Discussion II about the Suspension List
WRONG!!Quote: SOOPOOZK should have been nuked. Bob was suspended for an alleged personal insult, I would say I could find 1000 on this site worse that resulted in no suspension. Bob and I go back and forth quite a bit, sometimes on the forum and sometimes via pm, and I might find him extremely irritating (he is good at that!) but NEVER insulting. I STRONGLY disagree with his suspension. And if I was the Wizard, I would use the nuclear option on ZK. Sort of like Micky Crimm, he has many interesting ideas, but just cannot control himself enough to participate on an adult forum that has rules of decorum.
Lock her up.Quote: AxelWolfWRONG!!
For what(other than martingale)?Quote: GWAEHe should have been nuked long ago
Last person was the Hillary supporter before the election, whatever his name was. He deserved it, was 1000% a troll, dishonest and cheated in all discussions.
Quote: AxelWolfFor what(other than martingale)?
If I’m reading it correctly he is accusing someone from the meeting of selling him out to DG. And I am assuming that someone is a member here. While he shouldn’t have named someone without proof, or if he has it, he should dealt with it in private. It makes the forum look like it has backstabbers out to hurt other members, similar to the other recent situation.
There cannot be a rule for everything but I see at some point being a member of a forum is potentially bad for a person. It appears multiple people have met and tried to help ZK. Maybe that is the best path for him, if he wants to vent or even discuss issues, contact someone that he has their information.
And while he hasn’t made any specific threads, there has been plenty of “They are going to pay” and such that it has to make one wonder. As a business owner you always have to be thinking about liability and bad publicity. I would bet everyone has had concerns about his state of mind at times, it’s that obvious. The blowing off steam excuse doesn’t fly all the time.
As for a reason to justify it, I’m not going to start naming names that don’t need brought up, but I did put up a link up earlier to nuke without a specific rule.
The most important thing to me is the guys wellbeing, believe it or not. I hope I am totally wrong on this guy.
Quote: BozIf I’m reading it correctly he is accusing someone from the meeting of selling him out to DG. And I am assuming that someone is a member here. While he shouldn’t have named someone without proof, or if he has it, he should dealt with it in private. It makes the forum look like it has backstabbers out to hurt other members, similar to the other recent situation.
Only one if many unfounded, bizarre accusations in the last 6 months.
Quote: BozAnd while he hasn’t made any specific threads, there has been plenty of “They are going to pay” and such that it has to make one wonder. As a business owner you always have to be thinking about liability and bad publicity. I would bet everyone has had concerns about his state of mind at times, it’s that obvious. The blowing off steam excuse doesn’t fly all the time.
I'd call that fairly specific. The threats were to Casinos. The only thing missing is a hotel name. If I was the owner of this site, I'd probably already given the authorities at least a heads up.
Quote: BozThe most important thing to me is the guys wellbeing, believe it or not. I hope I am totally wrong on this guy.
You're not. I see this kind of thing all the time. I was correct on the previous similar situation here well before the tires blew off.
ZCore13
Quote: SOOPOOZK should have been nuked. Bob was suspended for an alleged personal insult, I would say I could find 1000 on this site worse that resulted in no suspension. Bob and I go back and forth quite a bit, sometimes on the forum and sometimes via pm, and I might find him extremely irritating (he is good at that!) but NEVER insulting. I STRONGLY disagree with his suspension. And if I was the Wizard, I would use the nuclear option on ZK. Sort of like Micky Crimm, he has many interesting ideas, but just cannot control himself enough to participate on an adult forum that has rules of decorum.
EvenBob should be given the nuclear option:
“Nuclear option: Finally, if the site administrators feel that a member is so disruptive to the site, even while abiding by the rules above, a "nuclear option" may be invoked to permanently ban the offender. This will be used sparingly for only the worst of trolls. (Added 2/20/11)”
If someone is well known to stir s*** up, be irritating, get people suspended while keeping himself out of it....I’d say that fits the description above rather well.
nQuote: RSEvenBob should be given the nuclear option:
“Nuclear option: Finally, if the site administrators feel that a member is so disruptive to the site, even while abiding by the rules above, a "nuclear option" may be invoked to permanently ban the offender. This will be used sparingly for only the worst of trolls. (Added 2/20/11)”
That's why you are not an administrator obviously...... The administrators must not agree with you as they have analyzed over 20,000 posts and not come to the conclusion you have. You of course now will likely be suspended, as you have called Bob not just a regular troll, but 'the worst of trolls".
Quote: MrVMutual insults, per BBB.
See: "Shout out to everyone" thread .
I commented in that thread that no way EvenBob should have been suspended -- he analogized someone's behavior to that of a child - he did not call that person a child -- and, as I noted, Mission146, long ago, detailed that the use of analogies is NOT an insult -- I guess the rules have changed???
Then I saw that his name is off the "top contributors" list.
That probably irks him. lol
Quote: SOOPOOnQuote: RSEvenBob should be given the nuclear option:
“Nuclear option: Finally, if the site administrators feel that a member is so disruptive to the site, even while abiding by the rules above, a "nuclear option" may be invoked to permanently ban the offender. This will be used sparingly for only the worst of trolls. (Added 2/20/11)”
That's why you are not an administrator obviously...... The administrators must not agree with you as they have analyzed over 20,000 posts and not come to the conclusion you have. You of course now will likely be suspended, as you have called Bob not just a regular troll, but 'the worst of trolls".
That’s why there are no amendments to the constitution, laws never get changed, rules are the same from day 1, and gay marriage doesn’t exist. Women can’t vote and men still can’t get raped, either!
Quote: aceofspadesQuote: MrVMutual insults, per BBB.
See: "Shout out to everyone" thread .
I commented in that thread that no way EvenBob should have been suspended -- he analogized someone's behavior to that of a child - he did not call that person a child -- and, as I noted, Mission146, long ago, detailed that the use of analogies is NOT an insult -- I guess the rules have changed???
How is asking if hes old enough to enter casinos not calling him a child?
Quote: darkozQuote: aceofspadesQuote: MrVMutual insults, per BBB.
See: "Shout out to everyone" thread .
I commented in that thread that no way EvenBob should have been suspended -- he analogized someone's behavior to that of a child - he did not call that person a child -- and, as I noted, Mission146, long ago, detailed that the use of analogies is NOT an insult -- I guess the rules have changed???
How is asking if hes old enough to enter casinos not calling him a child?
My fiancee was asked for ID last week in the DR as we were about to enter a casino. It was one of the highlights of the trip for her....... She did not consider it an insult!
Quote: SOOPOOnQuote: RSEvenBob should be given the nuclear option:
“Nuclear option: Finally, if the site administrators feel that a member is so disruptive to the site, even while abiding by the rules above, a "nuclear option" may be invoked to permanently ban the offender. This will be used sparingly for only the worst of trolls. (Added 2/20/11)”
That's why you are not an administrator obviously...... The administrators must not agree with you as they have analyzed over 20,000 posts and not come to the conclusion you have. You of course now will likely be suspended, as you have called Bob not just a regular troll, but 'the worst of trolls".
FREE RS!
I'm taking a side just in case.
Quote: darkozQuote: aceofspadesQuote: MrVMutual insults, per BBB.
See: "Shout out to everyone" thread .
I commented in that thread that no way EvenBob should have been suspended -- he analogized someone's behavior to that of a child - he did not call that person a child -- and, as I noted, Mission146, long ago, detailed that the use of analogies is NOT an insult -- I guess the rules have changed???
How is asking if hes old enough to enter casinos not calling him a child?
I do not consider 20 year olds to be children. DAMN is immature an insult. Just asking OK That's all
Quote: edwardjsmith
I do not consider 20 year olds to be children. DAMN is immature an insult. Just asking OK That's all
I have no idea except to say it might depend on which way you lean. It has before.
#FreeEvenBob
Quote: edwardjsmithQuote: darkozQuote: aceofspadesQuote: MrVMutual insults, per BBB.
See: "Shout out to everyone" thread .
I commented in that thread that no way EvenBob should have been suspended -- he analogized someone's behavior to that of a child - he did not call that person a child -- and, as I noted, Mission146, long ago, detailed that the use of analogies is NOT an insult -- I guess the rules have changed???
How is asking if hes old enough to enter casinos not calling him a child?
I do not consider 20 year olds to be children. DAMN is immature an insult. Just asking OK That's all
I have been called immature plenty of times
I certainly dont take it as a compliment. Quite the opposite
So yeah calling someone immature is kinda insulting
Quote: darkozQuote: edwardjsmithQuote: darkozQuote: aceofspadesQuote: MrVMutual insults, per BBB.
See: "Shout out to everyone" thread .
I commented in that thread that no way EvenBob should have been suspended -- he analogized someone's behavior to that of a child - he did not call that person a child -- and, as I noted, Mission146, long ago, detailed that the use of analogies is NOT an insult -- I guess the rules have changed???
How is asking if hes old enough to enter casinos not calling him a child?
I do not consider 20 year olds to be children. DAMN is immature an insult. Just asking OK That's all
I have been called immature plenty of times
I certainly dont take it as a compliment. Quite the opposite
So yeah calling someone immature is kinda insulting
I always considered an insult to be a deliberately discourteous or rude remark. That seemed to be missing, at least based on the EB comments I have seen since becoming a member here.
Quote: AZDuffmanI have no idea except to say it might depend on which way you lean. It has before.
#FreeEvenBob
Or perhaps on whether complete and accurate analysis is done
Asking if he old enough to enter a casino could mean insinuating hes only 20 and i know you guys want to try that Angle
But the COMPLETE post was:
"You sound like a kid. Are you even old enough to enter a casino?"
Once again showing how people try to omit stuff to twist the truth
If someone asks if you are a kid then asks if you are old enough to enter a casino they are clearly implying you are a kid and not a 20 year old
the kid on the pro golf tour
Lots of those KIDS are old enough to enter a casino. I would expand but, well, you know just got here and seems to be a minefield with people deciding what was implied or inferred and which definition they attach to your words.
It's not the job of the few Mods we have to review the member's posts. I think your Idea might have some merit when dealing with new members in order to cut down on spam or sneaky sockpuppets trying to get in a quick derogatory post. Most people know whats ok to say and whats not ok.Quote: NathanWhy not put Zenking on post and thread moderation when he comes back? :) You know how many websites have "Thread/post awaiting moderation?" Why not do this for Zenking? Only allow the not so harmless threads and posts from him and discard the kind of creepy ones? For example, Zenking writes,"18 Pine Street Casino jipped me out of my money. I did 100 hands in a row in Poker and NONE of them won! 18 Pine Street is a greedy casino who cheated me out of my money! I swear they are out to get me! I hope they go out of b business for cheating me out of my money!" Admin(s) can say,"Okay,Zenking is coming off as a paranoid loon, but it's not TOO BAD, so I'll approve it." Now, if Zenking starts a thread like,"All of you guys on WOV are out to get me, I swear you all have hidden agendas meant to take me down!" Admin can say,"Zenking seems really creepy with this thread,I will not approve thread, and discard it.
I just don't think ZK's post warrants a nuke, however, I have no problem with him being suspended for it.
Quote: NathanWhy not put Zenking on post and thread moderation when he comes back? :) You know how many websites have "Thread/post awaiting moderation?" Why not do this for Zenking? Only allow the not so harmless threads and posts from him and discard the kind of creepy ones? For example, Zenking writes,"18 Pine Street Casino jipped me out of my money. I did 100 hands in a row in Poker and NONE of them won! 18 Pine Street is a greedy casino who cheated me out of my money! I swear they are out to get me! I hope they go out of b business for cheating me out of my money!" Admin(s) can say,"Okay,Zenking is coming off as a paranoid loon, but it's not TOO BAD, so I'll approve it." Now, if Zenking starts a thread like,"All of you guys on WOV are out to get me, I swear you all have hidden agendas meant to take me down!" Admin can say,"Zenking seems really creepy with this thread,I will not approve thread, and discard it.
Looks like I was wrong after all. If those are actual posts by Zenking, how could EB infer he was immature ? SHAME ON EB
Quote: edwardjsmithLooks like I was wrong after all. If those are actual posts by Zenking, how could EB infer he was immature ? SHAME ON EB
You haven't read his posts. Boy are you in for a treat. Recommended reading on how not to act in a casino and on a forum.
ZCore13
Quote: edwardjsmithWebster " often used as a generalized reference to one especially younger or less experienced
the kid on the pro golf tour
Lots of those KIDS are old enough to enter a casino. I would expand but, well, you know just got here and seems to be a minefield with people deciding what was implied or inferred and which definition they attach to your words.
Because as you certainly know words have meanings based on their usage. Rarely do they live in a vacuum
"Having won another academy award for best actress Faye Dunaway is an amazing woman"
"Of course she messed up the job, shes a woman what did you expect"
Please tell me you dont think the latter example is not an insult because since when did the word woman become an insult
Quote: edwardjsmithSeems with the left that the word MAN is an insult!
Oh lordy!
Quote: edwardjsmithSeems with the left that the word MAN is an insult!
Anything manly is to lefties.
Quote: GlenGIm left handed..i find the phrase "lefties" offensive to my kind. lol
Quote: Zcore13You haven't read his posts. Boy are you in for a treat. Recommended reading on how not to act in a casino and on a forum.
ZCore13
Or in real life
Quote: edwardjsmithLooks like I was wrong after all. If those are actual posts by Zenking, how could EB infer he was immature ? SHAME ON EB
TBH, my examples were not actual Zenking threads\posts but they are eerily similar. Like really eerily similar, like 1 or two steps away from being an actual Zenking thread/post. ;)
Quote: NathanTBH, my examples were not actual Zenking threads\posts but they are eerily similar. Like really eerily similar, like 1 or two steps away from being an actual Zenking thread/post. ;)
Then, if you have a point to make about ZenKing, why don't you quote him instead of putting words into his mouth?
Quote: GWAEI am jealous. Your life must be so easy to spend so much time worrying about stupid crap like suspensions. I can send you some of my problems if you would like to have real world issues.
Take it easy. The entire forum lights up in controversy with almost every suspension. You can see the tizzy everyone is in over a EB's three-day suspension. Nathan is hardly the only one to care about who gets suspended and for what.
Quote: NathanWhy not put Zenking on post and thread moderation when he comes back? :)
So in addition to all the other work we do, the moderators should pre-approve posts now? Nope. People here are expected to behave like adults and not need pre-approval for everything they say.
Quote: beachbumbabsThen, if you have a point to make about ZenKing, why don't you quote him instead of putting words into his mouth?
I was saying hypothetical things he might say in the future that could be approved or disapproved my you guys. :)
Quote: WizardSo in addition to all the other work we do, the moderators should pre-approve posts now? Nope. People here are expected to behave like adults and not need pre-approval for everything they say.
It was just an innocent suggestion. :)
Quote: WizardSo in addition to all the other work we do, the moderators should pre-approve posts now? Nope. People here are expected to behave like adults and not need pre-approval for everything they say.
Maybe problematic posters could forward you a synopsis of what they would like to say and you can sugarcoat it for them.
Ibeatyouraces
Both are showing as restricted. Seems their suspensions should have expired by now.
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I never noticed this before, but EB went red and disappeared from the "Top Contributors" list.
Quote: billryanMaybe problematic posters could forward you a synopsis of what they would like to say and you can sugarcoat it for them.
Isn’t that like what was done with Micky Crimm?
It's not nearly robust enough.
If you block someone not only should they disappear, but you won't be able to change your mind and see their posts for 3 months*. And if someone quotes them, that should be a blank. And there should be no spoiler boxes.
Let's face it, how are you going to be bothered by someone when you won't even see their posts for months? It does us all a favor.
*I just picked 3 months. Arbitrary, but pretty significant time.
Personally, I would prefer a different system altogether, but no one seems to like that idea.
Quote: rxwineIn my opinion, one of the problems is the "block" feature.
It's not nearly robust enough.
If you block someone not only should they disappear, but you won't be able to change your mind and see their posts for 3 months*. And if someone quotes them, that should be a blank. And there should be no spoiler boxes.
Let's face it, how are you going to be bothered by someone when you won't even see their posts for months? It does us all a favor.
*I just picked 3 months. Arbitrary, but pretty significant time.
Personally, I would prefer a different system altogether, but no one seems to like that idea.
I remember on the old IMDB message boards someone saying, something like, "When I have someone on my ignore list, I see "This post is hidden because poster is in your ignore list." Doesn't this defeat the purpose? I shouldn't be able to see ANYTHING if the poster is in my IGNORE list."
Quote: GlenGI'll make some threads pretty confusing if you cant see someone's post
This is the exact reason a certain someone doesn’t get blocked by me. The threads would get quite confusing when I try and read them and every second post is gone. Even if what is posted is nonsense it still is a part of the puzzle (even if it’s the annoying part of the puzzle).
I appreciate and respect them for being so lenient and fair! :D
Quote: billryanMaybe problematic posters could forward you a synopsis of what they would like to say and you can sugarcoat it for them.
This is not kindergarten. Full grown adults should know how to control what they say. Plenty of times, I've written out a lengthy post that after reflection may have had too much venom in it, so I never clicked "post." A simple test would be to put yourself in the shoes of the one you're posting about and ask if you would feel insulted.
Quote: NathanWOV Admins are some of the most lenient Admins on forum websites.
Thank you!
