MathExtremist
MathExtremist
Joined: Aug 31, 2010
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February 25th, 2011 at 8:20:32 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

This is something else I don't understand. Oil is in the ground. We take it out, make a bottle out of it, and put the bottle back in the ground, where it came from. Where exactly is the harm? I have presented this very argument to at least three rabid Greenies over the years and they never have an answer, they just stare at me like I have dog crap on my shoe and wander away.



Well, lots of food is in your refrigerator. What if we take it out, run it all through a food processor, and then put the blended concoction back into your fridge, where it came from. Where exactly is the harm?
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
teddys
teddys
Joined: Nov 14, 2009
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February 25th, 2011 at 8:59:02 AM permalink
Gas just shot up again substantially thanks to the Libyan crisis. Libya has much more oil reserves than Egypt.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
thecesspit
thecesspit
Joined: Apr 19, 2010
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February 25th, 2011 at 10:01:11 AM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

This is something else I don't understand. Oil is in the ground. We take it out, make a bottle out of it, and put the bottle back in the ground, where it came from. Where exactly is the harm? I have presented this very argument to at least three rabid Greenies over the years and they never have an answer, they just stare at me like I have dog crap on my shoe and wander away.



It's a waste of an energy dense, highly transportable product. That there is a limit to. Plus you've spent energy making the bottle, transporting the bottle and throwing the bottle for 500ml of a product that you can get out of a tap, or a filter anywhere. Landfill takes up space. Decomposing bottles are at ground level not 100's of foot down in rock and shale, and in a different form with very different chemicals after the process of making the bottle.

What a waste of human ingenuity and energy for 500ml of water.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
reno
reno
Joined: Jan 20, 2010
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February 28th, 2011 at 8:47:36 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

Besides the Obama Administration discouraging and even prohibiting development of shale oil I often wonder when it will come to pass. Back in the late 1980s they said oil needed to be at about $80/bbl for shale to work out. Inflation might raise that but tech breakthrus should lower it.



Is the goal of shale oil development to increase supply, thereby lowering the price of oil?

Oil is traded on a global market, so increasing U.S. production will have a negligible impact on price-- the demand for energy in China & India is insatiable. The only way new drilling could have a noticeable impact on the price of this global commodity is if the U.S. increased production on a MASSIVE scale. There would certainly be advantages to devastating the Colorado wilderness to help out 1.3 billion Chinese drivers: it would reduce America's trade deficit, and change the power dynamics of our relationship with Beijing. But personally, I'd prefer that the Chinese buy their oil from the Saudis, and we save the energy resources in Colorado for future generations of Americans who haven't been born yet.

Utah, Colorado, and Wyoming probably have over a trillion barrels in oil shale. The problem is that separating the oil from the rock requires enormous quantities of water (at least 3 barrels of water for each barrel of oil). I'm not suggesting it will be impossible to achieve daily production of, say, 4 million barrels of oil in a dry arid place like Utah. But it won't be easy, and it won't be cheap.

Even if we could ride the planet of sanctimonious tree-huggers and hypocritical politician liars like Obama, I'm not convinced there's enough water in Utah for production of 4 million barrels of oil a day (12 million barrels of water per day.) Perhaps we could spend some money and re-route some rivers and squeeze out 200,000 or 300,000 oil barrels per day. But how could that possibly impact the price in a market with daily consumption of 85 million barrels?
Nareed
Nareed
Joined: Nov 11, 2009
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February 28th, 2011 at 9:03:00 AM permalink
Quote: reno

Oil is traded on a global market, so increasing U.S. production will have a negligible impact on price--



Any increase in supply has an effect on price. America's oil production does not happen in a vaccum.

Quote:

I'm not suggesting it will be impossible to achieve daily production of, say, 4 million barrels of oil in a dry arid place like Utah. But it won't be easy, and it won't be cheap.



So ship the shale rock where the water is. It shouldn't be hard, and there are plenty of railroads in Utah.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
ItsCalledSoccer
ItsCalledSoccer
Joined: Aug 30, 2010
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March 2nd, 2011 at 11:04:11 AM permalink
Paid $3.95 earlier today.
zippyboy
zippyboy
Joined: Jan 19, 2011
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March 2nd, 2011 at 12:26:38 PM permalink
It's up to $3.55 at my corner store here in Las Vegas, up a dime from yesterday.
"Poker sure is an easy game to beat if you have the roll to keep rebuying."
zippyboy
zippyboy
Joined: Jan 19, 2011
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March 27th, 2011 at 10:21:10 PM permalink
$3.77 for reg unleaded today at my corner station.
"Poker sure is an easy game to beat if you have the roll to keep rebuying."
weaselman
weaselman
Joined: Jul 11, 2010
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March 28th, 2011 at 4:13:50 AM permalink
Quote: Switch

GAS - the one thing that I'm really surprised about is that there seems to be very few diesel cars in the US.


Believe it or not, they are ILLEGAL to buy (new) in some states. Go figure ...
"When two people always agree one of them is unnecessary"
RobSinger
RobSinger
Joined: Oct 6, 2010
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March 28th, 2011 at 4:50:53 AM permalink
The closest station to my house, Chevron, is $3.75, but I saw $3.39 @ Arco 8 miles away. The Chevron is off a freeway and the other is not. Chevron is also 10X busier. This is in N. Phoenix.

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