FleaStiff
FleaStiff
Joined: Oct 19, 2009
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December 21st, 2015 at 1:59:58 PM permalink
Really an example of Oklahoma and of tribal casinos.

Vegas is full of bus drivers from retirement homes who come in with a stack of retiree's cards.

Someone I know of has an Uncle who plays for a two week visit in Vegas each year, they often play together as part of the family visit but on the last day of his visit it is always the same ritual at half the casinos in town. They switch cards and all those dealers, hosts and pit bosses never bat an eye when he buys in for five grand and presents "his" players club card showing he is Penelope. They play like this for several hours at different outer casinos and inner lower-tier casinos. No one ever calls this beefy cigar reeking guy from Jersey "Penny". No one ever calls Penelope "Jersey Mike" or offers her a chaw of tobaccy.

Absolutely nothing is said by the casino personnel who know that Jersey Mike's niece will get several highly enhanced mailers from the various casinos involved over the next several months.
qwertyoc
qwertyoc
Joined: Dec 17, 2015
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December 21st, 2015 at 2:28:56 PM permalink
Quote: ukaserex

Let's be honest here. Your friend is getting over on the casino by using other people's free/match play. You say he's risking his own money - he's not. He puts 5 coins in, the machine reimburses those 5 coins, win or lose. So, he is essentially stealing money from the casino. You could argue that if it's not him getting the money, it's his friend/family, so what's the harm?



You are completely incorrect here about how match/free play works. If it is $5 match play, he plays his own $5 and then is able to download $5 (credit) to the machine but he cannot cash it out so it did not reimburse him. In some cases, even after playing his own $5 and then the $5 match, he may not hit a single pay and have lost money. So yes, he is risking his own money. So is he stealing money from the casino in this case? If you could cash out the $5 after playing your own $5, that would be a different story but it doesn't work that way because it isn't $5 they are giving you, it is $5 credit.
RS
RS
Joined: Feb 11, 2014
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December 22nd, 2015 at 12:47:10 PM permalink
Quote: Paigowdan

No; I may be a winner by skill.......I don't expect to win as a goal, I expect to play, and enjoy it.



You contradict yourself right here.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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December 22nd, 2015 at 1:08:34 PM permalink
Quote: qwertyoc

A good friend of mine was just recently arrested for playing on players club cards



Hold it. This isn't about casino rules about using cards. We all know there are rules about that. But... ARRESTED? And having a car towed?

Please IDENTIFY the casino. I want to call them.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
Joined: Oct 5, 2011
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December 22nd, 2015 at 1:15:24 PM permalink
Quote: mcallister3200

The IRS thinks free slot play has a cash value



since when? the IRS doesn't even tax frequent flyer miles.

Quote: Dalex64

"no cash value" just means that it can not be redeemed for cash.



That's right. You can't redeem it for cash because it has no cash value. And that's why it's not taxed.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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December 22nd, 2015 at 1:18:07 PM permalink
Quote: mcallister3200

Saying that the IRS doesn't consider freeplay to have monetary value but that the income from it is taxable is entirely an issue of semantics.



It is not an issue of semantics. It's a matter of reality.

Free play has no value. But if you play for free and happen to win something, that get's taxed.

Understand?

Okay, try this: you send in your entry to the Publishers Clearinghouse. That entry has no value and is not taxed. But you win a million dollars a year for life, and then you're taxed.

No semantics involved.
qwertyoc
qwertyoc
Joined: Dec 17, 2015
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December 26th, 2015 at 1:05:05 AM permalink
Some additional information to report:

The police report indicates that my friend used 12 peoples cards to be awarded $5 in match play for which he played on the machine and was able to cash out for a profit which they are claiming defrauded the casino. He actually had put $200 of his own money into the machine and was playing the cards and when he was approached, they seized his entire ticket which would have been any money he made plus his own money. When he told them $200 was his own money, they claimed they had to keep the cash out ticket for evidence and then arrested him.

Nationally, I believe that Tribal authorities only have jurisdiction over non-indians in matters of Domestic Violence but in 2013, Oklahoma enacted a House Bill (#1871) which allows tribal police to enforce state laws and act as peace officers (essentially making them just like regular officers). Because of this, when they made the arrest, they were acting as a city/municipal police department so I believe if there is a claim for false arrest and wrongful search and seizure he would possibly have a case since it isn't tribal. Also, I think it could be shown that the reason he was arrested was out of a retaliation since the tribal police are mainly funded by the casino.

I am curious on everyone else's thoughts?
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
Joined: Jan 12, 2010
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December 26th, 2015 at 8:14:38 AM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

Hold it. This isn't about casino rules about using cards. We all know there are rules about that. But... ARRESTED? And having a car towed?

Please IDENTIFY the casino. I want to call them.


I think he said an Indian casino in Oklahoma. They can do what they want and you have no recourse.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
SanchoPanza
SanchoPanza
Joined: May 10, 2010
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December 26th, 2015 at 9:47:45 AM permalink
Quote: qwertyoc

Nationally, I believe that Tribal authorities only have jurisdiction over non-indians in matters of Domestic Violence but in 2013, Oklahoma enacted a House Bill (#1871) which allows tribal police to enforce state laws and act as peace officers (essentially making them just like regular officers). Because of this, when they made the arrest, they were acting as a city/municipal police department so I believe if there is a claim for false arrest and wrongful search and seizure he would possibly have a case since it isn't tribal. Also, I think it could be shown that the reason he was arrested was out of a retaliation since the tribal police are mainly funded by the casino.

Who holds the trials, the tribes or the State of Oklahoma?
MrV
MrV
Joined: Feb 13, 2010
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December 26th, 2015 at 11:19:29 AM permalink
Tribal court, almost certainly.

Your buddy is screwed.

He should hire an attorney familiar with Indian law, one who practices regularly in that particular tribal court, and see what kind of deal can be made to plea bargain and resolve the case.

He was a fool to do what he did, and should not whine unduly after getting caught.
"What, me worry?"

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