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Doc
Doc
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November 13th, 2011 at 9:48:23 AM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

I think what the wizard meant was that no English words start with "tl".


Of course. That's why from the many possibilities I chose two particular examples and my closing clause. (A lame attempt at humor gimped into the abyss.)
pacomartin
pacomartin
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November 13th, 2011 at 1:08:40 PM permalink
Quote: Nareed

But here are words in Spanish with "tl," well, at least one I could think of: Tlapalería (it means paint and paint-tool store; meaning house paint rather than art or industrial paints.)



En náhuatl tlapalli significa "raíz de color". So your initial guess was correct. The "tl" combination is from the indigenous languages.

Quote: Wikipedia


Nahuatl is a group of related languages and dialects of the Nahuan (traditionally called "Aztecan") branch of the Uto-Aztecan language family. Collectively they are spoken by an estimated 1.5 million Nahua people, most of whom live in Central Mexico. All Nahuan languages are indigenous to Mesoamerica. Nahuatl has been spoken in Central Mexico since at least the 7th century AD.

Many words from Nahuatl have been borrowed into Spanish and thence have diffused into hundreds of other languages. Most of these loanwords denote things indigenous to central Mexico which the Spanish heard mentioned for the first time by their Nahuatl names.

English words of Nahuatl origin include "avocado", "chayote", "chili", "chocolate", "coyote", "axolotl" and "tomato".






Lila Downs has recorded songs in Mixtec, Zapotec, Maya, Nahuatl and P'urhépecha. CANTO NAHUATL.
pacomartin
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November 13th, 2011 at 3:23:48 PM permalink
Quote: Doc

(A lame attempt at humor gimped into the abyss.)



Doc,
I am not sure if you know that a gimp is now a sexual fetishist who likes to be dominated and who dresses in a leather or rubber body suit with mask, zips, and chains. I am not sure how the word definition made the transformation from "lame", but I suspect that it was in France. The word "gimp" is related to "guimple" which is an Old French word meaning "headdress" or "veil".

I would retire this word from your vocabulary.

Nareed
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November 13th, 2011 at 3:30:50 PM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

I am not sure if you know that a gimp is now a sexual fetishist



Just about everything can be a fetish, you know :)
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
pacomartin
pacomartin
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November 13th, 2011 at 4:19:47 PM permalink
Quote: Nareed

Just about everything can be a fetish, you know :)



They did an episode of Sex and the City which implied that women were OK with male shoe fetishists since so many women were irrationally obsessed with shoes.


Personally, it reminds me of a Chihuahua dog, which seems to get excited about everything.
Doc
Doc
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November 13th, 2011 at 4:56:47 PM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

Doc,
I am not sure if you know that a gimp is now a sexual fetishist who likes to be dominated and who dresses in a leather or rubber body suit with mask, zips, and chains. I am not sure how the word definition made the transformation from "lame", but I suspect that it was in France. The word "gimp" is related to "guimple" which is an Old French word meaning "headdress" or "veil".

I would retire this word from your vocabulary.


I know there is such usage, and I recall the pawn shop owner and his friend Zed in Pulp Fiction referring to their plaything as "the gimp". However, I don't usually let my language usage be dominated by whatever the current fad in slang may be, particularly if it is a word that works well with other meanings. I doubt that you do either. Perhaps I would think in terms of that other meaning, if this forum were focused on bondage and domination, but then I wouldn't likely be posting here at all. I was thinking more of the definition I find in a standard dictionary:
Quote:

gimp informal often offensive
noun
a physically handicapped or lame person.
a limp.
a feeble or contemptible person.
verb [ intrans. ]
limp; hobble : she gimped around thereafter on an artificial leg.

ORIGIN 1920s (originally U.S.): of unknown origin.


My brother's girlfriend has one natural leg and a collection of artificial ones. She knows and uses a wide range of quips on the topic. She has several T shirts with comments about how "gimps" do it better. While there certainly is sexual content implied, it is not the one that you have suggested. I think "gimp" still works quite well in the context of "lame" or "limp", particularly if not used in an offensive manner.
pacomartin
pacomartin
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November 13th, 2011 at 7:24:40 PM permalink
Quote: Doc

However, I don't usually let my language usage be dominated by whatever the current fad in slang may be, particularly if it is a word that works well with other meanings. I doubt that you do either.



Well, if a word starts making some associations with people that I didn't intend, I am wary. If a word has some strange association that only a small group of people know, then it's not an issue. But "gimp" is gradually making it's way into the mainstream. I was particularly struck by how many times it was used in talking about the new television series, "American Horror Story".



I'm old enough that words like Eskimo, Indian, and Oriental do not some offensive to me, but merely descriptive. All these words have been used for hundreds of years. However, I don't use them because there are a lot of people who take offense.

You can't say the word appeasement because the meaning was permanently altered 60 years ago. The word "gypped" has connotations. You won't find one person in ten who can correctly define "chauvanistic".

We are rapidly losing our common culture. In 1823 when the following poem was published, probably everyone recognized the reference to Hamlet in the second line. Today almost nobody does.
1 'Twas the night before Christmas, when all thro' the house,
2 Not a creature was stirring, not even a mouse;
Wizard
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Wizard
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November 13th, 2011 at 7:30:37 PM permalink
What I was thinking was that I wasn't familiar with any words where T and L are consecutive and in the same syllable. I followed the show The Young and the ResTLess for years, and should have thought to quality my statement better.

That is interesting that English picked up the word Avocado and Spanish didn't. Don't they use palta instead?
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Nareed
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November 13th, 2011 at 7:48:26 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

That is interesting that English picked up the word Avocado and Spanish didn't. Don't they use palta instead?



What's interesting is how Spanish can vary between countries. I'd never heard the word "palta" before. In México, that vile fruit is called "aguacate."
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pacomartin
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November 14th, 2011 at 5:57:27 AM permalink
Quote: Nareed

Quote: Wizard

That is interesting that English picked up the word Avocado and Spanish didn't. Don't they use palta instead?



What's interesting is how Spanish can vary between countries. I'd never heard the word "palta" before. In México, that vile fruit is called "aguacate."



The word 'avocado' comes from the Spanish aguacate which in turn comes from the Nahuatl word ahuácatl (testicle, a reference to the shape of the fruit)

In Argentina, Bolivia, Chile, Peru, and Uruguay, the avocado is known by its Quechua name, palta. Quechuan is a "language" family spoken by as many as 8-10 million people. In contrast Mexico has 68 recognized indigenous languages spoken by roughly 5 million people.

There are four languages in Mexico with more than 1/4 million speakers:
(1) Mayan (4 major variants)
(2) Nahuatl (more than a million)
(3) Mixtec (mostly in Oaxaca)
(4) Zapotec (mostly in Oaxaca)

There is nothing remotely equivalent in the United States. Only Hawaiian is an official state language, and there are less than 2000 native speakers, and another 25K who have learned it as a secondary language.

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