Nathan's Corner
Quote: ZenKinGLet me get this off my chest without making a thread. Im sick of this.
Basic strategy is not devised to ALWAYS ASSUME A 10. IF I HEAR ANOTHER PLAYER OR DEALER SAYING YOU GOTTA ASSUME A 10 IS UNDERNEATH, IM GOING TO LOSE MY MIND.
Basic strategy assumes A 'TOTAL OF 10', NOT A 10 VALUE CARD. JESUS.
END OF RANT
If you do not mind, I'd like to add the goal of the game is not to "get as close to 21 as possible without going over!" When I work the parties I hear it described to new players that way about half the time. Who on earth started that?
When you become wise, you don't show any reaction, agree with them without agreeing. Do not seek approval, seek victory.Quote: ZenKinGLet me get this off my chest without making a thread. Im sick of this.
Basic strategy is not devised to ALWAYS ASSUME A 10. IF I HEAR ANOTHER PLAYER OR DEALER SAYING YOU GOTTA ASSUME A 10 IS UNDERNEATH, IM GOING TO LOSE MY MIND.
Basic strategy assumes A 'TOTAL OF 10', NOT A 10 VALUE CARD. JESUS.
END OF RANT
When the dealer has a six or less showing, he has to take a third card. The preponderance of three card hands will have a ten in it, so saying to assume the down card is a ten is not a bad rule of thumb for amateurs.
When you become a dreaded threat to the casinos making almost five figures a year, you'll know better.
Quote: AxelWolfso is Victoria, she just sent me a PM.
You decide....
She must be blocking her sh*t.
???
#I'mgettingtrolled.
But Victoria hasn't been on WOV since December 26th! O.O Are you pulling our legs, Axel? ;)
Quote: billryanBasic strategy assumes a total of ten? Please explain that.
When the dealer has a six or less showing, he has to take a third card. The preponderance of three card hands will have a ten in it, so saying to assume the down card is a ten is not a bad rule of thumb for amateurs.
When you become a dreaded threat to the casinos making almost five figures a year, you'll know better.
Why would anyone assume a 10 is underneath when there are only FOUR ten value cards in a deck(10, J, Q, K)? Meanwhile you have NINE other different denominations in the same deck(A,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9). So all the players ASSUMING a ten value card is underneath is WRONG and this is why the EZ bust side bet is in my opinion one of the smartest side bets ever created by the casino.
Theres just a huge misconception about bust rates and always assuming a 10 and thinking a 2,3,4,5,6 are BUST CARDS. None of those upcards will ever bust more than a 43% rate with the dealer 5 being the players best chance at close to 43% with the dealer 6 slightly behind on a stand 17 game, but if its a soft 17 game, the 6 becomes the highest % to bust at roughly the same rate. Not to mention the average dealer bust rate is around 28% for a stand 17 game and i believe 29% for a soft 17 game. EVEN with a high true count of +5, the bust rates for a 5 or 6 only go to 46 to 47% or so for an upcard of 5 and 6.
The correct theoretical way to use and learn a basic strategy chart is to ASSUME a TOTAL COMBINATION of 10 such as a combination total of 6+4 or 2+8 or even a face card or ten card. So even though people have the right idea of assuming a 10, they're using it the wrong way with erroneous logic because all that logic does is create a false illusion about the game and leave you vulnerable to a side bet like EZ bust thinking the dealer will bust at a 50.01% rate or higher which is patently false.
Quote: NathanYour friend has a $2000 Food and Drink Comp for Gordon Ramsey's Hell Kitchen. He or she says,"I REALLY don't need to eat or drink$2,000 worth of food. But I can use $1,000. Do you want to use the other $1,000 as my Comped Guest?" You accept the offer. What would you eat at HK? :) I would eat Beef Wellington, Shrimp Cavinini or whatever it is called, ;)drink a glass of Merlot, have Chocolate Marquise with a side of vanilla ice cream with ganache as a topping . :) How about you? :)
Since I don't drink wine, and at max could down two expensive mixed drinks, even with the priciest appetizer and seafood entree I probably barely make it to $200. Probably take 50 deserts to go.....
Quote: ZenKinGWhy would anyone assume a 10 is underneath when there are only FOUR ten value cards in a deck(10, J, Q, K)? Meanwhile you have NINE other different denominations in the same deck(A,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9). So all the players ASSUMING a ten value card is underneath is WRONG and this is why the EZ bust side bet is in my opinion one of the smartest side bets ever created by the casino.
Theres just a huge misconception about bust rates and always assuming a 10 and thinking a 2,3,4,5,6 are BUST CARDS. None of those upcards will ever bust more than a 43% rate with the dealer 5 being the players best chance at close to 43% with the dealer 6 slightly behind on a stand 17 game, but if its a soft 17 game, the 6 becomes the highest % to bust at roughly the same rate. Not to mention the average dealer bust rate is around 28% for a stand 17 game and i believe 29% for a soft 17 game. EVEN with a high true count of +5, the bust rates for a 5 or 6 only go to 46 to 47% or so for an upcard of 5 and 6.
The correct theoretical way to use and learn a basic strategy chart is to ASSUME a TOTAL COMBINATION of 10 such as a combination total of 6+4 or 2+8 or even a face card or ten card. So even though people have the right idea of assuming a 10, they're using it the wrong way with erroneous logic because all that logic does is create a false illusion about the game and leave you vulnerable to a side bet like EZ bust thinking the dealer will bust at a 50.01% rate or higher which is patently false.
Don't quit your day job.
Quote: SOOPOOSince I don't drink wine, and at max could down two expensive mixed drinks, even with the priciest appetizer and seafood entree I probably barely make it to $200. Probably take 50 deserts to go.....
I don't really drink wine myself, but for a COMPED meal gifted to me , I'd drink Merlot as a wine drink. ;) Maybe in my scenario, I should have split the $2000 5 ways since as you pointed out an expensive meal at a very nice restaurant is more like $200 a person, not $1,000. ;)
Quote: NathanI have some Pharaoh's Fortune Slot machine Symbols questions. The Symbols relate to Ancient Egypt, but I am confused by certain Symbols. The blue Dog is Anubis, right?!The Dog sitting on the Throne also looks like Anubis. Who is the symbol that looks like a really magnificent bird spreading its wings? Is this Ra? I think the Owl is Osisis, right?
I think the Pharoah is Dennis Rodman.
Quote: ZenKinGWhy would anyone assume a 10 is underneath when there are only FOUR ten value cards in a deck(10, J, Q, K)? Meanwhile you have NINE other different denominations in the same deck(A,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9). So all the players ASSUMING a ten value card is underneath is WRONG and this is why the EZ bust side bet is in my opinion one of the smartest side bets ever created by the casino.
Theres just a huge misconception about bust rates and always assuming a 10 and thinking a 2,3,4,5,6 are BUST CARDS. None of those upcards will ever bust more than a 43% rate with the dealer 5 being the players best chance at close to 43% with the dealer 6 slightly behind on a stand 17 game, but if its a soft 17 game, the 6 becomes the highest % to bust at roughly the same rate. Not to mention the average dealer bust rate is around 28% for a stand 17 game and i believe 29% for a soft 17 game. EVEN with a high true count of +5, the bust rates for a 5 or 6 only go to 46 to 47% or so for an upcard of 5 and 6.
The correct theoretical way to use and learn a basic strategy chart is to ASSUME a TOTAL COMBINATION of 10 such as a combination total of 6+4 or 2+8 or even a face card or ten card. So even though people have the right idea of assuming a 10, they're using it the wrong way with erroneous logic because all that logic does is create a false illusion about the game and leave you vulnerable to a side bet like EZ bust thinking the dealer will bust at a 50.01% rate or higher which is patently false.
Really? So dealer has a 2 thru 6 up card and the player should assume a total of ten.
So then they will hit all their 12 through 16s ,well that's wrong.Oh and they better not double their 9 or 10 against any upcard since u assume a total of 10.
We all know that assuming a 10 in the hole isn't correct but for a total novice it sends them in somewhat the right direction.
Obviously if they have any interest they can learn basic strategy or at least simplified basic.
Quote: CrystalMathI think the Pharoah is Dennis Rodman.
It's been rumored that The Pharaoh looks like Flava Flav. LMAO! :D
Quote: NathanGambling game pronunciation question time! My local Radio station Hard Rock Casino commercial announcer says,"Hard Rock Casino offers the hottest table games such as Baccaraw!" (Baccarat.) I thought I was pronounced Baccarat(The last syllable being pronounced like the Rodent animal that crawls around people's houses, not Baccaraw, the last syllable being pronounced like not cooking a food before you eat it). Hmm.
Its really pronounced rat like the rodent.That's how the game got its name,years ago in the slums of Paris there were a lot of rats ,so people would catch them ,and put numbers on their backs and let them race around a track,gamblers would back a rat ie.bet on a rat,eventually the name became baccarat .so its pronounced back a rat.:)
Quote: beachbumbabsIt's French. You don't say the last t. Bahk-cah-RAH.
So, the commercial announcer was right. :) In my defense, I only saw it WRITTEN, never spoken before I heard the radio commercial, so I was reading it as if it were pronounced in the English way. :) Thank you for the clarification. :)
Quote: HunterhillIts really pronounced rat like the rodent.That's how the game got its name,years ago in the slums of Paris there were a lot of rats ,so people would catch them ,and put numbers on their backs and let them race around a track,gamblers would back a rat ie.bet on a rat,eventually the name became baccarat .so its pronounced back a rat.:)
Um, I just Thanked Babs for her post but now you've got me all confused again. :/
Quote: NathanUm, I just Thanked Babs for her post but now you've got me all confused again. :/
Let James Bond settle it for you.
Quote: HunterhillReally? So dealer has a 2 thru 6 up card and the player should assume a total of ten.
So then they will hit all their 12 through 16s ,well that's wrong.Oh and they better not double their 9 or 10 against any upcard since u assume a total of 10.
We all know that assuming a 10 in the hole isn't correct but for a total novice it sends them in somewhat the right direction.
Obviously if they have any interest they can learn basic strategy or at least simplified basic.
The 'total of 10' thing I mentioned is in reference to people trying to 'quickly' learn basic strategy with the proper logic. I was simply correcting the erroneous logic of always assuming a 10 value card is underneath that people try to teach a new player of how to play.
I understand that, but I think your total of 10 logic is more flawed than the always assume a 10 in the hole.Quote: ZenKinGThe 'total of 10' thing I mentioned is in reference to people trying to 'quickly' learn basic strategy with the proper logic. I was simply correcting the erroneous logic of always assuming a 10 value card is underneath that people try to teach a new player of how to play.
Quote: HunterhillIts really pronounced rat like the rodent.That's how the game got its name,years ago in the slums of Paris there were a lot of rats ,so people would catch them ,and put numbers on their backs and let them race around a track,gamblers would back a rat ie.bet on a rat,eventually the name became baccarat .so its pronounced back a rat.:)
Wow I thought you were joking but just to make sure, I googled it.
Holy hell, it actually is (or was) pronounced with a hard T at the end and started from gamblers in the slums of Paris (isn't all of Paris a slum tho? let's be real, it's France) by betting on rats.
"One reason card counting works is because the dealer will bust more"
FALSE
A dealer's bust rate actually slowly goes down as the true count reaches into the double digits by an end result of 2-3% and this is due to a higher probability of pat 20s because of a higher frequency of a 10 value card being the upcard. The highest average chance of the dealer busting is actually around TC -3.5 to TC -0.5 with a standard counting system.
Woman: What color eyes do I have?
Man: Um, brown eyes, pretty light brown eyes.
Woman: Yes, but did you know my eyes turn green in the summer?
Man: Oh(Oh $#!t)
Quote: onenickelmiracleMan: (explaining troubles with exgf) Never trust a green eyed girl.
Woman: What color eyes do I have?
Man: Um, brown eyes, pretty light brown eyes.
Woman: Yes, but did you know my eyes turn green in the summer?
Man: Oh(Oh $#!t)
If it's April Fool's Day, he's safe. ;)
No that's a true story. A lot of people have their eye color appearance change for various reasons, including what they are wearing and what surrounds them.Quote: NathanIf it's April Fool's Day, he's safe. ;)
Quote: HunterhillReally? So dealer has a 2 thru 6 up card and the player should assume a total of ten.
So then they will hit all their 12 through 16s ,well that's wrong.Oh and they better not double their 9 or 10 against any upcard since u assume a total of 10.
We all know that assuming a 10 in the hole isn't correct but for a total novice it sends them in somewhat the right direction.
Obviously if they have any interest they can learn basic strategy or at least simplified basic.
I dont get it either. Obviously ZK must be right, as he is infallible but his explanation is weak.
Quote: billryanI dont get it either. Obviously ZK must be right, as he is infallible but his explanation is weak.
Right,his method would have you misplaying most every hand,but what do we know?
Quote: onenickelmiracleNo that's a true story. A lot of people have their eye color appearance change for various reasons, including what they are wearing and what surrounds them.
No, I meant that he could claim he was just joking, to attempt to save his ass hence "April Fool's Day."
Quote: billryanI dont get it either. Obviously ZK must be right, as he is infallible but his explanation is weak.
I think, when the player doesn't lose immediately, the average sum of the dealer's first two cards is 14.4
Quote: Dalex64I think, when the player doesn't lose immediately, the average sum of the dealer's first two cards is 14.4
And yet the bestest blackjack player ever says differently.
Quote: billryanAnd yet the bestest blackjack player ever says differently.
I already explained it. It was in reference to someome learning basic strategy. The 'always assume a 10' quick way of learning basic strategy should actually be to 'assume a total of 10'. Semantics, but that logic makes much more sense than assuming a 10 value card is underneath when there are 2x the amount of other denomiations in the pack. Has nothing to do with using that logic to mathematically play your hand.
And yes im still the best. Thanks.
Quote: ZenKinGI already explained it. It was in reference to someome learning basic strategy. The 'always assume a 10' quick way of learning basic strategy should actually be to 'assume a total of 10'. Semantics, but that logic makes much more sense than assuming a 10 value card is underneath when there are 2x the amount of other denomiations in the pack. Has nothing to do with using that logic to mathematically play your hand.
And yes im still the best. Thanks.
You are sprouting nonsense.
Quote: billryanYou are sprouting nonsense.
I thought you had that department covered. ;-)
Quote: billryanYou are sprouting nonsense.
I think I see it.
What he really means to say is to assume a VALUE of 10, not just literally a 10 card - excluding a jack, queen, or king.
He is saying it is twice as likely that the card will not be a ten value than it will. That's true but not where he stops. He says it is better to assume the dealer will have a total of ten. For that to happen, the hole card can only be one of thirteen ranks. Besides which the roughly one third of the time you get a ten value card, his advice makes even less sense.
Here is a question for the math enabled amongst us. Assuming an infinite deck, what are the chances a three card hand will not include a ten value?
Quote: ZenKinGI already explained it. It was in reference to someome learning basic strategy. The 'always assume a 10' quick way of learning basic strategy should actually be to 'assume a total of 10'. Semantics, but that logic makes much more sense than assuming a 10 value card is underneath when there are 2x the amount of other denomiations in the pack. Has nothing to do with using that logic to mathematically play your hand.
And yes im still the best. Thanks.
Its not semantics,to assume the dealer has a total of 10 is ludicrous,and would have the newbie misplaying nearly every hand.
To assume a10 in the hole would be a much better generic strategy than yours.
Keep trying to back track but even the King is wrong sometimes or most of the time.
Quote: NathanI have some Pharaoh's Fortune Slot machine Symbols questions. The Symbols relate to Ancient Egypt, but I am confused by certain Symbols. The blue Dog is Anubis, right?!The Dog sitting on the Throne also looks like Anubis. Who is the symbol that looks like a really magnificent bird spreading its wings? Is this Ra? Is this Isis? I think the Owl is Osisis, right? I'm assuming that The people who look absolutely shocked when you get a line win with them(Really subliminal messaging there, ;) they look shocked because the head covering is removed, leaving them bald as they look at one another's bald head, LMAO)are Pharaohs or just regular Peasants.
According to Google, the Dog is really a Wolf, the "Magnificent looking bird spreading its wings," is a Phoenix, The Owl is really just an Owl, the two people are regular Egyptians, Anubis sitting on the throne is really a man wearing a Wolf Mask(What's up with Wolves in an Egyptian game? Egyptians worshipped Cats primarily, not Wolves. :/
Quote: ZenKinGI already explained it. It was in reference to someome learning basic strategy. The 'always assume a 10' quick way of learning basic strategy should actually be to 'assume a total of 10'. Semantics, but that logic makes much more sense than assuming a 10 value card is underneath when there are 2x the amount of other denomiations in the pack. Has nothing to do with using that logic to mathematically play your hand.
And yes im still the best. Thanks.
Just tell them to assume they have a 7.3 value hole card.
Quote: billryanNo, he says that there are twice as many non-ten cards in the deck. Four ranks have a value of ten, nine ranks don't.
He is saying it is twice as likely that the card will not be a ten value than it will. That's true but not where he stops. He says it is better to assume the dealer will have a total of ten. For that to happen, the hole card can only be one of thirteen ranks. Besides which the roughly one third of the time you get a ten value card, his advice makes even less sense.
Here is a question for the math enabled amongst us. Assuming an infinite deck, what are the chances a three card hand will not include a ten value?
When i say a 'total of 10' im not talking about the end total of the dealers hand. Jesus. Theres some really bad reading comprehension on these forums.
When I say assume a total of 10 im talking the next combination of card will however it may be will equal a value of 10. It could be a 2 card combination of 10, 1 card combination of 10, 3 card conbination of 10, etc. Thats where the assumption of 10 comes from. Whoch makes more sense? Assuming the hole card is a single value rank 10, of which there are only 4 of those ranks in the pack or assume a COMBINATION of a 10?
Quote: billryanNo, he says that there are twice as many non-ten cards in the deck. Four ranks have a value of ten, nine ranks don't.
He is saying it is twice as likely that the card will not be a ten value than it will. That's true but not where he stops. He says it is better to assume the dealer will have a total of ten. For that to happen, the hole card can only be one of thirteen ranks. Besides which the roughly one third of the time you get a ten value card, his advice makes even less sense.
Here is a question for the math enabled amongst us. Assuming an infinite deck, what are the chances a three card hand will not include a ten value?
When i say a 'total of 10' im not talking about the end total of the dealers hand. Jesus. Theres some really bad reading comprehension on these forums.
When I say assume a total of 10 im talking the next combination of card will however it may be will equal a value of 10. It could be a 2 card combination of 10, 1 card combination of 10, 3 card conbination of 10, etc. Thats where the assumption of 10 comes from. Whoch makes more sense? Assuming the hole card is a single value rank 10, of which there are only 4 of those ranks in the pack or assume a COMBINATION of a 10?
Quote: MaxPenI think he heard you the first time. Well, at least the second time.
Clearly not
Quote: NathanAccording to Google, the Dog is really a Wolf, the "Magnificent looking bird spreading its wings," is a Phoenix, The Owl is really just an Owl, the two people are regular Egyptians, Anubis sitting on the throne is really a man wearing a Wolf Mask(What's up with Wolves in an Egyptian game? Egyptians worshipped Cats primarily, not Wolves. :/
And once again, according to Google, there IS an Osiris, I just don't know which one he is because pictures of Osiris look nothing like an Owl. The eye symbol is Horus.
Quote: NathanHoly crap! O.O My Paycheck hasn't come through yet! I usually get it before 3:30 am every two Thursdays, but as of now, it is 4:19 am and I still not received my paycheck. Getting worried. O.O
Paycheck still hasn't come through yet as of 8:07 AM. The website where I check my paycheck information is also coincidentally down. Now officially worried. Oh crap. :/
