OnceDear
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OnceDear
Joined: Jun 1, 2014
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June 8th, 2014 at 4:28:17 PM permalink
Hi,

I find this interesting, being a die-hard cynic....

My game of choice is live blackjack at one of a few Europe based online casinos. I generally spend to enjoy with no big idea of winning, though I have won some good sessions. Mostly it's fun spending.

This weekend, I threw 3 lots of £50 into the pot and over three sessions, I steadily spent that at £5 or £10 per hand: That's pretty unremarkable.

But today, I threw another £50 of spending money in and had a disappointment: The live tables seemed to be offline or broken in some way :

So, to get my blackjack fix, I had to resort to one of the Random Number Generator Blackjack games. I sincerely expected to find the games biased towards the house at least noticeably more than the normal house edge. There were no shuffles and the virtual shoe seemed to last forever. I figured they were simulating an infinite shoe. I honestly expected the cards to be noticeably against me. Slight rule difference in that no double on soft hands.

But... Wooooo, I did not find that at all !
Good fortune seemed to shine on me to a proportionate degree and there was no feeling of inappropriate bias. That shocked me to the core.

Over the course of this evening, betting in level £5, £10, or £25 bets, as the mood took me, I progressively turned my £50 bankroll into £500.50 and now, I've checked out.

That's cleared my weekend losses very nicely, thank you very much.

Granted there were no other players, and no live dealers to chat with/chat up or leer at, but all in all it was far better than I could ever have hoped.

So. In conclusion. RNG Blackjack, can be faster and apparently as fair as live blackjack. That amazes me. I'll definitely be back, especially if I have any bonuses to play rapidly.

B
If you are enjoying the game, you're already winning.
MangoJ
MangoJ
Joined: Mar 12, 2011
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June 8th, 2014 at 5:03:28 PM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

I had to resort to one of the Random Number Generator Blackjack games. I sincerely expected to find the games biased towards the house at least noticeably more than the normal house edge. There were no shuffles and the virtual shoe seemed to last forever. I figured they were simulating an infinite shoe. I honestly expected the cards to be noticeably against me.



Why would you think that an infinite deck is used ? I've never seen an infinite deck RNG blackjack game. The reason the shoe "lasts" forever is because the whole shoe is shuffled before every game. You can test your infinite deck hypothesis though: record the number of exact pairs (i.e. cards including suit) on the deal (before any action). You will need a large number of games to see a difference towards an 8-deck game though.

Further question: why would you think the game is biased beyond the house edge as defined from the rules ? That would mean their RNG is biased which is a pretty substantial speculation.
GWAE
GWAE
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June 8th, 2014 at 6:16:13 PM permalink
Quote: MangoJ

Why would you think that an infinite deck is used ? I've never seen an infinite deck RNG blackjack game. The reason the shoe "lasts" forever is because the whole shoe is shuffled before every game. You can test your infinite deck hypothesis though: record the number of exact pairs (i.e. cards including suit) on the deal (before any action). You will need a large number of games to see a difference towards an 8-deck game though.

Further question: why would you think the game is biased beyond the house edge as defined from the rules ? That would mean their RNG is biased which is a pretty substantial speculation.



plus, if you think a casino has a biased RNG game then why would play their live game. If they are going to cheat you on the RNG the they are going to cheat you on the live game as well.
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
OnceDear
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OnceDear
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June 9th, 2014 at 12:15:46 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

being a die-hard cynic....



Since the edge on the casino's slots is several percent more than BlackJack and since it would be so easy to rig the RNG, I just expected it to be rigged.
I suppose they could rig the live games by pulling a few cards but that would be more visible than non-randomly pulling from the RNG.

I figured it was being treated as an infinite deck, because I played the same shoe for ages with no sign of a shuffle.
If you are enjoying the game, you're already winning.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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June 9th, 2014 at 12:28:07 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

Since the edge on the casino's slots is several percent more than BlackJack and since it would be so easy to rig the RNG, I just expected it to be rigged.
I suppose they could rig the live games by pulling a few cards but that would be more visible than non-randomly pulling from the RNG.

I figured it was being treated as an infinite deck, because I played the same shoe for ages with no sign of a shuffle.

Just because you had a good session does not mean its not rigged. If I was a online casino that wanted to cheat players. I would let players win a bit on each new game they played. Get them hooked by letting small bettors win at first, meanwhile they now think its random(like you do). Crush the big bettors to make up for the losses I gave to all the small players. Next time you play I would rape you and hope you just think your running bad.


Of course this would be exploitable if you knew they were doing this.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
pacomartin
pacomartin
Joined: Jan 14, 2010
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June 9th, 2014 at 1:37:53 AM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

Since the edge on the casino's slots is several percent more than BlackJack and since it would be so easy to rig the RNG, I just expected it to be rigged.
I suppose they could rig the live games by pulling a few cards but that would be more visible than non-randomly pulling from the RNG.

I figured it was being treated as an infinite deck, because I played the same shoe for ages with no sign of a shuffle.



Online casinos don't rig the games because they don't have to. It is far more damaging to have people stop playing than it is beneficial to cheat a few people.

Normally the simulation is for a single deck (FOR EACH PLAYER) that is shuffled each time. Sometimes they have a switch to simulate 5 or more decks FOR EACH PLAYER since it improves house odds.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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June 9th, 2014 at 2:58:14 AM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

Online casinos don't rig the games because they don't have to\.

That's the worst augment in the world. It is not true online casino have been caught cheating many times. Please don't spread miss information.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

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