Lion's Share
Quote: tringlomaneSavvy work. Looks like the only way you'll get timely data for awhile. :-\ But it's as valid as your own spins at least.
Honestly it's a pretty good deal, as he doesn't have to put out any cash to collect more data.
Although, if the final determination is that it's +EV, then one would want to be on the machine while collecting the data :)
Tourist/Local?
Male/Female?
Over/under 40?
Race?
How many children do they have?
Odds on someone hitting this first spin?
Will they know the capital of Canada?
Put one up and book the action, I'm going to parlay it, I already have my pics.Quote: djatcWe should put a line on what type of person will hit this thing.
Tourist/Local?
Male/Female?
Over/under 40?
Race?
How many children do they have?
Odds on someone hitting this first spin?
Will they know the capital of Canada?
Add
am or pm
What kind of car they drive
smoker non smoker
Drinker non drinker
married or single
Where they heard about the machine.
How many times they have been to vegas
occupation
Quote: djatcWe should put a line on what type of person will hit this thing.
Tourist/Local? Tourist -1,000
Male/Female? Female -400
Over/under 40? Over 40 -300
Race? White -800
How many children do they have? Who cares?
Odds on someone hitting this first spin? Yes +473
Will they know the capital of Canada? No -800
Quote: WizardTourist/Local? Tourist -1,000
Male/Female? Female -400
Over/under 40? Over 40 -300
Race? White -800
How many children do they have? Who cares?
Odds on someone hitting this first spin? Yes +473
Will they know the capital of Canada? No -800
If you analyze Mike's answers, it is pure Wizard!!! 1000, 400, 300, 800, 800 and................ 473!
Mike obviously used hunches to make most of the lines, then probably sat for an hour figuring out how many spins the average person makes, what the hit rate would be, etc.....
I would take local +1000. If it becomes truly positive EV, I sense Axel renting a chair there.......
$1
+800
Quote: SkittleCar1I say they will know the capital of Canada. The winner may even be Canadian. :-P
$1
+800
Canada has a capital?
Quote: geoffCanada has a capital?
It even has a hockey team.
The world Zamboni Racing Championships are held there every year.
The International Metric Time & Date line runs straight through it.
Quote: SkittleCar1It even has a hockey team.
The world Zamboni Racing Championships are held there every year.
The International Metric Time & Date line runs straight through it.
You forgot it is home to TIM HORTONS
Not on your life. (Anyone figure out what the hourly loss rate on this was until you hit it?)Quote: SOOPOOIf you analyze Mike's answers, it is pure Wizard!!! 1000, 400, 300, 800, 800 and................ 473!
Mike obviously used hunches to make most of the lines, then probably sat for an hour figuring out how many spins the average person makes, what the hit rate would be, etc.....
I would take local +1000. If it becomes truly positive EV, I sense Axel renting a chair there.......
This Lion Share is the exact AP I stay away from, unless I'm just taking a shot for a few hrs a day.
I dislike MGM, especially the parking, I park in a cheater spot at the at Tropicana and walk, I'm not telling where(no not disabled parking. They are always full ;).
LS has To much guess work( Mikes going to bankrupt someone, I smell a lawsuit ;) ) I just ran into a unknown situation a few months ago due to bad information, luckily it worked fairly neutral for me(I think I told you About it?).
The LS would be a nightmare with Taxes(a problem you would like to have, but as far as AP logic before you hit/play it, it does not make sense) Also when you hit this there would be to much publicity.
I cant imagine the casino would even let you lock something like that up 24/7, without getting complaints from the poppies who came to Vegas just to to play it. the casino would probably tossing everyone out. That's the +EV here. Have a all black or gay team. A teacher, a War Vet, a priest (black of course) and some Hero(sounds like the start of a dirty joke. ___ ___ __ all walk into a casino) all lock it up for a few days. Once the MGM tosses everyone out, sue them, they may settle due to the bad publicity it would cause.
Plays where all the +EV is all tied up on some incredible long shot sucks balls. They are nice when you hit them in the first 10% of the cycle. Not so much when you go 5 cycles. Anymore I'm really looking for a gift not an investment. 3% over a short cycles. Ill take 3% on a 1000 hand cycle over 4% on a 40k cycle any day of the week. Also I get board with video poker unless its something exciting. A single line slot machine after 60 min would put me to sleep.
Sometimes my biggest gamble is whether or not the casino is going to pay me or not.
You are welcome to put up your money and I will take a free roll ;), Since we keep the machine, we can use it in a new vintage Vegas old school casino that we will start after we hit it. Seriously I think that machine may have some value for the right person.
Quote: SkittleCar1It even has a hockey team.
The world Zamboni Racing Championships are held there every year.
The International Metric Time & Date line runs straight through it.
Give me a hint. Does it have a professional sports team ?
Quote: Wizard
How many children do they have? Who cares?
Based on many people telling me about their children and how they are honor students/valedictorian/mute hookers I would say this is pretty important.
Quote: SOOPOOIf you analyze Mike's answers, it is pure Wizard!!! 1000, 400, 300, 800, 800 and................ 473!
The 473 was the easiest line to set. From my Lion's Share page, the hit frequency is 0.1744137606. So a fair line on the YES would be 100*(1-0.1744137606)/0.1744137606 = 473.
Quote: djatcBased on many people telling me about their children and how they are honor students/valedictorian/mute hookers I would say this is pretty important.
I'm sure it is important to them but admit that when they are bragging about such things you're thinking "who cares?"
Quote: SkittleCar1I say they will know the capital of Canada. The winner may even be Canadian. :-P
$1
+800
The line on the NO was only +800 because Canadians make up a pretty good market share here in Vegas. If we knew the player wasn't Canadian the line would be about +4000.
Quote: Wizard
I'm sure it is important to them but admit that when they are bragging about such things you're thinking "who cares?"
touche!
Quote: AxelWolfSince we keep the machine, we can use it in a new vintage Vegas old school casino that we will start after we hit it. Seriously I think that machine may have some value for the right person.
Mount the machine on a mobile platform (battery and convertor underneath) and roll it around Las Vegas Blvd and let people put coins in it.
Pretty sure there are various legal problems with the first mini mobile casino operation.
Quote: WizardThe 473 was the easiest line to set. From my Lion's Share page, the hit frequency is 0.1744137606. So a fair line on the YES would be 100*(1-0.1744137606)/0.1744137606 = 473.
I think he meant, hit the jackpot on their first spin.
The real question here is, how long is the average session?
I have a feeling you could use it like a promotional machine to get people to sign up for things IE timeshare, Players cards, fun books, charge/tipps for pictures taken with it like the panhandlers do, Gambling supply store use it as a ploy to get customer emails and phone numbers for a free spin. I can think of many different ways it could be used and valuable. I can imagine once it hits there will be a ton of publicity, roomers ,story's surrounding it. A legend will be made.Quote: rxwineMount the machine on a mobile platform (battery and convertor underneath) and roll it around Las Vegas Blvd and let people put coins in it.
Pretty sure there are various legal problems with the first mini mobile casino operation.
If I was the MGM I would try to get some celebrities to play it, And use it better for marketing, offer special free play for it. I have had 3 family members ask me about the machine and say they want to try it when they come to Vegas.
Quote: thecesspitJust waiting for your Rodney Dangerfield joke now, and we'll be done.
I just got back in town. I asked the cab driver, where can I get some action? He took me to MY HOUSE!
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceI think he meant, hit the jackpot on their first spin.
The real question here is, how long is the average session?
Yeah, that's what I think he meant too. Hitting the jackpot on the first spin would be so movie cliche though.
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceI think he meant, hit the jackpot on their first spin.
The real question here is, how long is the average session?
That's what I thought he meant too, but I think the Wizards line is based on hitting any win on the first spin
If anything I bet it's a MGM employee, or if they aren't allowed to gamble on property then some employee from CET. Casino employees love to gamble and will take shots at it, maybe as an office pool of some sort.
Based on the proximity maybe a Hooters girl or a hooker who works at the Trop.
Quote: djatcO yeah I meant hit the jackpot on the first spin. Maybe extra odds for a first time gambler.
If anything I bet it's a MGM employee, or if they aren't allowed to gamble on property then some employee from CET. Casino employees love to gamble and will take shots at it, maybe as an office pool of some sort.
Based on the proximity maybe a Hooters girl or a hooker who works at the Trop.
I'd like to parlay that it will be a hooker who knows the capital of Canada.
I played for an hour or two, watched a few more hours than that. One fellow won the $10,000 while I was watching. He received all 3 lions, but not all on the payline.
While I was playing, however, the following happened to me:
As you can see, 60 credits were paid out due to the result of this spin. However, the payout guide clearly states that this would be the payout if 3 double bars were to come up. Obviously there is nothing on the third reel at all and so this should be a losing spin.
Like I said, I know nothing about the working of slot machines, but bear with me for a moment. If the machine thinks that a double bar is present where there is nothing on the third reel, then there can't be a lion in the spot where one is seen, because it would 'overlap' onto the spot where the double bar was. If there's only supposed to be one lion on that reel, perhaps this glitch is what has stopped the machine from hitting the progressive in the last 21 years.
Is this kind of glitch very common among slot machines? I had thought they were tightly regulated so that the display and payout guide is what is accurately paid. However, since I never play slots, for all I know this kind of thing happens all the time?
Quote: BoxcarsI played Lion's Share on my trip to MGM Grand last week. I found it fun hanging out with the people on line. It is the first time I've ever played a slot machine, though, and so I freely admit I know nothing about them.
I played for an hour or two, watched a few more hours than that. One fellow won the $10,000 while I was watching. He received all 3 lions, but not all on the payline.
While I was playing, however, the following happened to me:
http://imgur.com/msl1NPK.jpg
As you can see, 60 credits were paid out due to the result of this spin. However, the payout guide clearly states that this would be the payout if 3 double bars were to come up. Obviously there is nothing on the third reel at all and so this should be a losing spin.
Like I said, I know nothing about the working of slot machines, but bear with me for a moment. If the machine thinks that a double bar is present where there is nothing on the third reel, then there can't be a lion in the spot where one is seen, because it would 'overlap' onto the spot where the double bar was. If there's only supposed to be one lion on that reel, perhaps this glitch is what has stopped the machine from hitting the progressive in the last 21 years.
Is this kind of glitch very common among slot machines? I had thought they were tightly regulated so that the display and payout guide is what is accurately paid. However, since I never play slots, for all I know this kind of thing happens all the time?
OH SHI-
Quote: BoxcarsI played Lion's Share on my trip to MGM Grand last week. I found it fun hanging out with the people on line. It is the first time I've ever played a slot machine, though, and so I freely admit I know nothing about them.
I played for an hour or two, watched a few more hours than that. One fellow won the $10,000 while I was watching. He received all 3 lions, but not all on the payline.
While I was playing, however, the following happened to me:
http://imgur.com/msl1NPK.jpg
As you can see, 60 credits were paid out due to the result of this spin. However, the payout guide clearly states that this would be the payout if 3 double bars were to come up. Obviously there is nothing on the third reel at all and so this should be a losing spin.
Like I said, I know nothing about the working of slot machines, but bear with me for a moment. If the machine thinks that a double bar is present where there is nothing on the third reel, then there can't be a lion in the spot where one is seen, because it would 'overlap' onto the spot where the double bar was. If there's only supposed to be one lion on that reel, perhaps this glitch is what has stopped the machine from hitting the progressive in the last 21 years.
Is this kind of glitch very common among slot machines? I had thought they were tightly regulated so that the display and payout guide is what is accurately paid. However, since I never play slots, for all I know this kind of thing happens all the time?
I thought it was Buzzard working some slot magic so his wife will hit it on the first spin, so I've heard from his posts.
But seriously this sounds pretty interesting if it was true, so many people with 2 lions and a blank should have gotten winners.
Quote: Boxcars...As you can see, 60 credits were paid out due to the result of this spin. However, the payout guide clearly states that this would be the payout if 3 double bars were to come up. Obviously there is nothing on the third reel at all and so this should be a losing spin....
Here's the Wizard's page on Lion's Share. The Wizard states, "The lion is wild in any position on the reel. Three positions are visible."
So, your payout of 60 for three double bars was correct.
Quote: ChesterDogHere's the Wizard's page on Lion's Share. The Wizard states, "The lion is wild in any position on the reel. Three positions are visible."
So, your payout of 60 for three double bars was correct.
Not to highjack but this principal is also the same on the "Wild Party" machines that Ballys still has around. I believe they also made "Wild Cherry" machines with the same feature.
Quote: JohnnyQI'm sure this info is already on one of the 39 pages in this, but where is the game located inside MGM ? THANKS...
Just outside the main entrance to the high-limit slot room. Look for the line of people waiting to play.
For what it's worth, the jackpot as of 625pm on 3/27 was $2,361,084.26
Quote: Sosaman66
For what it's worth, the jackpot as of 625pm on 3/27 was $2,361,084.26
Here's a video of the machine the night before, 3/26 about 10pm at night.
http://youtu.be/NLe7_kuQs9M
I tried to play it 3 times last week.
Tried to play it Tues nite 3/25 but there was a line of 6 people. The guy on the machine dumped in 800 bucks so he probably had a long run. We simply watched for about 20 min and left.
Came back Thur nite and got lucky. One guy playing and no line and this guy was playing just 1 dollar a spin. rookie. After he was done I got on as he watched. Told him gotta play 3 bucks a spin to hit the biggie jackpot. Anyway I only put in 20, only 10 of it mine. Several workers gave me money to play slots for them. So I turned on the video recorder so my coworkers can see the result of their bets themselves. After their money was lost had a few more spins left with the rest of the 20 buck bill. I figured 20 more seconds of playing then meet my buddy who's drinking at a bar. Instead I went on an epic slot machine run. I may have went up to as much as 150 bucks. In any other instance, I'm taking the money and running, turning 20 into 150, never happened to me on a slot machine before. This machine, its all or nothing. After 18 min, I stopped recording so I could call my buddy at the bar. The total run lasted about 25 min. Sucks getting 100's of chances and not hitting the big one. After going down to 2 twice then back over a 100, I stuck in another dollar. Would have never forgiven myself if I hit the jackpot on 2 bucks not getting the big prize.
Me and my buddy hit a club and at about 1am I came back to the Lions Share. A group of 4 friends were huddled together on the machine taking turns hitting the spin button. What was frustrating was they were playing real slow, sometimes hitting the 1 dollar bet button 3 times instead of the big 3 dollar spin button. Oh well, they probably saved me money.
Quote: terapinedHere's a video of the machine the night before, 3/26 about 10pm at night.
http://youtu.be/NLe7_kuQs9M
I tried to play it 3 times last week.
Tried to play it Tues nite 3/25 but there was a line of 6 people. The guy on the machine dumped in 800 bucks so he probably had a long run. We simply watched for about 20 min and left.
Came back Thur nite and got lucky. One guy playing and no line and this guy was playing just 1 dollar a spin. rookie. After he was done I got on as he watched. Told him gotta play 3 bucks a spin to hit the biggie jackpot. Anyway I only put in 20, only 10 of it mine. Several workers gave me money to play slots for them. So I turned on the video recorder so my coworkers can see the result of their bets themselves. After their money was lost had a few more spins left with the rest of the 20 buck bill. I figured 20 more seconds of playing then meet my buddy who's drinking at a bar. Instead I went on an epic slot machine run. I may have went up to as much as 150 bucks. In any other instance, I'm taking the money and running, turning 20 into 150, never happened to me on a slot machine before. This machine, its all or nothing. After 18 min, I stopped recording so I could call my buddy at the bar. The total run lasted about 25 min. Sucks getting 100's of chances and not hitting the big one. After going down to 2 twice then back over a 100, I stuck in another dollar. Would have never forgiven myself if I hit the jackpot on 2 bucks not getting the big prize.
Me and my buddy hit a club and at about 1am I came back to the Lions Share. A group of 4 friends were huddled together on the machine taking turns hitting the spin button. What was frustrating was they were playing real slow, sometimes hitting the 1 dollar bet button 3 times instead of the big 3 dollar spin button. Oh well, they probably saved me money.
Were you recording openly or was it hidden? Did anyone say anything to you about it? Did you get strange looks (from staff I mean, not from other patrons)
There are a lot of slot machines that I really, really want to record spins of. Am I just being overly paranoid? Is this something that I can just sit down and do?
Edit: I just watched the beginning of the video. It is clearly not hidden. So, were there no issues at all?
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceWere you recording openly or was it hidden? Did anyone say anything to you about it? Did you get strange looks (from staff I mean, not from other patrons)
There are a lot of slot machines that I really, really want to record spins of. Am I just being overly paranoid? Is this something that I can just sit down and do?
Edit: I just watched the beginning of the video. It is clearly not hidden. So, were there no issues at all?
No issues, totally out in the open, Waitress came by, a guy in line wanted to order a drink, at 1st the waitress says no, I then chime in and ask what he drinks so I can order it for him, waitress then relents and takes his drink order and asks me what I want, I say a coke but may not be around to drink it because once my run is over, I am leaving. All of this is on the video tape and the waitress clearly sees I am recording.
Quote: terapinedNo issues, totally out in the open, Waitress came by, a guy in line wanted to order a drink, at 1st the waitress says no, I then chime in and ask what he drinks so I can order it for him, waitress then relents and takes his drink order and asks me what I want, I say a coke but may not be around to drink it because once my run is over, I am leaving. All of this is on the video tape and the waitress clearly sees I am recording.
No attention from suits at all? They are always walking by that place because the high limit room is right there.
Strange that the waitress didn't want to bring the guy a drink. She must hate tips...
So you left a machine after thinking it was paying abnormally in your favor? They would have had to drag me off.Quote: BoxcarsI played Lion's Share on my trip to MGM Grand last week. I found it fun hanging out with the people on line. It is the first time I've ever played a slot machine, though, and so I freely admit I know nothing about them.
I played for an hour or two, watched a few more hours than that. One fellow won the $10,000 while I was watching. He received all 3 lions, but not all on the payline.
While I was playing, however, the following happened to me:
http://imgur.com/msl1NPK.jpg
As you can see, 60 credits were paid out due to the result of this spin. However, the payout guide clearly states that this would be the payout if 3 double bars were to come up. Obviously there is nothing on the third reel at all and so this should be a losing spin.
Like I said, I know nothing about the working of slot machines, but bear with me for a moment. If the machine thinks that a double bar is present where there is nothing on the third reel, then there can't be a lion in the spot where one is seen, because it would 'overlap' onto the spot where the double bar was. If there's only supposed to be one lion on that reel, perhaps this glitch is what has stopped the machine from hitting the progressive in the last 21 years.
Is this kind of glitch very common among slot machines? I had thought they were tightly regulated so that the display and payout guide is what is accurately paid. However, since I never play slots, for all I know this kind of thing happens all the time?
Has it hit yet?
I'll be playing it sometime two weekends from now, after attending the WoVCon meet and greet.
Decided recently to come to Las Vegas 4/26 to catch DJ Tiesto spinning at MGM's Ibiza-like club, Hakkasan .
My host says he'll "walk me in."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovK6nkmtvg0
Go deep.
Quote: AxelWolfSo you left a machine after thinking it was paying abnormally in your favor? They would have had to drag me off.
I didn't see this when it was originally posted, but apparently you and Boxcars didn't realize that the 3rd lion off of the line acts as a wild symbol that can complete a line win. Machine looks to be functioning as usual...slowly sucking away money until it spews out a huge jackpot to some lucky sucker.
NO...I absolutely did realized this, as it's probably just like a wild cherry machine. However, he didn't know this, HE thought it was paying incorrectly, to what would be a huge advantage for him and yet he walked off.Quote: tringlomaneI didn't see this when it was originally posted, but apparently you and Boxcars didn't realize that the 3rd lion off of the line acts as a wild symbol that can complete a line win. Machine looks to be functioning as usual...slowly sucking away money until it spews out a huge jackpot to some lucky sucker.
I was wondering why he would walk off if HE thought this was the case.
Quote: AxiomOfChoiceWere you recording openly or was it hidden? Did anyone say anything to you about it? Did you get strange looks (from staff I mean, not from other patrons)
I've recorded playing slots for at least an hour in total and nobody has ever said anything. YouTube is full of videos of people playing them. Most casinos still have a "no photography" policy, but with cell phones it has become so ubiquitous that they turn a blind eye to it if done discretely.
Quote: WizardI've recorded playing slots for at least an hour in total and nobody has ever said anything. YouTube is full of videos of people playing them. Most casinos still have a "no photography" policy, but with cell phones it has become so ubiquitous that they turn a blind eye to it if done discretely.
I've watched some you tubes where they had to shut the camera off, but they obviously aren't asked to delete it or asked to leave or anything. Technology has made this rule not worth enforcing anymore unless the recording is clearly over sensitive information.
While playing VP, I had an attendant use her key to check something on the machine. As she was going through the menus, the game and its payout was listed (although the payout listed for this particular VP game was actually wrong -- it was a little higher than the expected return with optimal strategy, and could not be explained by rounding).
Anyway, I wonder if coming up with some BS excuse to get the attendant to do the same at a slot game would allow you to see the theoretical return that the machine is set to. This could be very useful for figuring out when games with small progressives, or must-hit-by jackpots, are +EV. Has anyone ever tried this?? ("I swear I got 5 quick hits 4 spins ago, but it didn't pay me the jackpot...")
