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Pacman
Pacman
Joined: Dec 7, 2011
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May 4th, 2012 at 7:03:27 PM permalink
Shuffle Master in the next 4-6 weeks will conduct another--albeit different--focus group for new table games.

Here are the specifics:

1. All Joes, no Pros. No SHFL games will be on display. All other developers are welcome, whether they are complete rookies or seasoned veterans.
2. Six games will be displayed.
3. Evaluators will play each game for 20 minutes.
4. Inventors must present their own games.
5. Same scoring as last time.
6. Date TBD, but likely in the second week of June.
7. If anyone needs "emergency math" to get his game ready, SHFL will do it.

If interested, please send me an e-mail at rsnow@shufflemaster.com.

This is not first-come, first-served. I will accept applications until 11:59 p.m. May 8 and then draw six names.


Roger
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
Joined: Apr 28, 2010
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May 4th, 2012 at 8:04:09 PM permalink
This is excellent.

All external entries,
longer time period for each game,
fewer games.

I think it was just a matter of getting it right, learning from where it could have been better.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
Joined: Mar 8, 2011
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May 4th, 2012 at 8:21:58 PM permalink
Damn.,stole my thunder. I was gonna post on Sunday that I would lay 8 to 1 the next focus group will allow at least 15 minutes.
And yes, I would have taken Roger's action too. LOL
THESWEENEY
THESWEENEY
Joined: Feb 28, 2011
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May 5th, 2012 at 1:36:25 AM permalink
One can only hope the host is afforded a little more courtesy this time round.
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
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May 5th, 2012 at 1:42:34 AM permalink
Quote: THESWEENEY

One can only hope the host is afforded a little more courtesy this time round.



I second that.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
Joined: Apr 28, 2010
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May 5th, 2012 at 3:16:03 AM permalink
Quote: TheSweeny

One can only hope the host is afforded a little more courtesy this time round.


Quote: Wizard

I second that.



The host is immensely respected, and always was, by those who know what he has accomplished. I think he is the Eric Clapton of the table game design business, and I carry just a little weight here. There is no question of that. He's also a very blunt and "cut through the bullshit" type of man not here to waste time, but is here on business. Still he, as we all, may get some things less than 100% the first time around on a production. This was not a secret laboratory event, it was a sponsored expo of new games evaluation, and there were mishaps, that's all.

In this light, One can argue that he would be given a very poor service from us if we were to indeed offer up - and to condone - any false patronage, when there were issues of event handling, procedure improvement, implementation and appearance problems, and what have you. These are issues that could and should be fearlessly addressed, without fear of anger from Roger.

Firstly, Roger himself would be the very first one to say, "Your game is way less than optimal, my friend - and here are its problems! Please address it and fix it if you wish to go forward with this type of thing. I'm here on business, and I am not here to patronize you." And he doesn't blow smoke up people's nostrils. And neither were we in presenting our concerns. He was plain speaking, and he came off to some as brusk to some; perhaps he is at times brusk and direct. Many of us present concerns, and as a result any appreciation, consideration or gratitude that is present (or certainly should be present in us for him), is not seen - whether it is masked or even absent. Keep in mind that Roger did this event to procure new games for the benefit of Shufflemaster, as well as for our benefit, and for us to get our games up to snuff by Shufflemaster's standards, as THEY will be distributing, and they know what's best.

I didn't mind having a negative score of HKP (Hong Kong Poker) - not at all. I wanted to know what exactly needed to be fixed if there WERE any problem. If I had received a lovely score and some applause when these things were secondary or irrelevant to game design problem solving, then it would be a bad thing. I want to know is my game good-to-go, and IF NOT - why!

This whole thing was primarily as issue of "beside manners and hurt feelings" in some cases, but I will also say that NO game designer present was a wide-eyed dreamer or a Prima Donna in any way, shape or form - and if he were, it is certainly gone now. No one expecting to really get a table game out should be a wuss or a p*ssy when presented with criticism, an assessment, or correction. But some travelled 2,000 miles after mortgaging the house to pay for patents and math, complete with arguments with the wife over everything along the way to get as far as they did, so it had to look 100% fair and square. Granted, it is very much a "not my problem" kind of thing if you choose to step into this brutally competitive ring, so it's for all the more reason that the deck must not only BE fair and not stacked (which it absolutely was by intention), and it has to LOOK fair and LOOK not stacked. If any biasing factors entered in, it was completey inadvertant, and part of a learning process even for the company with tremendous experience.

It is hard as hell - and a REALLY long road - to get a game out from a cocktail napkin sketch to the casino floor. Everybody makes sacrifies. Every game designer needs to know it is not for the faint-hearted or the dreamer, and usually, more than often, ends in failure. But, you shouldn't have missed it for the world, and with NO regrets for trying and as getting as far as you did. Without such projects, many would have been vegetating in front of a late-night HBO movie eating Dorito's if not better distracted with this personal game design mission, so such an endeavor if not successful, it is still successful in many ways. My wife used to think I was f*cking nuts. Now she knows better and goes shopping. And it took YEARS!

And an accurate assesment of our games is vital to all those who enter this fray. We need to hear what sucks, what stinks, or if we need to abandon game 'x' to start on game 'y' it is that bad. Or if we need a minor fix-up: to remove a redundant side bet, a daffy paytable, and awkward house edge mechanism, or what have you to fix it. Everyone present has a realistic shot as a game designer.

We also needed to see how our games stack up in an initial review on a fair field; Clarity, honesty, and Completeness in this area is just critical. If the 'evaulation event' looks suspect, or has accidental or inadvertant errors in it, or a lack of feedback, (espeially if conducted and organized in good faith), then the game designers who are trying to help a big distributor (as much as vice-versa) may consider the process wasteful as best, and corrupt, at worst, which it was not as all, as it was just natural beta-test errors. Concerns expressed about the costs or fallout of such human mishaps and learning experiences in this event process are not "ingratitude," even if natural anger or angst occurred. Things go wrong, people get upset, we get past it and learn from it. While I felt what Roger did was beautiful, there were mistakes that were criticised. More about the event than on the games, so the second time around I assume the balance will change.

What Roger did was beautiful and in our behalf, not meaning to sound corny. And yes, he and Shufflemaster deserve gratitude, - but not calls for patronage. Just as Shufflemaster tells us, "fix the problems, so let's learn from it," it's the same here.

And Shufflemaster really did it to advance table gaming, not just or primarily to recieve gratitude, applause, from knuckleheads like us.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
1BB
1BB
Joined: Oct 10, 2011
  • Threads: 18
  • Posts: 5339
May 5th, 2012 at 4:29:01 AM permalink
Quote: Pacman

Shuffle Master in the next 4-6 weeks will conduct another--albeit different--focus group for new table games.

Here are the specifics:

1. All Joes, no Pros. No SHFL games will be on display. All other developers are welcome, whether they are complete rookies or seasoned veterans.
2. Six games will be displayed.
3. Evaluators will play each game for 20 minutes.
4. Inventors must present their own games.
5. Same scoring as last time.
6. Date TBD, but likely in the second week of June.
7. If anyone needs "emergency math" to get his game ready, SHFL will do it.

If interested, please send me an e-mail at rsnow@shufflemaster.com.

This is not first-come, first-served. I will accept applications until 11:59 p.m. May 8 and then draw six names.


Roger



Pick me, I'm on a forum. Pick me, I know someone on a forum. Pick me, I know someone who knows someone .......
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
Joined: Apr 28, 2010
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May 5th, 2012 at 5:03:10 AM permalink
There's nothing fixed, and there never was.
Pacman and Shufflemaster are just trying to work out a process of new game evaluation, and they just are correcting issues from a first try at it that caused PR problems. Jesus...

If the next expo of new games is composed of:
a) only independent games from independent game designers, and
b) no prominent or recognized gaming executives are pitching these games, and
c) ample time if alloted to review the games,
then I say - as a loud critic of the previous expo's faults - that the new expo is clean, (as was the first, actually), and that it is provably clean now.
1BB - Who the hell are you in gaming to say otherwise, really, and what do you know?
This next expo will now be so provably proper than even EvenBob won't criticize it.

The use of a gaming forum where table game design is a very prominent area is perhaps THE VERY BEST source of finding new game developers in good faith.



The fact that some novices also troll our forum is incidental, and you describe yourself here:
Quote: 1BB

Pick me, I'm on a forum. Pick me, I know someone on a forum. Pick me, I know someone who knows someone .......


1BB, You won't be picked.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
1BB
1BB
Joined: Oct 10, 2011
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May 5th, 2012 at 5:34:57 AM permalink
Sorry if my attempt at humor offended you oh great one. Feel free to make all the personal insults you like. We all know you won't get suspended. Where are the F-words and racist comments this time?

Very slick. I should have quoted you so everyone would see that you edited your post by replacing the word morons with novices.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
Paigowdan
Paigowdan
Joined: Apr 28, 2010
  • Threads: 115
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May 5th, 2012 at 7:08:30 AM permalink
Quote: 1BB

Sorry if my attempt at humor offended you oh great one. Feel free to make all the personal insults you like. We all know you won't get suspended. Where are the F-words and racist comments this time?
Very slick. I should have quoted you so everyone would see that you edited your post by replacing the word morons with novices.


Your humor didn't offend me, and I am not a great one. Never said I was a great one. You did.
If the Wizard didn't suspend a ignorant fool like you, then he wouldn't suspend a true contributor like me. This is obvious.
Again, who are you and what have you done. The period denotes a statement here.

I replaced the word "moron" with "novice," - to express underserved kindness to a mere novice like you.

And if a novice like you isn't suspended, then shoot, neither am I.

If the Wizard protects novices like you, then he protects novices like me.
This is especially so, as you contribute less knowledge of this industry.
You know nothing about this industry, you contributed nothing to this industry in your life, as either a game designer or a veteran casino dealer.

1BB has Zero experience, and Zero knowledge of the gaming industry, aside from taking shots a successful gaming industry veterans.
That's the real story about you 1BB, and it is apparent.

No f-words, no ad hominen attacks, you are eraseable, or at least ignorable, by pointing out the simple fact of your non-contributions.
1BB, you actually have no qualifications to speak of to be on this board.
Or in the gaming industry - except as a floorman, many of whom DO actually act like you - before they are terminated.
And calling you a novice is not an ad hominen attack; it is simply a factual statement. You are a novice at best.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.

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