Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:43:56 AM permalink
The following is from a post created late yesterday or early today by darkoz. I've received a complaint about its mysterious disappearance with accusations that a moderator busted it.

What I speculate happened is selfish advantage players teamed up to flag it off the site. My response is that I'm bringing it back and will defend it from flagging. In fact, because of the sabotage I will be analyzing it and drawing even more attention to it as it does appear to be very generous. Stay tuned for more details.

I also invite you to visit Plaza promotions.


Quote: darkoz

I'm not in Vegas but wanted to alert those that are I just read of a pretty decent bonus for tax day only (April 18, this Monday).

All jackpots over $1200, i.e. taxable wins, will have the amount of the tax awarded in free-play. 28% was the amount I read in the article.

Here is the type from their own website. Note there is also a $500 new membership loss rebate so if you can combine those two, sounds like some nice +ev.

Payout Payoff

Tax Day Promotion Ė April 18th
We Pay The Tax On Eligible Jackpots
See Royal Reward for Details. Management reserves all rights.*

$500 ON US

ďPlayers club offers the best new-member benefit in town with the $500 on Us loss-rebate promotionĒ- Anthony Curtis
New Royal Rewards members receive $500 On Us Promotion. Actual slot loss of 100 up to 500 will be reimbursed in free slot play or promotional chips.See Royal Rewards Desk for details.

"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizardofnothing
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:58:24 AM permalink
I'm only going to guess who complained? Could it rhyme with park boz?
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Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 10:18:58 AM permalink
Fair warning that I will be issuing suspensions to anybody who I feel, beyond a reasonable doubt, was inappropriately flagging the original post. Be careful what you confess to.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizardofnothing
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April 15th, 2016 at 10:21:55 AM permalink
Wasn't confessing to anything I remember reading the post just not sure who would have complained that it was removed except the poster was my only thought
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Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 10:38:22 AM permalink
Here is a link to more information on this: Plaza Hotel and Casino to 'pay your taxes' on April 18.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
beachbumbabs
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April 15th, 2016 at 11:33:27 AM permalink
How nice that wov will be just a block away for pg's nugget challenge . You all should hammer that promo , pool your br and go big on some machine. Whack!
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 11:59:34 AM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

How nice that wov will be just a block away for pg's nugget challenge . You all should hammer that promo , pool your br and go big on some machine. Whack!



In the unlikely chance I can get a $5 machine, I intend to play. This could involve me missing the challenge.

Speaking of $5 machines, vpfree2 says the plaza has the following games, which I think would be appropriate for this promotion:

$1 10/7 Double Bonus
$5 9/7 Double Bonus
$5 8/5 Bonus Poker

Here are return tables for all three with wins of $1250 or more increased by 28%.

10/7 Double Bonus -- $1 Denom

Hand Pays Combinations Probability Return
Royal flush 1024 45,397,257 0.000027 0.027986
Straight flush 50 191,394,691 0.000115 0.005761
4 aces 160 332,732,452 0.000200 0.032049
4 2-4 80 870,659,141 0.000524 0.041932
4 5-K 50 2,663,065,508 0.001603 0.080160
Full house 10 18,585,501,849 0.011189 0.111887
Flush 7 23,242,111,907 0.013992 0.097944
Straight 5 25,180,802,400 0.015159 0.075795
3 of a kind 3 119,898,086,489 0.072180 0.216539
Two pair 1 207,287,736,561 0.124789 0.124789
Jacks or better 1 319,336,091,895 0.192243 0.192243
Nothing 0 943,468,962,950 0.567978 0.000000
Total 1,661,102,543,100 1.000000 1.007085


9/7 Double Bonus -- $5 Denom

Hand Pays Combinations Probability Return
Royal flush 1024 45,420,791 0.000027 0.028000
Straight flush 64 193,954,119 0.000117 0.007473
4 aces 204.8 376,552,677 0.000227 0.046426
4 2-4 102.4 875,093,731 0.000527 0.053946
4 5-K 64 2,663,176,878 0.001603 0.102609
Full house 9 17,728,749,942 0.010673 0.096056
Flush 7 22,618,371,370 0.013616 0.095315
Straight 5 24,812,830,906 0.014938 0.074688
3 of a kind 3 121,919,590,318 0.073397 0.220190
Two pair 1 198,951,262,614 0.119771 0.119771
Jacks or better 1 328,587,772,992 0.197813 0.197813
Nothing 0 942,329,766,762 0.567292 0.000000
Total 1,661,102,543,100 1.000000 1.042286


8/5 Bonus -- $5 Denom

Hand Pays Combinations Probability Return
Royal flush 1024 45,079,141 0.000027 0.027789
Straight flush 64 185,020,617 0.000111 0.007129
4 aces 102.4 326,960,003 0.000197 0.020156
4 2-4 51.2 875,925,222 0.000527 0.026999
4 5-K 32 2,713,820,429 0.001634 0.052280
Full house 8 19,093,819,266 0.011495 0.091957
Flush 5 18,389,802,932 0.011071 0.055354
Straight 4 18,737,204,942 0.011280 0.045120
3 of a kind 3 123,364,048,501 0.074266 0.222799
Two pair 2 214,346,741,139 0.129039 0.258078
Jacks or better 1 353,837,431,332 0.213014 0.213014
Nothing 0 909,186,689,576 0.547339 0.000000
Total 1,661,102,543,100 1.000000 1.020674
Last edited by: Wizard on Apr 15, 2016
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Johnzimbo
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April 15th, 2016 at 1:04:00 PM permalink
You mean Denom and not Demon...I hope?
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 1:15:14 PM permalink
Quote: Johnzimbo

You mean Denom and not Demon...I hope?



:-). Well, I have been known to buy human souls for $10.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
DRich
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April 15th, 2016 at 1:38:00 PM permalink
If I am not mistaken I think your numbers are wrong on 8/5 Bonus. Wouldn't only the royal, SF, and four aces get the bonus?
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
Keeneone
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April 15th, 2016 at 2:11:17 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard


8/5 Bonus -- $5 Denom

(Incorrect table removed because it was causing formatting problems)



-post edited down by me-

This Bonus Poker chart looks off on the pays for 4 5's-->K's. I do not know if this changes your calculations...
Last edited by: unnamed administrator on Apr 20, 2016
Wizardofnothing
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April 15th, 2016 at 2:13:05 PM permalink
That's because it accounts for the free play
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Ibeatyouraces
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April 15th, 2016 at 2:22:53 PM permalink
Don't forget, free play can't be used on VP there.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
MathExtremist
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April 15th, 2016 at 2:47:40 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Here is a link to more information on this: Plaza Hotel and Casino to 'pay your taxes' on April 18.

I'd do just about anything to get the Plaza to pay my taxes, but I had a good year in 2015.

Speaking of taxes, I hope you got to treat the sale of WoV as a long term capital gain from property held in a trade or business, thereby avoiding both the regular income tax rate and the 3.8% NIIT. If you have a big number on line 62 of your 1040, it's worth double-checking with your accountant. You have until Monday...
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:16:22 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

If I am not mistaken I think your numbers are wrong on 8/5 Bonus. Wouldn't only the royal, SF, and four aces get the bonus?



You're absolutely right. Thank you for the correction. I forgot to adjust the win for four 5-K after analyzing the double bonus games. I've amended the original post. The bottom line is return of 102.74%.

There is some good news. I forgot to mention they have 9-6 Double Double Bonus at the $5 denom. Here is a table for that.

Hand Pays Combinations Probability Return
Royal flush 1024 46,302,728 0.000028 0.028544
Straight flush 64 189,866,542 0.000114 0.007315
Four aces + 2-4 512 102,650,249 0.000062 0.031640
Four 2-4 + A-4 204.8 237,932,025 0.000143 0.029335
Four aces + 5-K 204.8 289,400,230 0.000174 0.035681
Four 2-4 + 5-K 102.4 638,537,018 0.000384 0.039363
Four 5-K 64 2,700,527,624 0.001626 0.104048
Full house 9 18,016,887,282 0.010846 0.097617
Flush 6 18,634,647,255 0.011218 0.067309
Straight 4 20,917,955,302 0.012593 0.050371
3 of a kind 3 124,848,084,877 0.075160 0.225479
Two pair 1 204,242,089,851 0.122956 0.122956
Jacks or better 1 349,218,664,035 0.210233 0.210233
Nothing 0 921,018,998,082 0.554462 0.000000
Total 1,661,102,543,100 1.000000 1.049891
Last edited by: Wizard on Apr 15, 2016
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:19:53 PM permalink
Quote: Ibeatyouraces

Don't forget, free play can't be used on VP there.



According to vpfree2.com, "Free play cannot be downloaded on most video poker machines, but OK at Sportsbook Bar. However, I've known that site to be outdated lots of times."
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
DRich
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:23:50 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard



By the way, I'm quite sure the player has to pay the tax on the 28%.



I would be very surprised if that was the case. Freeplay is generally not taxed.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
Ibeatyouraces
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:30:25 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

According to vpfree2.com, "Free play cannot be downloaded on most video poker machines, but OK at Sportsbook Bar. However, I've known that site to be outdated lots of times."


We checked every machine last summer. Not one accepted it.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:32:59 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

I would be very surprised if that was the case. Freeplay is generally not taxed.



I forgot the 28% was in free play.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
teddys
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:38:14 PM permalink
With only four $5 machines, it will be a real dogfight to get on. I would start playing at least four or five hours before 11:59 PM on Sunday. Hopefully there is a lower denomination on those machines so you can cut losses while waiting. Or play one credit at a time, sloooowwwly . . .

Of course there are probably other opportunities that some people on the board probably do not want revealed.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:50:43 PM permalink
Quote: teddys

Or play one credit at a time, sloooowwwly . . .



Good point! I'm usually one to say to always bet max coins in video poker, but being forced to play is an exception.

Expected loss at 5 coins = (1-0.989801)*5 = 0.0510 coins.
Expected loss at 1 coin = (1-0.978316)*1 = 0.0217 coins.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Ibeatyouraces
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:55:44 PM permalink
I don't think you have to worry about hoards of AP's there at 11:59pm on a Sunday night!
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
teddys
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April 15th, 2016 at 3:58:16 PM permalink
Quote: Ibeatyouraces

I don't think you have to worry about hoards of AP's there at 11:59pm on a Sunday night!

Oh, my, I don't think you could be more wrong!

I am willing to bet just about anything that all four $5 machines will be taken at 11:59pm on Sunday.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
Ibeatyouraces
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April 15th, 2016 at 4:00:53 PM permalink
Quote: teddys

Oh, my, I don't think you could be more wrong!

I am willing to bet just about anything that all four $5 machines will be taken at 11:59pm on Sunday.


I don't think I've ever seen that many people in that place :-)
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
Mooseton
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April 15th, 2016 at 4:02:24 PM permalink
Totally agree with Teddys! And possibly *0w****de*.
$1700, 18, 19, 1920, 40, 60,... :/ Thx 'Do it again'. I'll try
tes3355
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April 15th, 2016 at 4:20:50 PM permalink
Quote: Ibeatyouraces

We checked every machine last summer. Not one accepted it.

Did you specifically check the Sportsbook Bar? And the machines on the 3rd floor outside bingo? I believe free play can be downloaded on those.
tes3355
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April 15th, 2016 at 4:25:37 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

According to vpfree2.com, "Free play cannot be downloaded on most video poker machines, but OK at Sportsbook Bar. However, I've known that site to be outdated lots of times."

vpFREE2.com is crowdsourced, so if it's out of date, that means video poker players using the site aren't letting them know what updates need to be made.
Samhain
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April 15th, 2016 at 4:55:58 PM permalink
My GF and I were just in Vegas a couple of weeks ago and can confirm that the VP machines at the bar next to the book DO accept freeplay. I think the paytable was 8/5 JOB, and the other machines not at the bar were full pay 9/6. We took advantage of the new player $500 loss promo and I did quite well. The lady at the promo desk even told us that we could use our free play on the machines at the bar.
Wizardofnothing
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April 15th, 2016 at 5:23:55 PM permalink
And you need about 40k cash to be safe on that play, I just stopped there and as of now no one is locking up spaces
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TwoFeathersATL
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April 15th, 2016 at 5:42:45 PM permalink
Put PG on a machine early, maybe noon on Sunday. Bathrooms breaks only, someone cover for him. All night, no food, then put another team member in so he can go have some lovely lunch on Monday.

Burn down the house!
Youuuuuu MIGHT be a 'rascal' if.......(nevermind ;-)...2F
RogerKint
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April 15th, 2016 at 5:59:08 PM permalink
This play is over my head but I'm willing to hold seats in exchange for Louie Anderson tickets.
100% risk of ruin
AxelWolf
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April 15th, 2016 at 6:14:26 PM permalink
"Selfish" ABSOLUTELY NOT. Whether or not I play something or not, I would still not want this information out to potentially hurt other AP's by killing a play. A few people privately asked me about the play and possibilities I had no problem telling them what I knew and or what had potential.

Not wanting to yet again give the casinos a road map to exactly what, when, where and how so they can foil the play befoe it starts (Like the Revel and othets) is in fact the reason I FLAGGED that post. If someone has to admit it, or we all get it, will gladly be the student who fesses up.

People probably think..."here comes Axel again trying to suppress information again. He is the only one who feels this way." Not true it seems I'm just the most outspoken about it. Perhaps others are shy, timid, affrade or just kinda know it probably doesn't help. But trust me lots of people feel the same way I do or they are just telling me this.

Hell most very successful AP don't even post on forums, especially guys that don't just concentrate on things like BJ.

*AGIAN, not wanting the casino and darksiders to have a road map is one of the reasons I did it*. .Because I knew it would start a big discussion about the best way to approach this. Basically giving the casino A XYZ of what to look for. It's not just the fact the play might not go off but they could potentially use this info to just 86 people or pull some other crap. It's all fun to talk about plays if your not the one in the line of fire or have any risk.

Many of you who know me, know I have another VERY GOOD reason as to why I didn't want to see this get posted.

And there's other factors involved that I'm not posting publicly (for a very good reason). Feel free to PM, Email or text me and I'll explain.

Its more shocking/upsetting have a fellow AP WHO IS NOT GOING TO PLAY IT posting up the information for Everyone to see. Especially since he gains nothing by doing so (perhaps you will be more likely to buy his book) It gets annoying that people put time, effort money into scouting and scouring and figuring stuff out just to have someone just post up free information.

I don't post up AP information about his location.Perhaps he will share his multi thousand dollar plays with us before and or while they are going?

I think he said he had some big play worth a significant amount yet he didn't tell the forum what when where.

Perhaps he didn't see the potential here I guess.

This information WILL NOT HELP 99% of the AP community. Very few have the ability , money, energy, people,I the right location, and time to take this on. Most of the people who are /were going to play this all ready had the information and plans. I realize it had already been posted about, but it was with a limited amount of talk if any.

I get that some people just enjoy reading about this stuff and learning etc etc. But if the public information keeps killing plays there won't be anything to talk about or do.

I don't nessasarly have problem with talking about some plays after the fact, hopefully after a cooling off period. I would hope if it's something good and can read appear they would leave some details out. People interested in more details can always PM.

I see someone already posted up where you can play FP on VP (That's Just Wonderful) it's been there for a long long time and now perhaps it won't be.

Those machines have been a benefit to people who get weekly free play and other ongoing promos. If it ends because of this thread how does that help gambler's. Just look around (sorry if you tested every machine and couldn't find it)

I didn't mean any disrespect to the site or Mike by flagging it was not out of greed or selfishness it was out of trying preserving something.

Who knows, this promo might go off like a charm and all is well. Let's hope, and Goodluck to all set you all after my forum vacation or possibly at WOV spring fling.
Last edited by: AxelWolf on Apr 15, 2016
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Ibeatyouraces
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April 15th, 2016 at 6:16:47 PM permalink
This promo was posted on LVA.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
darkoz
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April 15th, 2016 at 6:30:31 PM permalink
There have been some people on here who have complained that I just ruined a great AP maneuver (they have sent me pm's in upset)

I would never give away an AP maneuver that was private and earned (for example those two guys who discovered the Poker double up bug).

The Plaza promotion however is neither a private nor an earned one (that is you didn't discover it through trial and error or your own diligence.) This offer was announced publicly through a press release from the casino, has been printed in gambling magazines across the country including ones being distributed in Atlantic City on the opposite coast.

Furthermore, it can be found announced on Steve Bouries site, American Casino Guide here: http://forum.americancasinoguide.com/casino-promotions/10887-plaza-hotel-casino-las-vegas-will-pay-your-jackpot-taxes-april-18-a-print.html

It can be found on Anthony Curtis gambling site (along with other tax day offers) here: http://vegasseven.com/2016/04/13/tax-day-deals/

It can be found here at CasinoCityTimes; http://www.casinocitytimes.com/news/article/plaza-hotel-and-casino-to-pay-your-taxes-on-april-18-217082

It can be found here at Gaming Today: http://www.gamingtoday.com/casino_games/video_casino/article/59670-Plaza_hits_jackpot_with_tax_savings#.VxGUU4-cEjY

And it can be found on the casinos own website prominently under, you guessed it, April promotions.

Now a few AP's have complained that the only machines worth attacking there, amount to four. I guarantee you, with all of the above exposure, if you thought those four machines were going to magically be open, that no one, particularly AP's, reads any of the above site nor the nationally distributed gambling magazines, that you guys are sorely disillusioned.

In fact, it would have been nothing short of ridiculous for this AP move to be listed on Anthony Curtis site, and Steve Bouries site and all the others - and NOT be listed or discussed on WOV.

I didn't put it up to ruin anyones move (trust me that was accomplished by all the other press). I did it to benefit the audience of WOV which comes here to learn of gambling opportunities.

We all have our secret moves. This was not one of them.

Good luck (I truly mean that) on all those who make to the Plaza for this promotion.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
AxelWolf
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April 15th, 2016 at 7:23:21 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

There have been some people on here who have complained that I just ruined a great AP maneuver (they have sent me pm's in upset)

I would never give away an AP maneuver that was private and earned (for example those two guys who discovered the Poker double up bug).

The Plaza promotion however is neither a private nor an earned one (that is you didn't discover it through trial and error or your own diligence.) This offer was announced publicly through a press release from the casino, has been printed in gambling magazines across the country including ones being distributed in Atlantic City on the opposite coast.

Furthermore, it can be found announced on Steve Bouries site, American Casino Guide here: http://forum.americancasinoguide.com/casino-promotions/10887-plaza-hotel-casino-las-vegas-will-pay-your-jackpot-taxes-april-18-a-print.html

It can be found on Anthony Curtis gambling site (along with other tax day offers) here: http://vegasseven.com/2016/04/13/tax-day-deals/

It can be found here at CasinoCityTimes; http://www.casinocitytimes.com/news/article/plaza-hotel-and-casino-to-pay-your-taxes-on-april-18-217082

It can be found here at Gaming Today: http://www.gamingtoday.com/casino_games/video_casino/article/59670-Plaza_hits_jackpot_with_tax_savings#.VxGUU4-cEjY

And it can be found on the casinos own website prominently under, you guessed it, April promotions.

Now a few AP's have complained that the only machines worth attacking there, amount to four. I guarantee you, with all of the above exposure, if you thought those four machines were going to magically be open, that no one, particularly AP's, reads any of the above site nor the nationally distributed gambling magazines, that you guys are sorely disillusioned.

In fact, it would have been nothing short of ridiculous for this AP move to be listed on Anthony Curtis site, and Steve Bouries site and all the others - and NOT be listed or discussed on WOV.

I didn't put it up to ruin anyones move (trust me that was accomplished by all the other press). I did it to benefit the audience of WOV which comes here to learn of gambling opportunities.

We all have our secret moves. This was not one of them.

Good luck (I truly mean that) on all those who make to the Plaza for this promotion.

Apperantly not all AP'so knew about it. Mike didn't post about it.

We're you asked if you would remove it?

At that point did you complain it got flagged off?

Any reason why you wouldn't be respectful to other AP's and just let it go?


I know a few known AP's and darksiders that didn't know about it but now do. There were other good reasons not to post it here specifically.

By posting it here people start talking about all the different detailed ways to attack it and this site attracts more casino employees and narks.

Basically the casino gets an entire math lesson and road map to the play and what to look for if you are the casino.

Why keep spreading it. All them guys make money from their websites so they actually have a reason to post it... do you?
Last edited by: AxelWolf on Apr 15, 2016
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
GWAE
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April 15th, 2016 at 7:34:07 PM permalink
I notice the promo says eligible machines. Who's to say they don't go making anything over .50 ineligible
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
RS
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April 15th, 2016 at 7:39:50 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

There have been some people on here who have complained that I just ruined a great AP maneuver (they have sent me pm's in upset)

I would never give away an AP maneuver that was private and earned (for example those two guys who discovered the Poker double up bug).

The Plaza promotion however is neither a private nor an earned one (that is you didn't discover it through trial and error or your own diligence.) This offer was announced publicly through a press release from the casino, has been printed in gambling magazines across the country including ones being distributed in Atlantic City on the opposite coast.

Furthermore, it can be found announced on Steve Bouries site, American Casino Guide here: http://forum.americancasinoguide.com/casino-promotions/10887-plaza-hotel-casino-las-vegas-will-pay-your-jackpot-taxes-april-18-a-print.html

It can be found on Anthony Curtis gambling site (along with other tax day offers) here: http://vegasseven.com/2016/04/13/tax-day-deals/

It can be found here at CasinoCityTimes; http://www.casinocitytimes.com/news/article/plaza-hotel-and-casino-to-pay-your-taxes-on-april-18-217082

It can be found here at Gaming Today: http://www.gamingtoday.com/casino_games/video_casino/article/59670-Plaza_hits_jackpot_with_tax_savings#.VxGUU4-cEjY

And it can be found on the casinos own website prominently under, you guessed it, April promotions.

Now a few AP's have complained that the only machines worth attacking there, amount to four. I guarantee you, with all of the above exposure, if you thought those four machines were going to magically be open, that no one, particularly AP's, reads any of the above site nor the nationally distributed gambling magazines, that you guys are sorely disillusioned.

In fact, it would have been nothing short of ridiculous for this AP move to be listed on Anthony Curtis site, and Steve Bouries site and all the others - and NOT be listed or discussed on WOV.

I didn't put it up to ruin anyones move (trust me that was accomplished by all the other press). I did it to benefit the audience of WOV which comes here to learn of gambling opportunities.

We all have our secret moves. This was not one of them.

Good luck (I truly mean that) on all those who make to the Plaza for this promotion.



So how are the people on WOV gonna benefit from hearing about this? There's only a few select machines worth while....you think 20-50 or however many people will get a slice of the action? People don't need to be spoon-fed information if they're too damn lazy to do their own research. Posting about this benefits NO ONE, except for the few that actually get time on those machines....and chances are, the people who get time on those machines already knew about it.

So -- this benefits no one (except the casino).
Ibeatyouraces
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April 15th, 2016 at 7:41:02 PM permalink
Quote: GWAE

I notice the promo says eligible machines. Who's to say they don't go making anything over .50 ineligible


"Eligible jackpots" not machines.

Nice birthday month promo too. 3 times your age in free play.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
darkoz
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April 15th, 2016 at 7:55:55 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Apperantly not all AP'so knew about it. Mike didn't post about it.

We're you asked if you would remove it?

At that point did you complain it got flagged off?

Any reason why you wouldn't be respectful to other AP's and just let it go?


I know a few known AP's and darksiders that didn't know about it but now do. There were other good reasons not to post it here specifically.

By posting it here people start talking about all the different detailed ways to attack it and this site attracts more casino employees and narks.

Basically the casino gets an entire math lesson and road map to the play and what to look for if you are the casino.

Why keep spreading it. All them guys make money from their websites so they actually have a reason to post it... do you?



Its funny because you just answered the point of why to spread the (nationally distributed) info. People like Mike did not hear about it.

Your anger comes only from the fact that you knew about it previously. Had you not known about it, like Mike, then you would be thanking me for pointing you to a valuable promotion that you had missed all the announcements on.

In the end, your views are not supported by the management here at WOV. This is and has always been a website dedicated to gambling odds, strategy and AP opportunities. Mike still sees it that way! I see it that way.

Mission, has stated numerous times, he knows plays which he is privy to but committed to not outing. I, too, am in this position. But not mentioning a play that is directly advertised by the casino, the newspapers and other gambling sites is not something that the mods, the Wizard or myself can make any sense out of.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
AxelWolf
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April 15th, 2016 at 7:56:59 PM permalink
Quote: RogerKint

This play is over my head but I'm willing to hold seats in exchange for Louie Anderson tickets.

Tickets to his private room perhaps because I'm thinking he isn't at plaza now?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AxelWolf
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:03:05 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

Its funny because you just answered the point of why to spread the (nationally distributed) info. People like Mike did not hear about it.

Your anger comes only from the fact that you knew about it previously. Had you not known about it, like Mike, then you would be thanking me for pointing you to a valuable promotion that you had missed all the announcements on.

In the end, your views are not supported by the management here at WOV. This is and has always been a website dedicated to gambling odds, strategy and AP opportunities. Mike still sees it that way! I see it that way.

Mission, has stated numerous times, he knows plays which he is privy to but committed to not outing. I, too, am in this position. But not mentioning a play that is directly advertised by the casino, the newspapers and other gambling sites is not something that the mods, the Wizard or myself can make any sense out of.

you didn't answer my real question. Did you complain your post got flagged down even after a few AP's asked you not to post it? Could you have perhaps asked them more as to why they didn't think it was a good Idea beyond the obvious, or did you run and complain to Mike?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:21:48 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

I didn't mean any disrespect to the site or Mike by flagging it was not out of greed or selfishness it was out of trying preserving something.



Thank you for your confession. Normally I think seven days would be appropriate for inappropriately flagging a post with useful and truthful information. However, since you confessed, I'll make it only three.

I'm working on trying to determine who else may have flagged it. Confessions are still being accepted and in return will receive lighter sentences.

To address the topic at hand, I concur 100% with darkoz. This was not some obscure opportunity but one the casino is trying to draw as much attention to as possible. With any lucrative promotion, drawing attention to it always can do no benefit to those who already knew about it, and those people always complain loudly. However, it can do no harm to those who didn't.

My general philosophy is that truthful information is a good thing. If somebody wants to share a play here, then he is welcome to. As far as I know, the three big controversial threads were all about plays that were no big secret anyway (Mohegan Sun triple down, Revel 100% loss rebate, and this). Even for those who don't play them, learning about strategies about how to play them can be educational. It all boils down to my philosophy that if there were unfettered access to truthful information, then the world would be a better place.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
TwoFeathersATL
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:39:46 PM permalink
No joke.
I will now be hesitant to flag any post.
I do not understand the rules as well as I thought I did yesterday.
BTW, that is not a confession.
Been a week or more since I flagged anything.
Youuuuuu MIGHT be a 'rascal' if.......(nevermind ;-)...2F
RS
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:39:58 PM permalink
Maybe some people thought "flag as inappropriate" means something that they think is inappropriate and shouldn't be posted on the forum -- a matter of opinion, whether something is appropriate or not.
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:41:59 PM permalink
I just got word from somebody I was going to play this with that all the $5 games are gone. The best one for this promotion is $2 9-6 Double Double Bonus. I show that has a return of 101.70%.

Hand Pays Combinations Probability Return
Royal flush 1024 46,925,024 0.000028 0.028927
Straight flush 50 184,157,518 0.000111 0.005543
Four aces + 2-4 512 102,704,558 0.000062 0.031657
Four 2-4 + A-4 204.8 237,941,055 0.000143 0.029336
Four aces + 5-K 204.8 289,567,285 0.000174 0.035701
Four 2-4 + 5-K 80 638,537,018 0.000384 0.030752
Four 5-K 50 2,696,447,999 0.001623 0.081164
Full house 9 18,006,710,343 0.010840 0.097562
Flush 6 18,635,694,348 0.011219 0.067313
Straight 4 21,145,118,110 0.012730 0.050918
3 of a kind 3 124,693,726,702 0.075067 0.225201
Two pair 1 204,075,123,732 0.122855 0.122855
Jacks or better 1 348,909,575,262 0.210047 0.210047
Nothing 0 921,440,314,146 0.554716 0.000000
Total 1,661,102,543,100 1.000000 1.016977
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 8:47:08 PM permalink
Quote: RS

Maybe some people thought "flag as inappropriate" means something that they think is inappropriate and shouldn't be posted on the forum -- a matter of opinion, whether something is appropriate or not.



I have a different opinion. Would you like a team of members following you around and flagging all of your posts because it was their personal opinion that all of your posts were inappropriate.

The fact of the matter is that 99% of the reason for the flag feature is to bust spam.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
RS
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April 15th, 2016 at 9:09:23 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I have a different opinion. Would you like a team of members following you around and flagging all of your posts because it was their personal opinion that all of your posts were inappropriate.

The fact of the matter is that 99% of the reason for the flag feature is to bust spam.



No group is going around following someone flagging all of their posts. It appears this isn't some on-going thing....happened once to a post which you admit is controversial. If Axel et al thought it was inappropriate.....maybe there's a chance it actually IS inappropriate.


How does the benefit outweigh the negative, here? Bunch of people learn about a play that they never knew about and likely wouldn't have ever played (if they would have played it, they would have known about it).
teddys
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April 15th, 2016 at 9:16:40 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I just got word from somebody I was going to play this with that all the $5 games are gone.

I am just about 0% shocked.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
Wizardofnothing
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April 15th, 2016 at 9:43:01 PM permalink
The d got killed on it last yearninthink and ended it or maybe it was golden gate... I thought flagging was based on opinion, I think it should be more of a warning then suspension and maybe an explanation of what you intend flagging to be use for, because on other site you can flag for a variety of things .
No longer hiring, donít ask because I wonít hire you either
Wizard
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April 15th, 2016 at 10:05:24 PM permalink
The results of the flagging investigation are in. Those who flagged the darkoz post were RS, AxelWolf, djatc, and Wizardofnothing. Here is what I'm going to do:

RS, djatc, Wizardofnothing: Seven-day suspension.
AxelWolf: As already stated, three-day suspension. The leniency is in return for the confession.

Edit I earlier incorrectly accused djatc for making a duplicate account to complain and gave him 14 days. In the heat of battle, I incorrectly confused him with someone else who did do this. For that, I have lowered his suspension back to seven days and I issue a public apology for the accusation and owe him 50 push-ups or one beer -- his choice.
Last edited by: Wizard on Apr 15, 2016
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
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