JackStraw8004
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September 3rd, 2014 at 9:52:36 PM permalink
More bad news for Atlantic city. Is Trump Taj Mahal the next domino to fall. I know Donald himself wants his name removed from the property. I didn't realize they were doing this bad until this article came out today in the New York Post. Why keep it open if it's operating at a small loss or a small profit. Things aren't going to get better for Atlantic City. Icahn owns the very profitable Tropicana. Closing the Taj would bring major heat from the Governor, the Mayor and the union. Another 5000 unemployed, oh boy! Let's face it, though. The Taj is a dump. Their concert hall has pull out bleacher seats like a gym in a high school from the fifties. Plate, their coffee shop restaurant closes at 8pm many nights. I'm not kidding. They send people to eat to the snack bar or the noodle bar.



New Jersey’s Atlantic City continues to roll snake eyes.
The Trump Taj Mahal, the 24-year-old boardwalk casino, has recently broken some of its loan covenants and without a quick deal with its creditors could be headed for a Chapter 11 reorganization within days, The Post has learned.
So far, talks between Trump Entertainment Resorts — which owns the Taj and its neighbor, the soon-to-close Trump Plaza — and its creditors have not found an out-of-court solution, sources said.
There was hope around the negotiation table that Carl Icahn, who owns much of the Trump Entertainment debt, would agree to convert that debt into equity and keep the 2,248-room hotel-casino out of Chapter 11.
That hope now appears to have faded.
“As cheap as these hotels are they are not bargains,” a source close to the situation said.
Atlantic City has had nothing but bad news this year. It started 2014 with 12 casinos — but when the Trump Plaza closes on Sept. 16 after the Miss America pageant there will be just eight remaining casinos.
Marc Lasry’s Avenue Capital in 2009 led a group of hedge funds that bought Trump Entertainment out of bankruptcy, beating a competing offer from Icahn.
Donald Trump retained a less than 10 percent stake.
Avenue and Icahn spokesmen declined comment. Trump Entertainment did not return e-mails seeking comment.
The Taj had a slight operating loss in the first six months of the year, according to Imperial Capital analyst Gregg Klein.
Trump Entertainment is working with restructuring adviser Houlihan Lokey, sources said.
The Taj until recently employed roughly 5,000 people. Already, roughly 6,000 people have lost their AC jobs as the Revel, Showboat and the Atlantic Club casinos have closed — to be followed by the Trump Plaza in 12 days.
Competition from casinos in Delaware and Pennsylvania is eroding traffic.
The Taj, with nearly 150,000 square feet of gambling space, is the second-largest casino in the seaside resort.
The casino closings will have “a big impact on Jersey shore businesses five or six miles away,” longtime Atlantic City worker Curtis Kugel told The Post.
There will be more store closings in nearby Egg Harbor Township and Pleasantville, he predicted.
The Taj’s trouble, of course, may not be the last of the bad news for AC.
“There is a real good chance [others] could be forced to file,” Klein told The Post.
Separately, the unsecured debt of casino owner Caesars has fallen from 50 cents on the dollar at the beginning of the summer to 25 cents more recently, sources said.
Caesars owners, Apollo Global Management and TPG Capital, last year split the chain into three companies — including one with faster-growing online assets and another with troubled brick-and-mortar casino operations.
bobsims
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September 4th, 2014 at 11:53:01 AM permalink
Quote: JackStraw8004

More bad news for Atlantic city. Is Trump Taj Mahal the next domino to fall. I know Donald himself wants his name removed from the property. I didn't realize they were doing this bad until this article came out today in the New York Post. Why keep it open if it's operating at a small loss or a small profit. Things aren't going to get better for Atlantic City. Icahn owns the very profitable Tropicana. Closing the Taj would bring major heat from the Governor, the Mayor and the union. Another 5000 unemployed, oh boy! Let's face it, though. The Taj is a dump. Their concert hall has pull out bleacher seats like a gym in a high school from the fifties. Plate, their coffee shop restaurant closes at 8pm many nights. I'm not kidding. They send people to eat to the snack bar or the noodle bar.





The Taj is going nowhere. It has positive EBITDA and will only get better with the Plaza's customers and some from the Showboat.
Who takes the hit is the bondholders-who have been taking hits for the last 20 years at the Taj.
While not a first rate property it is by no means a "dump".
bj4fun
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September 4th, 2014 at 7:16:26 PM permalink
We walked up from the Trop this afternoon and paid our respects to Trump Plaza. OMG this place looked and felt like a funeral parlor! They were dealing a few BJ games... Min 10 Max 50!!!! That's right folks... Guess they don't want to risk losing any "big" money. We won't be sad to see this one go (except for the employees, of course).

We stopped up at Caesar's after that, and they were quite busy. Dealing single deck (6/5), and shoe games (3/2). Watched someone get paid 18 dollars for his $15 BJ... I shook my head and my wife asked is 6/5 that bad? I said he should have gotten 22.5... She said so why do they play that? I shook my head again :(

As I said yesterday, full trip report upon our return home.
sodawater
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September 4th, 2014 at 7:30:01 PM permalink
Quote: bj4fun

We walked up from the Trop this afternoon and paid our respects to Trump Plaza. OMG this place looked and felt like a funeral parlor! They were dealing a few BJ games... Min 10 Max 50!!!! .




$50 max bet? why even spread the game?
bj4fun
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September 5th, 2014 at 4:32:51 AM permalink
Local AC news reporting that the Taj is about to file chapter 11....
Dicenor33
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September 5th, 2014 at 4:55:15 AM permalink
Real estate prices might go up. Hotels are closing, but AC is still on a map and people have to go somewhere on their vacations.
GWAE
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September 5th, 2014 at 5:02:15 AM permalink
Quote: Dicenor33

Real estate prices might go up. Hotels are closing, but AC is still on a map and people have to go somewhere on their vacations.



I think you have that backwards. Real estate taxes are going up which means house prices will drop.
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7star4now
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September 5th, 2014 at 7:07:51 AM permalink
"AC's Taj Mahal May Issue WARN Notices Soon: Source close to the situation says that UNITE HERE Local 54 has been informed"

Read more: http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/ACs-Taj-Mahal-May-Issue-WARN-Notices-Soon-Source-274043701.html#ixzz3CRyG1dzD
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AxelWolf
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September 5th, 2014 at 7:28:21 AM permalink
I wonder if they will start doing less for the players and charge more for rooms once the competition in AC goes down?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Boz
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September 5th, 2014 at 8:09:46 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

I wonder if they will start doing less for the players and charge more for rooms once the competition in AC goes down?




Since that would not any sense, I would expect them to do it immediatly!
GWAE
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September 5th, 2014 at 8:23:22 AM permalink
I don't understand why these places are willing to close to quickly. They have stayed open this long with losing money, why wouldn't you wait it out a little longer to see what happens with half of the competition closing.
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Boz
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September 5th, 2014 at 9:22:51 AM permalink
Quote: GWAE

I don't understand why these places are willing to close to quickly. They have stayed open this long with losing money, why wouldn't you wait it out a little longer to see what happens with half of the competition closing.



When you can no longer pay the bills and the banks are calling, sometimes you have to fold. Waiting it out is not an option sometimes.

Revel never made money and was out of options.
Trump Plaza was not going to pick any business up unless they spent tens of millions to update and no one would give them anything bringing in $4 million in gambling revenue a month.
Showboat was a calculated decision that the customers loyal to them would move to the other CZR properties and they could raise rates and drop comps for people who were not worth the trouble based on ADT and playing history.
And the Taj, if actually showing a profit, still cant afford the debt service.

And the level of competition is not going anywhere and is only increasing with MD now open taking much of the little remaining Baltimore business and the potential for NY to open more casinos.
7star4now
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September 5th, 2014 at 10:28:41 AM permalink
Quote: 7star4now

"AC's Taj Mahal May Issue WARN Notices Soon: Source close to the situation says that UNITE HERE Local 54 has been informed"

Read more: http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/ACs-Taj-Mahal-May-Issue-WARN-Notices-Soon-Source-274043701.html#ixzz3CRyG1dzD
Follow us: @nbcphiladelphia on Twitter | nbcphiladelphia on Facebook



update-

"Trump Taj Mahal paid its second-quarter property tax bill after reaching a settlement with the city on a reduction of the casino’s valuation. But the filing indicates that based on the casino’s financial distress, the third-quarter taxes will not be paid and such payments will be suspended “indefinitely.”

Meanwhile, Roger Gros, publisher of Global Gaming Business magazine and an Atlantic City casino expert for more than 30 years, tweeted on Friday that WARN notices – for The Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act, a federal law that requires companies to notify workers of a possible pending closing – would be sent to Trump Taj Mahal employees next week."

http://www.northjersey.com/news/trump-taj-mahal-could-be-the-next-atlantic-city-casino-to-close-owners-say-1.1081902
bj4fun
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September 5th, 2014 at 10:31:20 AM permalink
Tropicana President and CEO issued an open letter to their customers on AC.

Here is the link: open letter

We just left the Trop and you can already see many of the improvement they are making and things they are doing to attract and keep customers. Good to hear someone is investing in that market.
Boz
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September 5th, 2014 at 11:04:07 AM permalink
Quote: bj4fun

Tropicana President and CEO issued an open letter to their customers on AC.

Here is the link: open letter

We just left the Trop and you can already see many of the improvement they are making and things they are doing to attract and keep customers. Good to hear someone is investing in that market.




The rooms are what needs the most attention. I can live with a dirty old facade, worn carpet in the casino and all of that UNTIL I go to the room and it looks as bad as theirs do. Same issue as The Quad or whatever it is called now. A nice casino cannot cover filthy rooms.
onenickelmiracle
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September 6th, 2014 at 3:18:06 AM permalink
I've come to the conclusion the casinos know their protection within the state is over, above all else, the most pertinent reason they're all packing it in at once. It's a tragedy. Governor Crisco is done at this point from presidential consideration and New Jersey will keep him all to themself.
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vendman1
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September 6th, 2014 at 8:05:46 AM permalink
Quote: bj4fun

Local AC news reporting that the Taj is about to file chapter 11....



I think the Taj has been in bankruptcy 3 or 4 times over the years...doesn't mean they are going out of business just restructuring. Might they go out of business? Sure but the filing in and of itself means little.
7star4now
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September 6th, 2014 at 8:50:39 AM permalink
Quote: vendman1

I think the Taj has been in bankruptcy 3 or 4 times over the years...doesn't mean they are going out of business just restructuring. Might they go out of business? Sure but the filing in and of itself means little.



Yeah - but I've never heard imminent "WARN" notices coming from multiple sources re TAJ
ahiromu
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September 6th, 2014 at 11:13:18 AM permalink
If Taj closes I might have to seriously consider patronizing the Evil Empire. I've hung onto Trump for this long because if I put all my action towards Caesars, then I probably wouldn't get invited back to Trump - my bankroll for AC is much less than Vegas, so I can't risk having a few bad rolls at both places. However, with this potentially happening, I might have to stay a Sunday night (Only Sun-Fri) at Caesar's and see if they're willing to give me 7 days a week.
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JackStraw8004
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September 6th, 2014 at 2:31:20 PM permalink
Apparently Local 54 union and ex-mayor Whelan are denying there are imminent WARN notices. Who to believe. It's like the seven stages of death. They are at the denial stage.
pacomartin
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September 6th, 2014 at 3:07:39 PM permalink
Quote: ahiromu

If Taj closes I might have to seriously consider patronizing the Evil Empire. I've hung onto Trump for this long because if I put all my action towards Caesars, then I probably wouldn't get invited back to Trump - my bankroll for AC is much less than Vegas, so I can't risk having a few bad rolls at both places. However, with this potentially happening, I might have to stay a Sunday night (Only Sun-Fri) at Caesar's and see if they're willing to give me 7 days a week.



If Taj closes and Ceasars retains their gamblers from Showboat and possibly some of Taj gamblers, they may end up going from 38% to over 50%. As unlikely as it seems , the Commission is required by law to not have one organization control a majority of the gaming.
longhair
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September 6th, 2014 at 5:03:41 PM permalink
Quote: bobsims

The Taj is going nowhere. It has positive EBITDA and will only get better with the Plaza's customers and some from the Showboat.
Who takes the hit is the bondholders-who have been taking hits for the last 20 years at the Taj.
While not a first rate property it is by no means a "dump".




Agree. Compared to around 2-3 years ago, Taj upgraded the slots and has better shows in Mark Etess Arena..

Listen - no big loss with Revel.. that place wasn't great. Nicest rooms view in AC, yes.. but the Casino was a joke. Bouncy Craps tables without any feature bets, the high limit rooms were really weak, no six card feature bets at 3-Card and the 18 year old dealers were pretty bad overall. Not to mention that they ripped everyone off with that "you can't lose" farce.. Oh that's right.. they started out as a "resort that happens to have a casino" and then every was shocked that the casino lost money, players, and eventually closed.. Even the restaurant's sucked.. and you had to pay full because you couldn't get at comp..

We go at least one a month to AC - and usually about 15 time a year.. we certainly won't miss Revel..

Now Showboat I will miss.. great tables.. there was one jackass supervisor in the craps pit, but everyone else.. top notch. Card tables had feature bets too.. Tons of old school type $1 slots - blazing 7, quick hit.. rarely had to wait for one to play.. Love the $5 Wild Rose.. Those my end up at Bally's.. Taj or Resorts will likely absorb the non-Total Rewards Showboat players..

Total Rewards players will have an issue getting weekend comps at Caesars, but Harrah's has 2500 rooms.. only drawback is that Harrah's isn't on the boardwalk..

What really sucks - Golden Nugget re-covered all but one Craps table.. too bouncy now..
longhair
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September 6th, 2014 at 6:11:09 PM permalink
Quote: EvenBob

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2014/09/05/sources-say-trump-taj-mahal-casino-in-atlantic-city-is-poised-to-close/





Well that sucks.. What are they going to do with Scores?

Maybe they will turn Showboat into Scores.. :-)

rdw4potus
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September 6th, 2014 at 7:42:52 PM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

If Taj closes and Ceasars retains their gamblers from Showboat and possibly some of Taj gamblers, they may end up going from 38% to over 50%. As unlikely as it seems , the Commission is required by law to not have one organization control a majority of the gaming.



Really? So, if the Taj closes, there's pretty much no way Caesars can buy Revel without divesting Bally's & somehow ensuring that the buyer will operate the property as a casino.
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
Buzzard
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September 6th, 2014 at 7:56:09 PM permalink
The more things change, the more they remain the same. Read what some casinos did to promote future visitors. LOL

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/06/opinion/atlantic-citys-next-gamble.html?emc=eta1&_r=1
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onenickelmiracle
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September 6th, 2014 at 8:33:35 PM permalink
Quote: Buzzard

The more things change, the more they remain the same. Read what some casinos did to promote future visitors. LOL

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/06/opinion/atlantic-citys-next-gamble.html?emc=eta1&_r=1

I don't think the author knows what he is talking about. One of Atlantic City's biggest complaints is about the airport and he seems to think it's world class. As far as exorbitant costs to park, even around here the casino will make getting the money back with free play relatively easy with play though never free and still at an expected loss. If the casinos didn't do this in Atlantic City, they're not thinking longer term.
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pacomartin
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September 7th, 2014 at 9:11:08 AM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

Really? So, if the Taj closes, there's pretty much no way Caesars can buy Revel without divesting Bally's & somehow ensuring that the buyer will operate the property as a casino.



Well the law is a little vague, and it does not include specific limits (like Ceasars would be forced to give back everything above 50% to the state). Instead there are a series of requirements that the commission has to meet.

But remember NJ is the state that threw out MGM-Resorts for having dealings with Pansy Ho without an investigation (one of the most powerful people in gambling). The Gaming Commission also has to respond to possible charges brought by another casino company.

It seems unlikely that the Commission would force a sale (i.e. if Ceasars goes above 50% on it's last three properties), but they may prevent them from acquiring more.

It sounds impossible to believe that anyone would attack another casino in this climate, but people probably throw someone out of the lifeboat if things get rough.
onenickelmiracle
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September 8th, 2014 at 3:39:58 PM permalink
I was fully expecting Taj bankruptcy news today, but nothing yet.
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aceofspades
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onenickelmiracle
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September 8th, 2014 at 3:51:29 PM permalink
Quote: aceofspades

Taj filing bankruptcy and likely closing in November

Same rumor though, hasn't happened yet though all stories so far have come to fruition.
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Baccaratbabe81
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September 8th, 2014 at 3:55:06 PM permalink
Hey everyone new to the board. I got to say I keep seeing links about Taj closing but they all seem like the same exact story.
If the taj were to close it would obviously be the fault of big tobacco. Oh and 1 more thing, don't forget about the johny rockets coupons!
7star4now
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September 8th, 2014 at 4:29:36 PM permalink
"there is a high possibility that Trump Taj Mahal will close on September 16"?

http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/146524/will-atlantic-city-be-saved-by-sports-gambling
Baccaratbabe81
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September 8th, 2014 at 4:41:33 PM permalink
I thought a warn notice had to be 60 days. I could go for some cussingly good food at Harry's Oyster bar
rdw4potus
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September 8th, 2014 at 4:46:56 PM permalink
Quote: Baccaratbabe81

I thought a warn notice had to be 60 days. I could go for some cussingly good food at Harry's Oyster bar



The law says it's 60 days unless the buisiness is "faltering" and the 60 day notice would interfere with reasonable efforts to secure financing and save the business. Then it's 30 days. Since new financing would stave off the bankruptcy, the shorter 30 day requirement applies here.
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JackStraw8004
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September 8th, 2014 at 4:47:01 PM permalink
Quote: Baccaratbabe81

I thought a warn notice had to be 60 days. I could go for some cussingly good food at Harry's Oyster bar



Correct, WARN is 60 days.
onenickelmiracle
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September 8th, 2014 at 4:53:50 PM permalink
Quote: 7star4now

"there is a high possibility that Trump Taj Mahal will close on September 16"?

http://www.zacks.com/stock/news/146524/will-atlantic-city-be-saved-by-sports-gambling

High based on what big question. I don't give such a date much credibility.
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7star4now
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September 8th, 2014 at 5:00:10 PM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

The law says it's 60 days unless the buisiness is "faltering" and the 60 day notice would interfere with reasonable efforts to secure financing and save the business. Then it's 30 days. Since new financing would stave off the bankruptcy, the shorter 30 day requirement applies here.



"With three exceptions, notice must be timed to reach the required parties at least 60 days before a closing or layoff. When the individual employment separations for a closing or layoff occur on more than one day, the notices are due to the representative(s), State dislocated worker unit and local government at least 60 days before each separation. If the workers are not represented, each worker's notice is due at least 60 days before that worker's separation.

The exceptions to 60-day notice are:
(1) Faltering company. This exception, to be narrowly construed, covers situations where a company has sought new capital or business in order to stay open and where giving notice would ruin the opportunity to get the new capital or business, and applies only to plant closings;
(2) unforeseeable business circumstances. This exception applies to closings and layoffs that are caused by business circumstances that were not reasonably foreseeable at the time notice would otherwise have been required; and

(3) Natural disaster. This applies where a closing or layoff is the direct result of a natural disaster, such as a flood, earthquake, drought or storm."
http://www.doleta.gov/programs/factsht/warn.htm
JackStraw8004
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September 8th, 2014 at 5:01:38 PM permalink
I think any additional info about the Taj is now under wraps. Someone high up there probably pulled a Gordon Gekko from Wall Street in saying what they would do to the next person who leaked in formation out. The high level person said something about what he would do to their throats and skulls. It wasn't pretty.
7star4now
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September 8th, 2014 at 5:05:33 PM permalink
Quote: Baccaratbabe81

I thought a warn notice had to be 60 days. I could go for some cussingly good food at Harry's Oyster bar



Will you attend the "Show~Us~Your~Shoes" parade -tee~ hee?
7star4now
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September 8th, 2014 at 5:31:00 PM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

The law says it's 60 days unless the buisiness is "faltering" and the 60 day notice would interfere with reasonable efforts to secure financing and save the business. Then it's 30 days. Since new financing would stave off the bankruptcy, the shorter 30 day requirement applies here.



You could speculate that the disparity between Sept date, that just came out of the blue, & the Nov rumor, may be the reason the announcement is delayed.

They may want to close Sept but, waiting for a legal interpretation as to whether they need to be open 30 vs 60 days with the WARN loophole.
7star4now
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September 9th, 2014 at 6:03:44 AM permalink
(Reuters) -
"Trump Taj Mahal Casino is expected to close on or shortly after Nov. 13, if the company fails to reduce expenses and negotiate a deal with its largest union, the company said in its bankruptcy petition in a Delaware court."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/09/us-trump-bankruptcy-casinos-idUSKBN0H413E20140909
7star4now
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September 9th, 2014 at 6:58:57 AM permalink
Officials with the Trump Taj Mahal casino informed workers that they will receive WARN notices Tuesday afternoon, according to a high level source.

Read more: http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/Taj-Mahal-Workers-to-Receive-WARN-Notices-274464301.html#ixzz3CpK5Z6c0
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RaleighCraps
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September 9th, 2014 at 7:28:09 AM permalink
Trump Entertainment has filed for bankruptcy

http://money.msn.com/business-news/article.aspx?feed=BLOOM&date=20140909&id=17917231
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MrV
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September 9th, 2014 at 7:59:59 AM permalink
In this article , a Trump rep bleats: ""Mr. Trump brilliantly left Atlantic City more than 7 years ago and has not been back."

Sounds eerily familiar:

"What, me worry?"
ahiromu
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September 9th, 2014 at 9:01:30 AM permalink
Sigh. Evil Empire, here I come.
Its - Possessive; It's - "It is" / "It has"; There - Location; Their - Possessive; They're - "They are"
teddys
teddys
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September 9th, 2014 at 9:14:49 AM permalink
Quote: MrV

Ahahahahaha. Is that seriously for real? What year is that from?
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
miplet
miplet
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September 9th, 2014 at 10:25:45 AM permalink
Quote: teddys

Ahahahahaha. Is that seriously for real? What year is that from?


April 16, 1971
“Man Babes” #AxelFabulous
ahiromu
ahiromu
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September 9th, 2014 at 11:39:17 AM permalink
I grew up just outside of Seattle, I tell people I am from there because you can't expect people to know the suburbs. How the fuck did I not learn about this in school? Like, seriously, we spend half the year learning about the natives but we have to skip "recent" history because we run out of time? History education needs a serious overhaul.

The sad thing about a sign being posted up like that in AC would be that the last person out of the city will probably have their lights shut off because of lack of payment.
Its - Possessive; It's - "It is" / "It has"; There - Location; Their - Possessive; They're - "They are"
1BB
1BB
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September 9th, 2014 at 11:46:51 AM permalink
Quote: miplet

April 16, 1971



The lead car in the photo looks like a '62 Chevy, either an Impala, Bel Air or Biscayne. I'd have to see the tail lights.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
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