2020 Election
Quote: rxwineBECAUSE that's what an innocent person would demand to clear their name. A full and complete investigation is the solution. WHY wasn't he for it if he was so ruined?
Next time a cop asks to search your car, are you going to say "go ahead!"? What's the big deal, you're innocent right?
Quote: beachbumbabs
So I'm gone. This morning I changed my registration to Democrat. Yuck. But there do seem to be at least a few people of reason and moderation left there. And increasingly, I agree with their stances in opposition to what the "Republicans" are doing and how they comport themselves.
Quote: RSNext time a cop asks to search your car, are you going to say "go ahead!"? What's the big deal, you're innocent right?
Know your rights. Be lawyered up if necessary. Document, BUT I stand with the same answer. Everyone should want a full and fair investigation UNLESS you have something to hide.
For the Democrats, I don't know. Probably somebody that's old and everybody is sick of hearing about. Maybe Biden or one of the Dem women that's in the news a lot. It won't be Hillary. She's poison and she's smart enough to know it. I don't think Sanders is going to take a stab at it again, either. He seems to do more good on the sidelines.
Quote: beachbumbabs
So I'm gone. This morning I changed my registration to Democrat.
If you're interested, you should check your state laws to see if you have to register as one or the other.
In Oklahoma, you don't have to register as either Dem or Repub, but if you don't pick they automatically label you as an Independent. That still lets you vote in Democratic primaries, though.
Quote: beachbumbabs
So I'm gone. This morning I changed my registration to Democrat. Yuck. But there do seem to be at least a few people of reason and moderation left there. And increasingly, I agree with their stances in opposition to what the "Republicans" are doing and how they comport themselves.
Sadly, the time is coming where everyone must make a black and white choice. I think we are the closest we have been in post- Civil War history to losing it all.
Don't give up, Babs!
There are more Independents than ever, according to Gallup polling, as reasonable human beings are growing increasingly disenfranchised with the ideological extremists of both parties.
Your hatred of extremism makes you stronger, BeachBumBabs, it gives you focus. Join us on the Libertarian side of the force, BeachBumBabs.
Libertarians are generally extremely Liberal in their social positions, but that also includes a staunch defense of Freedom of Speech and a VERY broad definition for same. We're kind of split on abortion, though, but that's just mainly a question (for each person) of when we think that human rights start. Libertarians also tend to be overwhelmingly Economically Conservative, by the numbers, if that's what you're into.
Anyway, we're a great place for people who find themselves without a solid political home as we're so nuanced we don't even agree with ourselves all the time! We disagree with ourselves in a civil way, though. Both sides think we're nuts, so we must be doing something right. We also have cookies.
Black and White
I honestly wouldn't be opposed to splitting into two different countries. Let's just say pretend the South won as long as they promise not to have slavery. The Conservatives can have it. We have to have unrestricted air travel and visitation rights throughout both (all) countries and that's it. No passports required, either. Open trade, no tariffs. Different currencies, probably, but no exchange fees. We'll have to redraw some state lines and some people will get screwed by already owning property in the, "Wrong," country, but it seems pretty doable other than that.
Other than that, the Conservatives get everything South of the Mason-Dixon, with exception to Miami and South Texas. They get all the West except for California, Washington, Oregon and Las Vegas...which is incorporated as part of California as well as the wee little bit South of Las Vegas. Virginia, North Carolina and Maryland can vote on where they want to go. Michigan can also vote because, even though it would be geographically idiosyncratic, neither country really wants it...but somebody has to get stuck with Michigan. The losing country also has to take Toledo, Ohio.
EDIT: I guess Colorado should vote on where it would like to go, as well.
Quote: RSNext time a cop asks to search your car, are you going to say "go ahead!"? What's the big deal, you're innocent right?
Um...I mean, yes, if he asks. I've been pulled over and they've asked to search on one occasion, I don't hold because I don't smoke, so why would I say no? Out of principle? No thanks. I figure if I am polite and say yes, everything will be fine. If I say no, they'll get a warrant, plant evidence and off to jail I go.
Quote: TigerWuI think Pence is going to be the GOP nominee. I don't know how - either Trump is impeached and removed, his multiple scandals weigh him down too much, he just decides to not run, or he drops dead of a heart attack - but I think it's going to be Pence.
Removed by who? The Senate? Are we going to enter a reality in which the Republicans no longer wish to control the Presidency or either of the houses? The thing that you have to understand is that Trump has a base that absolutely loves him. It'd be political suicide to remove him from office. It would take Republican votes to do.
Some 35-40% of this country's citizens LOVE Trump. The sooner the Democrats are able to accept that and the fact that he won; (because the Constitution and Electoral College both suck) the sooner the Democrats can come up with a coalition and plan of action that actually pretends to make sense.
Quote:For the Democrats, I don't know. Probably somebody that's old and everybody is sick of hearing about. Maybe Biden or one of the Dem women that's in the news a lot. It won't be Hillary. She's poison and she's smart enough to know it. I don't think Sanders is going to take a stab at it again, either. He seems to do more good on the sidelines.
Who is sick of hearing about Biden? I'm not saying you're wrong, but my understanding is that almost everyone on the left loves Biden. I've certainly seen not much negative about him coming from the left.
Quote:If you're interested, you should check your state laws to see if you have to register as one or the other.
In Oklahoma, you don't have to register as either Dem or Repub, but if you don't pick they automatically label you as an Independent. That still lets you vote in Democratic primaries, though.
GREAT ADVICE!!!
In Ohio, you don't register as anything. However, if you vote in the primaries, then whatever ticket you pick is what you are registered as at least until the following primary. Technically, I'm a Republican. I saw no reason to vote in the Democratic Primary and there was also some lower office in which I wanted to vote in the primary, County Level, but could only do so on a Republican ticket.
Quote: Mission146Don't give up, Babs!
There are more Independents than ever, according to Gallup polling, as reasonable human beings are growing increasingly disenfranchised with the ideological extremists of both parties.
Your hatred of extremism makes you stronger, BeachBumBabs, it gives you focus. Join us on the Libertarian side of the force, BeachBumBabs.
Libertarians are generally extremely Liberal in their social positions, but that also includes a staunch defense of Freedom of Speech and a VERY broad definition for same. We're kind of split on abortion, though, but that's just mainly a question (for each person) of when we think that human rights start. Libertarians also tend to be overwhelmingly Economically Conservative, by the numbers, if that's what you're into.
Anyway, we're a great place for people who find themselves without a solid political home as we're so nuanced we don't even agree with ourselves all the time! We disagree with ourselves in a civil way, though. Both sides think we're nuts, so we must be doing something right. We also have cookies.
Black and White
I honestly wouldn't be opposed to splitting into two different countries. Let's just say pretend the South won as long as they promise not to have slavery. The Conservatives can have it. We have to have unrestricted air travel and visitation rights throughout both (all) countries and that's it. No passports required, either. Open trade, no tariffs. Different currencies, probably, but no exchange fees. We'll have to redraw some state lines and some people will get screwed by already owning property in the, "Wrong," country, but it seems pretty doable other than that.
Other than that, the Conservatives get everything South of the Mason-Dixon, with exception to Miami and South Texas. They get all the West except for California, Washington, Oregon and Las Vegas...which is incorporated as part of California as well as the wee little bit South of Las Vegas. Virginia, North Carolina and Maryland can vote on where they want to go. Michigan can also vote because, even though it would be geographically idiosyncratic, neither country really wants it...but somebody has to get stuck with Michigan. The losing country also has to take Toledo, Ohio.
EDIT: I guess Colorado should vote on where it would like to go, as well.
Bad idea
I really would not want to have a need of a passport just to visit Disney World
Quote: beachbumbabsCongratulations, Republican Party. 42 years ago this month, I registered with you. I have hung in with you during years of declining values, relevancy, greed, and corruption.
I still believe in being part of the conversation and fixing things from within, but there is no longer any shred of the party I joined there, no conversation we can have. And, once Trump is out of office, no party to sustain. Every reasonable, bipartisan, decent person has left or is leaving. Further, the party is villifying everyone still trying to inject a note of sanity or opposition to the goose-stepping mindless attacks and undermining.
So I'm gone. This morning I changed my registration to Democrat. Yuck. But there do seem to be at least a few people of reason and moderation left there. And increasingly, I agree with their stances in opposition to what the "Republicans" are doing and how they comport themselves.
Sadly, the time is coming where everyone must make a black and white choice. I think we are the closest we have been in post- Civil War history to losing it all. And 18% of this country forcing their extreme agenda on the rest of us is the powder keg. Not sure what will be the match. Maybe it's already lit.
I welcome you with open arms
Quote: AZDuffmanWell, you have not supported one thing the GOP stands for on this board that I have ever seen. You seem to hate Reagan. You seem to hate anyone popular with the party. You have supported everything the Democrat side says or does. You have attacked everything the GOP has done. Even with the GOP shift left over the last 20 years. You complain about "attacks" yet joined the party of trying to destroy Kavanaugh and making any kind of lowbrow attack on any conservative acceptable.
See you at the polls!
What a coincidence. I joined this board in 2013. The Republicans had left the track entirely in 2008, though they started the derail in 1980, when Reagan purchased GHWBs balls (an infamous reference at the time ) for his pocket. Voted John Anderson that year, who RWR defeated in the primaries. I still voted for GHWB in 1988 and Dole/Kemp in 1996, but couldn't vote for GWB in 2000 - he was just too incompetent. I voted for McCain in the primaries with an early ballot a couple days before he withdrew.
Anyway, Republicans categorically refusing to work with Obama starting Inauguration Day 2009 was the end, though I kept fighting internally alongside decent moderate AND fiscally conservative Republicans (two different subgroups), for the direction and soul of the party for over a decade.
That battle is over, and we lost. Those leaders have retired from the field, and left the party to the greedy destroyers and idiot bluenoses, not to mention the disgusting. Moderates mostly gave up in 2010, and NeverTrumper fiscal conservatives are mostly gone or going. So I'm gone.
I'm sure I'll have as tough a time with the idiot free college/free healthcare/welfare giveaway wing of the Democrats as well, and I may be forced to disenfranchise from parties alltogether. But at least the Democrats are fielding some people with personal responsibility, bipartisanship, and integrity, values I can get behind.
You actually helped, because I dislike your posts with attitudes, misinformation, and bias so much that you have come to personify everything that's wrong with my former party. You parrot and spread their every worst position possible. I leave you to it.
Quote: beachbumbabsCongratulations, Republican Party. 42 years ago this month, I registered with you. I have hung in with you during years of declining values, relevancy, greed, and corruption.
I still believe in being part of the conversation and fixing things from within, but there is no longer any shred of the party I joined there, no conversation we can have. And, once Trump is out of office, no party to sustain. Every reasonable, bipartisan, decent person has left or is leaving. Further, the party is villifying everyone still trying to inject a note of sanity or opposition to the goose-stepping mindless attacks and undermining.
So I'm gone. This morning I changed my registration to Democrat. Yuck. But there do seem to be at least a few people of reason and moderation left there. And increasingly, I agree with their stances in opposition to what the "Republicans" are doing and how they comport themselves.
Sadly, the time is coming where everyone must make a black and white choice. I think we are the closest we have been in post- Civil War history to losing it all. And 18% of this country forcing their extreme agenda on the rest of us is the powder keg. Not sure what will be the match. Maybe it's already lit.
In other news...water is wet.
Just messing with you Babs. Glad you registered with the party that you belonged with all along. Hopefully you can bring some sanity to them.
Quote: Mission146Removed by who? The Senate? Are we going to enter a reality in which the Republicans no longer wish to control the Presidency or either of the houses?
Maybe. If he becomes toxic enough in the next year or so, if the GOP loses the House, if they barely hold the Senate, if they see the writing on the wall for 2020 and beyond, they may want to cut slingload on Trump and start to move back towards the center to save their own hides. I can totally see it happening.
Quote:Who is sick of hearing about Biden?
That was code for "career politician."
Quote: TigerWuI think Pence is going to be the GOP nominee. I don't know how - either Trump is impeached and removed
Tiger you must not understand the mechanism of Presidential removal if you think this. Given the current Senate makeup (and there is no reason to think there will be major changes from this election) it would take a minimum of 17 Republican Senator to vote to remove him. Not going to happen...ever. In any reality.
Actually I am trying to find a bet online for this. However the only ones I can find are "Will he be in office past 2020" Which take into account stepping down after one term and death. I don't like those bets as much as removal. I would bet my house on the NO for removal.
Quote: VCUSkyhawkIn other news...water is wet.
Just messing with you Babs. Glad you registered with the party that you belonged with all along. Hopefully you can bring some sanity to them.
Nuh uh. Water isn’t wet, stuff that gets in water is wet.
Quote: beachbumbabsWhat a coincidence. I joined this board in 2013. The Republicans had left the track entirely in 2008, though they started the derail in 1980, when Reagan purchased GHWBs balls (an infamous reference at the time ) for his pocket. Voted John Anderson that year, who RWR defeated in the primaries. I still voted for GHWB in 1988 and Dole/Kemp in 1996, but couldn't vote for GWB in 2000 - he was just too incompetent. I voted for McCain in the primaries with an early ballot a couple days before he withdrew.
Anyway, Republicans categorically refusing to work with Obama starting Inauguration Day 2009 was the end, though I kept fighting internally alongside decent moderate AND fiscally conservative Republicans (two different subgroups), for the direction and soul of the party for over a decade.
That battle is over, and we lost. Those leaders have retired from the field, and left the party to the greedy destroyers and idiot bluenoses, not to mention the disgusting. Moderates mostly gave up in 2010, and NeverTrumper fiscal conservatives are mostly gone or going. So I'm gone.
I'm sure I'll have as tough a time with the idiot free college/free healthcare/welfare giveaway wing of the Democrats as well, and I may be forced to disenfranchise from parties alltogether. But at least the Democrats are fielding some people with personal responsibility, bipartisanship, and integrity, values I can get behind.
You actually helped, because I dislike your posts with attitudes, misinformation, and bias so much that you have come to personify everything that's wrong with my former party. You parrot and spread their every worst position possible. I leave you to it.
Good luck with the change, but I don't think you will find what you are looking for in the Democrat party. There a myriad of things that I don't like about the way Republicans have governed but I can't see anything better from the time the Democrats have held power recently. I know both parties are full of hypocrites and people who have no interest in you or me; only in staying in power. I see some good people among the Democrats just as I do among the Republicans. I also see a party swinging way left with socialist tendencies.
President Trump isn't perfect; he won because he spoke to a forgotten segment of the population and the Democrats act like they don't want to win them back because they are "deplorables" or whatever and it is easier just to call them racists and all kinds of other things. The whole "racist" thing is a red herring; there is racism out there, but the the vast majority of Americans aren't racist at all--they just want a fair shake. Lots of people also voted against Hillary even wiuth a distate for Trump--which helps the 2020 Dem nominee if it isn't her...
Anyway, good luck!
It'd be nice to not have a body that protects misdeeds from us knowing about them.
Quote: RonCIs there any way for us to get information from the Congress about who has been paid to settle complaints and what those complaints were?
It'd be nice to not have a body that protects misdeeds from us knowing about them.
There have been multiple FOIAs filed to get that information. So far, none have been successful. Some might still be in process. However, Congress has been very successful many times in exempting themselves from various laws about many things, especially concerning their employees and internal processes. I don't expect any of those accountings to come to light unless someone breaks an NDA or makes a significant leak.
Quote: VCUSkyhawkTiger you must not understand the mechanism of Presidential removal if you think this.
I do understand the mechanisms.
I didn't say it was going to happen, or that it even remotely has a chance of happening.
You're missing the big picture of what I'm trying to say - Trump won't be the GOP nominee for 2020.
Quote: darkoz
Bad idea
I really would not want to have a need of a passport just to visit Disney World
There's open travel between the countries. Also, Disney World sucks.
Quote: Mission146Also, Disney World sucks.
Fight me...
Quote: TigerWuI do understand the mechanisms.
I didn't say it was going to happen, or that it even remotely has a chance of happening.
You're missing the big picture of what I'm trying to say - Trump won't be the GOP nominee for 2020.
I mostly disagree. I see a possibility of stepping down. There is also be a small possibility of death. Aside from those two way, there is no way he will not be the nominee. As a matter of a fact, I am willing to bet any poster here up to 100. That he will be the nominee, barring his death or him stepping down.
Quote: Mission146There's open travel between the countries. Also, Disney World sucks.
Listen you wanna bash dems and lefties go right ahead
But I seriously draw the line at DisneyWorld
EDIT: although I will admit Universal Studios is a far shade better these days in the exciting rides department
Quote: beachbumbabs
I'm sure I'll have as tough a time with the idiot free college/free healthcare/welfare giveaway wing of the Democrats as well, and I may be forced to disenfranchise from parties alltogether. But at least the Democrats are fielding some people with personal responsibility, bipartisanship, and integrity, values I can get behind.
You actually helped, because I dislike your posts with attitudes, misinformation, and bias so much that you have come to personify everything that's wrong with my former party. You parrot and spread their every worst position possible. I leave you to it.
Babs,
First Quoted Paragraph: We Libertarians do that personal responsibility, bipartisanship and integrity stuff. Well, integrity only if you choose to have it. Absent committing crimes, having integrity is really more of a personal choice thing. By the way, some 80% of Libertarians are totally against my views on healthcare and State College/University. I promise.
Second Quoted Paragraph: Come join us! Exactly what you said is why I will NOT be associated with Democrats or the word, "Liberal," anymore. Don't spend too much time associating with the Far Left. Some of them are truly disgusting and we would live in a society that is just as de facto personally restrictive as the Evangelical Christians would like to see happen as a matter of law. You seem politically active. We really need your help. Most Floridians are already cuckoo clocks, so Libertarianism has a pretty good chance there, I think.
Quote: Mission146Babs,
First Quoted Paragraph: We Libertarians do that personal responsibility, bipartisanship and integrity stuff. Well, integrity only if you choose to have it. Absent committing crimes, having integrity is really more of a personal choice thing. By the way, some 80% of Libertarians are totally against my views on healthcare and State College/University. I promise.
Second Quoted Paragraph: Come join us! Exactly what you said is why I will NOT be associated with Democrats or the word, "Liberal," anymore. Don't spend too much time associating with the Far Left. Some of them are truly disgusting and we would live in a society that is just as de facto personally restrictive as the Evangelical Christians would like to see happen as a matter of law. You seem politically active. We really need your help. Most Floridians are already cuckoo clocks, so Libertarianism has a pretty good chance there, I think.
You wont accept Babs if you dont accept DisneyWorldism. Shes a Floridian
Quote: TigerWuMaybe. If he becomes toxic enough in the next year or so, if the GOP loses the House, if they barely hold the Senate, if they see the writing on the wall for 2020 and beyond, they may want to cut slingload on Trump and start to move back towards the center to save their own hides. I can totally see it happening.
That was code for "career politician."
They're going to have to do a lot worse than, "Barely hold," the Senate. Say it's 49-51, Democrat, you still need 17 Republicans to vote for removal. Good luck.
I also haven't seen anything at all that should be remotely impeachable yet. Ideal, no. Fair, no. But, from a policy standpoint, it looks like the left played the role of Penny Henny, because the sky ain't anywhere near falling, if one is objective.
Quote: darkozYou wont accept Babs if you dont accept DisneyWorldism. Shes a Floridian
Are they one and the same? I ask this to Floridians in seriousness.
Quote: Mission146There's open travel between the countries. Also, Disney World sucks.
Lol like righties would allow open borders
EDIT: or like Righties like DisneyWorld :))) j/k
Quote: TigerWuFight me...
I can't. I spent two and a half days in Disney World and can now no longer afford boxing gloves. I also made a Star Wars reference earlier in this thread today and have already been informed I'm being sued for copyright. I called Michael Avenatti, but he said he'll only protect me from Disney if I become a transexual, which I also can't afford, because I went to Disney so can't pay cash and my health insurance doesn't have to cover it.
Quote: Mission146Also, Disney World sucks.
My daughter was there this week...she saw a dad with a shirt that said "Most Expensive Day Ever"...can't say it isn't at least close to that!
However, as someone who has spent 100 days or more in Disney Parks, I have to disagree strongly with your position. It is one of our favorite places. It was close enough to home to go for the day...until St Cloud/Kissimmee became such a mess. Now it takes 1.5-2 times as long to get there from our home town.
Get your tickets now!
Ticketmaster has them for you...
Quote: VCUSkyhawkAs a matter of a fact, I am willing to bet any poster here up to 100. That he will be the nominee, barring his death or him stepping down.
I'm not big into prop bets, so I'd only put up $10 that he will NOT be the nominee, BUT that includes the possibility that he voluntarily steps down or decides not to run. Death voids the bet.
Quote: darkoz
EDIT: or like Righties like DisneyWorld :))) j/k
They hate it publicly for gay pride/social justice/liberal Hollywood reasons, but love it secretly because it's still a giant ruthless corporation.... Haha!
Let me know if we have a bet.
Quote: VCUSkyhawkHey Tiger if we can agree to a $10 bet with me taking the yes that he will be the nominee and you take the no. Death results in a push for both sides we have a bet.
Let me know if we have a bet.
Yes, we have a bet.
I take the no, he will not be the nominee for ANY reason except death.
I guess the pineapple whip was ok.
Quote: FinsRuleI understand why kids would like Disney world. But I’m not quite sure why adults want anything to do with it. The only enjoyment I got out of it was my kids being happy.
I guess the pineapple whip was ok.
Cause the rides and attractions are awesome?
I go as often as I can, thus my avatar.
Quote: FinsRuleI understand why kids would like Disney world. But I’m not quite sure why adults want anything to do with it.
So much good food to eat there. And the amount of alcohol you can get at Epcot is dangerous. With all the countries and booths, it's literally like a bar every 100 feet.
I enjoy Disney World as an adult more than I did as a kid. I can eat, drink, and buy whatever I want, and the rides are still fun no matter your age. Plus you get to talk to the hot Disney Princesses without anyone thinking you're a weirdo.
Quote: TigerWu
I take the no, he will not be the nominee for ANY reason except death.
I don't think making him the nominee would be a very good strategy if he dies. ;)
Quote: TigerWuYes, we have a bet.
I take the no, he will not be the nominee for ANY reason except death.
Cool, sent you a PM.
Quote: Mission146I don't think making him the nominee would be a very good strategy if he dies. ;)
Is zombie Trump less likely to win nomination than live Trump? I am not so sure with the current base.
Quote: TigerWuPlus you get to talk to the hot Disney Princesses without anyone thinking you're a weirdo.
Us Libertarians are in favor of legalized prostitution. One of the themed-brothels that would inevitably open can probably make Princess Jasmine happen for you. Just sayin'.
Quote: VCUSkyhawkIs zombie Trump less likely to win nomination than live Trump? I am not so sure with the current base.
The more important question is: Would Zombie Trump's skin actually be a different color, and if not, how would anybody know the difference?
I just feel awful for the Disney princesses. What a terrible job for $12/hr.
This would be a good time to flip to the Democratic side, because the GOP primary will probably not be competitive in 2020. Hope you'll join me in supporting Kamala Harris on the other side.
Also, I live in a Republican county, so the primaries are more important for me there as well.
This year I did Democrat because the governor race was more important on Dem side. I’ll stay Dem for 2020.
Quote: FinsRuleI voted in Republican 2016 primary because Hillary had pretty much already clinched the nomination by the time IL voted.
Also, I live in a Republican county, so the primaries are more important for me there as well.
This year I did Democrat because the governor race was more important on Dem side. I’ll stay Dem for 2020.
Sad reasoning skills.
Quote: FinsRuleYeah? How so?
You are asking a guy who has a winning hit and run craps system about reasoning?
