Chasing Quads instead of Royals
May 9th, 2022 at 12:16:59 PM
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In 9/6 Jacks or Better do you think it would be better to play safe hands like pairs, two pairs, and full houses while going for quads and ignoring the possibility of royal flushes entirely? I've heard some machines are rigged not to hit royal flushes or that they use a form of pseudo-RNG. Most people assume that optimal play will give the greatest payback over a long enough period of time, but you can purposely limit your time horizon to a few hands to increase variance and consequently make more money than shoving quarters into a machine in the hopeless attempt to hit a royal. What do you think? Are there strategies for video poker we haven't thought of?
May 9th, 2022 at 12:31:20 PM
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So you'll have 4 to a Royal every 1,000 hands. Feeling lucky?
May 9th, 2022 at 12:34:06 PM
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No. But if you think of your bankroll like a sine wave, you want to cash out at the apex. So shouldn't we play few hands, but at very high bets per hand, and then just quit once you're ahead? I feel like just playing VP forever is a losing proposition even if with comps you can get slightly over 100% RTP. There has to be some way to limit the scope of the game and make it winnable.
May 9th, 2022 at 12:35:55 PM
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I have to think that JOB has been dissected and studied to such an extreme that every possibility has been explored. This is not my area of study. If you are playing in a licensed casino, you should get a fair game but be aware there are games that look like video poker but are really slot machines. Know the rules and the jurisdictions.
If you don't care about the royal, you might as well play single coin so, right off the bat, you are saving a dollar a spin.
Trying to beat video poker without taking promos, slot clubs, drawings and the like is a very tough thing to do. Most players lose a little on every spin but make it up with rebates on their volume.
If you don't care about the royal, you might as well play single coin so, right off the bat, you are saving a dollar a spin.
Trying to beat video poker without taking promos, slot clubs, drawings and the like is a very tough thing to do. Most players lose a little on every spin but make it up with rebates on their volume.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
May 9th, 2022 at 12:45:23 PM
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The home games I've played either started with 100 credits, or 400 credits. The way to 0 is obvious, you can only levitate for so long before the next buy-in.
The Wizard has a web game you can play that starts with 1,000 credits. I'd suggest playing 10,000 hands minimum and see how much you're down after each 100 hands. Maybe it's easier at a casino where you can count session points and make a note.
https://wizardofvegas.com/games/video-poker/
I fell to 760 credits, just one straight flush from being ahead, then I got a 4 of a kind and a Full House and I was back at 900 credits, so not ahead.
The Wizard has a web game you can play that starts with 1,000 credits. I'd suggest playing 10,000 hands minimum and see how much you're down after each 100 hands. Maybe it's easier at a casino where you can count session points and make a note.
https://wizardofvegas.com/games/video-poker/
I fell to 760 credits, just one straight flush from being ahead, then I got a 4 of a kind and a Full House and I was back at 900 credits, so not ahead.
Last edited by: ChumpChange on May 9, 2022
May 9th, 2022 at 12:52:57 PM
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Quote: rektfastNo. But if you think of your bankroll like a sine wave, you want to cash out at the apex. So shouldn't we play few hands, but at very high bets per hand, and then just quit once you're ahead? I feel like just playing VP forever is a losing proposition even if with comps you can get slightly over 100% RTP. There has to be some way to limit the scope of the game and make it winnable.
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It would make sense if your bankroll followed a sine wave and not, say, a random walk.
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
May 9th, 2022 at 12:59:58 PM
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Quote: rektfastNo. But if you think of your bankroll like a sine wave, you want to cash out at the apex. So shouldn't we play few hands, but at very high bets per hand, and then just quit once you're ahead? I feel like just playing VP forever is a losing proposition even if with comps you can get slightly over 100% RTP. There has to be some way to limit the scope of the game and make it winnable.
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Quitting while you're ahead sounds great.
When are you ahead?
What tells you that you won't be winning the next hand if you don't quit?
I've been trying to figure this out for years, and I haven't cottoned on to the certain circumstances that could improve my play results from this technique.
May the cards fall in your favor.
May 9th, 2022 at 1:02:47 PM
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I’ve been trying to hole card VP for years. Haven’t found a machine that will expose any cards yet…
It’s a dog eat dog world.
…Or maybe it’s the other way around!
May 9th, 2022 at 1:30:14 PM
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Quote: rektfastI've heard some machines are rigged not to hit royal flushes or that they use a form of pseudo-RNG.
Every random number generator is a pseudo-RNG. You can't program something to be truly random. You can get really really really really really close, but never to true randomness.
May 9th, 2022 at 1:36:19 PM
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I threw the flush away but got nothing.
May 9th, 2022 at 1:39:39 PM
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If it is based on an atomic clock or whatever you could probably rig the RNG by pulling the lever at equal milliseconds apart, right? People say slot machines tend to give out hand pays the same day and time over and over which implies it is not randomized properly
May 9th, 2022 at 1:44:24 PM
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That's like trying to pick a pixel on a screen without a map.
May 9th, 2022 at 1:46:36 PM
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Pixel perfect one-frame inputs are not that difficult to do. People play Tekken and hit EWGFs all the time. Has anyone tried playing VP or slots with a millisecond timer and trying to hit the button at equal intervals until they find a timing that produces positive RTP?
May 9th, 2022 at 2:03:48 PM
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I'm down about 500 credits and I'm still waiting for my first straight flush, and I'm still waiting by drawing a straight.
May 9th, 2022 at 2:57:55 PM
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Quote: rektfastIf it is based on an atomic clock or whatever you could probably rig the RNG by pulling the lever at equal milliseconds apart, right? People say slot machines tend to give out hand pays the same day and time over and over which implies it is not randomized properly
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I have heard rumors of one RNG timing attack.
I have no direct information about it.
The attack required methods which were in violation of device laws.
As for anecdotal reports from slot players, please assume that their conclusions are erroneous. I don't think time of day or day of week plays a factor.
I can believe that point multiplier days draw in more slot players at once, and someone is likely to hit a payout (think of the monkeys with typewriters eventually producing Shakespeare), but that doesn't mean you are more likely to.
May the cards fall in your favor.
May 9th, 2022 at 3:08:57 PM
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I played a lot of Hearthstone and assume that slots and VP would be rigged the same way. Combining slot angle shooting like the five-spin method and playing outside peak hours with AP video poker strategy should be possible, right?
May 9th, 2022 at 3:17:33 PM
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In VP I notice I'll discard one card and the replacement card is the same one but just a different suit. It's like, why did I even bother discarding that card?
I don't find myself breaking up a 3 of a kind to try for a Royal for some reason.
Hmmmm...
I don't find myself breaking up a 3 of a kind to try for a Royal for some reason.
Hmmmm...
Last edited by: ChumpChange on May 9, 2022
May 9th, 2022 at 3:30:41 PM
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Now that is an interesting observation and part of the reason I think mathematically "optimal" play is not correct. Perhaps the last card is still in RAM and influences the RNG. Someone used savestates on old video poker ROMs and noticed that the cards dealt are, in fact, different if you rewind and draw again. So the outcome is not predetermined but actually different every attempt.
Also, what if putting a very large amount of credits into the machine gets you marked as a whale and improves your RNG? There are many crooked things in online gaming which would be trivial to implement in VP.
Also, what if putting a very large amount of credits into the machine gets you marked as a whale and improves your RNG? There are many crooked things in online gaming which would be trivial to implement in VP.
May 9th, 2022 at 3:39:37 PM
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Quote: rektfastNow that is an interesting observation and part of the reason I think mathematically "optimal" play is not correct. Perhaps the last card is still in RAM and influences the RNG. Someone used savestates on old video poker ROMs and noticed that the cards dealt are, in fact, different if you rewind and draw again. So the outcome is not predetermined but actually different every attempt.
Also, what if putting a very large amount of credits into the machine gets you marked as a whale and improves your RNG? There are many crooked things in online gaming which would be trivial to implement in VP.
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Nevada gaming laws require the RNG to be running at all times with the decision made at the time button is hit. That's for the deal and the draw. No cards are held in the RAM.
May 9th, 2022 at 4:01:44 PM
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Slot machines always are trending to their set house advantage. You might not get close to that HA% number until 100,000 spins, but with a large HA like 5%, it will be a noticeable slide in your session money as you go along.
With VP you could be 40,000 credits behind before you see your first Royal 4,000 credit win. You'll need another nine Royals to catch up and some of those are already baked into the HA.
With VP you could be 40,000 credits behind before you see your first Royal 4,000 credit win. You'll need another nine Royals to catch up and some of those are already baked into the HA.
May 9th, 2022 at 4:16:31 PM
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In slots they say the best strategy is to play the highest denomination possible. Probably the same is true for VP. Also, only playing a low number of hands makes fat-fingers and wrong inputs much less of a problem. What's the highest credit version of video poker? $50 a hand or something? I believe the optimal strategy would require as high of a wager as possible
May 9th, 2022 at 4:20:32 PM
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Quote: rektfastIn slots they say the best strategy is to play the highest denomination possible. Probably the same is true for VP. Also, only playing a low number of hands makes fat-fingers and wrong inputs much less of a problem. What's the highest credit version of video poker? $50 a hand or something? I believe the optimal strategy would require as high of a wager as possible
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Wow. Not even worth the effort.
May 9th, 2022 at 4:28:06 PM
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The pay table determines whether you get a favorable HA%. You might find worse pay tables at lower denominations, but you walk into a convenience store and get 6/5 $1 JoB, you should skip that game no matter the denomination.
May 9th, 2022 at 4:33:47 PM
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Quote: ChumpChangeThe pay table determines whether you get a favorable HA%. You might find worse pay tables at lower denominations, but you walk into a convenience store and get 6/5 $1 JoB, you should skip that game no matter the denomination.
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That's not always true. It depends on what class machine you are playing. VP machines in NY show regular 9/6 payouts but payout under 90%. It's because they are video lottery terminals, not games of skill.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
May 9th, 2022 at 4:57:14 PM
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I very rarely visit a racino so I don't know what their pay table is, but $600 payouts might be taxable?
I might expect the pay table to be 7/5 or 8/5 JoB, might see 8/6 on $1 denoms.
Meanwhile, another Royal Miss!
On my last 50 credits I missed hitting a Straight Flush 3 times!
So instead of getting way back up to 750 or 1,000 credits, I lost them all and went down swinging. I'll have to refresh the page to start a new game, or take a damn break.
I might expect the pay table to be 7/5 or 8/5 JoB, might see 8/6 on $1 denoms.
Meanwhile, another Royal Miss!
On my last 50 credits I missed hitting a Straight Flush 3 times!
So instead of getting way back up to 750 or 1,000 credits, I lost them all and went down swinging. I'll have to refresh the page to start a new game, or take a damn break.
Last edited by: ChumpChange on May 9, 2022
May 9th, 2022 at 5:33:35 PM
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Well if the game is unwinnable in the long term because of house edge then obviously the correct move must be to play as few hands as possible. I believe everyone has theorycrafted VP incorrectly. There is no "long run."
Maybe the optimal decision is to play one hand and then use your winnings to buy stock in the casino
Maybe the optimal decision is to play one hand and then use your winnings to buy stock in the casino
May 9th, 2022 at 6:44:40 PM
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Quote: rektfastIf it is based on an atomic clock or whatever you could probably rig the RNG by pulling the lever at equal milliseconds apart, right? People say slot machines tend to give out hand pays the same day and time over and over which implies it is not randomized properly
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If slot machines gave out hand pays the same day and time over and over again that would be wonderful!
They would be very easy to beat.
May 9th, 2022 at 7:28:35 PM
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There is some real VOODOO flowing in this thread. :/ Unless you play one of those jurisdictions where video poker machines aren't really video poker machines, but instead class 3 slots, most of the things discussed would be illegal in most jurisdictions. And if you are playing one of those places where VP machines are really class 3 slot....stop playing.
Former member here Rob Singer has a progressive wagering strategy where he is employs what he calls 'special plays' or less optimal plays trying to hit quads at the expense of Royals. It is a bad and losing strategy.
And our own Alan Mendelson is a big proponent of "quitting while ahead". He has started many discussions on this topic on numerous forums in the last 10 years. This too is not a real or winning strategy.
So what could go wrong with putting these two voodoo, losing strategies together? Two negatives equals a plus right? :)
Former member here Rob Singer has a progressive wagering strategy where he is employs what he calls 'special plays' or less optimal plays trying to hit quads at the expense of Royals. It is a bad and losing strategy.
And our own Alan Mendelson is a big proponent of "quitting while ahead". He has started many discussions on this topic on numerous forums in the last 10 years. This too is not a real or winning strategy.
So what could go wrong with putting these two voodoo, losing strategies together? Two negatives equals a plus right? :)
May 9th, 2022 at 7:30:18 PM
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But they do. Gamblers know there are irregularities with slot machine RNG. What those are is up for debate.
Rob Singer sounds like he had the same idea. Is there some way to make a side-bet to improve your VP odds? There must be some advantage opportunities people haven't thought of.
I'm also skeptical of Player's Rewards cards to the point that I think facial recognition could be used by the casino to keep track of whether you're an AP or a fish and adjust the machines accordingly.
As an aside, I know serious gamblers and pro poker players personally who believe astrology influences their performance at tournaments. After the pandemic practice shutdowns, machines were infamously looser because casinos had to make their payout percentages in time for the end of the quarter.
If you already have a 99.4% RTP machine and start adding on weird superstitious stuff like that, you could theoretically make VP beatable.
Rob Singer sounds like he had the same idea. Is there some way to make a side-bet to improve your VP odds? There must be some advantage opportunities people haven't thought of.
I'm also skeptical of Player's Rewards cards to the point that I think facial recognition could be used by the casino to keep track of whether you're an AP or a fish and adjust the machines accordingly.
As an aside, I know serious gamblers and pro poker players personally who believe astrology influences their performance at tournaments. After the pandemic practice shutdowns, machines were infamously looser because casinos had to make their payout percentages in time for the end of the quarter.
If you already have a 99.4% RTP machine and start adding on weird superstitious stuff like that, you could theoretically make VP beatable.
May 9th, 2022 at 7:53:24 PM
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I recall reading about people who sell systems to beat slots by playing them at the same time everyday once you've determined what time of day the machine hits.
I’ve always wondered why those people sell that system instead of going out and playing those machines themselves at the right time each day to become millionaires.
Also once the word gets out to too many people wouldn’t casinos have trouble staying in business if people just play the machines only at the time they pay a jackpot?
Either that or it’s possible that there is a lot of misinformation out there and slot machines aren’t actually exploitable to play at the same time everyday.
You would think that if it was true people would just do it & keep it quiet instead of selling the information or discussing it all the time,
I’ve always wondered why those people sell that system instead of going out and playing those machines themselves at the right time each day to become millionaires.
Also once the word gets out to too many people wouldn’t casinos have trouble staying in business if people just play the machines only at the time they pay a jackpot?
Either that or it’s possible that there is a lot of misinformation out there and slot machines aren’t actually exploitable to play at the same time everyday.
You would think that if it was true people would just do it & keep it quiet instead of selling the information or discussing it all the time,
May 9th, 2022 at 8:00:20 PM
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I mean operating systems like Windows have bugs and hacks and zero days all the time and people have no incentive to share their findings with the public because it would just get fixed. I doubt slots are that much more secure.
May 9th, 2022 at 8:14:23 PM
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Quote: rektfastI mean operating systems like Windows have bugs and hacks and zero days all the time and people have no incentive to share their findings with the public because it would just get fixed. I doubt slots are that much more secure.
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So if you believe that slots pay jackpots at the same time each day what you should be doing is playing slot machines all day, recording when they hit jackpots and then going back & playing them at the same time of day.
If you believe they are full of bugs and hacks then you should be playing them all day to find the bugs & then cleaning up monetarily.
Best of luck, I hope that you are right and can win lots of money!
May 9th, 2022 at 8:25:01 PM
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Quote: rektfastI mean operating systems like Windows have bugs and hacks and zero days all the time and people have no incentive to share their findings with the public because it would just get fixed. I doubt slots are that much more secure.
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Bugs in the system hun? Like the "double up bug"? lol.
Do the machines teleport their hot and cold cycles to you as well?
May 9th, 2022 at 9:11:23 PM
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Quote: rektfastIn slots they say the best strategy is to play the highest denomination possible. Probably the same is true for VP. Also, only playing a low number of hands makes fat-fingers and wrong inputs much less of a problem. What's the highest credit version of video poker? $50 a hand or something? I believe the optimal strategy would require as high of a wager as possible
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Who are they that say higher denomination is a better strategy?
It may or may not be a better RTP. It may or may not be a more comfortable level of volatility.
Going broke chasing a GrandMegaMajorPot is decidedly not a better strategy, so hopefully your bankroll suits the undertaking.
Video poker paytables are directly displayed on the machine; Nevada law requires that the game being offered have fair probabilities, as would suit a common deck of playing cards.
As others have pointed out, there are gaming machines in certain jurisdictions that look like video poker, but are not video poker. Beware the genie and any really weird paytables.
Note to kewlj: I think you maybe meant Class II instead of Class 3.
May the cards fall in your favor.
May 9th, 2022 at 9:36:56 PM
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Quote: Dieter
Note to kewlj: I think you maybe meant Class II instead of Class 3.
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Yep, class 2. I got it classes ass backwards, but I think everyone got my point.
May 11th, 2022 at 5:06:57 AM
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Good point.
Incidentally, when playing high hands per hour, how do you stop making mistakes? I seem to click through small pairs by accident. Playing quickly I'm only 97ish% accurate. How do you get to 99.9%?
Incidentally, when playing high hands per hour, how do you stop making mistakes? I seem to click through small pairs by accident. Playing quickly I'm only 97ish% accurate. How do you get to 99.9%?
May 11th, 2022 at 5:22:56 AM
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Quote: rektfastGood point.
Incidentally, when playing high hands per hour, how do you stop making mistakes? I seem to click through small pairs by accident. Playing quickly I'm only 97ish% accurate. How do you get to 99.9%?
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By not playing quickly. Accuracy is far more important than speed.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
May 11th, 2022 at 6:21:02 AM
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You're right. Playing slightly slower I got 99.38% accurate.
What % is considered an advantage player, 99.9% accuracy?
At any rate I believe that the posters here have proven that chasing quads at the expense of royals is not correct, so I'm glad we sorted that out.
What % is considered an advantage player, 99.9% accuracy?
At any rate I believe that the posters here have proven that chasing quads at the expense of royals is not correct, so I'm glad we sorted that out.
May 11th, 2022 at 8:50:40 AM
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Quote: rektfastWhat % is considered an advantage player, 99.9% accuracy?
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I believe that "advantage player" refers to other aspects of the play.
May the cards fall in your favor.
May 20th, 2022 at 9:49:42 AM
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so you wish to attack video poker? i been playing video poker since 2017 when the wifey hit the 2k jackpot w/ a 100 dollar bankroll ohhh if only video poker was played that way we wouldnt be discussing such matters on forums but back to your post, there was/is a guy on slot massacre claimed his friend started with a 100$ freeplay and ended the night with a 100k jackpot(s) if you believe it he closed out 3 royals .5 / 2$ and i think last was 125$ per turn yikes talk about a parlay imo if hes already playing a good game with great comps theres no wrong denom to play with especially if your in for the long run and committed to gamble. it seems like your looking for your 9 blacks or reds in a row like in roulette well it does exist in every casino game that 1 over x shot, my system has won over 3 solid bankrolls and hasnt busted out yet im sure it will but i want to see profits vs ruin and im well aware getting 5 jackpots or 5 standard devations ahead of any game before things normalize, however im not sure if i need to use my system since my casino gave my wife 700 dollar free play and she dont even gamble there anymore and this other casino in atlatnic city gave her crummy 30$ a week what a friggin joke and she dont gamble there either, but i do notice more free play i use on my card the less they give me and less she plays on her card the more they give her, my theory on my casino is well if hes hooked and hes getting crummy offers dont give him squat and if shes not playing and were giving her low ball weekly offers lets give her a chunky free play. so yea casinos are smart how they allocate there free play i wish i had 20 card holders like darkoz could clean up nicely this year
but back to video poker yea i can give you 3 solid softwares on video poker made by 3 different programers and one of them claims his software shuffles the 1 single deck 7 times over before the deal button is hit damn near to random can be and all these software will follow your ebb n flow of full houses straights and flushes per 100 hand
no there is no commish nor a zero or double zero combat with but the game has its own problems you can spread your bet 1-7 or your bankroll 1-7 if your rich , tamper with your bets during a session if you think it helps, i cant speak for everyone but my last memories were to stick with 1 denom through out the session is safest, i lost out on a 125 credit winner by not starting off on the prefered denom but still hit a good jackpot, that slot massacre friend seems to love to tamper with the denom during session play i honestly dont think it matters if your already playing a winning comp game.
but back to video poker yea i can give you 3 solid softwares on video poker made by 3 different programers and one of them claims his software shuffles the 1 single deck 7 times over before the deal button is hit damn near to random can be and all these software will follow your ebb n flow of full houses straights and flushes per 100 hand
no there is no commish nor a zero or double zero combat with but the game has its own problems you can spread your bet 1-7 or your bankroll 1-7 if your rich , tamper with your bets during a session if you think it helps, i cant speak for everyone but my last memories were to stick with 1 denom through out the session is safest, i lost out on a 125 credit winner by not starting off on the prefered denom but still hit a good jackpot, that slot massacre friend seems to love to tamper with the denom during session play i honestly dont think it matters if your already playing a winning comp game.
May 20th, 2022 at 9:52:56 AM
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Yeah I don't think VP has enough volatility to make a living but if you apply the VP profits to angle-shooting high-limit slots I think you can make a profit.
5 spin method, going on off-peak hours after holidays, leaving the casino after your first hand pay, and doing stuff like resetting pity timers by printing a voucher and removing your player card can probably make VP positive.
I personally believe that video poker is just as rigged as slot machines and playing the same machine for a long period of time is rigged to make you lose. Probably once your session is in the green you should pull your money out and switch to another machine and repeat the process
5 spin method, going on off-peak hours after holidays, leaving the casino after your first hand pay, and doing stuff like resetting pity timers by printing a voucher and removing your player card can probably make VP positive.
I personally believe that video poker is just as rigged as slot machines and playing the same machine for a long period of time is rigged to make you lose. Probably once your session is in the green you should pull your money out and switch to another machine and repeat the process
May 20th, 2022 at 10:09:24 AM
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Rek, i think your thinking too much into it, there are cold machines and hot machines just like there are hot and cold streaks on baccarat/roulette table problem you wont know before hand which machine/table is running hot for you or cold, some machines can play for hours on end with little to no money and other machines will eat 20$ buy ins like you just got robbed like 100$ an hr you will be looking around like who took your money well its the ebb n flow per machine per dice roll, hitting that deal button on that nano second seperates you doubling your buy in or losing all, i dont believe those poker machines follow same sense as 5 spin method i believe its 1 long dice roll played with cards instead of dice.
May 20th, 2022 at 10:28:54 AM
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Quote: rektfastPixel perfect one-frame inputs are not that difficult to do. People play Tekken and hit EWGFs all the time. Has anyone tried playing VP or slots with a millisecond timer and trying to hit the button at equal intervals until they find a timing that produces positive RTP?
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I don't think milliseconds is good enough. I have heard stories about people who had "accuracy" to within a tenth of a millisecond, but even with "only" a 1 MHz clock, that's still just a 1/100 chance. Of course, having a 1/100 chance of a payout much greater than that is asking for trouble, which is why I am under the impression that the RNG is not periodic, or at least not periodic in terms of when a jackpot/Royal hits.
With a truly periodic RNG, once you know when a Royal is dealt, it should be dealt again every 2,598,960 cycles. On the other hand, if the period is, say, 1 million times that, but you divide the value by 2.6 million and round down (if you take the remainder, then the original cycle occurs), then there will be 1 million Royals in spades dealt every 2.6 trillion cycles, but they will not all be 2.6 million cycles apart.
May 20th, 2022 at 10:32:47 AM
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are you saying the speed (how fast or how slow) has an impact on your bankroll? producing more winning hands vs losing hands? if you are saying that (im saying you are)
then everyone would be playing top speed and making mistakes and killing there ev in the game =/ nothing has proven speed of play has any merit towards the game.
then everyone would be playing top speed and making mistakes and killing there ev in the game =/ nothing has proven speed of play has any merit towards the game.
May 20th, 2022 at 10:42:08 AM
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Yes but I'm saying the opposite. If the game has less than 100% RTP then the only way to win is to stop playing, not play forever. It's a fact that playing penny slots is worse than playing high-limit slots even if you spend the same amount of money on each. So VP for say $100 a hand and then quitting when you hit a full house or something would probably be better than chasing royals at $1 a hand.
As for the timing attacks, I don't know if the way the RNG works is a trade secret but I've seen slot mechanics discuss this sort of thing before. The "shuffler" probably works the same way Hearthstone and Magic Arena do, which is to say not at all.
As for the timing attacks, I don't know if the way the RNG works is a trade secret but I've seen slot mechanics discuss this sort of thing before. The "shuffler" probably works the same way Hearthstone and Magic Arena do, which is to say not at all.
May 20th, 2022 at 10:49:07 AM
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i do not understand when you use example 100$ per hand and quitting when hit a full house, could you enlarge on that? bet more win more end of story, if your saying a royal should pay 40 grand since its 1 over 40k then yea play 50$ a turn and get that 40k jackpot but it does not matter since we can convert our play to smaller denom 1cent, 1 dollar, 10 dollar and so on burns down to the same chances of a winning dice hand or a losing dice hand 45 will be winners and 55 will be losers on the average.
May 20th, 2022 at 10:50:34 AM
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Quote: ThatDonGuyWith a truly periodic RNG, once you know when a Royal is dealt, it should be dealt again every 2,598,960 cycles. On the other hand, if the period is, say, 1 million times that, but you divide the value by 2.6 million and round down (if you take the remainder, then the original cycle occurs), then there will be 1 million Royals in spades dealt every 2.6 trillion cycles, but they will not all be 2.6 million cycles apart.
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Here's an example of what I mean. Suppose the probability of getting a Royal Flush on a deal was 1 / 625,000. I constructed a periodic RNG of period 250,000,000 where the number is divided by 400 and rounded down so you have an equal chance of getting a number between 0 and 624,999, with 0 being a Royal Flush, and here are the number of periods needed between each two consecutive Royal Flushes for the first 50:
1,785,655
183,129
306,653
1,737,321
759,712
58,046
1,828,260
505,900
133,462
234,360
53,291
636,224
1,279,975
367,831
360,856
898,661
1,126,068
139,280
189,376
102,573
124,813
972,050
857,174
311,552
460,016
1,066,592
1,848,028
1,680,236
267,832
244,527
37,134
54,245
730,636
690,317
265,622
309,102
233,245
841,440
406,358
196,001
898,774
1,831,063
627,831
289,199
1,317,883
959,603
759,753
1,595,736
1,956,617
179,035
In other words, the first Royal comes up in the 1,785,655th number generated, the second comes up 183,129 numbers after that, the third 306,653 after that, and so on.
Note that every number from 0 to 624,999 comes up 400 times in every 250 million consecutive periods, and whenever a number does appear, it will appear again exactly 250 million periods later.
May 20th, 2022 at 10:51:32 AM
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Exactly, that would also be why people have observed slot machines hitting at the same times of day over and over again.
May 20th, 2022 at 11:01:44 AM
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you do realize video poker is a funny bird, IGT atlantic city resorts video poker machine gave me a 630 credit finish with a 80 credit buy in that was a lousy 96% deuces wild machine, to climb to 630 credit with a 80 credit buy in i could not duplicate home video poker software nor the big dogs such as frugal or winpoker 6 cant do it however boris video poker on android spits out winners like theres no tomorrow on a 94% machine! it does exhibit royal flush streaks that stand out, i only continue to play on after a royal same day same machine and i did get royal flush twice within 15-20min of each other, never seen that happen on my manual play app except boris, and i only played on cause my wife lost my money which was a good thing too cause ended a bigger winner that trip, i usualy do like to go home a winner if i can even tho it doesnt tamper with the long run of things, i just find it those 2 things stand out, running up a 530 credit winner w/o the aid of 4 ducks or royal or hit 2 royals very close to one another, i emailed him about that software and his reply was "random number generator" its random as far as i dont know what cards are coming out but not random enough asking wheres the house edge at?=/ this other app i played 25k hands no 4 aces with kicker no royal and down 3200$ i kinda got depressed after that and quit
May 20th, 2022 at 11:11:49 AM
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Don, what is the possibiltiies of hitting 3 royals with a constraint bankroll?
that John guy claimed to do it and went home a winner 100k cash, ive hit 2 royals within 20min each other, once in ac and other in pa but i dont play hardcore like most video poker players.
that John guy claimed to do it and went home a winner 100k cash, ive hit 2 royals within 20min each other, once in ac and other in pa but i dont play hardcore like most video poker players.
