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pacomartin
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September 23rd, 2012 at 7:29:33 AM permalink
Quote: WongBo

I believe ole' is directly descended from shouts of "Allah"

I know that there are literally thousands of Spanish word that trace their entymology to Arabic.


Correct!

Mostly adjectives, interjections, and nouns come from Arabic. English on the other hand took many verbs from French.

BTW, the spelling is "ety" not "enty". The latter is the study of insects.
WongBo
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September 23rd, 2012 at 7:57:31 AM permalink
I think my auto correct is stuck on insects.
I was researching mosquitos this summer, as I am horribly allergic.
Obviously mosquito is derived from mosca, or fly, in Spanish .
Yet, the insect I call a mosquito is called a zancudo by my Spanish speaking friends...
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
Wizard
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September 23rd, 2012 at 8:33:54 AM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

...but what is the one word you would expect Arabs to say?



Explosion.
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Doc
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September 23rd, 2012 at 8:43:15 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Explosion.


I assume you heard about the terrorist who was injured while trying to blow up a car. Burned his lips on the tail pipe.
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September 27th, 2012 at 11:07:20 AM permalink
Ping.

I thought I'd keep this thread on life support by asking if those who participate say my Spanish lesson with Claudia video. It has received only seven views on YouTube, so I'm not very sure. She answers to questions that we debated here:

1. Can "gordo/a" be used in a nice way in Spanish?
2. How do you say "hot dog" in Spanish.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
WongBo
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September 27th, 2012 at 12:02:40 PM permalink
I was not aware of the video until now.
I knew that gordo was ok as I have been called that and understood the context.
I was not sure if it was ok for a man to ever call a woman gorda.
In America you can call your buddy fatso, but not a woman...
I do not think I would be comfortable going there with gorda or even gordita.

The argument over hot dog reminded me that there are so many colloquialisms in Spanish
that one person is unlikely to know them all.
One example is ..bowling alley or bowling.
The term bolera is used by my friends Spanish mother,
And boliche by his Mexican brother in law.

trivia:
name an independent country where Spanish is the official language,
that is not located in Europe, South America, Central America or the Caribbean .
equatorial guinea in western Africa


Bonus trivia:
name a country also not located in the areas listed above,
Where Spanish was once an official language but is not any longer.
Phillippines, removed 1973
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
1BB
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September 27th, 2012 at 12:09:37 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Ping.

I thought I'd keep this thread on life support by asking if those who participate say my Spanish lesson with Claudia video. It has received only seven views on YouTube, so I'm not very sure. She answers to questions that we debated here:

1. Can "gordo/a" be used in a nice way in Spanish?
2. How do you say "hot dog" in Spanish.



The El Gorda y La Flaca show has been on Univison for years. Raul doesn't seem to mind being El Gordo.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
WongBo
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September 27th, 2012 at 12:16:53 PM permalink
Quote: 1BB

The El Gorda y La Flaca show has been on Univison for years. Raul doesn't seem to mind being El Gordo.


But would you ever see a show called EL FLACO Y LA GORDA?
Copyright!
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pacomartin
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September 27th, 2012 at 12:17:13 PM permalink
Quote: WongBo

trivia: name an independent country where Spanish is the official language,
that is not located in Europe, South America, Central America or the Caribbean .



Without looking, I know there is a tiny one in Africa near the indentation on the east side of the continent, but I can't remember the name. The Portuguese so controlled those waters, that there was very little opportunity for colonization by the Spanish.

Of course, in prior to American takeover, the Phillippines and Guam were one of the most important of the Spanish colonies. The yearly sailing of all the Spanish gold was the prize to beat all prizes for piracy.
pacomartin
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September 27th, 2012 at 12:21:09 PM permalink
Quote: 1BB

The El Gorda y La Flaca show has been on Univison for years. Raul doesn't seem to mind being El Gordo.



Even words like skinny, slender, or slight can be misconstrued in English if you are talking about a woman's body. A friend of mine says that Anglo are too uptight. Latinos take it for granted that people initially notice another person's body, and are not so worried about commenting on it.
WongBo
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September 27th, 2012 at 12:26:07 PM permalink
You were close, paco.
It is on the western shore of Africa.
Which I think you meant as you did mention the indentation.
Hint: the indentation is called the Gulf of Guinea
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
pacomartin
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September 27th, 2012 at 1:10:26 PM permalink
Quote: WongBo

Hint: the indentation is called the Gulf of Guinea



That's a pretty big hint. I looked up the history in Wikipedia to see how the Spanish got there. I see that it was almost 300 years after the famous Treaty of Tordesillas divided the entire world between the Spanish and the Portuguese.

I bet the Spanish dialect there is highly unusual. There are actually more English speakers in Nigeria than in the UK, but some people might not call it English.

Wizard
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September 27th, 2012 at 1:19:04 PM permalink
I got the bonus question correct.

However I got the first one wrong, but I think had a reasonable guess, which was
Sierra Leone
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pacomartin
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September 27th, 2012 at 2:11:54 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I got the bonus question correct.

However I got the first one wrong, but I think had a reasonable guess, which was



That is a reasonable guess. The name is actually Italian, not Spanish. According to wikipedia, the name was originally Portuguese, but it was later rendered in Italian. Which leads to an interesting question for which I have no answer. Why would a country in that portion of the world have an Italian name? Italy had no involvement with that region of Africa.
WongBo
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September 27th, 2012 at 2:45:31 PM permalink
Wikipedia discusses the formation of a corporate body called the Sierra Leone Company founding a colony of ex-slaves.
I assume the name of the company resulted from the translation of the original,
but no explanation for the change is given.
It seems possible or even probable that the name was changed before the foundation of the company and colony.
Probably just corrupted colloquially.
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
pacomartin
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September 27th, 2012 at 3:39:46 PM permalink
Quote: WongBo

Wikipedia discusses the formation of a corporate body called the Sierra Leone Company founding a colony of ex-slaves.
I assume the name of the company resulted from the translation of the original,
but no explanation for the change is given.
It seems possible or even probable that the name was changed before the foundation of the company and colony.
Probably just corrupted colloquially.



The Portuguese Serra de Leão goes back to the 15th century. The name was rendered in Italian at some point, but long before the Sierra Leone Company was founded at the very end of the 18th century.

If it was corrupted colloquially you would think that there were some Italian speakers that were influential enough to change the name of a region.
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October 12th, 2012 at 1:54:50 PM permalink
I just came across the name/title Santa Muerte today, also known by various other titles. You can read the Wiki link for the long version, but she is a saint of death, which some disaffected Catholics in Mexico find solace in. Evidently she has roots in the pre-Columbian Indian religions, and she made her way into Catholicism. It would seem from Wikipedia she is a pretty significant figure in Mexican Catholicism. I'm surprised I have not heard of her.

Just a little Spanish culture to keep this thread on life support.
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October 15th, 2012 at 12:57:00 PM permalink
Sorry to keep talking to myself, but this is a follow-up to the above post. I asked my landscaper Lamberto about Santa Muerte today. That was a mistake. I had to suffer through a sermon about the basics of Christianity and the joy Jesus brings to his heart. In the end, he basically said Santa Muerte was the same person as the devil.
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pacomartin
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October 16th, 2012 at 7:39:26 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I just came across the name/title Santa Muerte today, also known by various other titles.
Just a little Spanish culture to keep this thread on life support.



The figures of Santa Muerte are used in a lot of both horror movies, and in gangster films. They are very popular in Tepito ,the legendary open air market in Mexico City. The saying is that if you need an elephant you can find one in Tepito.

While Mexican markets are a lot of fun, Tepito is usually considered too dangerous for foreigners.




She is unrelated to the more whimsical skeletons that you see everywhere.
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October 16th, 2012 at 8:26:21 AM permalink
Today is Lunes Martes, which means Lupe's weekly visit. I asked her about Santa Muerte and got a pretty strong response, which is unusual for Lupe.

She said that belief in Santa Muerte is basically a popular form of witchcraft in Mexico. I definitely got the opinion it is contrary to Catholicism, and something good Catholics like her self stay away from. However, she told a story that she knew two different people who worshiped SM. According to one of them, SM cured her daughter of cancer and brought them wealth. The other had an alter devoted to SM on which she would put apples and other food. However, to Lupe, the SM is still very taboo.
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Ibeatyouraces
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October 16th, 2012 at 8:44:36 AM permalink
deleted
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
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October 16th, 2012 at 9:05:06 AM permalink
Quote: Ibeatyouraces

Wasn't yesterday Lunes?



¡Ooops!
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pacomartin
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October 16th, 2012 at 9:26:20 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

She said that belief in Santa Muerte is basically a popular form of witchcraft in Mexico.



SM is closely associated with the violent armed gangs and is rejected by good Catholic Mexicans.

While on this topic, keep in mind that America is more used to secular comments. You can say that Christmas, Yule logs, Christmas trees, Easter Bunnies, are all pagan rituals adopted into Christianity or that the pope's holy vestments were merely the clothing of the medieval upper class. Most comments like this will not upset people in America. Most preachers in the USA will say that Christmas is the day we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ to get out of the argument that there is no good reason to think that Jesus was born near the winter solstice. In addition shepherds didn't watch over their sheep in the middle of winter.

But if you tell a Mexican that many historians believe that the Virgin of Guadalupe is a version of the mother-goddess Tonantzin which was adopted by the Spaniards as a way of mass converting the native people to Catholicism, you may find yourself in deep trouble.
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October 16th, 2012 at 8:32:03 PM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

SM is closely associated with the violent armed gangs and is rejected by good Catholic Mexicans.

While on this topic, keep in mind that America is more used to secular comments. You can say that Christmas, Yule logs, Christmas trees, Easter Bunnies, are all pagan rituals adopted into Christianity or that the pope's holy vestments were merely the clothing of the medieval upper class. Most comments like this will not upset people in America. Most preachers in the USA will say that Christmas is the day we celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ to get out of the argument that there is no good reason to think that Jesus was born near the winter solstice. In addition shepherds didn't watch over their sheep in the middle of winter.

But if you tell a Mexican that many historians believe that the Virgin of Guadalupe is a version of the mother-goddess Tonantzin which was adopted by the Spaniards as a way of mass converting the native people to Catholicism, you may find yourself in deep trouble.



Christianity has been watered down in both the US and Mexico, but by different things. Mexico has the Virgin Guadalupe and the U.S. has Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. I'm not going to say either religion is closer to the truth. It would be like saying one betting system is better than another.

As long as their followers are striving to improve themselves, and others, that is okay with me.
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FrGamble
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October 16th, 2012 at 8:51:18 PM permalink
Whoa horsey!?! Do I hear you guys saying that Our Lady of Guadalupe is a made up ploy for evangelization or is equivalent to Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny??? That is loco mi amigos. The miracle of the Virgin Guadalupe is something for good reason very special to not only the Mexican people but to every Catholic.
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October 16th, 2012 at 9:18:04 PM permalink
Quote: FrGamble

The miracle of the Virgin Guadalupe is something for good reason very special to not only the Mexican people but to every Catholic.



The floor is yours Padre. Please continue. Don't forget -- at least one sentence in Español.

Yo quiero Taco Bell.
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FrGamble
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October 16th, 2012 at 10:39:38 PM permalink
Oh boy, where do I begin, I know... Yo quiero Taco Bell.

No seriously I think Our Lady of Guadalupe is one of the most amazing things in the world. I just have time to give three quick reasons that I would be happy to elaborate later on but I trust Pacomartin would do a great job as well.

1) It is an amazing physical miracle. Specifically the hands and face are painted in a way that no one can explain.
2) It brought together and gave birth to the Mexican people and some say the country.
3) It was providential that the Blessed Virgin Mary would appear in the new world gaining so many converts while at the same time in the 'old world' of Europe so many were leaving the Church during the reformation.

Sorry this post is so weak but I've got to hit the sack. buenas noches.
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October 21st, 2012 at 12:01:57 PM permalink
Thanks Father. I stand corrected; I guess. Can you give me the Dummy's version of all the virgin manifestations? Is there a list of all the recognized ones by the Vatican?

Mi casa es su casa.
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WongBo
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October 21st, 2012 at 1:31:52 PM permalink
Yo quiero taco bell?
Vaya con Dios!
Adios.
;)
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
WongBo
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October 21st, 2012 at 2:30:32 PM permalink
Following the Spanish Conquest in 151921,
a temple of the mother-goddess Tonantzin at Tepeyac outside Mexico City,
was destroyed and a chapel dedicated to the Virgin built on the site.
Newly converted Indians continued to come from afar to worship there.
The object of their worship, however, was equivocal,
as they continued to address the Virgin Mary as Tonantzin.


Source wikipedia
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
FrGamble
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October 21st, 2012 at 7:40:17 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Thanks Father. I stand corrected; I guess. Can you give me the Dummy's version of all the virgin manifestations? Is there a list of all the recognized ones by the Vatican?

Mi casa es su casa.




This is a pretty neat link that talks a little about the Church's approach to appearances of Mary. It includes a list of all of the 20th Century claimed appearances of Mary. I learned a lot because I had no idea there were so many. Here is a quote from the link:

"A statistical analysis of the Marian apparition directory reveals the following results. During the twentieth century, there have been 386 cases of Marian apparitions. The Church has made "no decision" about the supernatural character regarding 299 of the 386 cases. The Church has made a "negative decision" about the supernatural character in seventy-nine of the 386 cases. Out of the 386 apparitions, the Church has decided that "yes" there is a supernatural character only in eight cases: Fatima (Portugal), Beauraing (Belgium), Banneux (Belgium), Akita (Japan), Syracuse (Italy), Zeitoun (Egypt), Manila (Philippines) (according to some sources), and Betania (Venezuela). Local bishops have approved of the faith expression at the sites where these eight apparitions occurred. Besides the eight approved apparitions, there have been eleven (out of the 386 apparitions) which have not been approved with a "supernatural character," but which have received a "yes" to indicate the local bishop's "approval of faith expression (prayer and devotion) at the site."

List of Marian Apparations

Yo quiero Taco Bell
FrGamble
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October 21st, 2012 at 7:44:09 PM permalink
I want to make sure I reiterate that this list is just starting from 1900 and doesn't go back to the 3rd century for a complete list of all the approved appearances of the Blessed Mother. Therefore you won't see Guadalupe or Lourdes for example on this list. Gracias!
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October 21st, 2012 at 8:23:30 PM permalink
Thanks Father, I did read through that list. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Virgin Mary does not have a confirmed appearance in the U.S.. Do Catholics typically enjoy visiting the spots of confirmed sightings in their travels? How many have you been to?
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pacomartin
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October 21st, 2012 at 10:06:54 PM permalink
Quote: FrGamble

I want to make sure I reiterate that this list is just starting from 1900 and doesn't go back to the 3rd century for a complete list of all the approved appearances of the Blessed Mother. Therefore you won't see Guadalupe or Lourdes for example on this list. Gracias!



Here is a short list of classic Marian Apparations

The list contains an IMPORTANT NOTICE:

Belief in apparitions and private revelations is not binding on Catholics. Note that it is up to the appropriate Church authorities to pass judgment on all apparitions and private revelations. Catholics should reject any 'apparitions' and 'private revelations' which do not conform to traditional Catholic teaching as unworthy of belief.
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October 22nd, 2012 at 4:08:34 AM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

Belief in apparitions and private revelations is not binding on Catholics. Note that it is up to the appropriate Church authorities to pass judgment on all apparitions and private revelations. Catholics should reject any 'apparitions' and 'private revelations' which do not conform to traditional Catholic teaching as unworthy of belief.



Again, very interesting. I see them walking a fine line on the issue of all these virgin appearances. For what it is worth, I think my tutor believes in all of them -- especially the ones in Peru.

My mother in law claims to have been visited by Jesus' father (Joseph) as a child, and miraculously cured her of chilblain. I've always hoped FrG could meet her, to flesh out her story some more.
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WongBo
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October 27th, 2012 at 10:57:37 AM permalink
No se oía ni el vuelo de una mosca...
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Wizard
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October 30th, 2012 at 3:33:06 PM permalink
¡Hemos Movado!

I'd like to invite everybody over to Diversity Tomorrow to continue learning Spanish, one word at a time.
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Nareed
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October 30th, 2012 at 4:41:42 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

¡Hemos Movado!



¿Qué?

Assuming you meant to say "We've moved," thet it's "Nos mudamos," or "nos hemos mudado"
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
pacomartin
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November 5th, 2012 at 7:40:40 PM permalink
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