it. You said ,"If you don't tip don't play." That's bizarre because you guys are the ones who said that only 10% of players tip. You're telling 90% of the players in your casino not to play because they don't tip you. Tip or no tip the casino still gets their money unless players take your advice and don't play. Now, in your very limited experience, you are categorizing people based on race and nationality.

I doubt that top casino executives read these forums but they have people who do and I can't imagine that they would appreciate your comments. To avoid driving yourself crazy over tipping, I suggest that you adopt the attitude of the more experienced dealer on this forum and for goodness sake don't say anything that would put you in a bad light with your bosses.

Some top casino execs do read this forum, more from game distributors than operators, I would assume.

I don't think this would be an issue with the boss or CEO if it were seen. And if seen, it would probably be agreed with quietly, as mere observation or point of view in a discussion that is not at all of an intentionally hostile nature, very similar to waiters discussing their patrons on a waiters' forum.
Nothing in Nick's posts was "anti-Industry," and nothing in his posts espoused anti-casino acts such as hole-carding, etc. - which is common on this board. In fact it can be pointed out that Nick is a fine supporter of the gaming industry who gave us observations on what dealers and floormen experience.
Unlike facebook, this is a subset gamblers' and workers' forum that is not at all a part of the wider general public media, and where a bit of open discussion and honest opinion and observation can hopefully be expressed while "refusing to be paranoid" about 100% adherence to manaical standards of political correctness. If a worker had specifically said "Casino 'X' sucks ass/is a ripoff," (business character assassination) or makes a claim of "We cheat customers - and this is how we do it," (impugning business integrity/legality), then yeah, that would look bad.

The simple fact of the matter is that pit personnel work directly with the general public just like waiters, etc., and expressing opinions and observations that many from the general public are rough, even horrible to deal with at times is not only a resonable observation, but arguably true as the factual downside to the service job.

Expressing the sentiment of "don't tip, don't play" is exactly what many dealers, cocktail waitresses, and all other service workers feel
at times, in the sense that we wish all players/customers would "carry their weight" when THEY are using the resources of the table games pit or the restuarant for their own recreation. Basically it is the sentiment of "pay your way, to include a fair tip, don't be a stiff." Certainly a waiter who rants about customers who stiffed him, on a specific "waiters' forum," can't be criticized if he didn't do it at work, and if he didn't slander or blame his employer for that behavior in any demonstrable way.

Indeed, if the CEO or big boss did read such things, he might have a renewed appreciation for what his front line service workers have to put up with on his behalf, especially if we vent in proper settings far "off the floor."

I'm glad to hear that because Nick seems like a fine young man.

Quote: SOOPOO

How about maids? I leave between 1$ and 2$ per day per night I stay in a hotel, but if by some chance I actually see the person taking care of my room I give them a few dollars on the spot, too. I know people who wouldn't think of leaving a tip, and others that think I'm too cheap.
How about the check in person at the desk? If they seem nicer than they have to be, I like leaving a dollar. I know it isn't much, but it has always been greeted witha thank you.
How about the bus driver from the airport to the rental center? If I have a bag he gets a buck, if he hands it to me.

OK guys, I need advice! My pool has lifeguards, who are very friendly, and apparently only get $10 per hour. I chat with them all, and they clearly make my pool time more fun. I have never tipped a lifeguard before, so what to do!? There are around 6 of them that take turns. I know 2 of them are full time teachers who make a good living during the year, and I believe the other 4 are just college kids doing it for a summer job. What would you do, Dan? Or Nick?

Seek out the top person in charge of the lifeguards and leave the gratuities with him or her.Do it a week or two before the pool closes and be sure to include a short note.Just tell them what you told us here.

Good advice.

Quote: FinsRule

A good example is our president. He is 1/2 African, 1/2 American, yet not African-American...

You forgot the third half: he's a half wit.

Quote: 4andaKicker

You forgot the third half: he's a half wit.

and that puts him exactly 0.5 wits higher than our 43rd president....
we don't know how many wits mittens has,
he won't release the password on his cayman islands account where he keep them.

Quote: 1BB

I'm glad to hear that because Nick seems like a fine young man.

They're all nice kids when they start out. Dealing is very
hard on people who do it for a career. Dealing with the
public, especially the drinking public, makes you hate
the job in a relatively short time.

For instance, the average burnout rate for a haidresser
is 7 years. Thats how long most of them can deal with
the public before they have to get out. And their clients
aren't drinking. Dealer burnout is around 5 years,
depending on who you listen to. Of course people stay
in professions like that for decades, but they end up
despising what they do, its not worth it.

Quote: EvenBob

They're all nice kids when they start out. Dealing is very
hard on people who do it for a career. Dealing with the
public, especially the drinking public, makes you hate
the job in a relatively short time.

For instance, the average burnout rate for a haidresser
is 7 years. Thats how long most of them can deal with
the public before they have to get out. And their clients
aren't drinking. Dealer burnout is around 5 years,
depending on who you listen to. Of course people stay
in professions like that for decades, but they end up
despising what they do, its not worth it.

Bob, you're funny, but you're also no expert. I doubt that many people here bounce career decisions by you. Maybe they do.

While I will say dealing with the general public has changed my view of the general public, (as people are very often out to get away with what they can get away with, especially gamblers at times), many dealers are not burnt out after 40 years, and some quit in three weeks. Same with waitressing, same with social work, same with being a cabbie. You deal with customers, you deal with customers. Not everyone can be a book editor at a University press, or a film editor in a dark room.

The general public does not change my view of my job, it changes my view of the general public, which is a different thing. There are for-hire mercenaries and CIA assassins who love their work for decades, and kindergarten teachers and nannies who burn out in weeks.
So has reading the newspaper every day, too, changed my view of the world for that matter, and yet that has not changed my view of my job, my family, etc. or have given me burn out.

The job is fine: it pays well enough, I have great benefits, and I work with some very fine people. If I got crap benefits and worked with some moronic and unfair people, well, then THAT would give me job burn-out, regardless of John Q. public.
Some saint who walks in off the street is a saint, and some clown who walks in off the street and acts like a clown...is simply that also.

When you pick your job, you pick your co-workers and bosses. The general public will always be the general public. If you're a fine young man, then you got a good shot at being a fine old man. If one is a little prick, he's got a shot at being an old prick down the road.

Quote: Paigowdan

The general public does not change my view of my job, it changes my view of the general public, which is a different thing.

Geez, Dan. Obviusly thats what I said! People in high stress jobs dealing
with the PUBLIC have high burn out rates. Casino dealers and hair stylists
are among the highest. Its not the JOB they come to hate, its dealing
with the PUBLIC they hate. Any job where you routinely deal with an
angry PUBLIC is a job that has a high turnover.

And does ever post directed at me from you have to include a personal insult? I
thought we were getting away from that here.

Quote: WongBo

he won't release the password on his cayman islands account where he keep them.

He has regularly filed all the required data involving that to the I.R.S., which has not found any problems.

Dan, here's an article on dealer burnout from theNY Times . Its about
AC, but all casinos are the same. Everytime a new casino opens here,
I see dealers I know from other casinos. They switch casinos because
they think they're burned out on the casino, but they're really burned
out on working with the public, and management who doesn't care.

Steve Wynn loves to tell complaining dealers that if they don't like
what he does, he has a 3ft high stack of applications on his desk
from people who want jobs as dealers. And he does.

Quote: EvenBob

Geez, Dan. Obviusly thats what I said!

No, you said they all burn out in 5 years, which is not true.

Quote: EvenBob

People in high stress jobs dealing
with the PUBLIC have high burn out rates.

True, the burn-out rate is higher than book editors, but it is more similar to being a waiter or bartender than to being a cop. It's often a RUDE job, but dealing really isn't prone to burn-out once you pass a "window of adjustment" in dealing with the landscape.

Quote: EvenBob

Casino dealers and hair stylists
are among the highest [in burn out].

I disagree. I think cops, high school teachers, CIA operatives, correction officers, social workers, and air traffic controllers get far more job burn out. I taught High School for a short period, and felt the teenage inner-city gangster was a HOPELESS endeavor. THAT job has burnout! A rude and tipsy gambler snapping his fingers in your face and saying crap about your mother when steaming the money or getting caught in a cheating scam is NOTHING in comparison to a 17-year old gang-banger with a bandana and a switchblade who is high on crack, and who is in NO mood to "solve for 'X'...." A high school teacher in East L.A. or Baltimore has it worse than a crap dealer at a jammed up gambling hall, for example.

And I can see that being a hairstylist or beautician being tough, in the sense of every single "princess customer" being demanding, snotty, and like our ex-wives on maximum PMS over anything less than perfect nail job or coif, ("you bitch, you f*cked up my NAILS!!!" [slap!]), but you gotta realize that being a beautician doesn't draw from the mercenary "guns-for-hire" or the "CSI: Special Victims Unit" crowd of candidates, it too draws from the princess squad of Heathers, the "I broke a nail, my life is over" kind of thing. Roscoe ain't working there handling the situation.

Quote: EvenBob

Its not the JOB they come to hate, its dealing
with the PUBLIC they hate. Any job where you routinely deal with an
angry PUBLIC is a job that has a high turnover.

Yes, but only in a "first window" sense of a short period. My wife went to dealers' school and tried dealing for a short period, as had many, and said, "yee-gads, this is NOT for me! The NERVE of these people" (the general public). For that matter, my wife will never make a good stylist, cabbie, waitress, or high school teacher, or cop. Thin-skinned people will burn out of any work that isn't hush-puppy easy, and thick-skinned people will never internalize the worst of John Q. Public.

If one is adjusted and acclimated to the work's terrain, it's experience is more of the "work's daily grind" kind of thing than that of "Life during Wartime." In dealing, you can deal with some very rude dirt bags as well as a few level-headed angels, but if you're familiar with the terrain and are not foolish enough to take the work-storms home with you, it isn't that burn-out prone.

Quote: EvenBob

And does ever post directed at me from you have to include a personal insult? I
thought we were getting away from that here.

Bob, you're fine with me, and I never called you any name. I did say that, as when it comes to casino pit career advice, you might not be the "go-to" guy for casino pit job/career detemination, for all your expertise on this board. Years of successfully living and working in the casino pit is what it's about, and it can be done without burn out. As for Steve Wynn telling any worker-griper that he has a three foot high stack of applicants, well it's true. EVERY shift managers tells a complaining worker, "If you don't like the job, take a hike, - why are you HERE, then??!!" - and I agree with that attitude. The pit is a busy place, and if you have a work issue, talk with human resources about solutions instead, no floorman wants to be bothered by any crybaby complaints while he's doing a fill on a jammed up game or counting down a table with a team of AP'sand gold action on it.

Quote: Paigowdan

for all your expertise on this board.

I've taken so many grains of salt from reading EBs expertise, doctor said I had to cut back. (rimshot)

Quote: rxwine

I've taken so many grains of salt from reading EBs expertise, doctor said I had to cut back. (rimshot)

I can relate. Blood pressure problems can come from too much salt intake.....

Quote: Paigowdan

I disagree. I think cops, high school teachers,
.

From the NYT:

"It is high-pressure work (Casino dealing), as stressful on a daily basis as being a big-city cop or an emergency room nurse"

If I'm full of crap as Dan implies, at least I'm in good
company. I'll say it again. Everytime I'm in a casino,
I say to myself why would anybody work here on
purpose. Its the same thing I said after having the
bar for 3 years.

Quote: Paigowdan

I can relate. Blood pressure problems can come from too much salt intake.....

Yet the NY Times agrees with me. Better fire off an
angry letter to them Dan and set them straight.

Quote: EvenBob

Everytime I'm in a casino,
I say to myself why would anybody work here on
purpose.

Because it is better than being unemployed? Not everyone can get the 'dream job' they would want. People ask why I would choose a field where I periodically have to be up all night.... because I am paid to do so?

Quote: EvenBob

Everytime I'm in a casino,
I say to myself why would anybody work here on
purpose.

For the most part I really enjoy dealing. Many of the players are very nice people and I like being in the environment of all the sounds and lights (contrary to what the article said).

The down side is the jerky players but I have a thing I do that diffuses about half of them and turns them into 'ok' customers to deal with. The other half... well, it's not always the easiest job, but that doesn't mean it isn't mostly enjoyable.

Quote: EvenBob

Yet the NY Times agrees with me. Better fire off an
angry letter to them Dan and set them straight.

Why should I? You think I give a flying xxxx over some old newspaper opinion piece?? If they or he [the NY Times writer] feels that being a dealer is like being a cop or an emergency room worker, then I feel that that is a bit of hyperbole and embellishment which was employed, really, and that's it. Sure, it's a very rude job at times with people fired up on booze lose their money, and they're yelling it's all your fault, - fire him! Sure, I had some bosses in the past that were absolute dicks. Sure, the 7PM to 3AM schedule can get to you. If I wanted to, I could draw up a list of horrors and injustices and cry myself a river, but to what avail?

The worst of the article was the vehemently rude steaming players, all drunk and losing; the crap player who pissed under the table because he didn't want to leave a hot roll, and the nit-picking bosses constantly complaining and threatening to fire you over every little detail and over every percieved slight and error. And the rough, off-hour work schedules. Substance abuse is high, and work stress is just an excuse.

I really have to admit, cops and ER workers see more tragedy and have more stress than this, and also make at least as much money for it. One can write a sensationalized story of the catfights in beauty parlors and the stresses entailed there, comparing it to being an air-traffic controller or what have you. We all have our work stresses, our war stories of work during wartime, and all that jazz. If you're familiar and comfortable with the terrain and can deal with the stresses of your job, fine. You can "manage." If you cannot, then consider taking the right steps, to get out into another line of work.

Everybody with a job or a career can wail about stresses, money problems, bossman problems, and being driven to drink and drugs, etc. People are complaining and maladjusted with jobs in nail salons.....forget about the gambling hall. There are people who can manage their lives, and people who cannot.

Retired policeman have this nasty habit of swallowing their 38's.

Some retired policemen have this nasty habit of playing golf on Tuesday afternoons for that matter, too. Know a few of these guys, too.
Like I said, some people have it together, and some don't.

Quote: Paigowdan

I really have to admit, cops and ER workers see more tragedy and have more stress than this,

The difference being, dealers are under constant stress
not to make mistakes, because everybody is watching
them. The pit, the customers, the eye. Who is watching
the cop while he sits under a viaduct eating a bag of
Dunkin Donuts. Dealers are on constant display for
all to see.

I especially feel sorry for the attractive
women dealers. Its one of the few jobs where a man
can sit there, right in front of you, for as long as he likes,
and flirt his ass off. I watch these sickening men in
their 50's try and make constant eye contact and
keep up an unending patter of things a teenage boy
wouldn't say. Where else do men have access to women
like this, I can't think of any other job where a woman
has to sit for hours sometimes and be harrassed by the same guy.

Quote: EvenBob

Where else do men have access to women like this

Germany? Amsterdam? Storey County?

Quote: P90

Germany? Amsterdam? Storey County?

I'm talking about in a business situation open to the
public. Sure there are bank tellers and waitresses and
cahsiers. But you only deal with them for a few minutes
at a time. Ever try to get an attractive woman to make
eye contact with you in a grocery store? Its nearly impossible.
Even women bartenders don't stand there and wait on just
you for an hour.

I had a friend once who was an airport cop, because I
was at the airport all the time picking up lost luggage
and delivering it. He had lots of stories of the lengths
some men will go to trying to get an attractive woman to
pay attention to them. Some of them were almost
arrestable. Thats why we have stalking laws now. But
you can still stalk a female dealer and there's nothing
she can do if the guy is playing when he does it. As long
as he doesn't get too carried away, that is.

Quote: EvenBob

. Ever try to get an attractive woman to make
eye contact with you in a grocery store?

Just be walking with an attractive women, and you catch all the other women in the store looking at you.

Quote: EvenBob

Ever try to get an attractive woman to make
eye contact with you in a grocery store?

When I'm in the grocery store, I always pick the line with the cutest checkout girl, no matter how many people are already in line.

The airport cop used to tell me the worst thing an attractive woman can
do is speak to a strange man without a good reason, even in an airport.
Thats all the encouragement some men need to make total asses out
of themselves and follow the woman around pestering her.

I'm glad I started reading this board. It's a pleasure to learn from a guy like Bob who already knows everything

Don't attractive females dealers rotate out every 20 mins? They sure seemed to when I was playing the tables. Kinda like my waitresses, here one minute, gone the next!

Quote: Beardgoat

I'm glad I started reading this board. It's a pleasure to learn from a guy like Bob who already knows everything

Now, I don't know 'everything'. It just seems that way. I
learn something new every blue moon.. Or so.

Quote: EvenBob

Now, I don't know 'everything'. It just seems that way. I
learn something new every blue moon.. Or so.

Good News Bob!!!! You have a golden opportunity in August as there will be a blue moon!

Lucky you! Can I come hang in Michigan with you towards the end of August ;-)

Quote: avargov

Good News Bob!!!! You have a golden opportunity in August as there will be a blue moon!

Seriously? Great news because I've been feeling really dumb
of late..