Trump's Second and Third year in office
That is not "America First."
Quote: FinsRuleBelieving in science is not the same thing as believing everything any scientist says.
Which is why I said blind faith in science and not just believing in science.
Quote: beachbumbabsRx tried to be somewhat conciliatory above, but I think that's an incorrect approach.
Facts are stubborn things. The scientific method, which is rigorously applied before making a science-based statement in almost every case, requires independently confirmable facts. If in science, something is theorized, it is stated as a theory, pending EITHER verification or invalidation.
If facts during the scientific process invalidate a theory, that theory is disproven and either discarded or modified to account for the variable AND re-tested. Rinse and repeat.
I agree so long that the scientific method is rigorously applied.
Unfortunately this is not the case with many Social Sciences, which have recently been invaded by extreme left ideologies at the universities. And I say that as a generally left leaning individual.
Epidemiological studies, especially involving nutrition, are also notoriously unreliable.
I too believe in science as fact and not opinion. But unfortunately not all studies and “scientist say....” headlines are backed by good data.
Quote: gamerfreak
I too believe in science as fact and not opinion. But unfortunately not all studies and “scientist say....” headlines are backed by good data.
But RS comparison is an equivalency of science vs religion.. What is the rigor that religion follows? No consistent one, that's for sure.
.
I'll take a list of all big discoveries religion has made from RS compared to the rigor of science. We all follow blind faith every day, but it's almost always in science based ideas not religion based.. I don't board a flight on blind faith because a priest prayed over the engine. I get on it because I believe there is science in aerodynamics and principles that were discovered and engineers who designed it and mechanics who worked on it. And pretty sure it will continue to fly with atheists on board and not a religion in sight. Science got people all the way to the moon and back and sent robots to mars. It sent a vehicle into interstellar space. And on and on.
Go ahead RS.
Quote: rxwine..... Science got people all the way to the moon and back and sent robots to mars......
I'm still amazed that it was basic Newtonian Physics, i.e., 17th century science, that NASA used to land the Mars rover within a few feet of where they wanted it to.
Quote: rxwineBut RS comparison is an equivalency of science vs religion.. What is the rigor that religion follows? No consistent one, that's for sure.
.
I'll take a list of all big discoveries religion has made from RS compared to the rigor of science. We all follow blind faith every day, but it's almost always in science based ideas not religion based.. I don't board a flight on blind faith because a priest prayed over the engine. I get on it because I believe there is science in aerodynamics and principles that were discovered and engineers who designed it and mechanics who worked on it. And pretty sure it will continue to fly with atheists on board and not a religion in sight. Science got people all the way to the moon and back and sent robots to mars. It sent a vehicle into interstellar space. And on and on.
Go ahead RS.
So in other words, you don't have blind faith in science that a plane will stay in the air. I'm certainly not saying ALL belief in science is by blind faith.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/25/world/americas/tijuana-mexico-border.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Quote: lilredroosterthe little girl doesn't even have shoes
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/25/world/americas/tijuana-mexico-border.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Hoaxed: The ‘Illegal Alien Mom with Barefoot Kids’ Photo was a Setup – Another Staged #FakeNews Production
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/11/hoaxed-the-illegal-alien-mom-with-barefoot-kids-photo-was-a-setup-another-staged-fakenews-production/
Quote:After further review, yesterday’s ‘horrific’ picture of a woman with barefoot children running from the US border wall was a hoax. In the background of the picture a group of men are posing for one camera man and another is running towards another camera man. In other areas, people are just standing around. The woman with the children was just a photo-op:
Quote: FleaswatterQuote: lilredroosterthe little girl doesn't even have shoes
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/25/world/americas/tijuana-mexico-border.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Hoaxed: The ‘Illegal Alien Mom with Barefoot Kids’ Photo was a Setup – Another Staged #FakeNews Production
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/11/hoaxed-the-illegal-alien-mom-with-barefoot-kids-photo-was-a-setup-another-staged-fakenews-production/
So they are saying we DONT have an illegal immigration problem?
Its all staged?
The Republican view is its not real and so not a problem? Just liberals staging photo ops?
Im confused
Quote: darkozSo they are saying we DONT have an illegal immigration problem?
Its all staged?
The Republican view is its not real and so not a problem? Just liberals staging photo ops?
Im confused
Me too.
First of all, that article doesn't prove any hoax whatsoever. All it shows is that there were other cameramen present, which is not even remotely suspicious considering how much media traction this story is getting all over the North and Central American continents.
Second of all, a hoax staged in such a way would actually benefit REPUBLICANS, i.e. "here's all these migrants violently rushing the border, so we have to fight back!" There would be literally zero reason for liberals/Democrats to stage a photo this way. They would stage it to show everyone being peaceful and lovey-dovey and "see how harmless these people are? There's no problems at the border at all! We should let them in!"
Third of all, and most importantly, there is literally no reason for ANYONE, on either side of the aisle, to fake this, because we know the story actually happened. Migrants rushed the border, and were repelled by federal agents from both countries with tear gas and physical arrests. No one is disputing that. It is even the top story on Fox News' website as of right now, so even the right wing media agrees that what is seen in that picture actually happened to people.
In other words, Gateway Pundit and Fleaswatter are both full of doo-doo.
the Times definitely does have a liberal bias
but nonetheless, they are regarded by a great many on both sides of the political spectrum as being historically and currently this country's greatest newspaper
every newspaper and news organization has some bias
none of them are totally objective
that is a very, very long way from deliberately publishing fake photos
He also said tear gas is safe for children. "We did not use any kinetic force."
They fired tear gas to break up the crowd because rocks and other objects were being thrown and they were rushing the border.
Quote: rxwineBrandon Judd President of National Border Patrol Council (organization for 16,000 border patrol agents) said it happened.
𝐇𝐞 𝐚𝐥𝐬𝐨 𝐬𝐚𝐢𝐝 𝐭𝐞𝐚𝐫 𝐠𝐚𝐬 𝐢𝐬 𝐬𝐚𝐟𝐞 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐜𝐡𝐢𝐥𝐝𝐫𝐞𝐧./q]
Hear is what NCBI (The National Center for Biotechnical Information), and NIH (The National Institutes of Health) have to say about tear gas:
"Evidence from the limited epidemiological studies available and from case studies demonstrates that tear gas agents have the potential to cause serious harm and present specific threats to vulnerable populations, including children"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5096012/the foolish sayings of a rich man often pass for words of wisdom by the fools around him
Quote: RSLooks like they need a lot more tear gas.
Land mines would be even more effective.😳
Quote: lilredroosteranybody who believes the New York Times stages photos and publishes them as being legitimate is really far gone
+1
Not even worth engaging with, only mocking.
Look at all the horrible comments on Breitbart about these poor immigrants. Some of these Trumpsters are just truly horrible, irredeemable people.
Quote: ams288+1
Not even worth engaging with, only mocking.
Look at all the horrible comments on Breitbart about these poor immigrants. Some of these Trumpsters are just truly horrible, irredeemable people.
Deplorable even?
Just wish she hadn't walked it back.
Quote: RSWho was it just several days or few weeks ago who said the caravan isn't even going to reach the border, it's all gonna blow over, nothing's gonna happen, etc. ?
I don't know, but on a scale of 1-100 how frightened are you so far?
Quote: RSWho was it just several days or few weeks ago who said the caravan isn't even going to reach the border, it's all gonna blow over, nothing's gonna happen, etc. ?
I said this a little over a month ago:
"Depending on what numbers you look at, there are between several hundred and about [7,000] people in this migrant caravan.
Even assuming, for the sake of argument, that every single one of those people is just let into the U.S. willy-nilly, that number is a statistical rounding error in the grand scheme of political issues that we need to be discussing right now.
I doubt even a fraction of that [7,000], if any, even make it to the U.S. border and are let in.
Total non-issue."
There were about 500 people that tried to rush the border the other day, so only a fraction of that 7,000 even arrived and are putting up a fight. A few dozen were arrested.
But as I've pointed out before, Border Patrol apprehends about 1,000 people trying to get in the U.S. on a SLOW day, so I still say this migrant caravan is a non-issue in the grand scheme of immigration. It's all political theater. On both sides.
he will forever be known as:
𝐓𝐇𝐄 𝐏𝐑𝐄𝐒𝐈𝐃𝐄𝐍𝐓 𝐖𝐇𝐎 𝐆𝐀𝐒𝐒𝐄𝐃 𝐂𝐇𝐈𝐋𝐃𝐑𝐄𝐍
Why use inflammatory hyperbole like that? FFSQuote: lilredroosterwith a little bit of luck this could mean the end of Don the Con's political good fortune
he will forever be known as:
𝐓𝐇𝐄 𝐏𝐑𝐄𝐒𝐈𝐃𝐄𝐍𝐓 𝐖𝐇𝐎 𝐆𝐀𝐒𝐒𝐄𝐃 𝐂𝐇𝐈𝐋𝐃𝐑𝐄𝐍
https://www.denix.osd.mil/rcwmprogram/history/
Quote: lilredroosterwith a little bit of luck this could mean the end of Don the Con's political good fortune
he will forever be known as:
𝐓𝐇𝐄 𝐏𝐑𝐄𝐒𝐈𝐃𝐄𝐍𝐓 𝐖𝐇𝐎 𝐆𝐀𝐒𝐒𝐄𝐃 𝐂𝐇𝐈𝐋𝐃𝐑𝐄𝐍
Nah, this is an insignificant blip in his political career.
Almost the exact same thing happened under Obama in 2013, only on a slightly smaller scale, and nobody cared.
Quote: RSWho was it just several days or few weeks ago who said the caravan isn't even going to reach the border, it's all gonna blow over, nothing's gonna happen, etc. ?
I have no idea who said that...
I said we’d stop hearing about it after the election. Which was completely true for a couple weeks.
But Donald’s approval rating is slipping again, so he had to rile up his racists and bring it back into the news.
I'm surprised he hasn't used his dog whistle at a rally or an ambiguous tweet to suggest that gun owners near the border can have some fun unloading their weapons through the border fence with impunity. I did see that some 'militia' were heading in that direction.Quote: ams288But Donald’s approval rating is slipping again, so he had to rile up his racists and bring it back into the news.
Quote: ams288I have no idea who said that...
I said we’d stop hearing about it after the election. Which was completely true for a couple weeks.
But Donald’s approval rating is slipping again, so he had to rile up his racists and bring it back into the news.
Well, if you notice, his approval rating has been hovering around 42% since May, and that's the highest it's been since a few weeks after inauguration.
He's got about as much of his base riled up as he can get. I'd be surprised if he ever gets above 45% again.
Quote: ams288so he had to rile up his racists
he attracts more skinheads than Rogaine
Quote: rxwineI don't know, but on a scale of 1-100 how frightened are you so far?
I don't think 'frightened' is the right word about the actual invaders. What is frightening is the left's apathy towards securing the border. TigerWu's view appears to basically be -- meh, it's only a couple hundred, whatever.
Quote: RSI don't think 'frightened' is the right word about the actual invaders. What is frightening is the left's apathy towards securing the border. TigerWu's view appears to basically be -- meh, it's only a couple hundred, whatever.
I don't know about "the left," but I am not in favor of just letting people in willy-nilly. I've said in this thread several times I think the border should be secure.
My point is that "only a couple hundred" people trying to sneak across is business as usual for the border patrol. There is nothing remarkable about this handful of migrants trying to sneak in. It happens EVERY SINGLE DAY. It is 100% political fodder, and Trump's supporters are falling for it hook, line, and sinker.
Where was the GOP outrage for all the hundreds/thousands of people trying to sneak in on August 17th? Or February 9th? Or April 30th? Or any other day of the year? Why do they only seem to be obsessed with this one small group of migrants, when THOUSANDS of immigrants have already snuck in or overstayed their visas during the time that this caravan was in the news?
Shooting tear gas at these 500 people and shooing them away is not solving anything. I bet 500 people have already snuck into this country since this morning. The GOP wants you to focus on this distraction, so they can say, "See, we did something. We shot tear gas at them and they went away. We're keeping the country safe! Vote for me and give me money!"
Quote: TigerWu...Where was the GOP outrage for all the hundreds/thousands of people trying to sneak in on August 17th? Or February 9th? Or April 30th? Or any other day of the year? Why do they only seem to be obsessed with this one small group of migrants, when THOUSANDS of immigrants have already snuck in or overstayed their visas during the time that this caravan was in the news?...
Emphasis mine.
Wait are you serious?
Quote: rxwinePaul Manafort has violated his plea agreement. Not sure what that means for anyone other than him.
It means he’s going the pardon Hail Mary route.
I hope Donald does end up pardoning him. Will show everyone what a corrupt PO(tu)S he is beyond any doubt...
Quote: RSWho was it just several days or few weeks ago who said the caravan isn't even going to reach the border, it's all gonna blow over, nothing's gonna happen, etc. ?
Nobody said that, that I heard. They said putting the army down there was
1. Illegal. See (Google) posse comitatus.
2. Purely an election stunt, because they did it when the caravan was still 1000 miles away. Walking. Mostly women and children.
3. Not expected to arrive for another 5 weeks now, minimum.
4. Cruel and unusual abuse of troops over Thanksgiving.
And the people who charged the border today(yesterday? I've been busy) are not those who are in that caravan. Still 5 or so weeks away (see above). No, they were people denied the legal opportunity to request asylum for the last year or so that Trump/Sessions/ICE have been refusing to process asylum requests.
Quote: MaxPenThe military is not enforcing laws. They are defending the border against Invaders.
No, they aren't. At least, not directly.
https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/11/18/migrants-wont-see-armed-us-troops-on-the-border/
Quote: Dalex64No, they aren't. At least, not directly.
https://www.militarytimes.com/news/your-military/2018/11/18/migrants-wont-see-armed-us-troops-on-the-border/
The point is they are not in violation of posse comitatus.
Sources for any of the 5 points?Quote: beachbumbabsNobody said that, that I heard. They said putting the army down there was
1. Illegal. See (Google) posse comitatus.
2. Purely an election stunt, because they did it when the caravan was still 1000 miles away. Walking. Mostly women and children.
3. Not expected to arrive for another 5 weeks now, minimum.
4. Cruel and unusual abuse of troops over Thanksgiving.
And the people who charged the border today(yesterday? I've been busy) are not those who are in that caravan. Still 5 or so weeks away (see above). No, they were people denied the legal opportunity to request asylum for the last year or so that Trump/Sessions/ICE have been refusing to process asylum requests.
Quote: SanchoPanzaSources for any of the 5 points?
Would you decry all the sources as just fake news anyway?
Quote: RSQuote: TigerWu...Where was the GOP outrage for all the hundreds/thousands of people trying to sneak in on August 17th? Or February 9th? Or April 30th? Or any other day of the year? Why do they only seem to be obsessed with this one small group of migrants, when THOUSANDS of immigrants have already snuck in or overstayed their visas during the time that this caravan was in the news?...
Emphasis mine.
Wait are you serious?
Of course I am, and you know godd*** well the GOP doesn't really care about illegal immigration unless they can make it some kind of money grabbing political talking point. If they really cared about illegal immigration they would be doing something about the MILLIONS of illegal immigrants already in this country. Instead, for weeks they were 100% focused on a few hundred migrants WHO WERE IN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT COUNTRIES. They should be enforcing laws ALREADY ON THE BOOKS instead of trying to raise billions of dollars to build a wall that is not going to solve anything.
And like I said, Trump's supporters have fallen for the script hook, line, and sinker.
Quote: MaxPenThe military is not enforcing laws. They are defending the border against Invaders.
LOL
You guys and your Red Dawn fantasies....
Yup. The typically totally unsourced and imaginary assertions posted hereabouts are beyond a;ll challenges.Quote: darkozWould you decry all the sources as just fake news anyway?
Quote: MaxPenThe military is not enforcing laws. They are defending the border against Invaders.
ROTFL
Thanks Max
invaders??????
The right is turning into a bunch of snowflakes
Does the pentagon consider this an invasion :-)
What would Patton do? Patton would say this is beneath him
Quote: MaxPenThe military is not enforcing laws. They are defending the border against Invaders.
Are all Trump supporters really now trying to claim that illegal immigration is act of war? Or is it just the ones who were like Trump and did everything they could to actually avoid joining the military so they can't understand how a border is different from a battlefield.
-----
Trump should just build a wall like he was elected to do and be done with it. Unfortunately, Trump and his supporters don't think things like responsibility, accountability, and honesty are the values that Make America Great Again.
You have posted this before. I haven't seen anything to that effect.Quote: beachbumbabs..... Walking. Mostly women and children......
I have seen some photo ops where a woman is holding hands or something walking with kids. I have never seen a pair of flip flops that would make it a thousand miles.
I have seen aerial photos, and it was a mix, mostly of the typical migration with males of working age, complimented with some women.
I saw this article and without doing due diligence, post it as is. Do you consider this fake news or just wrong? I have never heard of a migration of people where the men stay behind and send the women forward to collect the nut?
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-11-27/nbc-news-admits-migrant-caravan-65-men
The number one purpose of people banding together in a group is to protect the pile of progress they call "ours" from the tribe and wolf next door. Everything else is secondary.
I find it humorous that so many people encourage and are willing to have their personal interests diluted bringing them closer to parity with the rest of the world.
Quote: MaxPenI'm sure all the people who support letting the illegals march across the border ILLEGALLY
Is Trump really allowing this to happen? And some of the people who voted for him actually think he's doing a good job?
