Playing for Comps

A local casino says if I'm playing on a certain night at a certain hour, I could be called on to win $90,000 cash. So how many people are going to be in the casino right then? That's my chance of winning.

Well, the Indian casinos regularly have something like that going on. I never play at home but family and friends do. At the casinos we go to locally the only requirement is to be present on the floor during the drawing and to have swiped your player card at a kiosk to show that you are there. But since I never play locally, most of the time when I swipe my card it shows no drum entries, while family members who swipe their cards seem to get hundreds of entries based on their regular play.

In other words, simply being there is not the only factor, prior play determines the number of entries you get. Still, it takes only one entry to win.

You seem to be describing a requirement that you are not only present but actually playing at the moment or at least night of the drawing? Are you sure they require that?

That's one thing I have never gotten into in any case, playing locally.

Quote: gamerfreak

Quote: billryan

I'd think most BIG Players, the ones that run billions through casinos, wouldn't even notice WOV FORUMS.

I edited that for you Bill.

Quote: MDawg

Well, the Indian casinos regularly have something like that going on. I never play at home but family and friends do. At the casinos we go to locally the only requirement is to be present on the floor during the drawing and to have swiped your player card at a kiosk to show that you are there. But since I never play locally, most of the time when I swipe my card it shows no drum entries, while family members who swipe their cards seem to get hundreds of entries based on their regular play.

In other words, simply being there is not the only factor, prior play determines the number of entries you get. Still, it takes only one entry to win.

You seem to be describing a requirement that you are not only present but actually playing at the moment or at least night of the drawing? Are you sure they require that?

That's one thing I have never gotten into in any case, playing locally.

That's a very common requirement at several, even many, casinos I've been to. They usually call it a "hot seat" promotion, and your card has to be in the machine with activity within some short parameter. They can pull that info up for the entire casino and call one or more names from the computer. Others have people who walk the floor and stick a bucket of tickets and a wireless microphone in your face while you're at the machine.

And yes, a lot of drawings are activated for tickets earned and either placed in a drum or drawn virtually after a kiosk swipe. But the "hot seat" stuff seems to be winning the promotion popularity contest with a lot of places, so I expect you'll see it sooner rather than later.

WinStar in Oklahoma certainly has these types of promotions.

MDawg, why were you concerned about getting a CTR thing if you cashed out over $10k?

I have to assume someone who even considered making a single $10k bet has reached that threshold hundreds of time?

One thing you mentioned described me to a tee. You mentioned it's not the money per se, but just the win that matters. I play negative EV games, but occasionally find + EV opportunities, usually weak dealers. I get a thrill out of walking out of the casino up less than I could make in an hour of work, even after playing 3-4 hours. And having them give me a free lunch to do so!

Casino Front money - Am I too small a player to use it?
https://www.vegasmessageboard.com/forums/index.php?threads/casino-front-money-am-i-too-small-a-player-to-use-it.121587/

Piggylane writes: Be careful. Central Credit LLC records all activity for your credit lines, markers, payments and delinquencies. I'm not sure about front money. The reason I point this out is that it is discoverable in Divorce Court. I know from personal experience.

I was accused of owing Las Vegas casinos thousands, maybe tens of thousands of dollars. I pointed out that Central Credit would have all records. I don't know if there was a fee for a credit check but it came back and she was embarrassed before the Judge to learn that my total credit line, in all casinos across the USA, was zero dollars throughout their entire database, throughout my entire history She then demanded win/loss records but the Judge told her to shut up (good thing!).

Credit lines are a convenience and I sure wish I didn't have to carry cash. At times I've had over $100K (didn't bring that much, just won it). I've never used front money because I'm unsure about Central Credit. Maybe others can chime in. Carrying $10K or less well protected (I'm licensed) isn't a burden.

Chump all the casinos I play at no longer use Central Credit instead they use VisuaLimits LLC (aka NCC Reports). You may get a free copy of your credit profile annually from either and answer your own question.

SooPoo if you give a chip from one casino to pay off the line from another they have to go through an entire verification process. Years ago, I've done that for as much as $50K of chips where I lost 50 at one casino walked across the street won 50 and walked back and presented the chips to pay off the line. Both casinos then know exactly what happened and while the one you pay off doesn't care nothing upsets a casino where you won more than that you took their money elsewhere because they then know they won't have a shot at winning it back.

Soopoo I try to avoid the $10K transaction reports although I suppose in this case I would have gotten one receiving and one paying would have been a wash. Soopoo I don't know what you are talking about generally I've taken bank wires when I won big there is no transaction report for that. I've also taken casino checks also no transaction report. There is no report whatsoever, don't you play table games, you would know this.

Spent yesterday just going taking it easy then to gym and we went out to Zuma at Cosmo. Will go to the gym again today, eat, then probably play some more, not really all that anxious to get back into it to be honest. I've earned enough comps for this resort put in a lot of hours.

Quote: MDawg

Soopoo I try to avoid the $10K transaction reports although I suppose in this case I would have gotten one receiving and one paying would have been a wash. Soopoo I don't know what you are talking about generally I've taken bank wires when I won big there is no transaction report for that. I've also taken casino checks also no transaction report. There is no report whatsoever, don't you play table games, you would know this.

A CTR is only issued when you are paying or collecting with actual cash. A chip exchange would not necessitate a CTR.

NCC Gaming is our cloud based FCRA compliant end-to-end marker management solution for online application hosting, credit acceptance, underwriting, maintenance, marker issuance, deposit and collection. https://www.nrttech.com/products/casino-credit-automation/ncc-gaming/

I wound up googling VisuaLimits casino table limit signage, so had to change my googling to NCC Gaming. Signs are lit nowadays.

The VL‐Focus® brings Play+ to your gaming tables. Cashless transactions are here and with the VL‐Focus® your guests can transfer funds from their Play+ account directly to the gaming table. https://www.nrttech.com/products/tables/vl-focus/

GN - Look no further than our Play+ Account* - https://nj-casino.goldennuggetcasino.com/promotions/promo-10/
LOL, I could play on their app if I can find Wi-Fi at the Delaware Water Gap, after a 4 hour car ride.

Square’s Cash app now supports direct deposits for your paycheck https://techcrunch.com/2018/03/07/square-cash-now-supports-direct-deposits-for-your-paycheck/

Ohhhh - https://www.nrttech.com/products/tables/vl-eye/
The VL-Eye is a unique piece of hardware. The VL-Eye adds visual appeal through a double side LCD tower. The LCD’s work in conjunction with the VL-Focus or VL-Pro to provide your guests with information related to game type, limit, smoking status, reserved status, and progressive details from afar. Your guests can spot the game of their choice with a glance through your casino.

The VL-Eye wasn’t designed for style alone. The system is embedded with three cameras and an embedded, software controlled lighting system. The cameras, in conjunction with the VL-Focus or VL-Pro, provide you with complete coverage of your gaming table.

While the coverage is an ideal method for surveillance to view every angle of the table through the IP cameras, the real purpose is to bring “Slot Data” to table games. Through software we are able to gather data on your players. We acquire average bet, using chip recognition, for your main wagers and side wagers and pair this data with facial recognition technology. This association provides you with the most effective method of ratings ever provided at gaming tables. You now know your most valuable players and your supervisors can focus customer service.

Though Facial Recognition and game play data the VL-Eye provides you with an effective AML solution. The automated system allow for tracking across all of your gaming tables. In addition to AML, you no longer need to worry about getting beat by a known cheat. The system is designed to inform you of those players at your gaming tables that you would prefer not be there.


AML Compliance (Anti-money laundering)
Facial Recognition provides you with the gateway to enhanced, simplified AML. Assigning a buy-in to a face means that face will be tracked across the casino floor and each further buy-in will be appended. Your staff can drop the outdated, antiquated way tracking is currently performed.

I think a lot of us (myself included) sometimes tend to answer a question in our own minds versus what was asked.

DRich, the issue with paying a casino loss with a chip from another casino is as I outlined above (about how the casino where you won will find out that you used their chips to pay off a loss elsewhere, something they really don't like to see), and the verification process I refer to is the recipient casino calling the issuing casino to verify that you won the chip there. The process is lengthy you'll end up standing at the cage for a very long time sometimes. I am talking about five thousand dollar chips. Nothing to do with a cash transaction report, where did I say that it had anything to do with that?

As far as what happens when casinos don't like what you are doing with their credit lines, such as using wins derived from credit lines to pay off other casinos, well it just depends on who is at the wheel and how long you have been playing with them and your past action. I doubt they would ever close your line permanently just for that sort of thing, but they could temp close it or lower it for that trip. I'd rather not find out so I try to avoid that scenario these days.

Remember the casino I am at now threatens to temp close your line just for trying to cash out or get a check for a big win, they ask you to instead deposit their chips onto your existing line, so I'd imagine taking their chips to another casino to pay off another casino's line would be even more offensive to them.

There are multiple issues involved in all this:
generating records, family law issues, IRS concerns, Foreign Chip verification procedures, Casino discovery that its chips are walking out the door rather than being played.

At least with front money the casino knows it is not extending credit to you, just giving you your own money.

I would say that anyone who plays at these levels should KNOW what is going on. Lawyers and CPAs are expensive but not having them can be more expensive. So can having a lawyer or CPA who doesn't know this stuff.

FleaStiff is a wise man.


Ended up playing something like 14 hours yesterday, all Baccarat, ate breakfast before starting, took a dinner break for a Billionaire Burger at Holstein's. She was at the spa so I ate alone.

To summarize, I pulled an 8K marker, and I was ahead at some point, then I lost it. I pulled another 8K marker and bet like 2000 a hand hit four players in a row got back to even almost instantly, paid off the 8K marker. Then I lost the 8K again, pulled another 8K again, and then somehow I lost that too, so I pulled a 20K. Then I kept playing did well, but I pointed out to the dealer that I was still down 6K.

Then the dealer actually suggested that I bet $20K on bank on the last hand, which I had been winning mostly on bank that shoe. She said, look you're doing well now. I said, no I'm still down $6K. She said, "that's not that much, and if you bet twenty thousand on this last hand then you'll be able to say that this was your best shoe today."

I have never had a dealer suggest seriously that I bet table limit, but she was serious. I kept debating, should I bet $20K? Or maybe just five K, or just one K. Anyway, I actually chickened out and did not bet the last hand at all, just free handed it. Bank came up with a four, player one, and the next card face card - bank wins. She didn't say anything, but I told her, well, I would have been pretty nervous holding just a four with twenty K on the line, and she said, yes but not for long I pulled that last card out fast. 😜

Anyway, I kept playing and playing and playing I counted 14 shoes from my score cards but that was just after dinner, not counting what I played before dinner. At one table where I had cut the deck a bunch of drunks came in and started betting against each other so I left the table and one sober guy followed me. He told me "I'll just follow you I won't even look at the cards, you open them, I'll do whatever you do." In the meantime eventually that table - the deck I cut - hit a fifteen bank run and all but one of them was betting bank, I can't tell you how much that bothered me that I let myself get chased out of my own table, I would have cleared a mint on that table on a 15 bank run and then left for the night right then and there.

Anyway, at no point was I up more than $14K and that is what I walked with, at about 4am. (Ironically this $14K I won after an entire day's play was exactly what I would have been ahead if I had bet that $20K in one hand on bank about 12 hours earlier.) Below is the marker redemption receipt because I redeemed the fifty K in chips (two pumpkins) at the cage and my markers were still in the pit, I was too tired to walk back to the high limit pit to get them, they told me that receipt is my proof that I am paid off clear. They kept asking me to deposit the chips against my line but I told them no, just give me a check please. I don't know if they temp closed my line or not we're checking out today or tomorrow (already asked for another comp'ed night) going to the next casino.

So now I'm ahead for this casino too, about five K. No losing trips.

It was a good swing when I think about it, I was down $16K at one point and ended up $14k, that's a $30K swing. Honestly I wanted to win $50K, I was really trying to do that but by 4am I was just too damn tired and given that I was never up more than $14K, and I was fluctuating between 9500 and 13K up most of the time, once I hit $14K up I called it a night. I must've tipped out at least a thousand in dealer bets too, with tie and dealer bets alongside mine.

Quote: rsactuary

WinStar in Oklahoma certainly has these types of promotions.

Every casino I've been to in Oklahoma does it.

I don't know if it's an Oklahoma thing or an Indian casino thing....??

One of the drunks that bounced into my table, he was so drunk he kept betting against everyone else a lot of the time without even realizing it, was wearing a Patek Philippe minute repeater
https://www.thehourglass.com/th-pmtthehourglass/collectors-guides/allure-of-patek-philippe-minute-repeaters/
the other drunks kept calling him "that *uck with more millions than he can count" but he wasn't even betting that big and kept losing. He kept asking me, "Which side should I bet?" And if I said Bank, he'd say, "You're sure Bank will win?" I could have dealt with just him alone but with the other drunks at the table it was just too much. I prefer to play alone. No one else seems to end up winning other than me, so why would I want to be influenced by anyone.

I myself have tourbillons, but not a minute repeater. We're getting into the realm of celebrities like Elton John and Eric Clapton when you talk about minute repeaters.

$2,000 a hand on an $8K buy-in? Seems like you're overbetting. I'd try $200 a hand.

Chump flat betting is a guaranteed losing proposition over time. At the Bacc. table I was playing at table min was $300. and a 1:5 spread is the minimum any serious gambler will entertain, I prefer more like a 1:10 and when I used to play BJ "professionally" I'd even do a 1:100 based on the count and card flow. Yes that means I'd jump from 100 to 10000 table max on BJ if I believed the cards called for it.

Nowadays it's more about having fun but still I am there to win and if I were to just flat bet the $200. you mention, I might as well just hand the casino the house edge and go home on day one. At least by varying the bet I have a fighting chance at winning.

You're playing solely for comps? I love comps too but I am playing to win. Actually I am not playing today at all, we're just relaxing in the suite until she goes to the spa, and I to the gym.

By the way I just remembered something, the night I walked all the way from one end of strip to the other, hot after losing my arse, not knowing exactly what I was going to do when I arrived at my destination, I walked by the nighttime Jesus Freak with the bullhorn at the corner of Paris Dr. and S. Las Vegas Blvd. exhorting everyone to Repent! before it's too late. I had to shake off the feeling that he was trying to tell me something.

Checking out and now on to the next resort. They covered all F&B, 11 nights in the suite and all of her spa charges, this was quite a lot comp'ed, so even if had not won would have to take all those comps into consideration. It was definitely quite a vacation for her, for me - it varied between jolly good fun and tense moments of catch up.

Only tips were not covered and even though I tried to tip everything in cash, still about four hunny in tips remained on the bill @ the end.

My average was more like a thousand and I put in more than four hours a day even though some days I would not play at all, others I'd play over ten.

By the way I met a now friend over at the other casino we were staying at before we moved here, and we have been hanging out. That guy passed a billion dollars easily across the circle in just one year.

I also ran into this guy last year
https://nypost.com/2019/09/16/ohio-billionaires-son-is-hooker-loving-drug-addict-who-threatened-shrink-suit/
at the tables but didn't realize who he was until today. The first time I ran into him he gave me an alias, the second time he actually gave me a business card because he got to know me and knew I was legit, and I just forgot about it some nondescript Jewish name didn't mean anything to me at the time.

The other day when I was playing my host showed up table side. He asked me if there was anything he could do for me, also added that "we have availability, you may stay as long as you like." After he left, the pit bosses started saying, Uhoh that's not a good sign when the host finds you and comes to let you know that you're taken care of. Means you're betting very big. I have been placing some 5 - 10K bets, winning some, losing some, but I'm ahead why not play with the house's money.

But we've been in town now five weeks, all my lines are clear, and I'm still winning. Can it keep up?

Quote: MDawg

Can it keep up?

We have no douBt you can keep thiS up.

Quote: MDawg

The other day when I was playing my host showed up table side. He asked me if there was anything he could do for me, also added that "we have availability, you may stay as long as you like." After he left, the pit bosses started saying, Uhoh that's not a good sign when the host finds you and comes to let you know that you're taken care of. Means you're betting very big. I have been placing some 5 - 10K bets, winning some, losing some, but I'm ahead why not play with the house's money.

But we've been in town now five weeks, all my lines are clear, and I'm still winning. Can it keep up?

The great ones make it look easy.

Hmm, had to go back to prior page of this thread just to find a post to which to respond, since I have banned a number of you from my view.

"Leaving Las Vegas" 😜today. She says, NO we're not going to stay here that long again. I say, why not?

Final tally was a WIN at Casino #1 (stay #1)
WIN at Casino #2 (stay #1)
WIN at Casino 🎰 #3 (didn't stay there just went in to play)
WIN at Casino #4 (one stay only)
WIN at Casino #2 (stay #2)
LOSS at Casino #1 (stay #2) - this was a pretty big loss, I was ahead $18K from this casino from this trip then I dumped all but one K of it on the last night, and ended up behind since I had also lost on the first night here. I was too cocky at this casino since I had been winning so consistently. Lost half my line, paid it off with cash from the other casinos. Then I clawed my way back to where I was even, then ahead, then dumped all the winnings and more than half of the line again.

If I hadn't lost at the last casino would have cleared over $60K, but as it ended up, ahead around 24K which is ironically just like the last trip, about what I was up after a week. I ended up no more ahead after five weeks than I was after one week.

Still, five weeks of suites, all RFB everything comp'ed even the spa, received at least $25K in comps, conservatively estimating.

I also completed a business deal in Vegas which earned about $44K from a client that I met at the Bacc. tables, which would not have happened if I hadn't been here.

Total stay time in Vegas: five weeks.

Played more WinCraps last night. I had just stopped buying the 4 & 10, and just betting the PL. Most of the point numbers that came up after were 4 & 10, and I'm like "should I be taking odds on these now?" Well, I lost my 25 bet $500 buy-in. So I bet $500 on the PL til I won the lost session money back and start a new session. Started a new session. Same loss pattern; not making the points. Lost my 25 bet $500 buy-in again. I bet $500 on the PL til I won the lost session money again. I think playing against this WinCraps is a bad strategy and I should go to the tables. I just need to win 10 bets ahead to double my buy-in, but I lost 50 bets instead.

Since that five week trip, the offers are rolling in. Wasn't really planning on going back for a while, but the offers are too tempting.

One casino is offering us a 2261 square foot suite with RFB status, plus about fifteen hundred in money to spend shopping. This is the casino where I ended up losing the last night of the last trip, dumping quite a bit. Figures.

The other casino is offering the same as always, free reasonably sized suite up front where they consider comping the food charges by the end, but lately they always do comp the food, with the promotion being a free seven day cruise. Our player status and history will determine where the cruise goes, but I imagine we'll be able to pick from any of the possibilities since I am a top player at that casino. Haven't lost at that casino yet.

Another casino has booked us their penthouse for around New Year's Eve, five nights, which is not bad considering this is that casino's largest suite, and their New Year's Eve dinner. This casino has one of the best views down the strip of any casino on the strip. I ended up playing, winning, not using any comps other than a buffet for one when I was hungry in between play, at this casino.

We're taking up the above three casinos on their offers, will be going to Vegas again in about a month for the first two promotions.

And another casino has some kind of tournament going on winner takes all $100K, but this tournament is coming up too soon and I'm too busy to head to Vegas again so soon after such a long trip away.

Of course all of these offers are just to get you in hoping that you'll leave behind more money than they have spent on you.

Since you are a big player make sure that the casino is going to pay all taxes for the cruise. Us low rollers get free cruises too, but we usually have to pay about $400 for the port taxes.

On the day before the last trip's final departure, I texted the host and asked him to give us a 6pm checkout for the next day. He shot back almost immediately, do you want me to just extend you another night? I answered no, 6pm will be fine and it more or less was, we left around that time, but later it reminded me of the Old Days when I used to play really big, I'd always have my check out day be a day AFTER I was actually going to leave, that way no phone calls from housekeeping, no knocks on the door, just leave whenever that day without care and let them figure out the next morning that I was gone. The suite was free anyway, so I'd just extend it automatically to the day after departure.

I started to think, wow, am I really back to where I was, playing that big again? Definitely not my intention when I started gambling again two years ago, I thought I was just getting into this to win comps and stay ahead in casino wins, but I did get carried away on quite a few bets this last trip and my average got a lot higher than I would have wanted on more than a few sessions. This worked in my favor at the casinos where I ended up winning, and against me at the last casino on the last night where I dumped a fair ton of what I had methodically accumulated little by little over time.

Still, as long as I don't get the the point of booking rooms gaming table side just to use the room's bathroom because I don't want to use the public stalls, I'll know that I'm not quite back to the way I used to play. Actually, my rule these days which I broke only once the last trip is to play only where I stay, so I shouldn't need any extra rooms.

I put in some black chip play at Harrah's a couple months ago, still haven't gotten any new offers yet. The only reason I think that's a little odd is that when I was a green chip player at Harrah's I was getting offers.

Quote: TigerWu

I put in some black chip play at Harrah's a couple months ago, still haven't gotten any new offers yet. The only reason I think that's a little odd is that when I was a green chip player at Harrah's I was getting offers.

Don’t remember about Harrah’s since they nuked my card years ago but many places for out of state addresses in LV it’s going to be a 3-4ish month lag before offers start rather than the two 1.x-2 month lag local places tend to be. Or any chance you would have had smaller play from previous months tainting the card or didn’t play that terribly long, or different HE of game you played with green?

Quote: mcallister3200

Don’t remember about Harrah’s since they nuked my card years ago but many places for out of state addresses in LV it’s going to be a 3-4ish month lag before offers start rather than the two 1.x-2 month lag local places tend to be. Or any chance you would have had smaller play from previous months tainting the card or didn’t play that terribly long, or different HE of game you played with green?

I was playing Tiles 90% of the time. Honestly I don't remember how long it took before offers started rolling in after the green chip play; I swear it was almost immediately (like within two weeks), but I could just be remembering wrong. And, yes, I am out of state.

I just want to schedule my next trip, dang it!

I set the trip for the casino that is giving us the fifteen hunny shopping money. Done, we arrive in a couple of weeks. However recently received an offer for another gift card from the same casino, an even better offer because this one may be used at any store in the casino including one of the designer stores, and she wants something from there that costs about a grand that I was about to buy for cash the last trip, but they had sold it out and needed to special order it and didn't feel like waiting, so now I may get her that item with a free gift card.

Anyway, I asked the host to put us down for this second gift card offer too but he said that the two shopping sprees represent different promotions and must be utilized on separate trips. Well, we could just do what we did the last time, move from casino to casino eventually returning to the starting point, but I don't expect this next trip to be an indefinite one it's not going to go on for five weeks like last time. Even if I wanted to stay that long she's not into it again, at least not so soon after the last extended trip.

Solution, I think, is to spend one night in the living room or second bedroom of a friend who basically LIVES at this casino in a 3500 square foot apartment, been there all year. As long as he doesn't run out of money before we arrive, which he's actually getting close this guy doesn't win regularly the way I do, he's a good friend gives us the key to his pad and the run of the place I am sure he wouldn't mind. So, rather than having to lug all our luggage down the strip, just move it next door (last trip we ended up on the same floor, could easily swing it again) to his suite after checking out, and the next day Voila! we're back, a new trip, reset the clock and collect the second gift card.

Quote: MDawg

I set the trip for the casino that is giving us the fifteen hunny shopping money. Done, we arrive in a couple of weeks. However recently received an offer for another gift card from the same casino, an even better offer because this one may be used at any store in the casino including one of the designer stores, and she wants something from there that costs about a grand that I was about to buy for cash the last trip, but they had sold it out and needed to special order it and didn't feel like waiting, so now I may get her that item with a free gift card.

Anyway, I asked the host to put us down for this second gift card offer too but he said that the two shopping sprees represent different promotions and must be utilized on separate trips. Well, we could just do what we did the last time, move from casino to casino eventually returning to the starting point, but I don't expect this next trip to be an indefinite one it's not going to go on for five weeks like last time. Even if I wanted to stay that long she's not into it again, at least not so soon after the last extended trip.

Solution, I think, is to spend one night in the living room or second bedroom of a friend who basically LIVES at this casino in a 3500 square foot apartment, been there all year. As long as he doesn't run out of money before we arrive, which he's actually getting close this guy doesn't win regularly the way I do, he's a good friend gives us the key to his pad and the run of the place I am sure he wouldn't mind. So, rather than having to lug all our luggage down the strip, just move it next door (last trip we ended up on the same floor, could easily swing it again) to his suite after checking out, and the next day Voila! we're back, a new trip, reset the clock and collect the second gift card.

Let me guess, it's a booster offer + a $500-$1,500 Tiffany's gift card? Ill be selling some soon if ya need more $1,500 doesn't go to far there.

Thats a shoe that i would score out on