2016 Election

Quote: SanchoPanza

Under that construction, we should do away with juries, judges and prosecutors.

Not at all, but before you throw the stone at border crossers, you should notice your glass house, especially when you act like it's a crime beyond the pale which many rightwingers do. Maybe some leftwingers do too, but I don't hear much from them.

Quote: Gandler

I never said that, I said everyone in Federal Prison is there for a Federal Offense which includes murder, violent crimes of many nature, immigration violations, counterfiet, etc....

You are making incredibly misleading statements though. You want us to think illegal immigrants are violent offenders because many of them are in federal prison and federal prison houses murders, but the truth is they are almost all their for immigration violations.

Quote: Twirdman

You are making incredibly misleading statements though. You want us to think illegal immigrants are violent offenders because many of them are in federal prison and federal prison houses murders, but the truth is they are almost all their for immigration violations.

...and others here are basically saying "they aren't all that bad"...well, except the ones that are that bad. If NONE of them were illegally here, NONE of them illegally here would be in prison for anything. If 200 cross the border and one commits a violent crime, that is still one more violent criminal than we had before.

"Border Patrol Agents (BPAs) and Customs and Border Protection Officers (CBPOs), assigned to The Nogales Placement Center (NPC), discovered that 16 unaccompanied alien children (13 El Salvadoran males, two Guatemalan males and one Honduran male) currently being held at the NPC are members of Mara Salvatrucha (MS-13). The MS-13 gang members admitted to their gang associations following a discovery of graffiti at the NPC. Homeland Security Investigations (HSI), ICE Enforcement and Removal Operations (ERO), and the Office of Refugee Resettlement (ORR) were notified."

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/immigration/item/18658-illegal-immigrant-children-include-ms-13-gang-members

I'm sure someone will take the source to task since it is anti-illegal immigration...but everyone sneakin' is not someone we should be happy got here...

Quote: RonC

...and others here are basically saying "they aren't all that bad"...well, except the ones that are that bad. If NONE of them were illegally here, NONE of them illegally here would be in prison for anything. If 200 cross the border and one commits a violent crime, that is still one more violent criminal than we had before.

"Border Patrol Agents (BPAs) and Customs and Border Protection Officers (CBPOs), assigned to The Nogales Placement Center (NPC), discovered that 16 unaccompanied alien children (13 El Salvadoran males, two Guatemalan males and one Honduran male) currently being held at the NPC are members of Mara Salvatrucha (MS-13). The MS-13 gang members admitted to their gang associations following a discovery of graffiti at the NPC. Homeland Security Investigations (HSI), ICE Enforcement and Removal Operations (ERO), and the Office of Refugee Resettlement (ORR) were notified."

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/immigration/item/18658-illegal-immigrant-children-include-ms-13-gang-members

I'm sure someone will take the source to task since it is anti-illegal immigration...but everyone sneakin' is not someone we should be happy got here...

Well, we ought to do something more practical than build a wall. Maybe offer a program where an illegal who reports another illegal involved in multiple criminal activities actually earns some special consideration to his/her status. That would be a win win. Get the bad ones sooner and reward someone who helped us get rid of the bad guys.

Quote: rxwine

Well, we ought to do something more practical than build a wall. Maybe offer a program where an illegal who reports another illegal involved in multiple criminal activities actually earns some special consideration to his/her status. That would be a win win. Get the bad ones sooner and reward someone who helped us get rid of the bad guys.

Yeah building a wall is expensive and not really effective for the size of border we have, all it is is a feel good measure for people who don't know any better. One big thing we need to start doing those is actually offer avenues to come to the country legally. I mean if you make it basically impossible to come here legally you shouldn't be surprised when people start resorting to coming here illegally.

Quote: rxwine

Well, we ought to do something more practical than build a wall. Maybe offer a program where an illegal who reports another illegal involved in multiple criminal activities actually earns some special consideration to his/her status. That would be a win win. Get the bad ones sooner and reward someone who helped us get rid of the bad guys.

Maybe. But even better would be destroying the incentives to come here. Require ID to register for school, get a job, or use tax payer subsidized health systems.

If there is no reason to break in, there will be no robber.

Quote: Twirdman

Yeah building a wall is expensive and not really effective for the size of border we have, all it is is a feel good measure for people who don't know any better. One big thing we need to start doing those is actually offer avenues to come to the country legally. I mean if you make it basically impossible to come here legally you shouldn't be surprised when people start resorting to coming here illegally.

Securing the border is part of the cost of being a sovereign nation. You need the military and other federal forces patrolling as well. Nowhere is it written that we have to take everyone who wants to come here.

A first step to keeping people here from coming illegally is end sanctuary cities and make anyone here illegally 100% ineligible for social services. Yes, that includes schooling for illegal's children. Right now they leave poverty for handouts. End the magnet that is pulling them, or at least one of them.

What is sad is how the attitude has cropped up that if you are not in favor of allowing illegal immigration then you are "racist" and "mean spirited." A nation that loses its borders is no longer a nation. We are probably already lost, for many reasons, but why move things along faster?

Quote: rxwine

Well, we ought to do something more practical than build a wall. Maybe offer a program where an illegal who reports another illegal involved in multiple criminal activities actually earns some special consideration to his/her status. That would be a win win. Get the bad ones sooner and reward someone who helped us get rid of the bad guys.

This is the kind of thinking (sic) that is causing America's decline. We are rapidly becoming a North American Brazil. A violent, corrupt, dysfunctional bankrupt state governed by racist black and brown socialist demagogues in league with a tiny white leftist elite.
Meanwhile in China and the rest of Asia they would put a boot firmly in the ass of a single black/hispanic "dreamer" who ever had the temerity to show up on their shores and demand a welfare check and citizenship for their kids.
Guess who wins?

Quote: kewlj

First, why do you have to say something like "that Maddow dude"??? Why do you have to be that small, immature and petty. The second I read something like that, I think "well that is not a very mature person that I want to attempt to engage in any kind of meaningful dialog with".



In your particular case stating "the Gay thing", with 'gay' in quotes emphasizes your opinion and how little you care and can relate to me. It is not a warm fuzzy, inclusive feeling.

I'll tell you, if there were no party labels and affiliations and everyone just ran as individuals based on their own views (and maybe that's the way it should be), I would most likely be supporting Jeb Bush. Instead, when party affiliations and party views and platforms are added to the mix, I will likely vote for Hillary Clinton, a candidate that I don't really like in this cycle.

First off I want to Thank You for taking the time to write a long well thought out post. I wouldnt expect anything else as you always present yourself in that manner. I dont have to time today to address everything but I do feel I want to respond to one part and I hope you understand where I am coming from.

As for maturity, I may or may not act that way in how I present myself but I am a very diverse person. As some know on here I own a successful (in my mind and on paper anyways) Bar and Restaurant that has won many Best of awards and such. I act mature and professional when I have to and other times I can be a complete jackass, and enjoy being both. One thing I am consistant in is my beliefs and they are different from most people. I have little time for feelings if they affect the end result. People waste too much time worrying about how other people will react to something or how they are feeling. In the end it costs them time and money, both of which are important to me. But those are MY values, not others. But that will be never stop me from being me. Just as you dont think I will ever understand how it is to be gay, I will never understand how many people never strive to see the great things in the country and world, are content with a small house, 2.3 kids and working 40 hours 50 weeks a year to go on a crummy (to me) vacation to Ocean City and drop $4000 on a beat up motel room. But it is not my job to run their life, but I sure as hell can say I dont understand it.

But on the gay (or "Gay") thing as I put it. Having 40+ employees, I naturally have a few openly gay ones, and a few more that may or may not be. At the end of the day they are employees, no different that any others to me, I only judge them on their work performance. To me this is how it should always be. I have one bartender who is very open to customers and many enjoy him for it and on rare occasions, others have complained about it. I get it, some just come to get away from their life and dont care about my employees problems. I have the same issues with straight bartenders discussing their problems or conquests with customers. I only judge them on their performance and address issues as they occur.

On the personal end and perhaps into the political end a little, one of my best friends is a conservative gay. He worked in the White House for a GOP president and now in the media. I dont want to get into too much more about him, because with research he could be found. Everyone knows he is a gay, knows his partner and doesnt hide it, but that doesnt mean there are some on the conservative side who might not hire him because of it. So in some ways, I do get it. He cant always be open about who he is because some are biased. Just like some on the left who call AA Conservatives Uncle Tom and such all the time. Look at all the stuff Clarence Thomas has to deal with and its not just because he is a conservative, but because he is a BLACK conservative. Why do we expect someone to be of a certain party just because they are....fill in the blank?

And that is how I see the entire issue, you are NO different from anyone else, and should be judged on your actions, if it is even anyone right to judge you. But some are not that way. I just hope you and others vote and do what is best for you, not what you are told to believe because you are...again fill in.

Oh, and back to the Dude Maddow thing. And maybe you will see this as me being inmature again, but when (in my opinion) you put yourself out there as a public figure and spread lies, half truths and practice the art of personal distruction (See 100+ segments against Chris Christie) day after day, you are going to get stufff like this. And you have to admit she looks like a dude. But if it helps, I say worse stuff about Olbermann day after day.

Thanks again for reading and I hope you take this for what it is, in the end we are all different, yet so similar. Thanks! Bob

Quote: bobsims

This is the kind of thinking (sic) that is causing America's decline. We are rapidly becoming a North American Brazil. A violent, corrupt, dysfunctional bankrupt state governed by racist black and brown socialist demagogues in league with a tiny white leftist elite.
Meanwhile in China and the rest of Asia they would put a boot firmly in the ass of a single black/hispanic "dreamer" who ever had the temerity to show up on their shores and demand a welfare check and citizenship for their kids.
Guess who wins?

My response is to quote your first line.

Quote:

This is the kind of thinking (sic) that is causing America's decline.

Does that mean I only get half-credit since I used your insult back at you?