FleaStiff
FleaStiff
Joined: Oct 19, 2009
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:21:44 PM permalink
So who is Madame Cheng that she leads poor Phil Ivey around by a nose-ring and gives orders to casino personnel as to how to orient the valuable cards?

What about Statutes of Repose and the doctrine of laches?
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:23:48 PM permalink
deleted
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
beachbumbabs
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beachbumbabs
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:28:19 PM permalink
It may come down to parsing words, but I think it's pretty fair to say Ivey and friend "tricked" the dealers into turning cards "based on superstition" when they had a hidden agenda. OTOH, this is a known technique (edge sorting) that should have rung a bell for SOMEone in the pit. Seems incredibly embarassing to announce to the world you've been had. Not sure I see the upside on trying to recover less than a week's take, or whatever their earnings are, when the publicity's going to be so bad.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
treetopbuddy
treetopbuddy
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:28:54 PM permalink
Quote: FleaStiff

So who is Madame Cheng that she leads poor Phil Ivey around by a nose-ring and gives orders to casino personnel as to how to orient the valuable cards?

What about Statutes of Repose and the doctrine of laches?



I didn't know that Madame Cheng was the greatest pirate the world as ever known
Each day is better than the next
beachbumbabs
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beachbumbabs
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:32:34 PM permalink
Quote: FleaStiff

So who is Madame Cheng that she leads poor Phil Ivey around by a nose-ring and gives orders to casino personnel as to how to orient the valuable cards?

What about Statutes of Repose and the doctrine of laches?



Bankroll rep for a consortium? Rainwoman? Arm candy? No idea.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
sodawater
sodawater
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:32:54 PM permalink
Here's the problem for the Borgata -- even if they could convince a jury that asking the casino's own table games staff to accommodate a superstition was somehow cheating, they still can't prove that Ivey used any extra information when betting. There's no evidence (other than inside Ivey's head) that he used his knowledge of the cards' edge patterns to change the odds of the game. He can just say he was betting on hunches, got lucky, and there's absolutely no evidence to prove otherwise.

It's the casino's job to police its own games. If they don't want their dealers to accommodate superstitious players, they should instruct them not to. Is turning 8s and 9s any different from turning dice that land on craps before returning them to the shooter? Well, we know that the former can be exploited by advantage play, but it's up to the casino to decide whether to do it or not.

Ivey never touched a card and this suit is frivolous. Ivey should countersue for defamation.
tringlomane
tringlomane
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:32:54 PM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

Not sure I see the upside on trying to recover less than a week's take, or whatever their earnings are, when the publicity's going to be so bad.



This is a good point. Borgata is the only thing worth talking about in AC. And unfortunately, the average person forgets/is unaware of how Phil Ivey played a major role in screwing over millions of online poker players at Full Tilt, so Borgata will look like the bad guy in the press I would think.
treetopbuddy
treetopbuddy
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:36:42 PM permalink
Quote: sodawater

Here's the problem for the Borgata -- even if they could convince a jury that asking the casino's own table games staff to accommodate a superstition was somehow cheating, they still can't prove that Ivey used any extra information when betting. There's no evidence (other than inside Ivey's head) that he used his knowledge of the cards' edge patterns to change the odds of the game. He can just say he was betting on hunches, got lucky, and there's absolutely no evidence to prove otherwise.

It's the casino's job to police its own games. If they don't want their dealers to accommodate superstitious players, they should instruct them not to. Is turning 8s and 9s any different from turning dice that land on craps before returning them to the shooter? Well, we know that the former can be exploited by advantage play, but it's up to the casino to decide whether to do it or not.

Ivey never touched a card and this suit is frivolous. Ivey should countersue for defamation.



Time to move on......sodawater nailed it....
Each day is better than the next
nickolay411
nickolay411
Joined: Sep 7, 2011
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:36:58 PM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

Bankroll rep for a consortium? Rainwoman? Arm candy? No idea.



doesn't look like arm candy...

http://www.pokernews.com/live-reporting/2012-pokerstars-com-ept-barcelona/50-000-super-high-roller/chips.39533.htm
Dicenor33
Dicenor33
Joined: Aug 28, 2013
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April 11th, 2014 at 5:39:50 PM permalink
Karas marked cards with his own hands.

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