Mdawgs Investments
Quote: MDawgElon doesn't care about money. Lives in a 375 sq. ft. prefab. and has declared that he will sell or give away all material possessions.
In some respects, he's not that far from the RainMan, remember, "he doesn't understand the concept of money."
link to original post
Entrepreneurial genius. Just an idiot with his mouth.
The only way to pay that tax is selling the converted shares?
Quote: TDVegasI’m still trying to understand why he needs to liquidate shares. I’m surmising that it is related to his stock options. He has the ability to buy the stock at $6 and sell it for current price. If he doesn’t convert the option into shares, he loses the option. Worthless. If he converts the option to stock shares…he then has a realized gain of $1,000’s per share based on current price and he must pay tax on that? Even if he just holds the shares?
The only way to pay that tax is selling the converted shares?
link to original post
My understanding is that he will be incurring a $15billion tax bill whether he buys the shares and holds them or sells them. He needs the $20billion to pay the $15billion tax bill.
Quote: DRichQuote: TDVegasI’m still trying to understand why he needs to liquidate shares. I’m surmising that it is related to his stock options. He has the ability to buy the stock at $6 and sell it for current price. If he doesn’t convert the option into shares, he loses the option. Worthless. If he converts the option to stock shares…he then has a realized gain of $1,000’s per share based on current price and he must pay tax on that? Even if he just holds the shares?
The only way to pay that tax is selling the converted shares?
link to original post
My understanding is that he will be incurring a $15billion tax bill whether he buys the shares and holds them or sells them. He needs the $20billion to pay the $15billion tax bill.
link to original post
That was my thinking. It doesn’t matter whether he holds the shares or not…when the options are exercised, and I’m guessing he has no choice, he will have to pay tax even on the unrealized gain. His only other option would be to let the options expire (worthless?)
My estimate is that his 22 million options at $6 will be bought for around $130 million and sold for in excess of $22 billion at current market valuation. At 37% tax rate, that’s around $8 billion that he has to come up with for tax man…unless one of my numbers is wrong.
His brother, who, AFAIK has almost no connection to Tesla beyond his brother is running the show cashed out $100 million on Friday. Nice work if you can get it.
Quote: TDVegasQuote: DRichQuote: TDVegasI’m still trying to understand why he needs to liquidate shares. I’m surmising that it is related to his stock options. He has the ability to buy the stock at $6 and sell it for current price. If he doesn’t convert the option into shares, he loses the option. Worthless. If he converts the option to stock shares…he then has a realized gain of $1,000’s per share based on current price and he must pay tax on that? Even if he just holds the shares?
The only way to pay that tax is selling the converted shares?
link to original post
My understanding is that he will be incurring a $15billion tax bill whether he buys the shares and holds them or sells them. He needs the $20billion to pay the $15billion tax bill.
link to original post
That was my thinking. It doesn’t matter whether he holds the shares or not…when the options are exercised, and I’m guessing he has no choice, he will have to pay tax even on the unrealized gain. His only other option would be to let the options expire (worthless?)
My estimate is that his 22 million options at $6 will be bought for around $130 million and sold for in excess of $22 billion at current market valuation. At 37% tax rate, that’s around $8 billion that he has to come up with for tax man…unless one of my numbers is wrong.
His brother, who, AFAIK has almost no connection to Tesla beyond his brother is running the show cashed out $100 million on Friday. Nice work if you can get it.
link to original post
I believe those options were earned in California so he will also have a large state tax bill.
Quote: DRichQuote: TDVegasQuote: DRichQuote: TDVegasI’m still trying to understand why he needs to liquidate shares. I’m surmising that it is related to his stock options. He has the ability to buy the stock at $6 and sell it for current price. If he doesn’t convert the option into shares, he loses the option. Worthless. If he converts the option to stock shares…he then has a realized gain of $1,000’s per share based on current price and he must pay tax on that? Even if he just holds the shares?
The only way to pay that tax is selling the converted shares?
link to original post
My understanding is that he will be incurring a $15billion tax bill whether he buys the shares and holds them or sells them. He needs the $20billion to pay the $15billion tax bill.
link to original post
That was my thinking. It doesn’t matter whether he holds the shares or not…when the options are exercised, and I’m guessing he has no choice, he will have to pay tax even on the unrealized gain. His only other option would be to let the options expire (worthless?)
My estimate is that his 22 million options at $6 will be bought for around $130 million and sold for in excess of $22 billion at current market valuation. At 37% tax rate, that’s around $8 billion that he has to come up with for tax man…unless one of my numbers is wrong.
His brother, who, AFAIK has almost no connection to Tesla beyond his brother is running the show cashed out $100 million on Friday. Nice work if you can get it.
link to original post
I believe those options were earned in California so he will also have a large state tax bill.
link to original post
Ah, yes. Correct. It’s probably closer to 50%.
It opened down 3% but BofA came to rescue this morning with a price hike target of $1,200. See if it holds today.
TSLA seems to be on the rebound.
Musk “quietly” dumped about $5b in Tesla stock.
I believe Ford owns 10% of Rivian so that is a potential $10 billion dollar windfall for them.Quote: TDVegasAMZN might be on back of RIVN. Currently a car company worth more than GM.
Musk “quietly” dumped about $5b in Tesla stock.
link to original post
Quote: MDawgTSLA dips below a 1000! I did a trade for additional shares at 980, see where it goes, might hold it past today.
link to original post
Looks like Musk sold at or near the high! He can re-buy now at a discount if he wants to resume the same percentage ownership he had before selling, and pocket literally billions of dollars in cash. I thought about buying more like you for a quick profit, but picked DKNG instead. Bought 300, already sold 200 at a total $100 profit. Still have 100 more holding....
All over the map.
Quote: TDVegasTSLA just did a 25 point reversal in about 5 minutes. Unreal volatility. Down $30 to down $5.
All over the map.
link to original post
It is a $1,000 stock. If the raw numbers bother you, go by percentages instead. Tesla has been a world-class roller coaster since its IPO.
Quote: billryanQuote: TDVegasTSLA just did a 25 point reversal in about 5 minutes. Unreal volatility. Down $30 to down $5.
All over the map.
link to original post
It is a $1,000 stock. If the raw numbers bother you, go by percentages instead. Tesla has been a world-class roller coaster since its IPO.
link to original post
Bother me? Not really. Something triggered heavy buying at exactly 2:40pm….$984 to $1,021, lickity split. Noted it.
Quote: MDawgI did a trade for additional shares at 980, see where it goes, might hold it past today.
link to original post
Still holding those additional shares, might just add them to my long term TSLA if the upward trend continues.
Holding these same stocks long term is great too.
Quote: MDawgDid someone say something about how a trade in AMZN could possibly be less than profitable? How/why, when it is pushing 3750 again. Patience is all it takes to achieve 100% success trading stocks that continue to hit ATHs and always return to at or close to ATHs. SooPoo got it - caught on and started trading away. Others - still banging their heads against walls wondering, why, how? 😇 😆
Holding these same stocks long term is great too.
link to original post
It is possible to lose on a day trade considering it has dropped almost $80 from the high today. Anyone telling me they can always time it right or time it better than 50% right, consistently, is probably not being truthful or transparent. I use “probably” because a stronger word might get me banned.
Quote: TDVegasQuote: MDawgDid someone say something about how a trade in AMZN could possibly be less than profitable? How/why, when it is pushing 3750 again. Patience is all it takes to achieve 100% success trading stocks that continue to hit ATHs and always return to at or close to ATHs. SooPoo got it - caught on and started trading away. Others - still banging their heads against walls wondering, why, how? 😇 😆
Holding these same stocks long term is great too.
link to original post
It is possible to lose on a day trade considering it has dropped almost $80 from the high today. Anyone telling me they can always time it right or time it better than 50% right, consistently, is probably not being truthful or transparent. I use “probably” because a stronger word might get me banned.
link to original post
You are not wrong…. but…. MDawg has stated many times if he buys one of his bellwethers and it goes down he just adds it to his long term holdings until it (inexorably, in his opinion) comes back up. I am pretty sure I can time it better than 50% right…. Remember, if I buy a stock at 100 and put a sell in at 101, I can win even if it just oscilllates from a range of 98-102, and it doesn’t even matter what it closes at. I did this with DKNG recently. Bought at (example, don’t remember exact numbers) 38, put in sell of 39, sold…. But then closed down at 37.
Quote: TDVegasQuote: MDawgDid someone say something about how a trade in AMZN could possibly be less than profitable? How/why, when it is pushing 3750 again. Patience is all it takes to achieve 100% success trading stocks that continue to hit ATHs and always return to at or close to ATHs. SooPoo got it - caught on and started trading away. Others - still banging their heads against walls wondering, why, how? 😇 😆
Holding these same stocks long term is great too.
link to original post
It is possible to lose on a day trade considering it has dropped almost $80 from the high today. Anyone telling me they can always time it right or time it better than 50% right, consistently, is probably not being truthful or transparent. I use “probably” because a stronger word might get me banned.
link to original post
This is 100% wrong. It’s been a bull market for how long now? If you think buying at a price and selling at a slightly higher price is only 50% chance of happening, you very much misunderstand the market.
Quote: SOOPOOYou are not wrong…. but…. MDawg has stated many times if he buys one of his bellwethers and it goes down he just adds it to his long term holdings until it (inexorably, in his opinion) comes back up.
That’s fine. I don’t consider that trading. That’s simply buying and holding and hoping your “day trade” that’s underwater eventually goes green as it is “switched” to a long term hold. Shhh…
Let’s cut the BS with calling all these “trades”. They are ONLY called trades when he’s on the profit side of a quick buy and sell and gladly announces that. Otherwise…the “losing” stock buy is merely “moved” into long term holdings, and no one hears anything about it.
I consider his banter about “trades” a form of a “shell game” where he is deliberately misleading people to look like a stock hero. No harm. It is what it is. It’s transparent now…only because I pointed it out, much to his chagrin.
Quote: unJonThis is 100% wrong. It’s been a bull market for how long now? If you think buying at a price and selling at a slightly higher price is only 50% chance of happening, you very much misunderstand the market.
Disagree. Completely. Day trading is a different animal. Entirely. He specifically uses the word trading, not investing. When the word trading is used, I consider that to be daily hit and runs…in effect day trading. Or trading stocks. Obviously it could be more than one day, but my point stands. Trading is different than investing. Investing in a bull market puts the wind at your back…it doesn’t guarantee profits.
On trading. Active trading. I trust this article and think it is you who is 100% wrong.
https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/if-you-re-day-trading-you-will-probably-lose-money-here-s-why-1030667770
This bull market is over a decade old now and I know a bunch of people who tried day trading and had their lunch handed to them.
Timing a bull market is no different than trying to time a bear market.
The rest of you, I don't want any trouble from the rest of you.
Quote: billryanI've done well on 100% of the stocks that have gone up since I bought them. I just don't see the point of bragging about that.
link to original post
Agree. I’m in the same boat.
Quote: billryanI've done well on 100% of the stocks that have gone up since I bought them. I just don't see the point of bragging about that.
This bull market is over a decade old now and I know a bunch of people who tried day trading and had their lunch handed to them.
Timing a bull market is no different than trying to time a bear market.
link to original post
Also agree. Trading is an entirely different animal, imo…bull or bear market.
Quote: TDVegasQuote: unJonThis is 100% wrong. It’s been a bull market for how long now? If you think buying at a price and selling at a slightly higher price is only 50% chance of happening, you very much misunderstand the market.
Disagree. Completely. Day trading is a different animal. Entirely. He specifically uses the word trading, not investing. When the word trading is used, I consider that to be daily hit and runs…in effect day trading. Or trading stocks. Obviously it could be more than one day, but my point stands. Trading is different than investing. Investing in a bull market puts the wind at your back…it doesn’t guarantee profits.
On trading. Active trading. I trust this article and think it is you who is 100% wrong.
https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/stocks/if-you-re-day-trading-you-will-probably-lose-money-here-s-why-1030667770
link to original post
So you just pulled a straw man? Congratulations. Lol. Way to argue against something that is not what MDawg has described as what he is doing.
True or false: Every person who plays Roulette for at least an hour is a winner!
It's true! Every person who plays for an hour is almost certainly going to have at least one winning spin.
Quote: unJon
So you just pulled a straw man? Congratulations. Lol. Way to argue against something that is not what MDawg has described as what he is doing.
link to original post
Yup, he just keeps saying the same thing over and over again. If a trade I enter is profitable enough, I close it that day. If not, or if it runs (such as when I entered extra shares of TSLA the other day at 980), I hold it beyond that day. I'd say that close to 100% of my trades are in the money the same day. But the notable exceptions are the times when I get stuck, sometimes badly, and in all such cases, holding anywhere from another day to - the longest was four months - the stock has always come back. And that was just one time I had to hold four months, usually it takes just a day, a few days or max a matter of weeks to get back into the green. Percentage wise the number of trades I end up having to hold beyond that day is extremely low, so the combination of that I trade stocks that tend to go up over time, and my experience in doing this do lend to a very low need to hold any trade longer than a day, unless I want to do so.
Keep in mind too that I also sometimes average in more shares before the trade is closed out profitably.
If you look at SooPoo's trades I assume that you will find that over time as he gets better at this, the number of times he gets stuck and has to hold longer than a day will go down. Either that, or he will quit trading, because it's not for everyone.
But with the stocks I trade, they always come back to new ATHs no matter what anyway.
The only real question is: would I make more money trading additional shares, or simply accumulating and holding additional shares. But, also as discussed, there is the "fun" factor of trading that figures into the equation too.
Quote: darkozThe old semantics game.
True or false: Every person who plays Roulette for at least an hour is a winner!
It's true! Every person who plays for an hour is almost certainly going to have at least one winning spin.
link to original post
Not really though DarkOz. Putting money in the stock market is +EV. What MDawg does trading wise is +EV, at least during a bull market.
Quote: unJonQuote: darkozThe old semantics game.
True or false: Every person who plays Roulette for at least an hour is a winner!
It's true! Every person who plays for an hour is almost certainly going to have at least one winning spin.
link to original post
Not really though DarkOz. Putting money in the stock market is +EV. What MDawg does trading wise is +EV, at least during a bull market.
link to original post
I get that.
I was just showing an extreme example of how semantics works.
Quote: MDawgI'd say that close to 100% of my trades are in the money the same day.
Correct. The ones that aren’t are “moved” to a long term hold.
Based on that, everyone could claim “close to 100% of my trades are in the money.”
As stated, I consider your wording to be at best misleading or an attempt to mislead about your stock prowess. I note your statement above as evidence of that.
Quote: darkozThe old semantics game.
True or false: Every person who plays Roulette for at least an hour is a winner!
It's true! Every person who plays for an hour is almost certainly going to have at least one winning spin.
link to original post
Yep. I consider his posting to be a form of what you noted.
Convenient wording to always be winning.
And the times I have to or choose to convert my day trades to swing trades in a given year is really not many times especially considering that I do an average of 20 trades a week when I am active. I am very good at this.
Your posting is predictable, if anything.
Where are all the transactions (trades) trying to capitalize on the upswing after drops? Oh yeah, none of those trades are listed here because the stock was trading lower each time.
As I stated, I trust my assessment of your wording. It’s not difficult to see that you like to present yourself in the manner you do…all things gambling, stocks and I’m guessing whatever else.
Quote: MDawgThe only real question is: would I make more money trading additional shares, or simply accumulating and holding additional shares. But, also as discussed, there is the "fun" factor of trading that figures into the equation too.
link to original post
Meantime, others may sit around doing nothing on dip days. Which translates to earning, nothing.
Quote: SOOPOOI really think the ‘misunderstanding’ between TD and MD is really just semantics. MDawg describes what he does and called it ‘trading’. TDVegas disagrees that what MDawg describes is actually ‘trading’. So just take out that word and you see what MDawg does, and given the bull market and the specific stocks he has mentioned, none of his claims are outrageous.
Quote: MDawgI'd say that close to 100% of my trades are in the money the same day.
Really? Again, I’m not so sure it’s NOT outrageous nor semantics. He is still claiming that “close to 100%” of his SAME DAY trades are in the money, What’s close to 100%?
99%…98%.
That is effectively saying you are almost never on the wrong side of a day trade (SAME DAY)
Sorry, I don’t believe that for a second.
Even if we drop it to 95%. 95 out of 100 day trades executed SAME DAY are in the money and the other 5% are tossed into a long or longer term hold? Days?
Utterly remarkable and frankly unbelievable. I understand what you are saying as to his claims…which is understandable. Losing trades are held. But, he’s STILL claiming an almost 100% record on his same day executions IN TOTAL. I understand that as meaning ALL (near 100%) the executed “buys” are in the money, same day. I assume he does not short.
Had he left it alone and my interpretation was taken…as you noted, fine. He seems to be doubling down that I still have it wrong and near 100% of his executable day trades are in the money, same day.
Quote: WatchMeWinSome take action and make things happen, while others just complain and jab from the outside looking in with envy.
Quote: MDawgThere are three kinds of people.
1. The first, make things happen.
2. The second, watch things happen.
3. The third, wonder, What the h happened?
link to original post
-JP Morgan.
“If you have to brag about all the material things in your life, there probably isn’t much else to it”
-Henry Ford
“Bragging makes you seem less impressive. If you are doing something worth bragging about, others will brag for you”
-Jeff Bezos
“When you continually brag, it becomes painfully obvious to the rest of us what you are insanely insecure about…and quite frankly, it’s also very unattractive.”
-Elon Musk
Quote: billryanThe Mexicans have a saying that translates to:- Show me what a man brags about and I'll tell you what he lacks.
link to original post
He who stand on toilet seat. High on pot.
Quote: TDVegasTesla drops from $1,200 to $981….not one word of any “trades” thruout the drop period. No day trades trying to capitalize on intraday moves. Suddenly bottoms at $980. “I did a buy a $980, let’s see where it goes”…..as it had already rebounded that day.
Your posting is predictable, if anything.
Where are all the transactions (trades) trying to capitalize on the upswing after drops? Oh yeah, none of those trades are listed here because the stock was trading lower each time.
As I stated, I trust my assessment of your wording. It’s not difficult to see that you like to present yourself in the manner you do…all things gambling, stocks and I’m guessing whatever else.
link to original post
These are fair questions and points.
I'd suggest concentrating more on trying to do something or if you're resigned to that trading successfully is impossible, then stick to that theory and don't do it! because you will fail at what you don't believe in.
SooPoo entered more than a few trades at positions that I pointed out to him were less than optimal and he STILL ended up fine. He seems to be a doer.
Quote: MDawgWhen TSLA was down -90, I pulled the trigger on a small (for me) trade. To my amazement, it dropped even further, but then started to rise steadily so I decided to hold until the bell. Cha'ching! forty points, 1067 to 1107.
link to original post
Correct…and if it dropped more than -90 by close, you claim (to yourself) to add it to a long term hold or swing trade and this post is never made. The only post that is made is one that turns profitable intraday and becomes a trade.
Congrats…you’ve invented a way to never appear to lose. You’re not the first. I’m guessing baccarat for you works the same way.
