we are all criminals
Poll
 | 40 votes (86.95%) | ||
| | 6 votes (13.04%) |
46 members have voted
Quote: tournamentkingWhat did you learn, other than what you can maybe get away with again after being a repeat offender?
Seems to me the original offense, the DUI, is never to be forgiven. You apparently are so fanatical about it that it would seem you missed his last point, "I wasn't driving drunk after the initial DUI but I had to get to work"
If some tragic accident involving alcohol has affected your family personally, OK, understandable, but really it is a bit much to ignore what the man wrote.
Quote: tournamentkingI wish you had gotten caught driving when you weren't allowed to, for your own sake...
Please don't mistake this for defending the man's actions (I agree with you that he shouldn't have been driving with a suspended license), but you act like he was driving drunk those times. He wasn't.
Also, after reading some of the other confessions in this thread, I'm surprised you've chosen to come down so hard on this guy.
Quote: tournamentkingYou should be in jail even today instead of crowing about your system-busting, and I hope you're writing from your cell. Some people lead such selfish lives that they never do learn to respect others. How many kids could you have snuffed out with you're irresponsibility, and worse still, why do you think they SUSPEND your license after you get caught doing something as stupid as that?
It appears as if tournamenking is DUI nazi.....how long would you have Beargoat locked up ? Six months, a year, longer? Maybe a labor camp?
As near as I can tell Beargoat didn't hurt anybody. That's what we call in the trade a "victimless crime".
Mind your own business....it's good for the soul.
Yet, cruising down a backroad with a beer in hand is somehow "worse".
Quote: FaceDUI laws are insane anyways. There are clearly some grey areas in "drinking and driving", yet the penalties are largely the same. And there are things one can do behind the wheel that are far worse than DUI, and some of those come without penalties at all. It would take more fingers than I have to count how many times I've been caught doing in excess of 100mph over the speed limit, and a majority of those I didn't even get a ticket for, let alone a serious punishment. The tickets I did get in these scenarios were either for <20mph over, or non moving violations.
Yet, cruising down a backroad with a beer in hand is somehow "worse".
You don't get it. People who drive fast and sober sometimes cause accidents (a good lesson learned was the guy who drove Paul Walker to his death and thankfully the dumbass went with) but the altered mind is far worse for innocent others. Instead of mentally fighting traffic laws, we'd all be much better off if we all just reasonably obeyed them. Driving while drunk or drinking is an unforgivable offense in my mind, there is nothing noble about it, and the penalties need to be beefed up because they just aren't keeping drunk driving jerks off the road enough.
Quote: tournamentkingYou don't get it. People who drive fast and sober sometimes cause accidents (a good lesson learned was the guy who drove Paul Walker to his death and thankfully the dumbass went with)
I don't think you get it. What you just said could apply to anyone, so I don't know why you had to target the guy you initially responded to.
Like I said before, with all the crazy confessions that have taken place in this thread, you choose to focus on a guy who drove SOBER with a suspended license?? Sheesh.
That's why the penalties have to be freakishly huge, because it's a deterrent. If you could automatically get behind the wheel and the car "knew" that you were drinking, technology should stop the car from starting. If police enforcement could be stepped up to monitor a larger part of the population more frequently, then maybe you could drop penalties.
But I support huge penalties for DUI as a deterrent. The penalties aren't so huge for speeding because it's easy to detect and far more easier to catch than drinking and driving.
Quote: tournamentkingYou don't get it.
As someone who's done 100mph over the speed limit several times, as well as flipped a car end over end through the trees at 90mph after a pint of Bacardi, I think I totally get it.
All I'm saying is there are shades of grey. Our friend Beardgoat never gave us the details, so it's tough to judge the level of his error.
When I was out in Wyoming with my now-Fed-former-Sheriff buddy, and he broke out the beers on our way to the river, we were technically committing a "serious offense". Pretend a cop would be that deep in the woods and pretend The Fed didn't have a badge to save us, and we could be facing jail time and five figure fines. For what? Traveling 35mph, 50 miles away from the nearest human, on a road we'd seen only two people on in 6 hours?
DUI is a totally preventable crime for which there are tragic consequences, sure, but surely you can see the difference between what I did with the Fed, and what I did at 90mph, right? And in that same vein, I think what I did with The Fed is infinitely safer for not only me but every single motorist on the road than when I was a 170mph missile flying through traffic.
Quote: boymimbo
But I support huge penalties for DUI as a deterrent. The penalties aren't so huge for speeding because it's easy to detect and far more easier to catch than drinking and driving.
You've never seen me on a bike ;)
Quote: FaceAs someone who's done 100mph over the speed limit several times, as well as flipped a car end over end through the trees at 90mph after a pint of Bacardi, I think I totally get it.
All I'm saying is there are shades of grey. Our friend Beardgoat never gave us the details, so it's tough to judge the level of his error.
It's not very exciting. I had like 4 drinks. I was stopped at a red light. Light turned green and I put my car into third gear... Whoops, popped it back to first gear and peeled the tires slightly. Cop was right behind me. No speeding or erratic driving
for the last 2 years I owned it. Sometimes
really plastered. It was only a six block drive,
but still. This was the early 80's it really wasn't
a big deal yet. MADD was just starting, there
were no giant fines and jail time yet. It's one
of the reasons I got out of that business, though.
I was out of control, and I had to get away.
Haven't done it since, but I still drink when I
want. Haven't been in a bar since, though. I
hate the damn things.
They say a drunk driver gets caught on average
once for every 40 times he does it. I drove home
drunk at least 700 times, hell, more than 700,
and never saw a cop. I knew guys I served in
the 4 years I was there who were drunk every
time they left and they never got caught while
I knew them. 40 my ass.
Quote: BeardgoatIt's not very exciting. I had like 4 drinks. I was stopped at a red light. Light turned green and I put my car into third gear... Whoops, popped it back to first gear and peeled the tires slightly. Cop was right behind me. No speeding or erratic driving
Damn, you have some bad luck, man. Sounds like something that would happen to me. lol
Quote: FaceAs someone who's done 100mph over the speed limit several times, as well as flipped a car end over end through the trees at 90mph after a pint of Bacardi, I think I totally get it.
All I'm saying is there are shades of grey. Our friend Beardgoat never gave us the details, so it's tough to judge the level of his error.
When I was out in Wyoming with my now-Fed-former-Sheriff buddy, and he broke out the beers on our way to the river, we were technically committing a "serious offense". Pretend a cop would be that deep in the woods and pretend The Fed didn't have a badge to save us, and we could be facing jail time and five figure fines. For what? Traveling 35mph, 50 miles away from the nearest human, on a road we'd seen only two people on in 6 hours?
DUI is a totally preventable crime for which there are tragic consequences, sure, but surely you can see the difference between what I did with the Fed, and what I did at 90mph, right? And in that same vein, I think what I did with The Fed is infinitely safer for not only me but every single motorist on the road than when I was a 170mph missile flying through traffic.Quote: boymimbo
But I support huge penalties for DUI as a deterrent. The penalties aren't so huge for speeding because it's easy to detect and far more easier to catch than drinking and driving.
You've never seen me on a bike ;)
Don't know if he was right, and the idea that 800 times makes you "due" is not defensible (as we know here [g]), yet he got to me with that statement. Decades of stupidity, I was thinking, might just add up to 800, certainly it was hundreds of times if you count borderline over the limit.
In any case, it worked. I quit doing it. A good friend.
Quote: wrobersonOn this DUI talk, the court should be required to provide the defendant a new physical ID card when they take away the DL. Leaving a person without ID is not cool.
The court didn't leave the defendant without ID, The defendant did. :)
It's obviously not in ones best interest to drive under the influence (whatever that means). The laws have become so harsh that a couple of beers and your in jail.
A lot of people say that the DUI laws are not harsh enough. I disagree. With the laws in place it is enough to fuck up your life and make it hell for at least three months if not a very long time if you lose your job. I was lucky enough to make my way through it. The way tournament king talks Its like i got right out of jail and went right back to the bars drinking and driving with my middle fingers in the air telling everyone I'm out to kill their kids.
Quote: BeardgoatI live in Arizona and the DUI laws are the most harsh, if not very close to the most harsh in the country. After my DUI I got 10 days in tent city. Heard of it? Look it up. Not fun. Car was impounded for 30 days. $20 a day fee plus towing charges and other B.S. costs. Mandatory interlock device. (luckily I didn't have to get this. One good thing my lawyer did). Installation fee for that and then mandatory maintenance costs every month to service the device. I personally did 36 hours of alcohol classes. 12 classes for 3 hours each. Guess what the classes aren't free. Each class was $30 a session. Had to take an 8 hour defensive driving class to get my license back. Not free either. Now that I add it all up I probably paid closer to like $9k. I was lucky enough to even have my job after I got arrested, but then your license is suspended for 90 days. My options were to drive on a suspended license to work... Or not have a job to pay for my fines and classes. Guess what happens if you don't pay your court fines and go to your classes? They throw you in jail. So as a broke ass 23 year old, maybe you have some insight now as to why I decided to break the law and drive sober to my job. This is all for a regular DUI. If you get an extreme DUI, over .16 BAC then it is even more harsh. 30 days in jail etc...
A lot of people say that the DUI laws are not harsh enough. I disagree. With the laws in place it is enough to fuck up your life and make it hell for at least three months if not a very long time if you lose your job. I was lucky enough to make my way through it. The way tournament king talks Its like i got right out of jail and went right back to the bars drinking and driving with my middle fingers in the air telling everyone I'm out to kill their kids.
Couple of options you could have explored: riding a bike, getting a good friend/family member to give you a ride for the duration, take public transit.
I'm not saying I know your specific situation, just that as part of the narrative, I'd like to at least hear some ideas thrown out and why they didn't work your specific situation. There's more than one way to move your body across this god forsaken planet than getting in a car and driving yourself there!
Quote: BeardgoatI live in Arizona and the DUI laws are the most harsh, if not very close to the most harsh in the country. After my DUI I got 10 days in tent city. Heard of it? Look it up. Not fun. Car was impounded for 30 days. $20 a day fee plus towing charges and other B.S. costs. Mandatory interlock device. (luckily I didn't have to get this. One good thing my lawyer did). Installation fee for that and then mandatory maintenance costs every month to service the device. I personally did 36 hours of alcohol classes. 12 classes for 3 hours each. Guess what the classes aren't free. Each class was $30 a session. Had to take an 8 hour defensive driving class to get my license back. Not free either. Now that I add it all up I probably paid closer to like $9k. I was lucky enough to even have my job after I got arrested, but then your license is suspended for 90 days. My options were to drive on a suspended license to work... Or not have a job to pay for my fines and classes. Guess what happens if you don't pay your court fines and go to your classes? They throw you in jail. So as a broke ass 23 year old, maybe you have some insight now as to why I decided to break the law and drive sober to my job. This is all for a regular DUI. If you get an extreme DUI, over .16 BAC then it is even more harsh. 30 days in jail etc...
A lot of people say that the DUI laws are not harsh enough. I disagree. With the laws in place it is enough to fuck up your life and make it hell for at least three months if not a very long time if you lose your job. I was lucky enough to make my way through it. The way tournament king talks Its like i got right out of jail and went right back to the bars drinking and driving with my middle fingers in the air telling everyone I'm out to kill their kids.
How many people did you kill or maim? You're in Sheriff Joe country. AMERICA'S TOUGHEST COP!........the seniors in Sun City love the guy. These are the same seniors that drive like Mr. Magoo......far worse than anybody thats had a few drinks. They keep electing the show horse. The most dangerous place in the world is the space between Sheriff Joe and a camera.
I lived in Phoenix for 22 years. The place is for the newlyweds and nearly deads. God help you if you get another DUI. Watch out for DUI checkpoints. Good luck.
Quote: rainmanGo ask the family members of the people who have been killed by a drunk driver with multiple DUI convictions if the penalty's are harsh enough.
Hey I'm not here advocating driving while drink. I'm saying I did my crime and did my time. I'm explaining my story. If someone reads my story and decides not to risk driving on 4 beers over a 2 hour period, it could save at least 2 lives.
Quote: HunterhillThe laws should be hard enough to "fuck up your life".For a four year period I drove drunk almost every night. I flipped my car end over end, that stopped me for about 2 days.My high school had 400 students and I can think of about ten kids who lost their lives due to drunk driving.
How about zero tolerance? A sip of beer sends you to jail. Would that make you happy? Ten kids, really? That's impossible.....underage drinking is illegal.
Quote: rainmanGo ask the family members of the people who have been killed by a drunk driver with multiple DUI convictions if the penalty's are harsh enough.
Why not make it multiple choice?
Would you feel better if your loved one was killed by a sober driver or drunk driver?
How about a distracted texting driver or a drunk driver?
Would you rather have your loved one killed by an imported car a suv or an 18 wheeler, or a train conductor that hadn't had enough sleep?
How do you prefer your family be killed?
Drunk driving is indefensible and causes permanent grief to the survivors. Me personally I don't drink at all. I want people also to know that the road is not a safe place to be distracted, learn to watch out for the other guy.
How much defensive driving training does anyone in your family have? I'm saying put the offense in context in this thread. Drunk driving is bad, and I will turn them in myself or drive them home or pay for a cab, I've done all three. A criminal can get out of prison after murder in 7 years or a technicality. Child assaulters get out after 4 or more convictions and on and on.
Seems like Beardgoat payed his debt to society, let him move on with his life. Yep, multiple dui offenders are a dangerous bunch but that's not this case.
Quote: HunterhillThe laws should be hard enough to "fuck up your life".For a four year period I drove drunk almost every night. I flipped my car end over end, that stopped me for about 2 days.My high school had 400 students and I can think of about ten kids who lost their lives due to drunk driving.
Death penalty would quite well f*** up someone's life.
No zero tolerance is too much.all I'm saying is the laws should be tuff enough to make people think twice about it.When I was doing it 30something years ago it was a slap on the wrist. Some nights the cops would even follow you home just to make sure you got home okay. I know you're joking about underage drinking but I was drunk almost every night all through High school.Quote: treetopbuddyHow about zero tolerance? A sip of beer sends you to jail. Would that make you happy? Ten kids, really? That's impossible.....underage drinking is illegal.
Quote: wrobersonOn this DUI talk, the court should be required to provide the defendant a new physical ID card when they take away the DL. Leaving a person without ID is not cool.
Are you talking about Illinois's policy to take away your license for a normal speeding ticket unless you immediately plead guilty and pay the fine? Yeah, that's BS. My g/f fell for that once and immediately paid the fine.
But for DUI, $20 for an ID card is the least of your concerns in Illinois and any state for that matter.
And Beardgoat, if you don't mind me asking, what did you end up blowing? Unless you were drinking higher ABV stuff, i can't imagine it being that high. Right now, I'm lucky my g/f isn't much of a drinker.
Quote: petroglyphWhy not make it multiple choice?
Would you feel better if your loved one was killed by a sober driver or drunk driver?
How about a distracted texting driver or a drunk driver?
Would you rather have your loved one killed by an imported car a suv or an 18 wheeler, or a train conductor that hadn't had enough sleep?
How do you prefer your family be killed?
Drunk driving is indefensible and causes permanent grief to the survivors. Me personally I don't drink at all. I want people also to know that the road is not a safe place to be distracted, learn to watch out for the other guy.
How much defensive driving training does anyone in your family have? I'm saying put the offense in context in this thread. Drunk driving is bad, and I will turn them in myself or drive them home or pay for a cab, I've done all three. A criminal can get out of prison after murder in 7 years or a technicality. Child assaulters get out after 4 or more convictions and on and on.
Seems like Beardgoat payed his debt to society, let him move on with his life. Yep, multiple dui offenders are a dangerous bunch but that's not this case.
sober.
distracted.
neither.
Natural causes.
Beardgoat stated he thought the penalty's for the crime were too harsh or harsh enough. I'm simply pointing out that there is better opinions to listen to on how harsh the penalty's are than those of people who have payed them.
Can you explain more about the Illinois law.Does the cop take your license or do you have to go to court?
Quote: rainmansober.
distracted.
neither.
Natural causes.
Beardgoat stated he thought the penalty's for the crime were too harsh or harsh enough. I'm simply pointing out that there is better opinions to listen to on how harsh the penalty's are than those of people who have payed them.
Fair enough
I'm not defending drunk driving but won't lie and say I've never been guilty.
In Ak. they are very serious about dui. Second offense is mandatory one year in jail. Also in Anchorage on I think first offense they take and keep your vehicle. I believe the average cost with increased insurance etc. is 15k. Where I worked that would also cause the loss of a 6 figure job. To increase the measure of stupidity, cab fair anywhere in town was only ten dollars which usually included the tip.
Like I said I haven't drank in years but because I have CDL, the law only allows me a .04. Under some circumstances that could be 1-2 drinks around 11p.m. and fail a breath test at 7 the next morning unknowingly. There are certainly degrees of intoxication.
The laws where BG was sentenced are at the time the best measure of justice that they have come up with to date. Penalty's are increasing. I can't imagine what would be fair to a family which had lost a loved one because of a drunk driver.
Quote: HunterhillTringlomane,
Can you explain more about the Illinois law.Does the cop take your license or do you have to go to court?
He will take your license if you don't plead guilty on the spot and pay the fine. You are supposed to use your traffic ticket as your "license" if you get pulled over again. At least that's how I understand it; I've never actually got a ticket there myself. It's a BS pressure tactic for you to immediately payoff the ticket.
Do you think DUIs would be the mess that they are if lawyers, alcohol counselors, etc. were not making a mint.
Do you know that many DUIs start with a call to crime stoppers from a team with someone inside the bar and someone inside the parking lot. Its good income while you are waiting for your license to be restored... you get others in a jam.
Some states issue request letters asking a cop for forbearance as long as the unlicensed driver is enroute to work, school or doctor's appointment. Grocery stores are usually NOT on the list.
Many cities have districts with lots of bars and no taxicab service or bus service at all... its either DUI or bankruptcy for the bar.
Years ago cops would just tell a guy to drive home carefully even if he could barely stand up.
Some alcoholics come to court after 72 hours in jail but their livers are so shot they couldn't "blow legal" right there in court.
One judge sentenced a man to live within one block of a bar. Probably the wisest sentence considering the man's history.
Some women are pressured by the point system or their alcohol content ... they need their license to work as a traveling salesman and the cop is horny. Which do you think wins out?
Quote: FleaStiff
Years ago cops would just tell a guy to drive home carefully even if he could barely stand up.
In the 1959 movie North by Northwest, Cary
Grant gets arrested for drunk driving. They
take him to the station and he calls his mother
to come and get him. As they're leaving, he's
arguing with the police and his mother says
"Just pay the $2 fine so we can get out of here."
$2 in 1959.
Quote: tournamentkingIt should all be simple...as simple as drinking over the legal limit then getting behind the wheel. First offense, 2 yrs. in prison. Another offense, 10 yrs. And for the 3 time losers out there, life without parole. There should be no coddling any drunk driver. They are dangerous to others. None of this nonsense about how "vague" or "confusing" the laws are. If you're stupid and ignorant enough to drive buzzed or worse, then too freaking bad for you.
Death would be better, imprisonment is such a waste of money for an easily provable crime.
I have no clue how someone can get in a car so drunk they cant even walk, that's just ridiculous.
I do think the legal limits are to low. An experienced drunk driver probably drives far better then foreigners, teens and old people. perhaps we need drunk driving classes, ones that teach you how to drive better when your drunk (:
Quote: rainmanGo ask the family members of the people who have been killed by a drunk driver with multiple DUI convictions if the penalty's are harsh enough.
Penalties are uneven, I assume. Who hasn't read a story about some repeat offender drunk who finally kills one or more people after a history of dozen run-ins over many years. Yet, they are out on the road years later finally achieving some nasty freakin' accident.
times after drinking too much, this is what I drank.
It's called a White Godfather. Fill a wide mouthed
glass with ice. Add 2oz of a good scotch, I used
Johnny Walker Red. 2oz of a good amaretto, I
used Disaronno. Fill the rest of the glass with
Half and Half, which is half milk and half cream.
This drink will knock you socks off. It's also very
expensive if you buy it in a bar. I was drinking
wholesale booze, so it didn't matter. This is so
good it should be illegal. Drink 2 of these and
see if your driving is impaired.
Quote: AxelWolfWho ever said ride a bike to avoid getting a DUI. May not realize you can get a DUI for doing that as well even a lawn mower and probably a shopping cart as well.
That was me, but I wasn't advocating drunk-bike-riding (although that's better than drunk driving). I was saying that if you got your license suspended, riding your bike around to work and other places is an option if you don't want to illegally drive without a license. As Beardgoat mentioned, it wasn't an option for him (I can appreciate the infeasibility of riding 35 miles one way at midnight).
Quote:I do think the legal limits are to low. An experienced drunk driver probably drives far better then foreigners, teens and old people. perhaps we need drunk driving classes, ones that teach you how to drive better when your drunk (:
Adam Carrolla has advocated for this. It would work like a motorcycle endorsement. Basically, you apply for the "6-pack" endorsement. The cops schedule you for an appointment out in BFW (bum fuck wherever). You sit around and drink a six pack, then they give you a supervised driving test on a course without any other cars. If you pass, you get the "6-pack" endorsement sticker on your license, and your legal limit is raised to .12 or something. Voila!
I think he actually filmed a segment like this with some local cop department for the Man Show. I'm not sure if it aired though, probably the network shut it down. Not the best message to be sending.
Quote: Mission146It's probably a very good drink, one of my favorite drinks is The Godfather, basically the same thing without the Half and Half.
It's deceptive. The the cream smooths it out so
much you're not really aware you're drinking
alcohol. After 2 of them you've had 8oz and
and it really has an effect on you. I got the
idea because I made so many White Russians
in those days. Vodka, Kahlua, and milk.
I have thought about something like that. I like the sticker idea and I'm not joking.Quote: AcesAndEightsThat was me, but I wasn't advocating drunk-bike-riding (although that's better than drunk driving). I was saying that if you got your license suspended, riding your bike around to work and other places is an option if you don't want to illegally drive without a license. As Beardgoat mentioned, it wasn't an option for him (I can appreciate the infeasibility of riding 35 miles one way at midnight).
Adam Carrolla has advocated for this. It would work like a motorcycle endorsement. Basically, you apply for the "6-pack" endorsement. The cops schedule you for an appointment out in BFW (bum fuck wherever). You sit around and drink a six pack, then they give you a supervised driving test on a course without any other cars. If you pass, you get the "6-pack" endorsement sticker on your license, and your legal limit is raised to .12 or something. Voila!
I think he actually filmed a segment like this with some local cop department for the Man Show. I'm not sure if it aired though, probably the network shut it down. Not the best message to be sending.
That is a reference to a famous joke not the actual sum of two dollars.Quote: EvenBob"Just pay the $2 fine so we can get out of here."
$2 in 1959.
Quote: tringlomane
And Beardgoat, if you don't mind me asking, what did you end up blowing? Unless you were drinking higher ABV stuff, i can't imagine it being that high. Right now, I'm lucky my g/f isn't much of a drinker.
Honestly I can't remember what I blew, like .121 or .112 or something.
Tournamentking's suggestion of 2 years mandatory prison time is so absurd to me. How many people are killed a year texting while driving, speeding, reckless driving, running red lights, etc.... Those people make sober Sober decisions to drive like assholes and their stupidity killed somebody. You'd never hear anyone ask for a 2 year mandatory prison sentence for running a red light, but that is the most dangerous thing you can do at an intersection.
Quote: FleaStiffThat is a reference to a famous joke not the actual sum of two dollars.
What famous joke, what are you talking about.
Quote: BeardgoatHonestly I can't remember what I blew, like .121 or .112 or something.
Tournamentking's suggestion of 2 years mandatory prison time is so absurd to me. How many people are killed a year texting while driving, speeding, reckless driving, running red lights, etc.... Those people make sober Sober decisions to drive like assholes and their stupidity killed somebody. You'd never hear anyone ask for a 2 year mandatory prison sentence for running a red light, but that is the most dangerous thing you can do at an intersection.
That's 2 years first offense w/o parole for any reason. What about cell phone use/texting and such? Their day will come. Drivink drunk has had years to kill people and it's time to move the penalties to the next level. Besides, most of those who drive influenced are not stellar, contributing members of society anyway. They tend to be from the same mold as those jerks who smoke: poor, uneducated, disrespectful, and of no real value to society.
