Obamacare
Quote: rxwineThe IRS stuff is nasty. But whether you can really tie Obama in some more direct way remains to be seen.
He is in charge, he sets the tone, the buck is supposed to stop with him. If a CEO used all the excuses he does about "the government is just too big" the board would fire him for not being able to handle the job.
Sorry, but when you are at the top and the IRS does what it did based on your (Obama's) similar pattern of attacks, well then the leader at the top has to own up to what happened. Whether or not Obama personally came up with or approved it directly makes no difference. He has to answer for it.
+1Quote: AZDuffmanWe warned about government control, now look at the IRS abuse of power.
How many more times do we need to warn about where this guy is taking the USA?
Totally agree, AZ. Our side warned everybody, and now they're surprised that what we said is finally coming true.
Quote: AZDuffmanHe is in charge, he sets the tone, the buck is supposed to stop with him. If a CEO used all the excuses he does about "the government is just too big" the board would fire him for not being able to handle the job. .
CEO's that set examples are ones who resign, take golden parachutes worth millions sometimes after sinking the company. That example?
Quote: EvenBobAre you trying to 'not get it' on purpose?
I was talking to him about Catholic priests earlier, and then he started going off on Reagan and the Fairness Doctrine out of the blue. A truly head-scratching moment. lol...
Quote: AZDuffmanHe is in charge, he sets the tone, the buck is supposed to stop with him.
I saw Bob Woodward yesterday. He said we don't
remember that nobody but nobody believed Nixon
had anything to do with Watergate. Not even the
Liberal press. It took a long time and a lot of evidence
before most people even heard of the Watergate
Hotel.
That will be an interesting turn of events.
157 White House visits by the IRS commissioner is a pretty good indicator. Then there is yet another lie by Stephanie Cutter, this time about her presence in the White House meetings on IRS and, supposedly, Obamacare. And lest we forget the White House meeting with the head of the Treasury employees' union on the day before the targeting was implemented. Hillary Clinton's articles of impeachment against Nixon were based on far less material than that.Quote: rxwineThe IRS stuff is nasty. But whether you can really tie Obama in some more direct way remains to be seen.
Quote: SanchoPanza157 White House visits by the IRS commissioner is a pretty good indicator..
Like Mob guys meeting with union heads 157 times. Look FBI, we met lots of times to throw you off, instead of the minimum necessary. If we were crooks we'd seldom be seen together.
Quote: rxwineI actually upped my assessment on the IRS over their conference spending. I don't think the public will tolerate more abuse than what was already there. That didn't help them out.
Just the latest abuse of this type by an agency under this administration. Who got caught a few years back doing the same thing? Some purchasing agency or something?
Also more proof that this admin is incompetent about claims that sequester will cut needed services. You spend like this and at the same time say there in no money for the WH tours, you just look like a clueless group who can't manage a budget.
Quote: EvenBobOf COURSE its about Obamacare. Bush was in office
for 8 years, do you remember even once where this
kind of thing happened? Why do you think the Evil
Queen of Obamacare was involved in this. Nothing
better to do? Its the rules, and the rules must be
followed, because Obamacare is coming and death
panels are coming, so you better get used to it. Some
people live and some people die.
We get it loud and clear, Frau Sebelius. Make your
report directly to Dr Mengele..
Bob, please explain to us, how donated organs should be distributed. I would love to see how your system would benefit society over the current "death panel"
of using a lung allocation score created by the United Network for Organ Sharing.
Quote: EvenBobOf COURSE its about Obamacare. Bush was in office
for 8 years, do you remember even once where this
kind of thing happened? Why do you think the Evil
Queen of Obamacare was involved in this. Nothing
better to do? Its the rules, and the rules must be
followed, because Obamacare is coming and death
panels are coming, so you better get used to it. Some
people live and some people die.
We get it loud and clear, Frau Sebelius. Make your
report directly to Dr Mengele..
Bob, I could not find any cases where the Bush administration intervened on behalf of a child to move to the front of the adult organ transplant list. Would it be possible for you to back up your accusations with some links to news articles or names of children that were moved to the front of the list?
Sarah Murnaghan lung transplant case: Sebelius ordered to make exception on transplant
If someone could explain why this has something to do with Obamacare, that would be awesome.Quote: Beethoven9thThe issue isn't putting the girl at the front of the list. It's about not putting her at the bottom of the list, which is where she's at right now because she's only 10.
Sarah Murnaghan lung transplant case: Sebelius ordered to make exception on transplant
None of this has anything to do with Obama. I've been on our hospital's ethics committee for decades. Who gets the organ is an old discussion. I guess you can call our committee a "death panel" and I as the chair the "head executioner". But we've been around long before Obama (and Sara) and will be here after them.
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/surgeon-claims-china-still-harvests-1816592
Because the HHS Secretary has such wide powers now, and they will increase geometrically in the next six months:Quote: s2dbakerIf someone could explain why this has something to do with Obamacare, that would be awesome.
"“I would suggest, sir, that, again, this is an incredibly agonizing situation where someone lives and someone dies,” Sebelius replied. “The medical evidence and the transplant doctors who are making the rule — and have had the rule in place since 2005 making a delineation between pediatric and adult lungs, because lungs are different that other organs — that it’s based on the survivability [chances].”
Barletta countered that medical professionals think Murneghan could survive an adult lung transplant. During the exchange, he also said that the girl has three to five weeks to live.
Quote: AZDuffmanThose of us on the right tried to warn everybody. We said that you cannot raise the cost of something (labor) and expect the consumer (employers) not to change their behavior. We said there would be layoffs. We were told we were greedy and uncaring, then shouted down.
We warned about government control, now look at the IRS abuse of power.
How many more times do we need to warn about where this guy is taking the USA?
What he said. Orwell was right. They are watching all of us now.
was Obamacare passed in 2005? Did I miss something?Quote: SanchoPanzaBecause the HHS Secretary has such wide powers now, and they will increase geometrically in the next six months:
"“I would suggest, sir, that, again, this is an incredibly agonizing situation where someone lives and someone dies,” Sebelius replied. “The medical evidence and the transplant doctors who are making the rule — and have had the rule in place since 2005 making a delineation between pediatric and adult lungs, because lungs are different that other organs — that it’s based on the survivability [chances].”
Barletta countered that medical professionals think Murneghan could survive an adult lung transplant. During the exchange, he also said that the girl has three to five weeks to live.
Large part of the problem is simple: organ donation is run as a moronic charity, you have to jump through hoops to sign up and get nothing in return. The choice to disallow post-mortem donation should be given exactly as much respect as a demand that your old car not be recycled and left out to rust naturally instead because it held emotional significance to you. It's a cultural problem, we need to HTFU and stop catering to everyone's little feelings.
The free-market solution is obvious, option to offset health insurance pricing by accounting for average body value in case of death, and a moderately regulated open market for live donations. Life extension or QoL improvement through medical means isn't in any fundamental way different from that provided through products and services of other industries.
The socialist-friendly solution is also obvious, opt-out with ineligibility for subsidized healthcare for people who do opt out. I wouldn't actually put it past BHO administration to implement something like that - the mechanism is already in place. If they do, it will be the only good thing to have ever come from this bunch, although they'll likely find a way to ruin even the best things.
Quote: s2dbakerwas Obamacare passed in 2005? Did I miss something?Quote: SanchoPanzaBecause the HHS Secretary has such wide powers now, and they will increase geometrically in the next six months:
"“I would suggest, sir, that, again, this is an incredibly agonizing situation where someone lives and someone dies,” Sebelius replied. “The medical evidence and the transplant doctors who are making the rule — and have had the rule in place since 2005 making a delineation between pediatric and adult lungs, because lungs are different that other organs — that it’s based on the survivability [chances].”
Barletta countered that medical professionals think Murneghan could survive an adult lung transplant. During the exchange, he also said that the girl has three to five weeks to live.
Yes, the fact that the same person who gave that statement is in virtually total control of Obamacare and the tens of thousands of pages of regulations that have already been issued and the additional tens of thousands of pages to come. And among the powers that control entails is to grant waivers in thousands of cases. We have already seen that in, say, bestowing exemptions to certain favored businesses and other groups, but not to less favored applicants.
Quote: AZDuffmanThose of us on the right tried to warn everybody.
Yeah, but since the right proved they were fully capable of putting their own abusers of power in office, they get no credit for being smart.
And they'll do it again when they get a chance. I'm willing to bet on it.
The United States is fairly unique where government officials (congress, senate, the President) represents its lobbyists (insurance and health care) more than it actually represents the people they are supposed to represent. Money talks. Politicians essentially can be bribed into a position, and they somehow get elected, because the other side is no better.
Sad, really.
People want security in their health care. Essentially, most people want to have a way to protect themselves when they are sick that won't cost them an arm and a leg. Corporations who offer health insurance as a benefit are pressured to keep costs down as their benefit costs go through the roof. If you pay health benefits to a family, you are looking at adding $15-20K in costs per FTE, which represents about $10-12/hour in work. So you may pay your employee $8/hour, but you are actually paying $20. Meanwhile you are competing with the rest of the world who has socialized health care which is much cheaper. For example, here in Canada, corporations who offer health insurance offer an extended health coverage that covers pharmceuticals and "extended health" - ambulances, chiropracty, etc which costs about $200/month per employee. So immediately, you can see where the cost of benefits has an effect on compensation packages.
Those people who think that the private coverage and the state of health insurance before Obamacare are delusional. It's a key reason why the United States loses jobs and can't compete globally anymore. The United States has to drive down the costs of health care overall. It can do so by looking at other models instituted in other countries (not Canada, necessarily). Yeah, the insurance companies and health care providers will scream, but it has to be done. Politicians have to have the balls to say "no" to their lobbyists and do what is actually good for its constituents -- drive down the cost of health care.
ObamaCare isn't the way to do that. It's a bunch of overregulated bull made to accomodate their lobbyists. It won't drive health care prices down. It will just drive up administrative costs and will be an unfunded liability to the government.
If politicians can come together and make a law that is good for the people, then something good could have come out of that. The problem is that ObamaCare is a Democrat production, and the Republicans do not want to see ObamaCare work, because it will cost votes in the next election cycle.
In government, you are supposed to look after the your constiutents first. In Washington, it's the lobbyists that seem to come first.
If we got insurance reduced to only cover what "insurance" is supposed to be and return to where you pay for the regular stuff yourself costs would fall fast and quality would go up as people started to shop for the best of both. Or what they can afford to buy.
As to "the USA can't compete" I say nonsense. Europe and Cuba to name two have sociized health care and neither is tearing up the world economy.
U.S. innovation in the pharma, biotech and technology industries play a major role in improving health care around the world. It's just that simple. Don't see a lot of innovation out of Canada, yet Canadians love to brag about their healthcare system. A system that is a direct beneficiary of U.S. capitalism. hehehe
Everybody in this country gets health care!
Quote: treetopbuddyHealth insurance companies operate on a 3-4% margin. The insured have no motivation to shop for best prices. Most insured hate their insurance company and love it when they can stick their carrier with a huge bill.
U.S. innovation in the pharma, biotech and technology industries play a major role in improving health care around the world. It's just that simple. Don't see a lot of innovation out of Canada, yet Canadians love to brag about their healthcare system. A system that is a direct beneficiary of U.S. capitalism. hehehe
Everybody in this country gets health care!
Last Canadian I met bragged he would be dead under the Canadian system.
He was as against Obamacare 100%.
Then they can get rid of Obamacare.
All the recent decisions will insure a demo President unfortunately.
The Republican House just voted to deport all the Hispanic "dreamers" Gee, Hispanic vote down the drain
The Republicans are now attacking Susan Rice even though she has support of Mccain and Lindsey Graham, Repubs just cant deal with a demo Woman as National Sec head. Hmm, lets also make sure the Women vote goes down the drain.
A report just came out on how Republican Party is viewed by college students. It aint pretty. Is the Repub party doing anything to change these perceptions, of course not. Young voters down the drain.
Repubs against Gay marriage, The gay vote down the drain.
Repubs cater to the Religious right and insult Atheists. There goes my vote and I'm a Republican.
Gee whats left , old white people that are dying off.
Gee, looks like Repubs love Obamacare, they certainly are not doing anything to make sure it can be repealed, in fact its the opposite, Their actions make sure it wont be repealed.
Unless the Republican party can change and attract voters instead of turning them off, Obamacare is here to stay.
DEAL WITH IT.
Regarding Susan Rice...
"Rice Lied, People Died"
Quote: Beethoven9thI get a kick out of people who tell the Republicans that they can win, but only if they act like Democrats. LOL
Regarding Susan Rice...
"Rice Lied, People Died"
OMG , NEWS FLASH - somebody in Washington DC lied.
Hmm.
How about this, is there anybody in DC that does not lie? Its politics, everybody lies in DC, well except Bullworth, but that's fictional. Are there any Bullworths in DC, of course not.
Do you really think anybody in DC really, really really cares about deaths overseas. They only care if it can be used as a political tool. And I'm talking about both sides of the aisle.
Quote: terapinedDo you really think anybody in DC really, really really cares about deaths overseas.
It's quite obvious that many Democrats don't.
Quote: Beethoven9thYou obviously didn't get the reference. The same people who b*tched and moaned and screamed at the top of their lungs "Bush Lied, People Died!" are all of a sudden dead silent about Susan Rice's lies.
You are absolutely right. ahem. correct. Its all Politics, Left or right.
Quote: Beethoven9thIt's quite obvious that many Democrats don't.
Do you seriously believe the Repubs wear the white hats and Dems wear the black hats. Its politics. Repubs and Dems only care about getting reelected so they can continue to get the free govt paid health insurance. Yes, tea partiers in DC love their health care benefits, so much so, they want to keep it for themselves. Very selfish.
Quote: AZDuffmanLast Canadian I met bragged he would be dead under the Canadian system.
Nothing like a sample size of one. With that sample size, you'd be surprised I guess to hear the FACT that Canadians live 3 years longer on average than Americans. Us Canadian's health care is so horrible that we're just dying for the American system. Yeah.
The excuse that Americans are unhealthier doesn't wash. We're healthier -- we take care of ourselves because we have easy and "free" access to preventative care, with absolutely no co-pays and no deductibles. In the past two weeks, i went in for my annual physical, got all of my bloodwork done, and had my followup appointment, all for the low price of nothing. If I break my arm, I don't have to worry about the $1,000 - $3,000 deductible. I pay nothing. The medical office and the lab swipes my health card and put in the codes to the single system (that everyone uses in the province) and they get paid. Pretty simple. For that service, we all pay more provincial income taxes.
I didn't say anyway that the Canadian system *is* better. It's not better for the 1-2% of Canadians who would like to pay and can afford immediate health services, and they accomodate that through medical tourism. And of course there are a few stories of Canadians who go somewhere else for treatment because the treatment is too new or isn't covered (typically because it is an alternative treatment that is too expensive) under the provincial plan, or they had to wait too long.
Quote: treetopbuddyDon't see a lot of innovation out of Canada
We're 1/10th of the population of the United States. The only thing that US capitalism does for Canadian health care is drive up costs. Canada contributes plenty of innovations to the world of medicine.
Did Benghazi happen because of Obamacare? I hear that Darryl Issa is going to have a hearing bout that.Quote: Beethoven9thYou obviously didn't get the reference. The same people who b*tched and moaned and screamed at the top of their lungs "Bush Lied, People Died!" are all of a sudden dead silent about Susan Rice's lies.
Quote: terapinedA report just came out on how Republican Party is viewed by college students. It aint pretty.
And this says something about these people who go to college even though they don't belong there and have no interest in learning, just so they can try and look down on their fellow man (it's a democrat thing), instead of acquiring a useful trade they can actually earn money with, not default on their subsidized loan and campaign for more handouts.
Bitter much?Quote: P90And this says something about these people who go to college even though they don't belong there and have no interest in learning, just so they can try and look down on their fellow man (it's a democrat thing), instead of acquiring a useful trade they can actually earn money with, not default on their subsidized loan and campaign for more handouts.
Quote: P90And this says something about these people who go to college even though they don't belong there and have no interest in learning, just so they can try and look down on their fellow man (it's a democrat thing), instead of acquiring a useful trade they can actually earn money with, not default on their subsidized loan and campaign for more handouts.
Huh????????? You on drugs? Seriously, that's what you believe? Its sarcasm right? Wow.
Quote: terapinedDo you seriously believe the Repubs wear the white hats and Dems wear the black hats.
Haha...this line is typical. Somebody makes a point about the Dems' lack of concern about the lives lost in Benghazi, and this is your response? LOL
Quote: terapinedHuh????????? You on drugs? Seriously, that's what you believe? Its sarcasm right? Wow.Quote: P90And this says something about these people who go to college even though they don't belong there and have no interest in learning, just so they can try and look down on their fellow man (it's a democrat thing), instead of acquiring a useful trade they can actually earn money with, not default on their subsidized loan and campaign for more handouts.
No, he just disagrees with you. I love how he "must be on drugs" just because he has a different viewpoint.
Quote: Beethoven9thHaha...this line is typical. Somebody makes a point about the Dems' lack of concern about the lives lost in Benghazi, and this is your response? LOL
Dude, Its Fox News. Wow, you drank the Kool-Aid. Pretty unfortunate. Gotta stay away from BS news outlets such as Fox and MSNBC. I could care less what Fox or MSNBC consider important stories. This is the age of the internet, I determine what I want to read. I love the news. What I consider important are stories I am interested in reading. Liberal media, conservative media, who cares, with the internet, the slant is meaningless, you can do your own research. Sorry, not reading Benghazi and IRS, tiny stories in my universe.
Quote: terapinedSorry, not reading Benghazi and IRS, tiny stories in my universe.
And I'm the one drinking the Kool-Aid? LOL
Quote: Beethoven9thAnd I'm the one drinking the Kool-Aid? LOL
Look, on a serious note on the media and what stories I consider important to me. I live in Tampa. Scientology has a huge presence in my area. They pretty much own and control downtown Clearwater. Its an incredibly destructive cult. Its destroyed many families and people. Some media outlets have the balls to report on scientology, St Pete Times, ABC, BBC. Most are afraid due to litigation and scientology fights back with dirty tactics. Fox news never reports on scientology because of Greta. Really Unfortunate because Fox News could really help a lot people by reporting about the criminal nature of scientology.
So sorry I'm not reading about Benghazi, I try to keep up on scientology. Finally some negative press about Narconon, one of their fronts.
Taking a walk around downtown Clearwater is like no other downtown. Very weird. Its cult central.
Would you say that there are a lot of people there who would drink the Kool-Aid if they were ordered to do so?Quote: terapinedTaking a walk around downtown Clearwater is like no other downtown. Very weird. Its cult central.
Quote: terapinedYou on drugs? Seriously, that's what you believe?
It's not a matter of belief. College is full of kids who only went there as a matter of prestige and cultural identification (leaving aside basket cases who were outright after partying), not to acquire the skills and certifications for their intended employment.
Republican economic policies cater to the people who seek to provide for themselves through productive employment or business. Like tradesmen, engineers, entrepreneurs. In other words, people any country actually wants and needs, not entitled whiners who must be catered to because they happened to grace this soil with the miracle of their birth.
Quote: terapinedFox news never reports on scientology because of Greta. .
I can't stand Greta, she makes my skin crawl.
She's sooooo Liberal and a Scientologist to boot.
FOX leaves them alone because its a losing battle.
They'd be in court forever.
Quote: P90It's not a matter of belief. College is full of kids who only went there as a matter of prestige and cultural identification (leaving aside basket cases who were outright after partying), not to acquire the skills and certifications for their intended employment.
Republican economic policies cater to the people who seek to provide for themselves through productive employment or business. Like tradesmen, engineers, entrepreneurs. In other words, people any country actually wants and needs, not entitled whiners who must be catered to because they happened to grace this soil with the miracle of their birth.
Sorry for my over reaction. I"m part of the Asian American community. I went to college and I can assure you my Asian American college buddies did nothing but study and work hard. Its part of our culture. To party at school is to dishonor our family. Yes a lot parties in college, but our community did not participate in that part of college life. My Father was a Doctor. My Uncle is a Doctor. Education is very very very important in the Asian American community. In fact Newt Gingrich said after Rommney loss, "We lost the Asian American Vote and these people don't want nothing from the Govt" Newt was right, Repubs did lose our vote, its because our community and culture place a high value on education and Repubs don't.
PS I'm actually bi-racial but consider myself an Asian American.
Quote: s2dbakerWould you say that there are a lot of people there who would drink the Kool-Aid if they were ordered to do so?
Yes they would drink it. Its very sad. All the scientologists can be easily spotted downtown, They all dress the same and tend to move from building to building in large groups. The whole cult is there. When I walk around downtown, its like being in a twilight zone episode, bizarre.
Quote: terapinedSorry for my over reaction. I"m part of the Asian American community. I went to college and I can assure you my Asian American college buddies did nothing but study and work hard. Its part of our culture. To party at school is to dishonor our family. Yes a lot parties in college, but our community did not participate in that part of college life. My Father was a Doctor. My Uncle is a Doctor. Education is very very very important in the Asian American community. In fact Newt Gingrich said after Rommney loss, "We lost the Asian American Vote and these people don't want nothing from the Govt" Newt was right, Repubs did lose our vote, its because our community and culture place a high value on education and Repubs don't.
PS I'm actually bi-racial but consider myself an Asian American.
I'm not sure where you get that republicans don't place a value on education.
I see more that the GOP lost Asians because so many Asians live in ca and just trend normal for ca voters.
Quote: terapinedRepubs did lose our vote, its because our community and culture place a high value on education and Repubs don't.
Quite a sweeping, all inclusive statement. Can you please back it up with hard facts.
