AZDuffman
AZDuffman 
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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March 28th, 2011 at 5:55:06 AM permalink
Quote: reno

Is the goal of shale oil development to increase supply, thereby lowering the price of oil?

Oil is traded on a global market, so increasing U.S. production will have a negligible impact on price-- the demand for energy in China & India is insatiable. The only way new drilling could have a noticeable impact on the price of this global commodity is if the U.S. increased production on a MASSIVE scale. There would certainly be advantages to devastating the Colorado wilderness to help out 1.3 billion Chinese drivers: it would reduce America's trade deficit, and change the power dynamics of our relationship with Beijing. But personally, I'd prefer that the Chinese buy their oil from the Saudis, and we save the energy resources in Colorado for future generations of Americans who haven't been born yet.



Your line of reasoning misses the point. Do I think if we develop shale oil we will in 3 years be paying $.659 for gasoline again? Heck no. But the point is supply of oil comes from thousands of small sources. Do you think in 1859 someone said, "Col Drake, you are wasting time drilling that well. You will never meet national yet alone world demand with it!" If they did, do you think Drake listened?

We have major production in AK, TX, Gulf of Mexico, CA, and now new oil coming online in ND and MT. None of these alone will "get us off imported oil." But every drop helps. If we get 3MM bbl from shale oil that is a big help in supply. And as time goes on we *WILL* find ways of extracting it with less water. Same as we improved extraction in who knows how many little and large ways over 150 years so far.

DRILL, BABY, DRILL--CONSERVATION NEVER FOUND A DROP OF OIL!
Tolerance is the virtue of believing in nothing
zippyboy
zippyboy
Joined: Jan 19, 2011
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February 25th, 2012 at 5:18:52 PM permalink
bump

I hear reg gas is $5.16 near Disney in Florida. I just filled up for $3.80/gal, but I see $4+ other places in town.
"Poker sure is an easy game to beat if you have the roll to keep rebuying."
EvenBob
EvenBob
Joined: Jul 18, 2010
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February 25th, 2012 at 5:34:56 PM permalink
They say it could hit $6 by July. Obama is now whining
that it wasn't him who nixed the Canada pipeline. Was
it Bush, did he do it from out of office? Bigtime inflation
is coming if gas keeps going up.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
boymimbo
boymimbo
Joined: Nov 12, 2009
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February 25th, 2012 at 5:54:37 PM permalink
Here in Niagara Falls, Ontario, gas is $1.25/L = $4.73 a gallon. It's been around here now for about 3 - 4 months.

It's 3.82 / gallon just over the river.
----- You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
charliepatrick
charliepatrick
Joined: Jun 17, 2011
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February 25th, 2012 at 5:56:02 PM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

Quote: French regulation


All vehicles driving on French roads must now carry a yellow fluorescent jacket, that can be put on if the driver has to get out in an emergency. The jacket must be carried in the car, not in the boot (not in the trunk), and be readily accessible. Drivers not carrying the obligatory jacket may receive an instant fine of up to 130 Euros, if stopped by police.

Based in the UK (remember we drive on a different side to mainland Europe) I drive to Europe once or twice a year. Various countries have different rules so amongst the things you need are Log Book (V5 - document to prove the vehicle is yours), Insurance, Triangle, Spare Bulbs, Jacket. I think sometimes you need a fire extinguisher. I know I had problems using an insurance replacement car and then driving to Europe, though amazingly it was only a 1.0l engine so I saved quite a bit in petrol and as northern Europe is fairly flat the lack of power wasn't much of a problem.

fwiw I drive a Diesel car and at the moment down south it's 141.7p. Also if you're in Belgium, for some reason Diesel is cheaper than petrol, so I always fill up there.
thecesspit
thecesspit
Joined: Apr 19, 2010
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February 25th, 2012 at 5:56:59 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

They say it could hit $6 by July. Obama is now whining
that it wasn't him who nixed the Canada pipeline. Was
it Bush, did he do it from out of office? Bigtime inflation
is coming if gas keeps going up.



I thought it was the Dakotas that nixed the Keystone project (as currently there's a lot of work shipping and refining the oil in those states). The Western Canada pipeline is also under threat from BC to build it. In the latter case, from my lay man's view, it seems strange for Canada to ship the raw material at quite high cost than to refine it in situ and sell the refined products instead. There's probably a good reason why not.

Canada has been a raw materials economy for the longest time.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
thecesspit
thecesspit
Joined: Apr 19, 2010
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February 25th, 2012 at 5:58:06 PM permalink
Quote: boymimbo

Here in Niagara Falls, Ontario, gas is $1.25/L = $4.73 a gallon. It's been around here now for about 3 - 4 months.

It's 3.82 / gallon just over the river.



I paid exactly that filling up this afternoon in British Columbia. Despite being on an island, fuel here is cheaper than it is in Vancouver.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
EvenBob
EvenBob
Joined: Jul 18, 2010
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February 25th, 2012 at 6:05:04 PM permalink
N Dakota is crying for truck drivers with a hazmat license
to drive the oil trucks to the refineries. They are short on
drivers every day because nobody wants to live in ND,
even for $60K+ a year. Plus the license isn't easy to get.
"It's not enough to succeed, your friends must fail." Gore Vidal
thecesspit
thecesspit
Joined: Apr 19, 2010
  • Threads: 53
  • Posts: 5936
February 25th, 2012 at 6:35:23 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

N Dakota is crying for truck drivers with a hazmat license
to drive the oil trucks to the refineries. They are short on
drivers every day because nobody wants to live in ND,
even for $60K+ a year. Plus the license isn't easy to get.



That only explains why the private sector would like to bypass North Dakota.

It doesn't explain why the state itself would like the pipeline to go straight through with no stopping (of course it wouldn't like that... all the jobs/tax revenue would disappear).
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
teddys
teddys
Joined: Nov 14, 2009
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February 26th, 2012 at 6:30:46 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

They are short on
drivers every day because nobody wants to live in ND,

My friend/former roommate moved to ND. Not in the oil business; he works for a public hospital. One of the few places where they are hiring for good-paying jobs.
Quote: thecesspit

In the latter case, from my lay man's view, it seems strange for Canada to ship the raw material at quite high cost than to refine it in situ and sell the refined products instead. There's probably a good reason why not.

Good question. Downstream refineries are usually located closer to population centers and transportation hubs; e.g., here in the Midwest, there are a lot along the shores of the Great Lakes in Gary, Toledo, Detroit, etc. Saves on the shipping costs, and probably more efficient economically. The oil pipeline must make sense from an economic point of view otherwise they wouldn't be clamoring to build it. I don't understand what the holdup is.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4

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