Vegas 2047 Pinball - G2E 2014
Quote: AhighBut you would have to set the house hold so high that there would be no opportunity for advantage play.
.
So to you AP means winning more than
you put in once in awhile? That is not
advantage play, that's called luck. It's
only AP if you win more than you lose
over time. You do understand that,
correct?
he is talking about $1 wagers wont have an advantage. The higher limit you play the better the % will be all the way to a +EV. Casinos set machines like this all the time.Quote: EvenBobSo to you AP means winning more than
you put in once in awhile? That is not
advantage play, that's called luck. It's
only AP if you win more than you lose
over time. You do understand that,
correct?
In that $1 setting the game should not be called an advantage play game.
I do see some problems if they are presenting this as an advantage play game and its not set to over 100% achievable by a good player, I see a casino getting sued.
Its like a casino claiming 8/5 jacks is over 100% payback.
Quote: Zcore13I think it does use past play to adjust current chances. So I see two issues with that.
1. A very skilled player will play to just the point needed and then stop, allowing himself to beat his previous best each time thereafter. He never gets the best score he can because that would hurt future games.
2. Eventually after very good players play, regular players will have a lesser chance to win. Then after they lose a few times the skilled player will swoop in. Does the term culturing ring a bell? Many new versions of Ultimate X don't allow it anymore. Games at The Cosmopolitan reset after a certain time.
ZCore13
The advantage is not on every play. The advantage is on selecting your plays when you can potentially gain an advantage based on your level of skill against the previous players.
This type of thing happens in poker rooms (picking your cards and spots). Not every play you make is +EV, but overall your play can be +EV. Same as wonging out of the blackjack game, or vulturing Ultimate X, or reading the progressives.
AP pinball players would have to find some way of knowing that score X is the target to get an advantage on the spin that happens after their game. If they know they can regularly get score X, they may then play a game at advantage. A single shot a +EV is still an advantage play (say I offer a coin flip at 3:2 odds, but once. You'd take it.).
Would casino's use it? Remember the variance of getting a score X for pinball player may make the sums quite tricky to work out if a machine is in the +EV state for your particular skill level.
But despite AHigh's math (which makes sense) $100 a pull on game, however small the risk maybe (selecting to play for a $5 win, say), it's still a big ticket price. Penny slot players may do $100 quickly, but to them every pull is 'just' 50c (or whatever). The mentality of spending 50c 200 times is different from $100 once.
The analogue ability to choose any bet seems to me to be too complex. I think it needs dumbing down so it's not just of interest to the beard scratching AP crowd. I think a game that you can drop $20, set it to win $100, and then have your score move a simple meter to show the chance of winning. OR $20, starts at a 1 in 5 chance to win $80 and the $80 meter fills up as you play. Have 4-5 presets, maybe a meter showing points = cents to add to this meter, and it's simpler. But also the info is there for the AP vulture pinball player to see 'hey, that $20 for $80 game is filling at 1000 points = 1c.... I know my score averages 2,500,000 points, that's $25 on the meter... that'll be an AP game for me. Oh, I played, got a good score and lost, but the meter has gone down to 900/cent points. Time to move on.'.
Much simpler than an EV number to the casual player, but the information is there for the player who wants to dig in further.
Course, it being digital pinball, I have no idea if the game is FAIR and the same every time I play. AHigh will tell me it is, and no doubt it is... but that's going to be a question mark over it. Maybe when it looks to be a positive game, maybe a little bounce here goes a little different there and the ball drains... oh dear, Mr Hotshot, didn't get your score!
Quote: AxelWolf
1. Flush Attack: Very fun profitable and popular, it did last a fairly long time at SOME casinos but the big casinos took them out quickly. Probably all gone now.
2. house a rocking (same concept ) fail
3. Max attack: (same concept ) fail
4. Clock Time VP 2 casinos Fail quickly.
5. Bonus Run: fun profitable FAIL (6 or 7 casinos)
6. Hurricane zone slots: fun, profitable and popular. Fail
7. X factor fail
8. hopping spree: fail
9. Break the bank AKA PIG machines, great new concept .Fail? Id say so.
10. IGT Vision machines AKA cherry pie, diamond mine, racing 7s and a long list of other versions at least 15. Not sure if i can say fail, but 99% are now gone. IGT pushed them on the market. Any other company would have failed quickly.
11. IGT Vision Super diamond mine: FAIL only a few casinos (1?)
12. Green Stamps: Fail
13. Bingo slots: all forms, 3 versions I know of. Fail.
14. Super Patriot: only 1 casino I know of Circus Circus Fail. ( should be 1 on the list)
15. Jewel machines: only seen at MGM Bellagio. Fail.
16. Net Pay Bellagio/beau rivage. Fail in months
17. Globe Shopping. Fail in months
18. Fist series of Linked Must hits at station casinos (not really a fail, but not a big winner)
19. Money Time: Fail.
20. Indiana Jones: Fail less than 2 years.
21. Odyssey: Had many AP games, however they just went away, not sure why. But, they were new unique and different great graphics.
22. Hot Reels: New unique, great concept, cross between multi line VP and slots. A few version were over 100% like FPDW that could have been easily changed
23. Maze slots: At Bellagio, Fail in months.
24. Black Out Video poker: Failed in months, 2 or 3 casinos.
25. ANCHOR GAMING: Entire system was customized (popular and fun for everyone) and attached to every machine in Mandalay Bay. It was entirely ripped out after a few months.
.
Wow, look at all these neat games. I had no idea.
If there was a problem, they couldn't be tweaked?
Damm, I missed out.
They all made money for the house especially Flush Attack. Sigma failed as a hole eventually .But they had good Ideas that made the games fun for tourists and locals easily understood with a excitement factor.Quote: terapinedWow, look at all these neat games. I had no idea.
If there was a problem, they couldn't be tweaked?
Damm, I missed out.
Some of the games were tweaked, but occasionally it made them even better for AP's.
IGT started hidden displays(VISION series), but that defeated the purpose. Tweaking them mostly defeated the purpose.
There's many more I didn't mention.
Quote: AxelWolfI do see some problems if they are presenting this as an advantage play game and its not set to over 100% achievable by a good player, I see a casino getting sued.
.
Ahigh seems incapable of answering my question
directly. He has to use the words AP in the same
way it's understood by the gaming community, he
can't make up his own definition.
An AP (play or player) has a mathematical edge
over the casino that can be proven. It's not a
person who might win sometimes. If Ahigh's game
cannot be beaten consistently, then he cannot
call it an AP game. This seems to be it's big
selling point, the one he's counting on to get people
to fork over a hundy on a regular basis. Without
it, it's just an over priced arcade game.
Quote: EvenBobAhigh seems incapable of answering my question
directly. He has to use the words AP in the same
way it's understood by the gaming community, he
can't make up his own definition.
An AP (play or player) has a mathematical edge
over the casino that can be proven. It's not a
person who might win sometimes. If Ahigh's game
cannot be beaten consistently, then he cannot
call it an AP game. This seems to be it's big
selling point, the one he's counting on to get people
to fork over a hundy on a regular basis. Without
it, it's just an over priced arcade game.
Calling me incapable is not likely to yield favorable results.
Maybe you would be able to be a little more polite and I could unblock your posts.
For now know that I have you and others blocked after being given this suggestion by the wizard.
Quote: AhighCalling me incapable is not likely to yield favorable results.
.
And again you avoid the question. It's obvious
your game does not do what you imply it does,
or you would come right out and say an AP can
get ahead of the casino and stay ahead. Anything
else is not considered AP. Casinos are not
terrified of advantage players because they win
once in awhile. It's because consistently win more
than they lose.
Quote: EvenBobAnd again you avoid the question. It's obvious
your game does not do what you imply it does,
or you would come right out and say an AP can
get ahead of the casino and stay ahead. Anything
else is not considered AP. Casinos are not
terrified of advantage players because they win
once in awhile. It's because consistently win more
than they lose.
It's been proven long ago that Ahigh's definition of AP and many other gambling standards are different than everyone else's.
He's claimed major casinos switched dice to cheat players. He's claimed he is the best dice controller he's ever seen. He's been kicked out of multiple casinos including one for bringing in a counting/tracking device.
Now he has an arcade game that serious gamblers are taking dozens of pages of conversation to attempt to figure out yet it expected your average uninformed (and not that interested in becoming informed) gambler will not only understand it but plop at least $100 into it every play.
ZCore13
Quote: Zcore13yet it's expected your average uninformed (and not that interested in becoming informed) gambler will not only understand it but plop at least $100 into it every play.
Here's the bottom line. There are some serious
pinball players still out there, young guys in
their 20's who can rack up thousands of points
and are very hard to beat. They can certainly
beat the pants off of all the guys on Ahigh's
staff. If this game can be beaten as Ahigh is
implying (yet not admitting), the pinball experts
will close it down in a week.
I can only assume we are not being told what's
really going on here and Ahigh is using the words
AP in a cavalier fashion, as you pointed out he
likes to do with other aspects of gambling.
I can't see why this in not the case. Take a 9/6 progressive with a .5% meter, due to bad players this can be profitable for an AP and the casinos.Quote: EvenBobAP can
get ahead of the casino and stay ahead. .
Comes close to breaking Missions rule ☺Quote: Ahigh
Maybe you would be able to be a little more polite and I could unblock your posts.
Quote: AxelWolfI can't see why this in not the case. Take a 9/6 progressive with a .5% meter, due to bad players this can be profitable for an AP and the casinos.
So if a pinball AP plays badly on purpose for awhile,
he can consistently win and stay ahead of the casino?
Why would the casino want a machine that did that?
Quote: AxelWolfComes close to breaking Missions rule ☺
Do all the mods make rules now?
Quote: petroglyphDo all the mods make rules now?
Ill let you know if this question gets answered.Quote: 1BB
I have a post sale question about the hierarchy of our administrators. Is the Wizard still the boss or are all five "greens" now equal?
Quote: AxelWolfIll let you know if this question gets answered.
Thanks. I'd ask it again but that would be a violation of Rule 5.
That Does not make sense it would work that way.Quote: EvenBobSo if a pinball AP plays badly on purpose for awhile,
he can consistently win and stay ahead of the casino?
Why would the casino want a machine that did that?
You can probably only get out part of what was lost previously. IE ploppy loses 1k in EV. AP gets $900 in EV house keeps $100 in EV. Everyone has a good time even the ploppy in entertainment value.
I'm not sure why it's hard to understand how its possible for an AP and the casinos to have an advantage overall . I'm not 100% sure how Ahigh's program is set up(possibly he doesn't either), but I understand how its simple to do in various ways.
Quote: AxelWolf
You can probably only get out part of what was lost previously. IE ploppy loses 1k in EV.
How do you get ploppies to donate 1K
in losses if they never win? This sounds
like one of those deals where if all the
ducks are lined up in a row, if this
happens and that happens, a pinball
AP might come along and win something.
Consistently? Nope. Get ahead and stay
ahead? Double nope. Calling it AP play is
stretching it to the limit, to say the least.
It's not AP play as we know it.
In EV not actual. Winning or losing may not affect it.Quote: EvenBobHow do you get ploppies to donate 1K
in losses if they never win? This sounds
like one of those deals where if all the
ducks are lined up in a row, if this
happens and that happens, a pinball
AP might come along and win something.
Consistently? Nope. Get ahead and stay
ahead? Double nope. Calling it AP play is
stretching it to the limit, to say the least.
It's not AP play as we know it.
Who said they wont win? it's possible for a ploppster to close his eyes and get the EV over 100%.
Quote: AxelWolf
Who said they wont win? it's possible for a ploppster to close his eyes and get the EV over 100%.
Arrguh!! This is totally confusing, I'm trying to
get it, imagine the ignorant player. How does
he have a chance? I can't even get Ahigh to
say if you can get ahead and stay ahead of
the casino. A ploppie will never play this twice.
ZCore13
Quote: EvenBobHow do you get ploppies to donate 1K
in losses if they never win? This sounds
like one of those deals where if all the
ducks are lined up in a row, if this
happens and that happens, a pinball
AP might come along and win something.
Consistently? Nope. Get ahead and stay
ahead? Double nope. Calling it AP play is
stretching it to the limit, to say the least.
It's not AP play as we know it.
What part of this didn't you understand ? it could be set up like this.Quote: AxelWolfI can't see why this in not the case. Take a 9/6 progressive with a .5% meter, due to bad players this can be profitable for an AP and the casinos.
Quote: AxelWolfWhat part of this didn't you understand ? it could be set up like this.
I don't understand how this lets an AP get ahead
and stay ahead of the casino. Could you explain
how it does that? Apparently Ahigh has no idea
how to explain it.
Quote: Zcore13It's been proven long ago that Ahigh's definition of AP and many other gambling standards are different than everyone else's.
Can you provide a link for this? This seems like a real serious accusation. This thread is about a new product in our gaming world. If you can't back this up you are messing with another mans money.Quote:He's claimed major casinos switched dice to cheat players.
Are you saying you've seen a better dc?Quote:He's claimed he is the best dice controller he's ever seen.
And somehow you see something wrong with this? Here,,,really, there is something wrong after announcing this weeks ago, inviting everyone on the board to G2e, you find something wrong with serious gamblers using up dozens of virtual pages to discuss Ahighs product. I don't get it?Quote:Now he has an arcade game that serious gamblers are taking dozens of pages of conversation to attempt to figure out yet it expected your average uninformed (and not that interested in becoming informed) gambler will not only understand it but plop at least $100 into it every play.
I can only theorize exactly how, I didn't write the software. However I do believe its highly possible. Certainly how it was set up at the show or even close.Quote: EvenBobI don't understand how this lets an AP get ahead
and stay ahead of the casino. Could you explain
how it does that? Apparently Ahigh has no idea
how to explain it.
Not sure why the 9/6 progressive example isn't enough to realize its easily possible.
Bonus banking slots or must hit by are also examples.
Possibly a certain bet and win amounts are set to have a 101% theoretical at all times, assuming you play very well.
You could have a VP set at 100.1 And not even the best VP players could play it perfectly enough to gain an advantage. You must think AP's sit and play machines and games that are theoretically over 100% only and all day. That's RARE.
Quote: petroglyphCan you provide a link for this?
Are you joking? He talked about it for
weeks here.
Quote: AxelWolfI can only theorize exactly how, I didn't write the software. .
I've been told the bottom line is, the casino
has the choice to make the outcome in
favor of the player or in favor of the casino,
no matter how good the player is. So why
in god's name would any casino make it in
favor of the player? They can do that with
any slot machine. Do they? They're in business
to make money, not give it away.
Quote: EvenBobAre you joking? He talked about it for
weeks here.
No, not joking. Those words directly accusing a casino of switching dice to "cheat" a player. If I just don't remember I will certainly apologize. I remember conversations [but not verbatim] about dice not being 100.00% true. A lot about math. The craps videos [I liked those], but I don't recall that. Can you show me Bob?
Bob, come on. Ahigh may not always be right, but he's a pretty honest guy. He's a lot of things. He says its possible. Have you played it? If there were "the way" would you really expect him to put it out on the internet?
That back door is just for those in the know Bob, sorry you didn't get the memo.
Quote: EvenBobI've been told the bottom line is, the casino
has the choice to make the outcome in
favor of the player or in favor of the casino,
no matter how good the player is. So why
in god's name would any casino make it in
favor of the player? They can do that with
any slot machine. Do they? They're in business
to make money, not give it away.
it's to my understanding they can set the advantage that a skilled player can get (using the$100 min) as high as 20% or down to xxx? since they might have to set the average payback to 75% to disallow anyone from gaining over 100% they may not want to do that.
Quote: petroglyphHave you played it? If there were "the way" would you really expect him to put it out on the internet?
I'm just trying to get him to back up
what he said he would back up.
That's all.
Quote: EvenBobI'm just trying to get him to back up
what he said he would back up.
That's all.
What do you want? Proof of the possibility of AP, where it can be a win win at the Wynn?
Just suppose he gives you what you want to your satisfaction, what does he get? Bob's seal of approval? And if so is there somewhere he can cash that?
Quote: petroglyphJust suppose he gives you what you want to your satisfaction, what does he get?
He started this. I posted what was said
on the radio and he said it just wasn't
true, they got it wrong. He said he would
explain it and 2 days later he now refuses
to. Why is that.
I just listened to it AGAIN, and nothing Mike
said has been disproved by Ahigh. At the
end when Munch hears the min to play
is $100, he says 'that's crazy, that's just
crazy.'
I do appreciate the support from the forum members here who do see the vision and can appreciate the hard work that our team at NanoTech Gaming Labs has put into this project. It has been a tremendous amount of work and a passion and drive to do something noteworthy.
I know for a fact that we surpassed our goals for G2E.
I am looking forward to explaining further about how this game and math model works. It should be tons of fun.
If you're still not understanding the big picture, sit tight, and I expect things will develop into a clearer picture as time goes by.
Quote: AhighHey, thanks for everyone's interest. I know that EB and Zcore will eventually figure things out. ]
Already figured it out, it doesn't do what
you claim it does. If it did, you'd be
defending it, and you're completely
silent when certain questions are
asked.
This is my first post to the forum and I, like Aaron, am here to promote Vegas 2047 and to answer any questions as best as I can.
I've read through the thread and really appreciate the comments and criticisms from everyone. Keep 'em coming by all means!
I encourage everyone to watch Aaron's video walking through a full play of the game, read the description of the game posted on NanoTech's website, and stay tuned to our Facebook page for news and updates.
I will state flatly that Vegas 2047 is Advantage Playable, that the Player's skill absolutely affects the chance to win, and that there is absolutely no exposure to the casino whatsoever. Before we even began designing table layouts, Aaron and I were ensuring that our math model would pass regulation, while being attractive to AP gamblers as well as pinball fans.
I'm very thankful to have a crowd of intelligent people contributing to this thread, and see negative comments and predictions of failure as challenges and obstacles to overcome and address. We knew from the start that we would be fighting an uphill battle. I know that even though Vegas 2047 was received positively at the G2E show, we still have plenty of explaining and convincing to do.
I firmly believe that the casino is money-motivated, and that the casino-goer is mainly looking for value for their money and a good chance to win. Every decision our team has made has been with those beliefs in mind. I believe that Vegas 2047 is only a sample of what NanoTech Gaming Labs is capable of, and a first step in leading the Casino industry in a new direction.
Please feel free to contact me privately through PM or email, or publicly to this thread.
Have fun!
STV
Quote: stv2047Hey folks,
This is my first post to the forum and I, like Aaron, am here to promote Vegas 2047 and to answer any questions as best as I can.
I've read through the thread and really appreciate the comments and criticisms from everyone. Keep 'em coming by all means!
I encourage everyone to watch Aaron's video walking through a full play of the game, read the description of the game posted on NanoTech's website, and stay tuned to our Facebook page for news and updates.
I will state flatly that Vegas 2047 is Advantage Playable, that the Player's skill absolutely affects the chance to win, and that there is absolutely no exposure to the casino whatsoever. Before we even began designing table layouts, Aaron and I were ensuring that our math model would pass regulation, while being attractive to AP gamblers as well as pinball fans.
I'm very thankful to have a crowd of intelligent people contributing to this thread, and see negative comments and predictions of failure as challenges and obstacles to overcome and address. We knew from the start that we would be fighting an uphill battle. I know that even though Vegas 2047 was received positively at the G2E show, we still have plenty of explaining and convincing to do.
I firmly believe that the casino is money-motivated, and that the casino-goer is mainly looking for value for their money and a good chance to win. Every decision our team has made has been with those beliefs in mind. I believe that Vegas 2047 is only a sample of what NanoTech Gaming Labs is capable of, and a first step in leading the Casino industry in a new direction.
Please feel free to contact me privately through PM or email, or publicly to this thread.
Have fun!
STV
You sound very level headed and intelligent. Thanks for bringing those traits to this discussion from your businesses side.
ZCore13
Quote: stv2047
I will state flatly that Vegas 2047 is Advantage Playable, that the Player's skill absolutely affects the chance to win,
How advantage playable, can an AP get
ahead and stay ahead playing it? If he
cannot, then it's not an AP machine.
How much does the players skill affect
the outcome? 50%? Higher than 50%?
Quote: EvenBobHow advantage playable, can an AP get
ahead and stay ahead playing it? If he
cannot, then it's not an AP machine.
How much does the players skill affect
the outcome? 50%? Higher than 50%?
Never wise up a chump. Never wise up a chump.
Quote: thecesspitNever wise up a chump. Never wise up a chump.
I'm the chump here, cause I sure ain't getting
wised up.
Quote: EvenBobI'm the chump here, cause I sure ain't getting
wised up.
I deleted my attempt at a witty comment relating to the signal to noise ratio. But honestly, EB, it would be nice if I felt your comments were a bit more constructive. Ultimately, it would be nice if we could stay on topic and not have to deal with a bunch of nonsense.
Quote: EvenBobHow advantage playable, can an AP get
ahead and stay ahead playing it? If he
cannot, then it's not an AP machine.
How much does the players skill affect
the outcome? 50%? Higher than 50%?
Getting ahead and staying ahead, IMO, assumes that you have enough data and have been playing the game long enough to state that you're "Advantage Playing it". However, you could just be getting lucky. In the short run. My short answer to your short question is, yes!
The amount that Player skill can affect the Chance to Win (not the OUTCOME, since that is determined randomly) is based on a number of factors: initial bet and goal pay amounts, operator settings such as house edge, local regulated minimum payout, and the history of all previous Player scores and Bets. I believe that Aaron posted up information regarding the settings we suggest a casino to use and those we used at the show. They are (from memory)
75% minimum payout
5% house edge at $100
1% house edge at $500
23% maximum Player Advantage
In simple terms, that means that (with enough plays) a Player who earns the best score on the machine will earn a 23% Advantage on that Bet.
A Player who earns an average score will give the House 1% edge for that Bet.
A Player who earns the worst score will give the House 25% edge for that Bet.
To the stipulation that there be existing theoretical Advantage to be won by the Player. Since we started filling the score database, I've noticed this phenomenon of being 'locked out' of earning more Advantage only twice.
Quote: stv2047To the stipulation that there be existing theoretical Advantage to be won by the Player. Since we started filling the score database, I've noticed this phenomenon of being 'locked out' of earning more Advantage only twice.
When a player earns a 23% player edge and they are attempting to win less than 23% of their risked/bet amount, the win amount is not increased.
This prevents the system from invoking the "veto" that would normally prevent the game from paying out more positive EV than what has already been captured from less than average scores previously.
However, when the average score for a machine increases over time, there will be an occasional game when the positive EV has been tapped out while the average score for the lifetime of operation is being significantly increased from one game to the next. This generally only happens a few times .. ever. Once the average score peaks, it no longer happens at all, in general.
Eventually the average score will decrease and an excess of +EV will be stored. And as Stephen has stated, it is extremely rare that the game is tapped out of EV to award an above average performance. We have been playing this game for quite some time now and we monitor the numbers.
There is also an option to reduce the effect of skill to allow players to tone down the effect of skill on the delta EV for the game. The operator can clamp out the most positive EV and the player can also lessen the effect of skill on the EV as well.
This affects the weighting of the bet amounts in the score history by the delta in EV. In STV's example above, a weight of 1.23 - .75 = .48 is modulated by the bet amount to come up with the weight. If the player chose to reduce the effect of skill by one half before launching the ball, that value would be .24 and the EV range would be 87% payback to +11% player advantage. A pure chance game with the skill component effecting the EV of the bet resolution would have a zero weight and would not affect the score percentile of subsequent games at all and would apply the average house edge no matter what the score in the game is.
Quote: stv2047In the short run. My short answer to your short question is, yes!
I'm sure you know the short run is irrelevant,
my wife gets ahead on slots in the short run
all the time. AP's are concerned with the
long run. Can playing your machine in a
skilled manner get you ahead and keep you
ahead of the casino. If it cannot, than it
can't be considered advantage play.
Quote: stv2047In simple terms, that means that (with enough plays) a Player who earns the best score on the machine will earn a 23% Advantage on that Bet.
A 23% advantage, what does that mean. A 23% edge?
Quote: EvenBobA 23% advantage, what does that mean. A 23% edge?
Yes. That means if you bet $100,000 to win $23,000, and you got the highest score on the game that has ever been seen before, you would win $23,000 with zero chance to lose in return for making the high score.
You can see a tiny sliver of chance to lose because the score I poked in there was just under the highest score in the history.
Quote: mipletWhile I suck at pinball, I did like the game. Do you have a list of scores from the show? Where was I (Adam Cohen) on the list? If this was at a casino, I would play it at what I play table games at: $5 to a max of $20. I like how you can choose how much you win. It might be better if there were more like a paytable of win amounts like a side bet.
We will be making a "for amusement only" pinball game (different theme) and the expected price per game will be very much the same as a regular pinball game.
This is just a different animal from what you want, and I apologize. But you can still gamble $100 a hundred times and it will cost you a buck on average per game at 99% payback, which I would hope you can find. You can even turn off the skill component so it doesn't penalize you for sucking at pinball. Personally, I'd rather play for a buck a game in the high limit table game room if it were me. This would be wise to set up as a loss leader to encourage folks to get more serious about winning big money. But there will be an arcade version coming out too. It might even be available first, I just don't know how long it will take to get into the casino.
If you're playing in the high limit room "for drinks" as they say. I would bet $100 to win $1 and play until I lose. You would expect to play 100 games on average before losing on the 101st game with a zero edge. With a 1% edge, you will lose about twice on average in 101 games instead of only once costing you $1 per game instead of coming out even. Turning off the skill component is all you need to have a good time without paying too much.
*This thread is akin to new parents posting pics of their newborn child and hoping others don't post that it's ugly*
Quote: MrVDoes your game have a "tilt" feature, and if so how sensitive is it?
*This thread is akin to new parents posting pics of their newborn child and hoping others don't post that it's ugly*
Funny comment about the baby.
Yes, there is a tilt feature, but it was disabled for the show.
https://ntek.com/mot-ionkit.php
This is the hardware that we make that's the industry standard for tilt on digital pinball machines. It works quite well for both plunger, general I/O, and tilt. However we already have new IRQ-based inputs for nanosecond latency instead of 5ms average latency we get on the USB controller, and we are revamping our tilt hardware for casino applications as it is more demanding than what we have available for the home market.
Specifically, the casino cabinet is a heavier cabinet than a regular pinball game. So the tilt feature is a little bit different than for a cabinet that can be moved around more easily. Also, the casino operator can, at their discretion, disable the tilt, and play may be considered more fair when tilt is disabled as it was for the show. Tilt tends to favor a personality-type that is a little bit more muscular, and I'm not truly sure that this is an objective for gambling (to enable physical strength to determine winnings).
But, again, short answer is that we do have the technical ability to support tilt.
Quote: AhighYes. That means if you bet $100,000 to win $23,000, and you got the highest score on the game that has ever been seen before, you would win $23,000 with zero chance to lose in return for making the high score.
So in order to stay ahead, as an AP does,
you have to get the best score every time
you play. You realize that's impossible, right?
And if you bet $100, you win $23 if you can
beat the highest score ever gotten every
time. Do I have it correct?
You are right, this is indeed advantage play.
It's out of the range of every human on the
planet, but it is AP. Kind of. Theoretically.
Hilariously.
Thanks for finally clearing this up..
