Health and Weight Loss
Quote: ZenKinGYou've just made my point. Why couldn't you keep it off?
BECAUSE I DIDN'T WANT IT BAD ENOUGH!!!!
I would go back to bad habits because
it's easy to do so. You do it little by
little and it's back to eating bread and
crackers and Doritos and chips because
it's easy peasy. I have to keep the weight
off now because it's a health issue because
I'm older now. I want it badly enough now
that I will never go back, never.
It's like guys I've known who try and quit
smoking for decades. They finally get sick,
and blammo! They find Jesus and quit that
day and never go back. They found the
incentive to want it bad enough.
Quote: EvenBobBECAUSE I DIDN'T WANT IT BAD ENOUGH!!!!
I would go back to bad habits because
it's easy to do so. You do it little by
little and it's back to eating bread and
crackers and Doritos and chips because
it's easy peasy. I have to keep the weight
off now because it's a health issue because
I'm older now. I want it badly enough now
that I will never go back, never.
It's like guys I've known who try and quit
smoking for decades. They finally get sick,
and blammo! They find Jesus and quit that
day and never go back. They found the
incentive to want it bad enough.
Nope because you dont realize it has nothing to do with 'wanting it bad enough'? Why does being skinny have to be something you have to work towards? Let that sink in and youll finally understand where im coming from. You think cavemen back in the day worried about getting fat? The way people live and eat today is the problem. The abundance of food and amounts of misinformation being spread about how to eat is the problem. Theres nothing to 'work towards' or 'wanting it bad enough' to become healthy and skinny. Youre just doing it all wrong and got everything mixed up.
With being said, i hope you and whoever else is overweight muvh success. Im just trying to inform and help you see the problem going on.
Quote: gordonm888
5. Cereal - this surprised me. It is terrible for you. I was eating plain Cheerios with no sugar frosting and thought I was virtuous. I was wrong. I was shortening my life.
That's a bit hyperbolic. Cheerios is not "terrible" for you and it probably wasn't even remotely shortening your life unless you were eating a ton of it. It only has 1 gram of added sugar per serving; other than that it's pretty benign when eaten in moderation. Corn Flakes are another cereal that's not "bad." Three grams of added sugar, but that's still really low when eaten in moderation. Grape Nuts is probably the best out there as far as mainstream cereals go. The flashy, "kid-friendly" cereals should obviously be avoided. I usually eat oatmeal every day, but every once in a while I'll break it up with one of the "safer" cereals, just for a change of pace.
Quote:6. Crackers and chips. These have partially-hydrogenated oils - probably the most toxic ingredient currently in the food supply. They are also a major source of carbs. Crackers and chips from a Heath Food store are a reasonable compromise.
Plain Triscuits are good, too, and available everywhere.
I'm not saying that the fasting school of thought is the one true religion but i have read things that support his assertions. Like that fasting slows down the negative effects of aging including dementia.
It's worked well for me and it can be flexible and forgiving. E.g you go out to eat at a great restaurant and eat 9 million calories. No prob. Just do a 24 hour + fast.
It's not even hard once you are used to it. Especially in the above circumstance. You realize you are still quite full the next day and there is no reason to eat just because it is lunch time.
I typically do 1 to 3 longer fasts per week as that suits my schedule. But I'm starting to think ZKs method could be better.
Also, why isthis complicated? Seems remarkably simple.
Quote: ZenKinGWhy does being skinny have to be something you have to work towards?
Because if you have a lifetime of bad habits you have to work to overcome them.
If I wanted to be really fat for some reason, I would have to overcome my lifetime of eating healthy food in reasonable proportions and develop new habits that would make me fat.
I would have to "work towards" getting fat.
Quote: ZenKinGNope because you dont realize it has nothing to do with 'wanting it bad enough'?
It has EVERYTHING to do with it!!!
This is nuts. If you want to keep the
weight off (any idiot can lose weight)
you WILL find a way. The vast majority
think they have accomplished 99%
of the project just by losing the weight.
Now they have the ENTIRE rest of their
life to keep it off, and they fail miserably.
Keeping away from bad habits for the
REST OF YOUR LIFE is beyond the
capability of the average person.
Quote: EvenBobIt has EVERYTHING to do with it!!!
This is nuts. If you want to keep the
weight off (any idiot can lose weight)
you WILL find a way. The vast majority
think they have accomplished 99%
of the project just by losing the weight.
Now they have the ENTIRE rest of their
life to keep it off, and they fail miserably.
Keeping away from bad habits for the
REST OF YOUR LIFE is beyond the
capability of the average person.
Youre not understanding my point, but maybe if you stop reacting to my post to defend yourself and actually read what im writing, then maybe it will sink in. The point im making is the only reason you think you need to 'want it bad enough' is because of the erroneous way you eat and live just like 99% of this country.
You, along with many think 3-6 meals is the correct way to go. You, along with many get no exercise either because the food you eat all day deprives you of energy and makes you feel sluggish. Try not eating for 20-24 hrs each day and see if you want to lay in bed or on the couch during that span. The amount of adrenaline that will be sent to your brain by the 24 hr mark will have made you accomplish many things throughout the day.
Do you think cavemen back in the day had to 'want it bad enough' to be skinny? Or were they hunting for food all day and eating one big meal at night? Do you know anything about biology? You do realize eating all day just makes you sluggish and tired and that eating at night is the proper way to go about it. The problem is people think that by skipping a meal, you will die or go into starvation mode due to the vast amount of bullshit being spread by these so called professionals and the mass media.
I want to see anyone be overweight eating one big meal at night. Go ahead and try. Eat whatever you want as well. Also let me know if that insomnia many suffer from ever happens again. Then you can go throw those insomnia pills into the ash can along with the doctors advice where it belongs.
Quote: ZenKinGYoure not understanding my point, but maybe if you stop reacting to my post to defend yourself and actually read what im writing, then maybe it will sink in.
We ARE reading what you're writing, and you're not making any sense. You're contradicting yourself.
You're saying there's nothing to work towards and it's not about wanting it bad enough.
But then you say people have been brainwashed to eat a certain way and gotten addicted to pills, and you also said it takes time to get used to fasting.
Which is it?
If you're a brainwashed addict, you have to WORK to overcome that.
Quote:Do you think cavemen back in the day had to 'want it bad enough' to be skinny?
No, because THEY HAD NO OTHER OPTION. They didn't have the luxuries we have today.
Are Ethiopians starving and scrawny because they have great self-control? NO! They're like that because they barely get food.
Quote:I want to see anyone be overweight eating one big meal at night. Go ahead and try. Eat whatever you want as well. Also let me know if that insomnia many suffer from ever happens again. Then you can go throw those insomnia pills into the ash can along with the doctors advice where it belongs.
So according to your logic, I can eat one meal a day which consists of 8,000 calories of chicken nuggets and chocolate cake, and I will never be overweight, I'll sleep like a baby, and I'll be in perfect health?
Quote: WizardCare to enlighten me on these benefits?
Keeps your weight down, but makes you high strung and cranky from not eating. That's my guess.
Quote: TigerWuWe ARE reading what you're writing, and you're not making any sense. You're contradicting yourself.
You're saying there's nothing to work towards and it's not about wanting it bad enough.
But then you say people have been brainwashed to eat a certain way and gotten addicted to pills, and you also said it takes time to get used to fasting.
Which is it?
If you're a brainwashed addict, you have to WORK to overcome that.
No, because THEY HAD NO OTHER OPTION. They didn't have the luxuries we have today.
Are Ethiopians starving and scrawny because they have great self-control? NO! They're like that because they barely get food.
So according to your logic, I can eat one meal a day which consists of 8,000 calories of chicken nuggets and chocolate cake, and I will never be overweight, I'll sleep like a baby, and I'll be in perfect health?
I honestly give up. When did i say you will be eating 8,000 calories? I said go ahead and try to do it, cause you wont be able to. Instead of trying to argue with me, listen to what im saying.
Yeah, they didnt have any other option and thats the way it should be. We have an over abundance of food in society and at the whip of a finger. Its completely unnatural. People are eating all day every day and eating just to eat whether it's because theyre bored or depressed or any of these bullshit reasons. Combine the over abundance of food with misguided advice from doctors and the media and what you create is an epidemic with obesity.
Quote: ZenKinG
Any supplement or drug you can take can be found through proper nutrition and fasting. Why take a omega 3 fish oil tablet when you can chow down a salmon or tuna for dinner? Why are you taking leptin drugs when fasting has been shown to increase leptin sensitivity? High blood pressure, high cholesterol can all be solved through proper nutrition and fasting as well. All of these people on cholesterol medication and blood pressure medication is unbelievable and quite sad. It's really sad that we live in a world where these big pharmas and billion dollar corporations care more about the fiat paper going into their wallet then actually telling the truth about what's going on. They rather sell you a pill to keep you coming back rather than telling you the truth about what's going on and you can bet every single paper bill in your pocket and wallet that these big pharma executives and doctors know the truth. Not all doctors are out to get you, most are just misinformed drones that were spoon fed bullshit in med school and sticking to the script. Is what it is at this point.
I agree with most of what you have to say on this. Americans have a problem with diet (the U.S. food industry is screwed up) and exercise and the medical profession characterizes the results of that as "metabolic syndrome" and big Pharma steps in with expensive drugs to control measurable symptoms of metabolic syndrome such as cholesterol, glucose, etc. And after awhile the hapless patient has a new set of medical issues - namely the major side effects of those pharmaceutical drugs he takes every day. Its an awful mess.
Leptin is good because it can produce a permanent weight loss quickly - and overweight people need that kind of immediate success to encourage them to continue to change their ways. I would not recommend taking leptin for long periods of time.
You advocate the benefits of fasting, but just because fasting is good doesn't mean that everything else is bad. There are a few supplements (CoQ10, omega-3 fish oil, B-12 vitamins) that will deliver benefits to the nutritional wellness and cardiac health of most Americans who are 40 or older and who aren't prepared to do fasting. This is not an either/or decision -these supplements really can start to help people immediately. And I eat fish regularly, but significant daily intake of omega-3 oils -(far above what you can get from eating fish 2-3 times a week) can really improve your health.
Quote: ZenKinGis because of the erroneous way you eat and live just like 99% of this country.
No no NO!
You can lose weight on any diet
and keep it off if you want to.
If the diet is balanced, you can
do it. But you have to WANT it,
there is no secret way of eating
that works for everybody.
I like keto, some do WW, some
do vegan or intermittent fasting.
Or whatever. It all works. But for
it to last, you have to want it a
lot, and most people do not.
Quote: gordonm888I agree with most of what you have to say on this. Americans have a problem with diet (the U.S. food industry is screwed up) and exercise and the medical profession characterizes the results of that as "metabolic syndrome" and big Pharma steps in with expensive drugs to control measurable symptoms of metabolic syndrome such as cholesterol, glucose, etc. And after awhile the hapless patient has a new set of medical issues - namely the major side effects of those pharmaceutical drugs he takes every day. Its an awful mess.
Leptin is good because it can produce a permanent weight loss quickly - and overweight people need that kind of immediate success to encourage them to continue to change their ways. I would not recommend taking leptin for long periods of time.
You advocate the benefits of fasting, but just because fasting is good doesn't mean that everything else is bad. There are a few supplements (CoQ10, omega-3 fish oil, B-12 vitamins) that will deliver benefits to the nutritional wellness and cardiac health of most Americans who are 40 or older and who aren't prepared to do fasting. This is not an either/or decision -these supplements really can start to help people immediately. And I eat fish regularly, but significant daily intake of omega-3 oils -(far above what you can get from eating fish 2-3 times a week) can really improve your health.
When did i say fasting is the only answer? My answer was two-fold. Fasting and proper nutrition(actual food). Why take a tablet of omega 3s when you can eat the actual fish for dinner?
Quote: ZenKinGI honestly give up. When did i say you will be eating 8,000 calories? I said go ahead and try to do it, cause you wont be able to.
You said I could eat whatever I want for one big meal a day.
Quote:Instead of trying to argue with me, listen to what im saying.
I'm trying to, but half the time you're not making sense and contradicting yourself.
Quote:Yeah, they didnt have any other option and thats the way it should be. We have an over abundance of food in society and at the whip of a finger. Its completely unnatural. People are eating all day every day and eating just to eat whether it's because theyre bored or depressed or any of these bullshit reasons. Combine the over abundance of food with misguided advice from doctors and the media and what you create is an epidemic with obesity.
Ahh, see, now you're making sense again.
This thread is exhausting. I'm going to quit now while we actually agree on something.
Quote: ZenKinGWhy take a tablet of omega 3s when you can eat the actual fish for dinner?
Again I do eat fresh fish regularly, however with the oversight of a nurse-practitioner who is an expert on supplements, I also take 2200 mg (in the bioavailable form) of omega-3 fish oil supplement daily. Very few people can "eat enough fish" to get that level of the bioavailable form of omega-3 fish oil. And it is like a mini-fountain of youth. I have more energy, I feel better and all my problem areas in my bloodwork improve. And I am not the only one - many people are experiencing this.
ZenKIng, be open to new knowledge.
Quote: gordonm888Again I do eat fresh fish regularly, however with the oversight of a nurse-practitioner who is an expert on supplements, I also take 2200 mg (in the bioavailable form) of omega-3 fish oil supplement daily. Very few people can "eat enough fish" to get that level of the bioavailable form of omega-3 fish oil. And it is like a mini-fountain of youth. I have more energy, I feel better and all my problem areas in my bloodwork improve. And I am not the only one - many people are experiencing this.
ZenKIng, be open to new knowledge.
What new knowledge have you told me? You only said to take a supplement instead. I disagree, supplements and drugs should be done away with. Supplementd are nothing but a gateway to brlieve drugs are the answer as well. Get your vitamins and minerals from actual food, not from some supplement tablet or drug capsule.
Quote: ZenKinGFirst off, as already said, improvement of body composition and fitness...
Thanks. I don't know this topic well enough to debate you on it. I will say no doctor I have ever met has endorsed fasting, that I'm aware of. I hope SOOPOO will comment.
there may be many different approaches and plans but many things are well known that are necessary to do this:
a more healthy diet including fruits and vegetables
reducing amount of sugar
increase in fiber in food choices
exercise
limiting food intake
increasing water intake
if one of these many different plans helps a person lose weight it is most likely because having a plan triggered a person's will and organization
but they didn't really need one of these plans
they only needed the basic info that has been out there for years and the WILL to do it.
many years ago I quit smoking cold turkey because I really wanted to quit. I had pains in my chest and the price of cigarettes was going way up.
I had tried in prior years with hypnosis and nicotine substitues and failed.
the difference was my desire to quit was greatly increased by the above mentioned factors. I didn't need any commercial plan. I just needed the will.
Quote: lilredroosterI didn't need any commercial plan. I just needed the will.
Bingo. That's what most people are
lacking in changing any behavior, the
will to keep it going. It usually takes a
health scare to get people straight, but
even then they often go back to old
habits.
Quote: ZenKinGWhat new knowledge have you told me? You only said to take a supplement instead. I disagree, supplements and drugs should be done away with. Supplementd are nothing but a gateway to brlieve drugs are the answer as well. Get your vitamins and minerals from actual food, not from some supplement tablet or drug capsule.
Have you ever, in your entire life, taken a vitamin or pharmaceutical?
Okay. How about milk in a glass container exposed to light for two hours. (Such as a display case in a retail store). Eighty percent of the Vitamin D gone. Or foods kept on a steam table. Or potatoes peeled while raw?Quote: ZenKinGGet your vitamins and minerals from actual food, not from some supplement tablet or drug capsule.
Face did battle with an octopus and found it very intelligent. In nature an octopus often kills with insulin. Should we change our view on insuin?>
Quote: rxwineKeeps your weight down, but makes you high strung and cranky from not eating. That's my guess.
Ha Ha. Hilarious! Good stuff, keep it coming...
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What about genetics? I always heard/read genes play a role in who we are (when it comes to eating/exercise/"wellness").
I remember hearing/reading recently American's average life expectancy has leveled off and may actually be decreasing.
Genetics, good nutrition, good exercise habits......... general moderation. No need to obsess over things. A few days of fasting will never hurt you or else all Jews would be dead. The 5:2 diet will work but the "2" days can simply be low calorie, not zero calories. And frankly you can get the same result by increasing melatonin intake rather than caloric restriction.
Lowers weight AND increases longevity (in test animals) hard to tell with humans. Too many confounding factors and too many darned bioethicists.
Cheerios, corn flakes, grape nuts and triscuts are all processed garbage. No matter how many grams of whatever. And I’d bet grape nuts is the worst of the group. Most food with labels (ie junk) is to be avoided.Quote: TigerWuThat's a bit hyperbolic. Cheerios is not "terrible" for you and it probably wasn't even remotely shortening your life unless you were eating a ton of it. It only has 1 gram of added sugar per serving; other than that it's pretty benign when eaten in moderation. Corn Flakes are another cereal that's not "bad." Three grams of added sugar, but that's still really low when eaten in moderation. Grape Nuts is probably the best out there as far as mainstream cereals go. The flashy, "kid-friendly" cereals should obviously be avoided. I usually eat oatmeal every day, but every once in a while I'll break it up with one of the "safer" cereals, just for a change of pace.
Plain Triscuits are good, too, and available everywhere.
Quote: ZenKinGAny supplement or drug you can take can be found through proper nutrition and fasting....
I disagree with this... Vitamin D being the one i think is hardest to get depending on where you live. There is a whole lot of talk about deficiency and quite a bit of healing/prevention to be had here.
I think most of what you say is spot on and a great way to lose weight or maintain same weight.
I do think their are other ways to do either especially if you are at a normal weight.
For losing weight I prefer fasting because it works so well with a low carb diet once you are ketone adapted. The low hunger side effect really helps to maintain that fast repeatedly to get to those benefits of reducing insulin resistance.
Most 'bran' flakes have sawdust ... yes, its legal for them to use it.
labels? Remember "Pam" the nonfat spray.... each ten second application was 52.5 grams of fat but the label was legal.
Although previous work has shown how intermittent fasting can slow aging, we are only beginning to understand the underlying biology,”
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2017/11/intermittent-fasting-may-be-center-of-increasing-lifespan/
It is NOT a vitamin at all. It never has been and never will be a vitamin.
It comes in three forms.
Many disease states have clear "latitude" sensitivity. Live in Miami, you don't get it; live in Boston, you do.
Vitamin D in milk is often stored at too high a temperature and is added to the top of a vat that trucks empty from the bottom. There are no great big spoons to stir it around or anything. You can always tell what state and dairy your milk comes from by the date code. On my first ten or so visits to Vegas, I tended to prefer the smaller downtown buffets because of the self serve cold milk machines that the Strip lacked. Now it is meaningless to me. Even the fresh orange juice is pleasant but too much fructose for me.
Quote: Not so fast: Pros and cons of the newest diet trend...there's no strong evidence that fasting adds health benefits beyond any other weight-loss strategy.
Source: https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/not-so-fast-pros-and-cons-of-the-newest-diet-trend
Quote: WizardFrom the Harvard Medical School...
Source: https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/not-so-fast-pros-and-cons-of-the-newest-diet-trend
Them referring to fasting as a 'diet' should send red flags off right away. Not to mention them saying no other health benefits can be proven. Really? Slower metablism as well? Exactly why I hate the world we live in. So many people have their own agenda to mislead with bogus studies. They took 100 over weight people and most dropped out. Wow, so thats the fastings fault?
But regardless if they call it a 'diet' or not, their verbiage changes the numerical results?Quote: ZenKinGQuote: WizardFrom the Harvard Medical School...
Source: https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/not-so-fast-pros-and-cons-of-the-newest-diet-trend
Them referring to fasting as a 'diet' should send red flags off right away. Not to mention them saying no other health benefits can be proven. Really? Slower metablism as well?
Quote: RomesBut regardless if they call it a 'diet' or not, their verbiage changes the numerical results?Quote: ZenKinGQuote: WizardFrom the Harvard Medical School...
Source: https://www.health.harvard.edu/heart-health/not-so-fast-pros-and-cons-of-the-newest-diet-trend
Them referring to fasting as a 'diet' should send red flags off right away. Not to mention them saying no other health benefits can be proven. Really? Slower metablism as well?
Look at the study they ran and the conclusions they get from it. They try and blame fasting as the reason. The fat ass people drop out and they blame fasting as the culprit that its not sustainable LOL. 100 people sample size as well. Wow. Coming from a mathematical forum such as this, you guys should know drawing conclusions from a sample size of 100 is also meaningless. But that doesnt stop that article and studies to draw definitive conclusions to sway public opinion? I mean really? That should send off more red flags.
This reminds me of the uncontrolled study once that was ran about if you skip breakfast, you will gain weight. They took people with horrible eating habits and had them skip breakfast and indulge in their bad habits during the day and eat garbage and then conclude that skipping breakfadt makes you fat when it had nothing to do with skipping breqkfast but more so to do with the guys horrible eating habits. Then after that was done, news spreads about breakfast being the most important meal of the day.
You have to be so careful not to be swayed by people with an agenda and misleading vague controlled studies
True, [sarcasm]that's the first thing I think of with Harvard Medical School and their research... they're on an agenda. [/sarcasm] =)Quote: ZenKinG...You have to be so careful not to be swayed by people with an agenda and misleading vague controlled studies
Quote: RomesTrue, [sarcasm]that's the first thing I think of with Harvard Medical School and their research... they're on an agenda. [/sarcasm] =)
You go ahead and read that study and conclude for yourself if anything can be taken from that. Its just another vague uncontrolled study that tells us nothing. Whether its an agenda or just pure misleading information is irrelevant. Tell me exactly what 'numerical results' you got from that.
Not to mention the fasting schedule im advocating is very different than the studies they cited that they made their participants do and was very unclear about how long they actually fasted for each day. They said one group was restricted to a certain amount of calories each day, that tells me nothing about what actually happened during the day and how long he actually fasted. The other group said they fasted for alternate days. Once again tells me nothing about how long they fasted. Outside of the studies, the doctor refers to the 5:2 diet which is not fasting at all. You eat normally for 5 days and restrict calories to 500 or so on 2 dayd each week? Wtf is that? Try actually fasting for 18-20 hours each day, maybe even 24 hours and then having a big meal at night and maybe some low glycemic foods during the day such as fruit, almonds, and nuts. Thats completely different than what was cited in that article. The studies gave no specific details about the fasting times or anything.
This is the danger of the media right here. If youre new to a subject, its hard for you to extrapolate exactly what is happening in each of these studies and then mass minsinformation begins to spread. Another red flag is they really went ahead and said 'fasting adds no other health benefits' and that theres no 'strong evidence it does'? REALLY? LOL. Shall i cite every single study?
One of my main points about fasting wasnt even discussed by the doctor either in that article and that is the biological sense that fasting makes over traditional eating being done today. A simple understanding of the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems will show you that eating all day long is completely wrong to how you should be living unless its low glycemic foods like fruit, almonds, nuts, etc. But people are eating actual meals throughout the day whoch is complete nonsense. All that does id spike insulin levels and activate the parasympathetic making you feel sluggish all day. Is that the way to go through your day every day? Or should you be eating only at night whem that is the time to feel sluggish, tired, relaxed, and ready to go to bed?
/pubmed/28459931
CONCLUSIONS AND RELEVANCE:
Alternate-day fasting did not produce superior adherence, weight loss, weight maintenance, or cardioprotection vs daily calorie restriction.
Are either of you really surprised there are multiple ways to lose or maintain weight?
ZK it's not some damn conspiracy. The study looked at daily calorie restriction vs Alternate day fasting.
R, this study doesn't say squat about most of what ZK claims.
Quote: ZenKinGYou have to be so careful not to be swayed by people with an agenda and misleading vague controlled studies
Nice to find something we agree on. Everyone I've ever met, except you, who was big on fasting had some kind of book or cleanse they were trying to sell.
If the purpose of the fast is to cleanse the body, that is what the kidneys and liver are for.
Quote: dfwbirdYou both seem to be talking past each other. On purpose.
/pubmed/28459931
CONCLUSIONS AND RELEVANCE:
Alternate-day fasting did not produce superior adherence, weight loss, weight maintenance, or cardioprotection vs daily calorie restriction.
Are either of you really surprised there are multiple ways to lose or maintain weight?
ZK it's not some damn conspiracy. The study looked at daily calorie restriction vs Alternate day fasting.
R, this study doesn't say squat about most of what ZK claims.
What youre not understanding is 'why' the vagueness about how long they fasted for? Why wasnt any specifics mentioned? Why did they immediately try to blame fasting when a small sample size of overweight people dropped out and then try to sway public opinion that it might not be sustainable and immediately criticize it?
I never said fasting is the only way to lose weight. Losing weight comes down simply to thermogenesis. Anyone can lose weight by cutting their food intake. My thing with fasting is the health benefits and indirect benefits that come along with it such as the natural biological way of eating that should be done. Our bodies are not meant to be eating large portions during the day and going through the day sleeping on our office desks trying to get through the day. People go through the day with their parasympathetic activated most of the time when the sympathetic fight or flight system should be the one activated keeping you alert and on your toes.
Weight loss with fasting is just another added benefit that comes with it. To me its more about the lifestyle changes it brings. For the article to really go and say at the end that fasting brings 'no additional health benefits' and no 'strong evidence' is a massive red flag. Did the doctor forget about the study that after 24 hours HGH levels shoot up 2000% from baseline leveld. What about the study that after 72 hours, your whole body begins to regenerate itself creating new white blood cells? Why not talk about the proven spring cleaning cellular process phenomenon that occurs within our body known as autophagy?
Whether all of this was a shot at fasting with an agenda by this doctor is irrelevant to me, but it sure looks like it when he cites no sources, but still feels the need to give definitive conclusions with no data to back it up.
Quote: ZenKinGBecause like I said before, your body is not used to it. It's the same thing when you first start working out on an empty stomach. Your blood sugar is still not used to it, so you will see a few side effects, but within a week or so of doing it, all that goes away. 99% of americans haven't gone their whole lives without eating for more than 6 hours at a time. It's basically a 'shock' to your system.
I can vouch for the working out on an empty stomach theory. I’ve been lifting weights 5/6 days a week for about 17 years. About 7 years ago I began lifting an hour after I wake up with only coffee in my system. Within two months I began to see pretty drastic positive differences in terms of body fat percentage , muscle tone , and just an overall good feeling. I did not lose any strength and continued to lift heavier and heavier weights. Now after 7 years of doing it this way I don’t feel right at all when I eat breakfast or try to work out with food in my stomach. I eat one very large meal an hour after I work out (usualluy around 1200 calories). Then 3 normal meals the remainder of the day. I do all my eating within a 9 hour window and basically do a 15 hour fast every day. It’s not that difficult since 8 of those hours are spent sleeping.
This has worked for me. But everyone is different.
The purpose of the fast for weight loss is to take advantage of the prolonged drop in insulin as per a hormonal theory of obesity.
Quote: ZenKinGWhy take a tablet of omega 3s when you can eat the actual fish for dinner?
1. Medical source: "Increasing omega-3 fatty acid consumption through foods is preferable. However, those with coronary artery disease, may not get enough omega-3 by diet alone."
2. "Eating fish" is not necessarily enough. Many popular fish are NOT good sources of Omega-3s such as tilapia, mahi mahi, cod, pollock, snapper, grouper, orange roughy, light canned tuna, trout, halibut, perch, bass, whitefish and hoki.
Also most shellfish are NOT sources of omega-3s including lobster, oysters, crab, scallops, shrimp and mussels.
Only a very selective group of fatty fish are high in omega-3 fatty acids: salmon, mackerel, herring, sardines, and albacore tuna.
Quote: ZenKinGWhat youre not understanding is 'why' the vagueness about how long they fasted for? Why wasnt any specifics mentioned? Why did they immediately try to blame fasting when a small sample size of overweight people dropped out and then try to sway public opinion that it might not be sustainable and immediately criticize it?
I never said fasting is the only way to lose weight. Losing weight comes down simply to thermogenesis. Anyone can lose weight by cutting their food intake. My thing with fasting is the health benefits and indirect benefits that come along with it such as the natural biological way of eating that should be done. Our bodies are not meant to be eating large portions during the day and going through the day sleeping on our office desks trying to get through the day. People go through the day with their parasympathetic activated most of the time when the sympathetic fight or flight system should be the one activated keeping you alert and on your toes.
Weight loss with fasting is just another added benefit that comes with it. To me its more about the lifestyle changes it brings. For the article to really go and say at the end that fasting brings 'no additional health benefits' and no 'strong evidence' is a massive red flag. Did the doctor forget about the study that after 24 hours HGH levels shoot up 2000% from baseline leveld. What about the study that after 72 hours, your whole body begins to regenerate itself creating new white blood cells? Why not talk about the proven spring cleaning cellular process phenomenon that occurs within our body known as autophagy?
Whether all of this was a shot at fasting with an agenda by this doctor is irrelevant to me, but it sure looks like it when he cites no sources, but still feels the need to give definitive conclusions with no data to back it up.
I agree that its a bad article. It doesn't address why intermittent fasting has risen in popularity. Which in my opinion is the hormonal theory of obesity.
Instead it relies a study that merely shows you can lose weight multiple ways. And concludes with a clear attempt to scare by suggesting people on blood pressure or heart disease meds are in danger due to big word at end of article not explained in any detail aimed at the two classes of people most likely to be reading an article about fasting. It's terrible reporting.
Quote: WizardFor what it is worth, our own TomG, who achieved the 150 Chicken McNugget challenge, routinely eats only one meal a day, as I recall. I'm not sure if it out of health reasons or economic ones. His one meal is typically at a Vegas buffet, where consumes many thousands of calories. As always, someone correct me if I'm in error.
Used to do that on vacations. One huge meal at Pizza Huts buffet late afternoon. Of course, we also consumed a few thousand calories of Molson Gold.
Now you're talkin'. Small beer, beer, ale are beverages that created our world.Quote: billryanOf course, we also consumed a few thousand calories of Molson Gold.
Children consumed several glasses a day of small beer.
Build pyramids for a day and you got six quarts of beer.
Attend church in the middle ages and it was at least two quarts of beer a week.
Quote: WizardFor what it is worth, our own TomG, who achieved the 150 Chicken McNugget challenge, routinely eats only one meal a day, as I recall. I'm not sure if it out of health reasons or economic ones. His one meal is typically at a Vegas buffet, where consumes many thousands of calories. As always, someone correct me if I'm in error.
That type of diet/eating schedule lends itself to being a successful competitive eater. Explains why he did so well in the McNugget challenge
Many people have radical ideas about eating properly and weight loss when it’s extremely simple.
Eat real food and everything will fall into place...your weight, your health and your energy. You will become more physically active naturally. You will stop wanting junk food. If you have diabetes you will reverse it eventually.
There is so much misunderstanding regarding proper food. People consider a Subway sandwich with a side of chips and a Diet Coke as a healthy lunch instead of garbage.
Quote: WizardFor what it is worth, our own TomG, who achieved the 150 Chicken McNugget challenge, routinely eats only one meal a day, as I recall. I'm not sure if it out of health reasons or economic ones. His one meal is typically at a Vegas buffet, where consumes many thousands of calories. As always, someone correct me if I'm in error.
Usually the only cost is a $2 to $5 tip and then there is no need for shopping, cooking, cleaning. But mostly it's simply what I like. I like eating the largest amount possible -- like 10-pounds or more. In earlier years (2009 - 12) I would weigh myself before and after. I think 16-pounds was comfortable, with a few occasions going over 20 -- I like to believe I could have done 200 McNuggets no problem in those days.
When it comes to nutritional systems / strategies / advice / regimens/ guidelines / methods / diets / lifestyles / whatever-you-want-to-call it, virtually anything can be part of maximizing our health and well-being. And virtually any of it can be part of poor health and well-being.
For example:
Quote: ZenKinGOne of my main points about fasting wasnt even discussed by the doctor either in that article and that is the biological sense that fasting makes over traditional eating being done today. A simple understanding of the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems will show you that eating all day long is completely wrong to how you should be living unless its low glycemic foods like fruit, almonds, nuts, etc. But people are eating actual meals throughout the day whoch is complete nonsense. All that does id spike insulin levels and activate the parasympathetic making you feel sluggish all day.
Many people (myself included) are able to eat many large meals during a day and still maintain vigor / energy / stamina / whatever-you-want-to-call-it. With as many points you have to the benefits of your routine, you now find yourself unable to eat multiple meals in a day without being sluggish. You now have the problem of an inflexible eating schedule -- something most of us aren't restricted to
