AN AP NIGHTMARE
You think he's the kids' biological father?
What, did he phone it in?
That’s a real possibility since he obviously doesn’t believe in protection for his phone.Quote: MrVThe guy is fresh out of prison and on parole after serving a six year stint, IIRC.
You think he's the kids' biological father?
What, did he phone it in?
In the context of the story, I have to say the daughter is in on it, in my opinion. Everything sets up too well for her to flip out and play an aggrieved party. More than that, I’m not sure how the fiancé can really hide it from her, even for a few days, given that it sounds like they’re always together.
What makes her position unique is deniability, so no matter how it goes down, she can come out all right. If stuff goes down with the fiancé, she can either deny all knowledge...or at least deny preknowledge. If everything goes well and they’re looking on course to get away with it; she can always do that and then make her amends later on down the road, or keep both the money and the denial.
The only reason I feel this way is why have someone who can nark on you everywhere you are? She can call DarkOz and give up the fiancé anytime, and likely would, if she came to find out about the theft and legitimately didn’t know before that.
For that reason, if the fiancé jacked it, is already ducking his PO and looking at two years; one would think you take the cash and get the hell out of Dodge ASAP and with as little baggage as possible. No female fiancé, no kids (particularly if they’re not his, doesn’t sound like they would be as it doesn’t sound like they’ve been together extremely long). Vaya con dios and see all of you in hell, you know?
The only way that’s not the plan is if the male fiancé expected to get away with it, but once it’s blown up, again, you take the hell off. Alone. Again, unless the kids are biologically his, but it doesn’t sound like they’ve been together that long.
Again, not speaking to the truth of the story, how the hell would I know? I’m just saying I can’t conceive of a scenario in which the daughter doesn’t know about it. But, again, she still has deniability, I guess, especially if the guy agrees not to rat her out for knowing if HE gets caught.
Running at an 8.5/10 for storytelling in my book so far, fact or fiction, and that’s a really good score! Here’s hoping for a strong finish.
Quote: MrVThe guy is fresh out of prison and on parole after serving a six year stint, IIRC.
You think he's the kids' biological father?
What, did he phone it in?
I also pointed out the possibility that he was a Father Figure to the kids, not a biological father but still loved them as his own. If he didn't care about the kids he would have dumped the kids off at Dark's house and go own the run with only Dark's daughter OR just go on the run by himself. Taking the kids with him shows he sees himself as a Father Figure to them.
Quote: NathanI also pointed out the possibility that he was a Father Figure to the kids, not a biological father but still loved them as his own. If he didn't care about the kids he would have dumped the kids off at Dark's house and go own the run with only Dark's daughter OR just go on the run by himself. Taking the kids with him shows he sees himself as a Father Figure to them.
I guess. I sometimes watch a show called, “I Almost Got Away With It,” and guys on the run do stupid stuff from time to time. Make contact with loved ones, the whole nine.
I still can’t wrap my head around any scenario where she doesn’t know about it. They flip off, pack everything and take off out of DarkOz’ ex-wife’s all because DarkOz made an accusation? If she doesn’t know about it, why would she go storming out of there? Just sounds like a win-win for her because she can use being angry at the accusation as a justification for storming out even though she knew about it the whole time. Like I said, plausible deniability, especially if the fiancé has already agreed not to take her down with him if he goes.
Quote: cmlotitoToo bad Jerry Springer is no longer in production. This would be ratings gold.....GOLD I TELL YA!
cash me ou'side, how bou' dah
Quote: RScash me ou'side, how bou' dah
“I only said I THOUGHT she kidnapped herself, you’re the one who’s so f———g certain!”
“That’s right, Dude. 100% certain.”
Quote: Mission146I guess. I sometimes watch a show called, “I Almost Got Away With It,” and guys on the run do stupid stuff from time to time.
Should look into Masterminds. The best of the bad.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0434702/
Plant the cards, keep the cash. Then you have a simple answer: the girlfriend was keeping the cash elsewhere.
I am reminded, for some reason, of the movie Sideways where the Paul Giamatti character needs cash and steals from his Mom.
Actually, over the past several weeks / few months, I've started to restructure how some bankroll management (EG: where the money is) is done. I keep as little as possible at home, now. Thankfully, I usually don't even need too much money for what I'm playing. If my house gets burglarized (knock on wood), yeah it's obviously gonna suck because no one wants to lose money and have to go through all that BS....but it's not going to be devastating.
As far as APs who use a LOT of money frequently, I really have no idea how to go about that. The only thing I could possibly think of is to have a decoy stash or have several stashes around the house, so that if you do get burglarized, hopefully the burglar finds the easy money, thinks that's all of it, then gets out. The other way to go about it would be to set up front money and lines of credit at the casino....unfortunately, that's kinda tough especially if you're playing at multiple places and/or don't wanna give up your name and whatnot.
The other possible solution would be to own multiple safe deposit boxes around town or areas that you frequent and only carry a small amount of cash on you, then if you do need a lot of money, go to the nearest SDB you have.
Quote: LottoballsPretty simple, call police, don’t mention players cards. Tell them about Mr. Felon on parole soon to be son in law. He goes to Prison, money is likely gone.
I disagree because it sounds like DarkOz has more interest in the money and particularly the cards than in homeboy going to prison. It sounds like he’s pursuing the path that would give him some chance at actual recovery of this stuff.
Also, he had no proof of any kind against anyone when all of this started. Even forensics (if it went that far) would be unlikely to do anything because there is no reason the guy’s prints and DNA shouldn’t be here and there in the house. He apparently recently cleaned the house.
As DarkOz points out, the whole situation with the phone isn’t usually something that would fall into someone’s lap or could be expected to. A smart criminal would destroy any phone containing any conversation that even hints at any wrongdoing completely.
Quote: Mission146I disagree because it sounds like DarkOz has more interest in the money and particularly the cards than in homeboy going to prison. It sounds like he’s pursuing the path that would give him some chance at actual recovery of this stuff.
Also, he had no proof of any kind against anyone when all of this started. Even forensics (if it went that far) would be unlikely to do anything because there is no reason the guy’s prints and DNA shouldn’t be here and there in the house. He apparently recently cleaned the house.
As DarkOz points out, the whole situation with the phone isn’t usually something that would fall into someone’s lap or could be expected to. A smart criminal would destroy any phone containing any conversation that even hints at any wrongdoing completely.
It's also a pretty shady operation. Not something you want police sniffing around. I would venture there's a pretty good chance of Federal Title 31 violations with multiple cards and cash machines being used.
ZCore13
Quote: RSWhat’s Title 31 have to do with DarkOz in this case? Do you know what Title 31 is?
Lol. You're funny.
ZCore13
Quote: Zcore13It's also a pretty shady operation. Not something you want police sniffing around. I would venture there's a pretty good chance of Federal Title 31 violations with multiple cards and cash machines being used.
ZCore13
You have a players card
You download your freeplay
You gamble at that slot machine
You print out your voucher
You go to a machine
You get your money
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
Quote: darkoz
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
Hmm, lets see. You and your 'crew'
of co-conspirators go into casinos
and using players cards not in your
name, dump a ton of cash that god
knows where you got it from, to turn
around and use the offers you get to
make a cash profit on the original
cash that nobody knows the origin of.
With players cards that belong to
other people.
Naw, why would a Fed prosecutor
think this might be money laundering.
Quote: EvenBobQuote: darkoz
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
Hmm, lets see. You and your 'crew'
of co-conspirators go into casinos
and using players cards not in your
name, dump a ton of cash that god
knows where you got it from, to turn
around and use the offers you get to
make a cash profit on the original
cash that nobody knows the origin of.
With players cards that belong to
other people.
Naw, why would a Fed prosecutor
think this might be money laundering.
Lol
I have over $100,000 in slot jackpots taxes paid
Guess there goes your theory of where does the money come from
Quote: EvenBobQuote: darkoz
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
Hmm, lets see. You and your 'crew'
of co-conspirators go into casinos
and using players cards not in your
name, dump a ton of cash that god
knows where you got it from, to turn
around and use the offers you get to
make a cash profit on the original
cash that nobody knows the origin of.
With players cards that belong to
other people.
Naw, why would a Fed prosecutor
think this might be money laundering.
Suspicious
Activity
Reports
Can be filed for any dollar amount. Not just $2,000 or more. No name of the suspected perpetrator is needed to file a report. But obviously who wants to waste time submitting a report with no suspects name.
Quote: darkozYou have a players card
You download your freeplay
You gamble at that slot machine
You print out your voucher
You go to a machine
You get your money
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
You have dozens of cards with other players names on them. Every amount of cash should go to you, not other names. Every cash out should go to you, not other names. You said he usually uses machines. If you have a lot of cashouts in a day and he went to the cage, they would notice and start tracking you. You are avoiding that.
Don't pretend the shadyness stops at one play. Once you start, the line keeps creeping more and more as you go.
ZCore13
Quote: darkoz
I have over $100,000 in slot jackpots taxes paid
Gee, I bet they never heard of people
paying taxes on part of their net
to cover up the money laundering.
Quote: FinsRuleI’ve always thought of you as the moral compass of this forum...
Quote: EvenBobGee, I bet they never heard of people
paying taxes on part of their net
to cover up the money laundering.
Al Capone didn't.
Quote: SOOPOOI've been silent. I think I was skeptical from the very beginning. But now that the criminal 'accidentally left his non-password protected phone' with 'incriminating pictures;
Let me get this straight. The victim
first tells everybody he knows,
almost, where he stores money
in his house. Then when he's
inevitably robbed by his daughters
convict boyfriend, the BF takes
fun pictures of what he stole
on his own phone and leaves it
where people who know the story
can find it.
If this were a true story, it would
be hard to rate the victim and
perp IQ wise, without being really
insulting to both of them.
Quote: djatcI am interested in how AP's with big chunks of cash keep it hidden. Obviously I don't need to know the exact details of your particular method but a general breakdown would be something I'd like to find out. PM me if it's sensitive information. People who actually do this, not wannabes who have like 10k in their backyard or something.
Shred it and put it in the attic for insulation. Bonus, it is hours of entertainment piecing it back together when needed.
Quote: djatcPeople who actually do this, not wannabes who have like 10k in their backyard or something.
Wat? I have 10k in my backyard.
It's below a very realistic looking pile of dog poop, that marks the spot with a jar attached and buried underneath. Sometimes I unroll toilet paper and lay 100 dollars bills along the paper then roll it back up and put it in the back of the cabinet. Hardly foolproof or fireproof.
Quote: rxwineSometimes I unroll toilet paper and lay 100 dollars bills along the paper then roll it back up and put it in the back of the cabinet. Hardly foolproof or fireproof.
That could get very expensive very fast if you have diarrhea.
Quote: djatcI am interested in how AP's with big chunks of cash keep it hidden. Obviously I don't need to know the exact details of your particular method but a general breakdown would be something I'd like to find out. PM me if it's sensitive information. People who actually do this, not wannabes who have like 10k in their backyard or something.
Real OGs keep it in they sock so it gets a lil damp and sweaty when searching for UX. Plus no one would look there.
Quote: Zcore13Quote: darkozYou have a players card
You download your freeplay
You gamble at that slot machine
You print out your voucher
You go to a machine
You get your money
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
You have dozens of cards with other players names on them. Every amount of cash should go to you, not other names. Every cash out should go to you, not other names. You said he usually uses machines. If you have a lot of cashouts in a day and he went to the cage, they would notice and start tracking you. You are avoiding that.
Don't pretend the shadyness stops at one play. Once you start, the line keeps creeping more and more as you go.
ZCore13
Your accusation is that this may fall under anti-money laundering title 31 laws
Money laundering is trying to turn dirty cash (i.e.cash gotten from criminality like drugs or ANY type of untraceable crime) into a traceable source of cash.
I commit no crimes
Money is made through "traceable" means i.e. casino offers. Every single players card had trackable play and even if they did not, there is no crime playing in a casino.
Please explain why gambling with clean cash from person A and clean cash from person B equals dirty criminal cash.
BtW - cashout from a machine is not illegal either (otherwise the casino would not offer the choice.) You have to come up with a better explanation than simply this guy never uses long lines at a cashier's and prefer simple efficient redemption machines offered by every casino in the world
Quote: EvenBobQuote: darkoz
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
Hmm, lets see. You and your 'crew'
of co-conspirators go into casinos
and using players cards not in your
name, dump a ton of cash that god
knows where you got it from, to turn
around and use the offers you get to
make a cash profit on the original
cash that nobody knows the origin of.
With players cards that belong to
other people.
Naw, why would a Fed prosecutor
think this might be money laundering.
Any casino’s written materials that I’ve seen, not that I’ve thoroughly perused them all, state free play has no cash value. I suspect that’s why the only prosecutions I’ve seen for anything along these lines have been for inside jobs. (Putting Free Play on cards with no play, hosts putting free play on the cards of other people, then giving the PINS and cards to different people still, then using the free play).
As DarkOz points out, all of his cards, according to him, are being used with permission of the people to whom the cards belong.
When there’s a conviction for picking up free play on a card that you had permission to use, let me know. I certainly haven’t seen one yet.
Quote: Zcore13
You have dozens of cards with other players names on them. Every amount of cash should go to you, not other names. Every cash out should go to you, not other names. You said he usually uses machines. If you have a lot of cashouts in a day and he went to the cage, they would notice and start tracking you. You are avoiding that.
Don't pretend the shadyness stops at one play. Once you start, the line keeps creeping more and more as you go.
ZCore13
Why would they necessarily notice that? I know you work tables, so I mean no offense when I ask if you’ve ever paid attention to the cage? You have people go up with three-ten tickets all the time and scan them out at once. You have people who toss in a $20 or $100, then they have a decent hit, cash out, pocket the ticket and then put in a different $20 or $100.
Also, if the casino is terribly worried about this as a company, and not just a few individual employees with a hard-on for AP’s, (not saying you) then they could just get rid of the cash out machines, problem solved. Force everyone to go to the cage, ID them all for every transaction. That would also help prevent underage gambling, as it would be a second point of potential contact for the player to be carded.
DarkOz operates on a MUCH bigger scale than I do, at least based upon his claims, but I can say that having to go to the cage to cash my tickets wouldn’t change anything about what I do at all and would honestly be of little to no concern to me.
I think the thing that bothers some employees, not necessarily you, about APs is the fact that all forms of AP that are not a crime stem from something the casino makes possible.
Quote: djatcI am interested in how AP's with big chunks of cash keep it hidden. Obviously I don't need to know the exact details of your particular method but a general breakdown would be something I'd like to find out. PM me if it's sensitive information. People who actually do this, not wannabes who have like 10k in their backyard or something.
$100 bills are the same width as a typical lasagna noodle. $50s work best as a baked ziti. Cook em up and freeze them. A small freezer chest can hold multiple dishes.
Quote: darkozQuote: Zcore13Quote: darkozYou have a players card
You download your freeplay
You gamble at that slot machine
You print out your voucher
You go to a machine
You get your money
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
You have dozens of cards with other players names on them. Every amount of cash should go to you, not other names. Every cash out should go to you, not other names. You said he usually uses machines. If you have a lot of cashouts in a day and he went to the cage, they would notice and start tracking you. You are avoiding that.
Don't pretend the shadyness stops at one play. Once you start, the line keeps creeping more and more as you go.
ZCore13
Your accusation is that this may fall under anti-money laundering title 31 laws
Money laundering is trying to turn dirty cash (i.e.cash gotten from criminality like drugs or ANY type of untraceable crime) into a traceable source of cash.
I commit no crimes
Money is made through "traceable" means i.e. casino offers. Every single players card had trackable play and even if they did not, there is no crime playing in a casino.
Please explain why gambling with clean cash from person A and clean cash from person B equals dirty criminal cash.
BtW - cashout from a machine is not illegal either (otherwise the casino would not offer the choice.) You have to come up with a better explanation than simply this guy never uses long lines at a cashier's and prefer simple efficient redemption machines offered by every casino in the world
The free play comes from casino offers. Where does the cash that creates the adt to earn the offers come from? That's pretty obviously what people are driving at. It's not possible to ramp this up without seed money, even if you can just roll the offers now.
Quote: Zcore13Quote: darkozYou have a players card
You download your freeplay
You gamble at that slot machine
You print out your voucher
You go to a machine
You get your money
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
You have dozens of cards with other players names on them. Every amount of cash should go to you, not other names. Every cash out should go to you, not other names. You said he usually uses machines. If you have a lot of cashouts in a day and he went to the cage, they would notice and start tracking you. You are avoiding that.
Don't pretend the shadyness stops at one play. Once you start, the line keeps creeping more and more as you go.
ZCore13
Using a tito machine is evidence of shady behavior? Really? That's what you're going with?
Quote: darkozQuote: Zcore13Quote: darkozYou have a players card
You download your freeplay
You gamble at that slot machine
You print out your voucher
You go to a machine
You get your money
Please explain where title 31 [anti-money laundering] would come into play
You have dozens of cards with other players names on them. Every amount of cash should go to you, not other names. Every cash out should go to you, not other names. You said he usually uses machines. If you have a lot of cashouts in a day and he went to the cage, they would notice and start tracking you. You are avoiding that.
Don't pretend the shadyness stops at one play. Once you start, the line keeps creeping more and more as you go.
ZCore13
Your accusation is that this may fall under anti-money laundering title 31 laws
Money laundering is trying to turn dirty cash (i.e.cash gotten from criminality like drugs or ANY type of untraceable crime) into a traceable source of cash.
I commit no crimes
Money is made through "traceable" means i.e. casino offers. Every single players card had trackable play and even if they did not, there is no crime playing in a casino.
Please explain why gambling with clean cash from person A and clean cash from person B equals dirty criminal cash.
BtW - cashout from a machine is not illegal either (otherwise the casino would not offer the choice.) You have to come up with a better explanation than simply this guy never uses long lines at a cashier's and prefer simple efficient redemption machines offered by every casino in the world
You don't understand the Title 31 regulations. If you purposely avoid Title 31 filings, you are suseptable to suspicious activity reports and legal issues. Your activities would most likely fall under structuring.
You don't get to decide if your activities relate to something Title 31 is related to(laundering, tax evasion or other financial crimes).
Using other people names/cards in a casino that help you avoid Title 31 tracking is at minimum suspicious activity. Possibly a crime. The Government will decide if what you are doing is a crime, not you or your definition of what you are doing.
You've stupidly posted your information on a public forum where for sure casino executives visit and I'm sure there's a chance law enforcement visits. You've admitted to things that probably violate Title 31 regulations. You are obviously not as smart as you think you are.
ZCore13
Quote: Mission146Why would they necessarily notice that? I know you work tables, so I mean no offense when I ask if you’ve ever paid attention to the cage? You have people go up with three-ten tickets all the time and scan them out at once. You have people who toss in a $20 or $100, then they have a decent hit, cash out, pocket the ticket and then put in a different $20 or $100.
Also, if the casino is terribly worried about this as a company, and not just a few individual employees with a hard-on for AP’s, (not saying you) then they could just get rid of the cash out machines, problem solved. Force everyone to go to the cage, ID them all for every transaction. That would also help prevent underage gambling, as it would be a second point of potential contact for the player to be carded.
DarkOz operates on a MUCH bigger scale than I do, at least based upon his claims, but I can say that having to go to the cage to cash my tickets wouldn’t change anything about what I do at all and would honestly be of little to no concern to me.
I think the thing that bothers some employees, not necessarily you, about APs is the fact that all forms of AP that are not a crime stem from something the casino makes possible.
Casino cage workers are trained to notice that. They are also provided with tools to help them track multiple transactions. Both casinos I've worked at, the cage is in contact with table games daily on transaction that include chips. We call them informing them of large amounts of chips coming there way and they call us if large amount of chips show up. It has absolutely nothing to do with AP. 90% of casino staff wouldn't even know what AP means.
The problem in his situation is he's using other peoples names to play and cash out, which may be avoiding Title 31 reporting. It doesn't look good at all. It's just a matter of time before he gets caught and reported.
ZCore13
Quote: rdw4potus
The free play comes from casino offers. Where does the cash that creates the adt to earn the offers come from? That's pretty obviously what people are driving at. It's not possible to ramp this up without seed money, even if you can just roll the offers now.
Clearly he killed someone to get it. (/sarcasm)
I had a full-time job at a hotel when I first started doing AP. Some AP's start working for other AP's, save up some money (or have a lucky hit) and then branch off and do their own thing.
You guys make it sound like there is no way to earn money (absent a direct paycheck from a company) that is not somehow nefarious. Hell, apparently paychecks from a company are to be considered ill-gotten if they lead to AP, from what I can tell of this conversation.
Quote: Zcore13
You don't understand the Title 31 regulations. If you purposely avoid Title 31 filings, you are suseptable to suspicious activity reports and legal issues. Your activities would most likely fall under structuring.
Using cash out machines? Okay, assuming this is true, how is the casino not aiding and abetting in this Title 31 whatever by providing the means to avoid whatever it is you're talking about?
Quote:You don't get to decide if your activities relate to something Title 31 is related to(laundering, tax evasion or other financial crimes).
Are you the arbiter of whether or not they do?
Quote:Using other people names/cards in a casino that help you avoid Title 31 tracking is at minimum suspicious activity. Possibly a crime. The Government will decide if what you are doing is a crime, not you or your definition of what you are doing.
Can you point to something specific in Title 31 that you think this applies to? I honestly don't think the other cards are being used for what you seem(?) to think they are being used for.
Quote:You've stupidly posted your information on a public forum where for sure casino executives visit and I'm sure there's a chance law enforcement visits. You've admitted to things that probably violate Title 31 regulations. You are obviously not as smart as you think you are.
What probably violates the regulations? Can you point to something concrete? It's really tough to discuss, "Title 31," as some all-encompassing concept without specifics.
Could a person who uses a cashout machine several times a day be violating Title 31 even if he plays on his own card?
Also, if the cashout machines are the big issue here, I fail to see how the casino is not helping the perpetrator commit the alleged crime. The casino is freely providing the tools to do so.
Quote: Zcore13Casino cage workers are trained to notice that. They are also provided with tools to help them track multiple transactions. Both casinos I've worked at, the cage is in contact with table games daily on transaction that include chips. We call them informing them of large amounts of chips coming there way and they call us if large amount of chips show up. It has absolutely nothing to do with AP. 90% of casino staff wouldn't even know what AP means.
They are trained to, 'Notice,' something that always happens? Why would they, "Notice," someone cashing out one or more slot tickets? Generally, you would just combine them all to be one ticket.
Also, most casinos seem to have a limit on how big a ticket the cash machine will cash out, over that limit and the machine instructs you to take it to the cage for specifically that reason. Again, if these things were anything the casino actually cared about and wanted to stop, they could get rid of the cash machines or reduce the limit on how big a ticket they will cash.
They're not going to do that, though, because then they would have to hire more employees to work the cage. They would then have to pay those employees, which is the entire thing being avoided with the use of cash out machines to begin with.
Quote:The problem in his situation is he's using other peoples names to play and cash out, which may be avoiding Title 31 reporting. It doesn't look good at all. It's just a matter of time before he gets caught and reported.
ZCore13
I suppose that would be true if I believed that is why he was using the other cards. However, I suspect that has little to nothing to do with the purpose of the other cards.
My fear is that I will bet that a each of these people who received money from DO for using their cards 'might' have forgotten to declare that income. And it is also possible that DO himself 'might' have forgotten to declare this income of his as well.
Quote: Mission146Clearly he killed someone to get it. (/sarcasm)
I had a full-time job at a hotel when I first started doing AP. Some AP's start working for other AP's, save up some money (or have a lucky hit) and then branch off and do their own thing.
You guys make it sound like there is no way to earn money (absent a direct paycheck from a company) that is not somehow nefarious. Hell, apparently paychecks from a company are to be considered ill-gotten if they lead to AP, from what I can tell of this conversation.
I wasn't trying to take it that far. Just pointing out that "it's free play!" is not a serious answer to the question that was asked.
