Bitcoin to hit $500,000 mark by 2030?

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April 21st, 2017 at 10:01:52 AM permalink

Bitcoin two benefits over traditional currency is that it's

1) Anonymous, which makes it desirable for illegal transactions

and

2) Distributed, making it very very cheap to transfer money

The problem with #2 right now is that it's recently become more difficult to buy Bitcoin with US Dollars. You used to be able to with credit cards for a very low fee, but all of those companies stopped doing it in the U.S.

I think niche #1 is a large part of what is giving bitcoin it's value.

Bitcoin is also inherently designed to become more valuable with time. Each bitcoin is harder to mine than the one before, so it takes more time/processing power to create.

Skeptic

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April 21st, 2017 at 10:07:32 AM permalink

I intend on going all-in on bitcoin just as soon as I close out my beanie-babies position.

Jokes aside, bitcoin is facing a huge problem with the block-chain becoming too large which tends to make transactions take several hours to complete. There's no easy fix for that (or any of the other fundamental technological issues it suffers) and those problems must be fixed before any widescale adoption takes place. The more people who try using bitcoin the bigger the problems become.

Skeptic

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April 21st, 2017 at 10:10:51 AM permalink

Quote: gamerfreak
You used to be able to with credit cards for a very low fee, but all of those companies stopped doing it in the U.S.

No offense intended but purchasing a wildly volatile "investment" instrument with borrowed money at 20% interest is an incredibly foolish thing to do. Whoever stopped allowing that is doing you a huge favor.

Zuga
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April 21st, 2017 at 10:12:31 AM permalink

One can argue since bitcoin is becoming more mainstream and getting regulated in big markets like Japan and Russia ( soon ) that it will give the financial market a positive signal to trade more, invest etc, which will help the price rise long term.

"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "

gamerfreak

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April 21st, 2017 at 10:24:26 AM permalink

Quote: Skeptic
No offense intended but purchasing a wildly volatile "investment" instrument with borrowed money at 20% interest is an incredibly foolish thing to do. Whoever stopped allowing that is doing you a huge favor.

An investment isn't the only reason to buy bitcoins. I never held on to any for an extended period, but I wish I had.

You can buy in/cash out to all the major online casinos for no fee with bitcoin, for example.

Also worth mentioning - you can transfer any fraction of a bitcoin up to several decimal places. So you can buy $1 worth of bitcoin, even with 1BTC trading for $1200 USD+.

The easy splitting combined with low transaction fees also makes it a great way to conduct micro-transactions.

DiscreteMaths2

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April 21st, 2017 at 10:38:52 AM permalink

Right now a lot of online merchants are having problems with charge back fraud. Cryptocurrencies don't suffer from this problem so merchants could possibly force further adoption rates on the issue. (However there is competition in this area from fingerprint scanners and other payment services so who knows how it will play out in the long run).

Assume the worst, believe no one, and make your move only when you are certain that you are unbeatable or have, at worst, exceptionally good odds in your favor.

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April 21st, 2017 at 10:51:15 AM permalink

Two people, not counting me, voted that Bitcoin coin will crash in this thread. I also think that.

First, I'm 51 and 100% of the time I've seen something rise in value extremely fast, it was always accompanied by an even bigger crash the other way. Furthermore, Bitcoin comes off to me as something of a fad.

Second, there are already competing virtual currencies like Ethereum. Eventually, I predict, every currency will be virtual. Give it about 50 years. Then there will be no need for currencies based on nothing like Bitcoin. Instead, we'll all use virtual dollars, Euros, pounds, or whatever.

Prediction -- On Jan 4/21/2027 Bitcoin will be worth under $100.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)

gamerfreak

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April 21st, 2017 at 11:16:24 AM permalink

Quote: Wizard
Second, there are already competing virtual currencies like Ethereum. Eventually, I predict, every currency will be virtual. Give it about 50 years. Then there will be no need for currencies based on nothing like Bitcoin. Instead, we'll all use virtual dollars, Euros, pounds, or whatever.

For the most part this is already the case. I know I never touch any cash for my business/personal finances.

The issue is that it is costly to process these transactions, due to the security/regulatory/technology expenses incurred by financial institutions and payment processors. The peer-to-peer blockchain system that Bitcoin (or any cryptocurrancy) uses solves many of these issues.

The math/compsci behind blockchains is pretty solid. I think transaction processing will trend this direction in the future, regardless of the currency.

GWAE

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April 21st, 2017 at 11:34:59 AM permalink

if that happened you will find Axel at the base of the tallest bridge in Nevada.

Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW

onenickelmiracle

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April 21st, 2017 at 11:44:34 AM permalink

These kinds of articles are hype and hysteria. Reminds me of years ago Dow 40,000 that was supposed to be years ago. It's almost like this article itself is an indicator for a huge crash about 8-16 months from now. I'll make a guess stating within 16 months from now, bitcoin will be around $500-600 at some point.

https://www.amazon.com/Dow-40-000-Strategies-Profiting/dp/0071351280

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rainman

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April 21st, 2017 at 11:55:34 AM permalink

A previous poster stated bitcoin is anonymous, For clarification it is not.

gamerfreak

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April 21st, 2017 at 12:00:31 PM permalink

Quote: rainman
A previous poster stated bitcoin is anonymous, For clarification it is not.

Transactions between wallet addresses can be traced.

However, a wallet is not inherently tied to an identity like a bank account or credit card.

Zuga
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April 21st, 2017 at 12:09:09 PM permalink

Quote: Wizard

Prediction -- On Jan 4/21/2027 Bitcoin will be worth under $100.

do I hear a bet ?

"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "

RS

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April 21st, 2017 at 12:30:10 PM permalink

Quote: Zuga
Quote: Wizard

Prediction -- On Jan 4/21/2027 Bitcoin will be worth under $100.

do I hear a bet ?

I was thinking the same thing. What kinda odds will you be laying, Mike?

AxelWolf

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April 21st, 2017 at 1:17:07 PM permalink

I keep thinking it's going to crash again, but it keeps going up it's at 1246.55 now.

It may be cheap to transfer from wallet to wallet, but I'm not so sure that's the case when you want to turn it into cash.

We recently had about 1k in BC just go missing during a transfer.

♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

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April 21st, 2017 at 1:32:53 PM permalink

Quote: RS
I was thinking the same thing. What kinda odds will you be laying, Mike?

I hate to make a bet on something that won't resolve in ten years.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)

gamerfreak

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April 21st, 2017 at 1:36:10 PM permalink

Quote: AxelWolf
It may be cheap to transfer from wallet to wallet, but I'm not so sure that's the case when you want to turn it into cash.

We recently had about 1k in BC just go missing during a transfer.

Like I mentioned, the issue is that all the legit currency exchange companies will not do USD/BTC anymore.

Where were you trying to cash out $1k that it got lost? Was it s individual that scammed you?

onenickelmiracle

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April 21st, 2017 at 1:39:53 PM permalink

Quote: AxelWolf
I keep thinking it's going to crash again, but it keeps going up it's at 1246.55 now.

It may be cheap to transfer from wallet to wallet, but I'm not so sure that's the case when you want to turn it into cash.

We recently had about 1k in BC just go missing during a transfer.

What I sense is just too much optimism, seeing an article like this. I don't really follow too much, don't know what to look for. I'm guessing the stock market has something to do with it, but not really sure. Could be a scandal like a company failing or a court ruling, or something else. I'd say get out late summer if you're scared, my guess just to exit before a crash or correction.

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WatchMeWin

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April 21st, 2017 at 2:16:28 PM permalink

Digital and Virtual currency will be the future. It is already happening. For example, If you walk around China, you will not see anyone use cash anymore. Vendors, Merchants, etc,... you name it. Cash will be virtually obsolete... sorry Ax. Blockchain technology stocks are definitely worth looking into. IBM is a major player in that space. I much safer play than buying bitcoins, although it is worth a small risk for great payout to buy some bitcoin in the event that the Winklevoss twins are correct... because their daddy said so!

I don't know how the casino industry will convert to digital currency... as I would guess that customers like cash transactions unrecorded. Right Ax?

'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'

AxelWolf

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April 21st, 2017 at 2:31:42 PM permalink

Quote: gamerfreak
Like I mentioned, the issue is that all the legit currency exchange companies will not do USD/BTC anymore.

Where were you trying to cash out $1k that it got lost? Was it s individual that scammed you?

While I don't know all the details because someone else was in charge of making the transfers. I just got a message saying we had some BC go missing during a transfer. It was not an individual, it was to or from a wallet. I think they have sent an Email and are trying to figure out exact what happened. From my, understanding there was some type of error message during the transfer.

♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

BTLWI

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April 21st, 2017 at 9:07:15 PM permalink

I think digital has a prominent role in the future of currency. I think Bitcoin will not be the crypto currency that is most widely used. Too easy for "BetterBits" to come out in 5-10 years using the best parts of everything out there.

TomG

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April 21st, 2017 at 9:16:54 PM permalink

If someone truly thought bitcoin would increase that much, they would have already put almost all their assets into it. And if their opinion on these things was truly valid, they would have already done well on other similar bets and had significant amount of money to invest on this one. And that would have caused the price to be far higher than it is now.

Similarly, for those who think it will crash, there should be plenty of opportunities to short it

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April 22nd, 2017 at 4:47:13 AM permalink

Quote: WatchMeWin

I don't know how the casino industry will convert to digital currency... as I would guess that customers like cash transactions unrecorded. Right Ax?

the online gambling industry is already adjusting to the bitcoin reality. There are many online casinos supporting this cryptocurrency and from our experience USA players love it ( knowing the banking limits they are faced with due to UIGEA )

"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "

WatchMeWin

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April 22nd, 2017 at 8:45:55 AM permalink

Quote: Zuga
the online gambling industry is already adjusting to the bitcoin reality. There are many online casinos supporting this cryptocurrency and from our experience USA players love it ( knowing the banking limits they are faced with due to UIGEA )

Yes, definitely for the online casinos, it is a no brainer as everything is digital already. The physical casinos will find a way to capitalize on however and wherever the money is coming from. Probably be used as front money and receive chips.. and for any electronic game that would be able to recognize a digital payment system. The live table games will always have a place for cash in players in my opinion.

'Winners hit n run... Losers stick around'

socks

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April 22nd, 2017 at 11:34:55 AM permalink

Bitcoin has always felt a bit fake to me, as in, it doesn't seem anchored to anything except people's desperation for an alternative to government currency.

That said, I do find the political implications interesting, that there is the possibility for a non-geographic "exit". Traditionally, the left values "voice" while libertarians and the right favors "exit", or the ability to be able to remove themselves from a given system. Sillicon Valley libertarians/crypto-futurists are now talking about the potential for a logical exit.

That said, bitcoin is young. Within the past few weeks, there was a new weakness found that reduced electricity costs for attackers by 30% (the 51% attack, I think?). So there are still question marks here.

Personally, I think zcash is more interesting in terms of asymmetric upside. It offers a greater level of anonymity and seems to be interesting in a way other bitcoin alternatives are not (not including ethereum, which I don't think of as a direct competitor). I'm far from an expert in any of this, but I'm watching hopefully.

sammydv

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April 22nd, 2017 at 10:18:53 PM permalink

Quote:
5. The 2030 price and user count will total $500,000 and 400 million, respectively. The price is determined by taking the $10 trillion market cap and dividing it by 20 million bitcoins, the fixed supply.

He's got everything to gain to try to make people believe that total garbage nonsense.
$10 trillion market cap? Please.
And Japan is on their own planet anyways.

Just wait till the up coming new .com 'social network' bubble explodes because it's all fake value on future speculation.

lilredrooster

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April 23rd, 2017 at 1:27:37 AM permalink

Quote: WatchMeWin
Digital and Virtual currency will be the future. It is already happening. For example, If you walk around China, you will not see anyone use cash anymore. Vendors, Merchants, etc,... you name it. Cash will be virtually obsolete...

I don't think you're correct or if it is the future it is a long way off. We haven't really needed cash for decades. There are a great many people who believe that going cashless offers the government one more way to keep total track of an individual and they don't like that idea. I'm one of those people. The government already knows way too much about me, way more than they need to know. They need to back off, not get closer.

Please don't feed the trolls

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April 26th, 2017 at 7:09:57 PM permalink

I've probably said this before, but I think the market is looking for something like Bitcoin. But not Bitcoin exactly. Something with a name behind it.

I still say Bitcoin is a fad. I remember a book in the 1990's predicting the future value of any given Beanie Baby given the rate of growth at the time of publishing. I have a copy somewhere. It would make you laugh to compare the predicted values to the actual ones. It is just a matter of time before the bubble pops in the same way it did for Beanie Babies.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)

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April 26th, 2017 at 7:33:58 PM permalink

Quote: Wizard
I've probably said this before, but I think the market is looking for something like Bitcoin. But not Bitcoin exactly. Something with a name behind it.

I still say Bitcoin is a fad. I remember a book in the 1990's predicting the future value of any given Beanie Baby given the rate of growth at the time of publishing. I have a copy somewhere. It would make you laugh to compare the predicted values to the actual ones. It is just a matter of time before the bubble pops in the same way it did for Beanie Babies.

I can't believe you are comparing beanie babies with BC. I Don't know what the future of BC is. I keep saying to myself, that's too high don't buy, as I watch it go higher and higher.

I stopped at a gas station this evening on charleston and Decatur where they have a BC ATM There were 3 people waiting to use it.

I asked one if they knew the transaction fees but they had no clue.

♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

MaxPen

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April 26th, 2017 at 9:29:10 PM permalink

When I first discovered Bitcoin it was under a buck. I am still kicking myself.

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April 26th, 2017 at 9:39:15 PM permalink

Quote: AxelWolf
I can't believe you are comparing beanie babies with BC. I Don't know what the future of BC is. I keep saying to myself, that's too high don't buy, as I watch it go higher and higher.

I think the growth in both is fueled by greed. Every bubble is. However, I've been saying that since Bitcoin was around $250, not too long ago. Wish I had bought back then.

Quote:
I stopped at a gas station this evening on charleston and Decatur where they have a BC ATM There were 3 people waiting to use it.

I asked one if they knew the transaction fees but they had no clue.

I once went to the Bitcoin ATM in a soda pop store on Sahara and Fort Apache. The mark-up was huge. I just wanted to say I was in the game, and still want to say that, but don't have any convenient way to buy Bitcoin. I have a friend who offered to sell me some but he insisted on using his Bitcoin wallet. I thought the beauty of Bitcoin was that different wallets could communicate.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)

AxelWolf

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May 8th, 2017 at 2:24:35 PM permalink

1679.00 US Dollar

♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

RS

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May 8th, 2017 at 2:42:23 PM permalink

So I don't really know how bitcoin works (well, I have an idea).....but with the increase in technology and computing power/speed over time, what's this mean for bitcoin?

Let's say 10 years from now BC is absolutely booming and it's everywhere and the main currency and used more often than cash or credit/debit cards. I assume BC could get hacked with improvements in technology. Maybe today it's one of those things where a computer would need 1000 years to hack it....what about 10 years from now?

If so, can BC easily and fluidly be updated, so that there isn't mass chaos if/when it does get hacked?

gamerfreak

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May 8th, 2017 at 6:01:18 PM permalink

Quote: RS
So I don't really know how bitcoin works (well, I have an idea).....but with the increase in technology and computing power/speed over time, what's this mean for bitcoin?

Let's say 10 years from now BC is absolutely booming and it's everywhere and the main currency and used more often than cash or credit/debit cards. I assume BC could get hacked with improvements in technology. Maybe today it's one of those things where a computer would need 1000 years to hack it....what about 10 years from now?

If so, can BC easily and fluidly be updated, so that there isn't mass chaos if/when it does get hacked?

Speaking about cryptography in general, it would take an increase in processessing technology so far above and beyond what we have, we're talking aliens dropping some tech, or opening some sort of black hole type level sci-fi advancements.

Cryptography is a big interest of mine, so I'll write more about Bitcoin and encryption in general when I have time. But a quick google search turned up this calculation:

Assume we have a supercomputer that links 1 billion modern day processors.

The universe itself only existed for 14 billion (1.4e10) years. It would take ~6.7e40 times longer than the age of the universe to exhaust half of the keyspace of a AES-256 key with this supercomputer.

billryan

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May 8th, 2017 at 6:59:04 PM permalink

Quote: Skeptic
No offense intended but purchasing a wildly volatile "investment" instrument with borrowed money at 20% interest is an incredibly foolish thing to do. Whoever stopped allowing that is doing you a huge favor.

I buy lots of things on my credit card and pay them off fully each month. Using a CC to purchase anything on eBay gives you an added layer of protection, as well as letting you garner airline miles. Even if I have cash in pocket, using a CC is much safer and smarter. I make about three roundtrips to NY a year, all free from ebay and paypal purchases.
Your nickname is accurate.

The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.

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May 8th, 2017 at 7:00:48 PM permalink

Quote: AxelWolf
I can't believe you are comparing beanie babies with BC. I Don't know what the future of BC is. I keep saying to myself, that's too high don't buy, as I watch it go higher and higher.

I stopped at a gas station this evening on charleston and Decatur where they have a BC ATM There were 3 people waiting to use it.

I asked one if they knew the transaction fees but they had no clue.

Informed investors at their best.

The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.

onenickelmiracle

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May 8th, 2017 at 7:51:50 PM permalink

They say illegal drug sales prop bitcoin, but it could very well be legal sales. I've heard of how they used collectible bongs to move their money buying and selling them, inflating the values. Maybe if you thought Trump really would(not just hot air) let marijuana dealers use banks, you would be worried about a crash.

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May 8th, 2017 at 7:56:31 PM permalink

Quote: billryan
Informed investors at their best.

Or just the typical Vegas 6/5 BJ players.

TumblingBones

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May 9th, 2017 at 6:57:06 AM permalink

Quote: RS
So I don't really know how bitcoin works (well, I have an idea).....but with the increase in technology and computing power/speed over time, what's this mean for bitcoin?

Let's say 10 years from now BC is absolutely booming and it's everywhere and the main currency and used more often than cash or credit/debit cards. I assume BC could get hacked with improvements in technology. Maybe today it's one of those things where a computer would need 1000 years to hack it....what about 10 years from now?

If so, can BC easily and fluidly be updated, so that there isn't mass chaos if/when it does get hacked?

For those interested in getting a better understanding of this stuff, there is a free Coursera course starting next week on Bitcoins and Cryptocurrency Technologies.

My goal of being well informed conflicts with my goal of remaining sane.

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May 11th, 2017 at 10:58:38 AM permalink

BC 1854.79

♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

Boz

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May 16th, 2017 at 8:51:48 AM permalink

This news will make some like BC even more for the privacy and others hate it but it seems to be the preferred currency of hackers willing to risk Human Lives for ransom.

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/15/wannacry-ransomware-hackers-have-only-made-50000-worth-of-bitcoin.html

Tanko

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May 19th, 2017 at 12:34:44 AM permalink

Quote: AxelWolf
BC 1854.79

Currently $1915.58

Bitcoin's Fatal Flaw?

AxelWolf

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May 19th, 2017 at 3:02:35 AM permalink

Quote: Tanko
Currently $1915.58

Bitcoin's Fatal Flaw?

I think it hit 1930 today? its 1926.99 now.

Due to a complicated situation, I will be slowly receiving payments in bitcoin. I Don't like the current price, but it is what it is, I doubt I will sell them.

♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

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May 19th, 2017 at 3:38:28 AM permalink

as i mentioned somewhere before, the expert are predicting $3000 wroth by years end. Given the recent boost Im pretty positive it will reach that mark, if not even sooner.

"All it takes for evil to prevail is for good people to do nothing "

Boz

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May 19th, 2017 at 6:53:31 AM permalink

Quote: Zuga
as i mentioned somewhere before, the expert are predicting $3000 wroth by years end. Given the recent boost Im pretty positive it will reach that mark, if not even sooner.

As soon as the "experts" start with TV commercials pushing it as a safe investment like the Gold guys do over here, SELL, SELL, SELL. Sad but may people missed the stock rally and lost hundreds an ounce on their gold plus paid crazy fees just because some over the hill actor played on their fears of an economic collapse.

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May 19th, 2017 at 8:02:56 AM permalink

Quote: Zuga
as i mentioned somewhere before, the expert are predicting $3000 wroth by years end. Given the recent boost Im pretty positive it will reach that mark, if not even sooner.

I've said this before but this has all the signs of a hysterical bubble. When it pops it will pop hard. I predict we will see a drop in price of at least 80% in a three-month period at some point in the next three years.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)

socks

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Joined: Jul 13, 2011

May 19th, 2017 at 8:52:29 AM permalink

I watch a lot of Peter Thiel(venture capitalist) videos on youtube and he has commented that one of his biggest mistakes was not investing in the second round of facebook. It had gone up so steeply, he sat round 2 out. He has broadened this to say that, in startup investing, when the fundamentals are good, stocks that have seen the steepest climbs turn out to be the most undervalued. I think bitcoin should be a question of what you think the fundamentals are, such as the potential market size given the world's apparently desire for a new scorekeeping system.

Another technology I'm watching in the cypto-decentralizing space is Urbit. I bought a star in a sale to mailing list members this week. There's a public auction later this summer. It's sort of like real estate (to bitcoin's currency) of a new internet organization that solves some of the problems of our current internet.

AxelWolf