The Adventures of MDawg
There is obviously no meeting of the minds here.
Quote: AxelWolfan attempt to squash the truth about how all his stuff could be faked.
LOL...how could MDawg possibly squash the truth about how all his stuff can be faked?
How could he or anyone stop you from doing what you said that you could do?
If there is any truth to what you claim, then you are the one squashing it.
Quote: AxelWolfOBVIOUS YOU DON'T WANT ME TO PROCEED.
Go right ahead and proceed. Who is stopping you?
You won't proceed because you choose not to...you don't want to...no other reason is possible.
Quote: MDawgThere is obviously no meeting of the minds here.
Axel is claiming that you are somehow stopping him from doing what he said he could do.
What have you done to stop him? Do you have him in custody or something?
To AxelWolf:
You made an unconditional sight unseen offer to buy Wizard's watch for 5500, even stipulating that you did not care what brand it was.
Later, before you knew anything more, no additional information about the deal, you qualified it by saying that you would perform “only if it was a good deal.”
By adding a condition precedent to your offer, you made your offer, I suppose in your mind, “a better deal” for yourself.
You seemed to have no problem with that.
But you seem to have all sorts of problems with the terms of my Challenge, which my terms include posting millions in markers, and three unanimous judges. And you even dislike my terms enough so that you make up a new rule (term) of your own – that you’ll post out of focus pictures. And that you must have the money posted up front. If you don’t like my terms you don’t have to undertake the challenge.
No meeting of the minds here.
Quote: MDawgThere is no meeting of the minds on the terms of this Challenge. AxelWolf has not even accepted my Challenge as I have proposed it.
Although Wizard and I have both asked that these discussions be conducted privately, AxelWolf keeps having a one sided public conversation with himself. And I mentioned that I blocked some people here, which makes it even more difficult for me to follow what is going on because I assume comments are being made that I don’t even see. I blocked to try to cut down the irrelevant noise and drama.
I did this after reading DeMango’s suggestion.
What is blowing this Challenge are three things: One, is that I actually privately told AxelWolf that I was willing to discuss posting money in advance, and then as soon as I had said that he started pressuring me with posts all over this thread seemingly desperate to get the money up front. When someone says that he’s amenable to discussing something, and the other side seems desperate to make it happen right away, that makes me suspicious. A guy says Okay and the other guy keeps talking? Why? I already said I was not opposed to considering that, what’s the need for all the high pressure talk.
Unless…and this brings me to the second issue, is something Wizard said to me during our phone conversation and reaffirmed via private message, advice that he gave me. Now, both during that conversation and afterwards when he posted here about our conversation, he made it clear that both of us were free to disclose anything that we had discussed. However, in deference to the Wizard’s subsequent wishes that he would rather I not disclose that particular piece of the conversation, I will not.
Nevertheless, even notwithstanding that second issue I was STILL willing to continue with the Challenge until it became clear to me that AxelWolf was just yeah yeah yeahing me with accepting the terms of the Challenge.
How is it clear to me that he hasn’t accepted accepted the terms? Well, for one, I stated days ago that there would be three judges, one appointed by him, one mutually, and one by me, and the decision would have to be unanimous.
He obviously read that, because he started talking about appointing PokerGrinder as a judge, and even later added that he was joking about that choice for his judge. But now he comes in three days later and says that no, he doesn’t want the judges to be unanimous.
Another reason I know he hasn’t accepted the terms, is that although he keeps saying that he agreed to the challenge he states that he doesn’t have to post millions of dollars in markers. That is part of the Challenge as clearly stated
and the fact that he hasn’t even looked at my trip reports other than one post from the early part of this thread, which I have told him more than once, this thread represents just my WOV trip reports starting from a little over a year ago – there are trip reports posted at WOV by me that go back to 2018, which is why he has to produce three years of trip reports, because I have.
If he is not agreeing to post exactly what I proposed in my Challenge, then he is not accepting my challenge.
And then AxelWolf glances at one post of mine (and even states that this is the only post he even looked at closely) and notices that it was slightly out of focus, one post out of hundreds, hundreds that he didn’t even bother to look at, and even though the dollar amounts of the markers on that one picture were still readable as being 5000, 10000 and 20000, he immediately declares that his posts may be out of focus too.
There is no meeting of the minds here. And – this is not a two sided wager with money potentially lost on both sides, this is a unilateral offer with me being the only one with anything monetarily to lose. If you don’t accept my Challenge and my terms in their entirety, you don’t have to undertake it. But you can't complain about ANYTHING until after you accept what I propose. And you haven't.
Blah blah blah, not posting money, a bunch of excuses and accusations, blah blah blah, more excuses and more accusations.
Wow that was a great post 🙄
So the fight is whether to post money then hash out challenge terms or hash out challenge terms then post money.
My advice to AW is to get MDawg to recommit to posting money before challenge begins but after agreed “meeting of mind” on challenge rules. We can then put the issue to bed.
People agree the rules and then MDawg posts money. If he fails to do it then, AW has proved his point.
If things fail in hashing out challenge rules, we can all draw our own conclusion from that. From my perspective unanimous voting with each contestant picking one judge is a clear “fix is in.” So that’s an easy call if MDawg sticks to that. MDawg will know that a three panel arbitration is decided based on a majority vote.
Quote: unJonI’ve given this some thought. The fight over posting the money first is misplaced. Money should be posted before the challenge begins. Even MDawg has agreed to that. I’m not sure Coachbelly has, but who cares about that.
So the fight is whether to post money then hash out challenge terms or hash out challenge terms then post money.
My advice to AW is to get MDawg to recommit to posting money before challenge begins but after agreed “meeting of mind” on challenge rules. We can then put the issue to bed.
People agree the rules and then MDawg posts money. If he fails to do it then, AW has proved his point.
If things fail in hashing out challenge rules, we can all draw our own conclusion from that. From my perspective unanimous voting with each contestant picking one judge is a clear “fix is in.” So that’s an easy call if MDawg sticks to that. MDawg will know that a three panel arbitration is decided based on a majority vote.
It's clear the fix has always been in.
MDawg wants a unanimous vote and he has stated he wants Coach Belly to be one of those judges.
No one would agree to those terms
Those terms are done to put AW in a negative light for refusing to accept ridiculous terms
Quote: unJonPeople agree the rules and then MDawg posts money.
You are confused, you're imagining a cart & horse problem when none exists.
Quote: unJonIf he fails to do it then, AW has proved his point.
Axel's point is that MDawg's trip reports and all of the photos, videos and documents can all be faked by Axel.
Until he posts what he claimed he could fake, he has proven nothing.
But Axel hasn't posted a single thing.
Quote: MDawgLet me put this in terms that should make it more clear.
If you don’t accept my Challenge and my terms in their entirety, you don’t have to undertake it.
If you don’t like my terms you don’t have to undertake the challenge.
No meeting of the minds here.
Axel either posts the stuff that he said he could, or he won't get paid.
And that's that, it doesn't matter what you or the others think.
All this maneuvering to convince MDawg to post the prize money in advance is a stall tactic.
It's a way for Axel to weasel his way out of the challenge, without ever posting a single thing to back up his claims.
Quote: darkozthe fix has always been in.
That sounds just like DT.
Quote: darkozNo one would agree to those terms
Sure they would, and Axel should too.
If Axel doesn't agree to those terms, then he loses out on a potential $5K.
But what does Axel have to lose by agreeing to those terms?
I did not say I would not do the Challenge, I have said privately to the Wizard that if he finds that AxelWolf had accepted my terms I would do the Challenge. Has AxelWolf accepted my terms? If so, why is he refusing to agree to that he must post millions in markers? Why is he saying that he may post out of focus pictures?
I think the reason there is no meeting of the minds is that AxelWolf doesn't read anything carefully. He hasn't read my challenge carefully nor has he even read my trip reports carefully.
I agree that UnJon has a fair assessment of the matter. He agrees that money might be needed to be posted first, but also says that terms must be agreed to first, and agrees that there has not been a meeting of the minds.
WHAT THIS GETS BACK TO IS FORCING SOMEONE TO POST MONEY IN ADVANCE FOR A CHALLENGE OR ELSE GET SUSPENDED. Huh? Who has EVER Needed to post money in advance for ANY challenge in the HISTORY of WOV? Even the Hot Blonde Challenge this never happened. Especially - post money in advance PRIOR to agreeing on terms. That makes no sense, as UnJon points out.
Quote: coachbellyYou are confused, you're imagining a cart & horse problem when none exists.
Nope. Wrong again. See MDawg who thought I had a fair assessment.
Given the choice between being WOV suspended and being forced to post money in advance or else be suspended, I'd take a suspension.
The two "terms" that AxelWolf seems to be playing games about is when he states categorically that he doesn't have to post millions in markers. That was a term of my wager to begin with. That he hasn't bothered to look at all my trip reports or thinks that I never posted that many markers is irrelevant. Also he thinks he may post out of focus pictures just because one picture of mine that he found is slightly out of focus. I mean, why doesn't he just write his own terms for a wager that I proposed - a wager where the only money at risk is mine, I might add?
That's why I want a unanimous judging decision - if AxelWolf thinks he may decide what constitutes the terms of the Challenge, I want to make sure every judge agrees not just a couple that might be fixed to side with him. A unanimous verdict is needed to convict, and in this instance I am the only one putting up money.
Quote: unJonMDawg who thought I had a fair assessment.
Must have been a momentary lapse of reason.
1) AW should post a bill of particulars with all the issues he has with the terms of the challenge as you laid it out. You can judge whether you would accommodate some or all of his issues. If the deal falls apart at this stage, everyone can draw whatever conclusions he or she wants about which party was being unreasonable.
2) The judging should be agreed. From my point of view there’s a natural suspicion that any judge picked by a particular contestant will always support that contestant. I don’t know how you rebut that presumption of bias. It seems clear to me that this framework with a unanimous requirement renders the challenge a mirage. Is there an acceptable compromise? You each pick a “judge chooser” and those two agree on judge 1. Judge 1 picks judge 2. And judge 2 picks judge 3. Just one thought.
3) Payment is “guaranteed” to the satisfaction of AW. The challenge is obviously a lot of work. And AW has made it clear it’s not something he would do for free or at the risk of not getting paid. I view that as reasonable and if the transaction falls apart on this term, I would draw the inference that AW proved his point. But I have been convinced by MDawg and Coachbelly that it’s unfair as to the two points above of money is posted prematurely. If AW unwilling to work out 1 and 2 before funds are posted, I would not draw per se the inference that AW proved his point.
It speaks well of you that you can admit when you do that. ;-) <— That’s a winking emoticon. I know you aren’t fluent.Quote: coachbellyMust have been a momentary lapse of reason.
Well, the quickest way I could prove visually that I have five grand, which five grand is nothing, is here is a picture of five thousand of the money I won in Vegas, taken a few seconds ago in front of one of the latest Vanity Fair issues, and one of my watches. The rest of the 27K or so in cash I put in the safe deposit box, when I deposited the $47K casino winning check, but if you compare this stack which I just took the pic of now
with the 5K stack that was part of the money I won in Vegas, posted here at WOV November 26th, you'll see that they are one and the same.
I put this bit of money away here at home and haven't had any need for it yet. I'm not usually a cash based person anyway.
And by the way, neither of these pics is out of focus. 😇
Quote: unJonMDawg, I agree with a lot of what you post above. Here are some thoughts in no particular order:
1) AW should post a bill of particulars with all the issues he has with the terms of the challenge as you laid it out. You can judge whether you would accommodate some or all of his issues. If the deal falls apart at this stage, everyone can draw whatever conclusions he or she wants about which party was being unreasonable.
2) The judging should be agreed. From my point of view there’s a natural suspicion that any judge picked by a particular contestant will always support that contestant. I don’t know how you rebut that presumption of bias. It seems clear to me that this framework with a unanimous requirement renders the challenge a mirage. Is there an acceptable compromise? You each pick a “judge chooser” and those two agree on judge 1. Judge 1 picks judge 2. And judge 2 picks judge 3. Just one thought.
3) Payment is “guaranteed” to the satisfaction of AW. The challenge is obviously a lot of work. And AW has made it clear it’s not something he would do for free or at the risk of not getting paid. I view that as reasonable and if the transaction falls apart on this term, I would draw the inference that AW proved his point. But I have been convinced by MDawg and Coachbelly that it’s unfair as to the two points above of money is posted prematurely. If AW unwilling to work out 1 and 2 before funds are posted, I would not draw per se the inference that AW proved his point.
Does the Wizard agree with this? It seems like he is the only one that matters at this point. Well, of course - besides me.
Quote: unJon
1) AW should post a bill of particulars with all the issues he has with the terms of the challenge as you laid it out. You can judge whether you would accommodate some or all of his issues. If the deal falls apart at this stage, everyone can draw whatever conclusions he or she wants about which party was being unreasonable.
2) The judging should be agreed. From my point of view there’s a natural suspicion that any judge picked by a particular contestant will always support that contestant. I don’t know how you rebut that presumption of bias. It seems clear to me that this framework with a unanimous requirement renders the challenge a mirage. Is there an acceptable compromise? You each pick a “judge chooser” and those two agree on judge 1. Judge 1 picks judge 2. And judge 2 picks judge 3. Just one thought.
3) Payment is “guaranteed” to the satisfaction of AW. The challenge is obviously a lot of work. And AW has made it clear it’s not something he would do for free or at the risk of not getting paid. I view that as reasonable and if the transaction falls apart on this term, I would draw the inference that AW proved his point. But I have been convinced by MDawg and Coachbelly that it’s unfair as to the two points above of money is posted prematurely. If AW unwilling to work out 1 and 2 before funds are posted, I would not draw per se the inference that AW proved his point.
1. He already has. AW has asked that money be posted up front and that a judge majority decide the matter. MD has said "no" to both, so far.
2. They seem pretty apart on this matter. MD seems to be trying to put himself in a position where he can't lose. I think AW is in a reasonable middle and MD has a lot of bending to do for any chance at agreement.
3. Whatever the two parties agree to in terms of preconditions to post money is fine with me. The record should show AW has already done so.
Quote: unJonAW proved his point.
What is the point that AW will have proved?
Quote: Wizard1. He already has. AW has asked that money be posted up front and that a judge majority decide the matter. MD has said "no" to both, so far.
2. They seem pretty apart on this matter. MD seems to be trying to put himself in a position where he can't lose. I think AW is in a reasonable middle and MD has a lot of bending to do for any chance at agreement.
3. Whatever the two parties agree to in terms of preconditions to post money is fine with me. The record should show AW has already done so.
Here are two "conditions" that AxelWolf seems to be pushing for, that I do not agree with.
A) That he doesn't have to post millions in paid markers. However, this was a clear condition of my Challenge.
B) That he may post out of focus pictures. He made up this condition on his own too - after he noticed that one of my hundreds of pictures was out of focus.
Quote: MDawgHere are two "conditions" that AxelWolf seems to be pushing for, that I do not agree with.
A) That he doesn't have to post millions in paid markers. However, this was a clear condition of my Challenge.
B) That he may post out of focus pictures. He made up this condition on his own too - after he noticed that one of my hundreds of pictures was out of focus.
Why would he not be allowed out of focus pictures?
Yours contains them.
To produce the most accurate fake it must contain them.
A red herring of which someone who doesn't read carefully or hasn't even looked at my trip reports in any detail is trying to take advantage. It was that kind of apparent subterfuge by AxelWolf that led to my proposing unanimous judges.
That and his saying that he didn't have to post millions in markers, when I not only have posted them, I have made that a clear condition of my Challenge.
Quote: MDawgOne out of hundreds of my pictures was inadvertently slighty out of focus. The denominations on the markers were still readable as 5000, 10000, 20000.
A red herring of which someone who doesn't read carefully or hasn't even looked at my trip reports in any detail is trying to take advantage. It was that kind of apparent subterfuge by AxelWolf that led to my proposing unanimous judges.
Okay, He gets one out of focus markers photo and the denoms must be readable.
Quote: MDawg
Your time is running out your not good enough too keep this charade up.
Your obstructionism is destroying your credibility.
The entirety of your posts paint a very clear picture you are not aware of.
If there is an agenda here, it's that of someone desperate to try to win five grand through artifice. I've never seen AxelWolf jump so high. This must mean a lot to him, but whether this really has to do with five grand, or something else, I don't know.
I'm still ready to roll if there is a meeting of the minds.
Quote: MDawgToo many people here think there is an agenda in what people do where there isn't always much of one. Maybe he just wanted to steal our wire cutters. You ever think of that?
If there is an agenda here, it's that of someone desperate to try to win five grand through artifice. I've never seen AxelWolf jump so high. This must mean a lot to him, but whether this really has to do with five grand, or something else, I don't know.
Tic..tic..tic
I guess I gotta add one more person to the list.
let me shed some light on this out-of-focus picture issue. It wasn't the fact that there was one, it was the fact that it was the VERY FIRST ONE. And since there's no guarantee of payment I'm not wasting my time going through all the pictures, so I asked kindly if he could send me or linked me to a group of them that I could take a better look at without doing a bunch of work.Quote: rainmanOkay, He gets one out of focus markers photo and the denoms must be readable.
Joined:Oct 10, 2012Threads: 147Posts: 18478December 12th, 2020 at 11:42:51 PMpermalink
You have one of your requirements as posting millions of dollars in paid markers. I don't believe you have posted up millions of dollars of anything like that. I could be wrong, I never paid that much attention... since ..well, never mind why. I ask that you please show evidence of this.
-------
He told me there was a bunch on the thread. So, I went to the beginning and the very first bit of paperwork was this... Go look..its illegible.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/trip-reports/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/16/#post747796
"I stopped on the first post that contained paperwork. It's blurred as hell, the amounts were not legible, only a few of the things I could kind of make out. You obviously have the pictures somewhere, do you mind sending the paperwork ones to my PM, not all, but perhaps 10 or so?"
---
The in a PM, after he sent me a PM, I responded with this...
"Whatever was originally posted on the forum. A link or something. If its not in focus on the forum then either it shouldn't count, or mine could be out of focus. I think you know better than I where this stuff was posted.
I believe I even asked on the form of anybody else could confirm he's posted up millions of dollars in markers. Certainly if it's a requirement then it would have to be something he has actually done himself.
Quote: MDawgYou see what I mean. In your mind there is a clock ticking. You like that drama. [/
Drama's are made for stage and screen and make mountains of money.
Everybody likes drama, it is to be human.
I spent some time analyzing your posts and built a psychological
profile.
tic..tic..tic
Quote: AxelWolflet me shed some light on this out-of-focus picture issue. It wasn't the fact that there was one, it was the fact that it was the VERY FIRST ONE. And since there's no guarantee of payment I'm not wasting my time going through all the pictures, so I asked kindly if he could send me or linked me to a group of them that I could take a better look at without doing a bunch of work.
Joined:Oct 10, 2012Threads: 147Posts: 18478December 12th, 2020 at 11:42:51 PMpermalink
You have one of your requirements as posting millions of dollars in paid markers. I don't believe you have posted up millions of dollars of anything like that. I could be wrong, I never paid that much attention... since ..well, never mind why. I ask that you please show evidence of this.
-------
He told me there was a bunch on the thread. So, I went to the beginning and the very first bit of paperwork was this... Go look..its illegible.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/trip-reports/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/16/#post747796
"I stopped on the first post that contained paperwork. It's blurred as hell, the amounts were not legible, only a few of the things I could kind of make out. You obviously have the pictures somewhere, do you mind sending the paperwork ones to my PM, not all, but perhaps 10 or so?"
---
The in a PM, after he sent me a PM, I responded with this...
"Whatever was originally posted on the forum. A link or something. If its not in focus on the forum then either it shouldn't count, or mine could be out of focus. I think you know better than I where this stuff was posted.
I believe I even asked on the form of anybody else could confirm he's posted up millions of dollars in markers. Certainly if it's a requirement then it would have to be something he has actually done himself.
All he said she said bull......
Said the guy who can't even come up with a measly 5K.Quote: MDawgToo many people here think there is an agenda in what people do where there isn't always much of one. Maybe he just wanted to steal our wire cutters. You ever think of that?
If there is an agenda here, it's that of someone desperate to try to win five grand through artifice. I've never seen AxelWolf jump so high. This must mean a lot to him, but whether this really has to do with five grand, or something else, I don't know.
I'm still ready to roll if there is a meeting of the minds.
This isn't really about the money, the money is the icing on the cake, but I must admit, I don't really like cake without icing.
Anyway first off, for about the sixth time I am repeating this, this thread this Adventures thread has only the trip reports going back about a year. The prior trip reports were in different threads at WOV, going back to 2018. And that one slightly out of focus picture isn't even the first one of this thread either. Which even in that picture you may read the denominations of the markers 5000, 10000, 20000, so, what?
Anyway, there are pictures of an average of a hundred K of markers posted per each week of my trip reports, over a three year or so period, and here is a picture of the markers that were posted for the third resort of the most recent trip, where the action was pretty heavy - more like 200K in markers per week. These alone for that month or so, add up to about a million. Some of the Imgur images for that particular post from Nov. 26th dropped off not sure why but I posted the same at TruePassage a month ago. The marker images for that Nov. 26th post did not drop off they are all right there at WOV, complete. In that picture the markers are spread out in one picture, and stacked in another, but in my other pictures of markers for my trip reports every marker is set separate from the other, clearly. And again, you'll need to look over this stuff more carefully actually LOOK at it to know. Look at not just this one post I am directing you to now, but hundreds more.
You're the one who stands to get paid. And going on and on about how easy it would be to fake all this. You haven't even looked closely at what it is you claim you may fake?
If we have to keep going back and forth like this over "what my trip reports mean" and "what my pictures mean" how are we ever going to undertake this challenge?
The categories and things that I said you must post are in my original Challenge and you said you agreed to them ALL. Is that correct, or not? You can't agree and then later say, hey, hold on, I couldn't find this or that, or this Imgur image dropped of or whatever, to try and get out of the clear requirements of the Challenge, which again, are:
And if you want to keep saying stuff like "can't even come up with 5K" that's a personal insult that you know is untrue. I don't WANT to post the money up front, I don't believe that should be a requirement, that's different from not having it. This appears to be very important to you, so I'd suggest being on better behavior if you hope to entice me into doing what you want me to do.
I agree, but it certainly seems as if MDawg is trying to twist and make an issue about what I regarding the markers.Quote: rainmanAll he said she said bull......
He's claiming he posted up millions of dollars in markers, therefor, making that a requirement as part of the challenge. Just because he claims he's posted up millions of dollars in markers, that doesn't make it true. Maybe he has, I'm certainly not going to go back and look right now, not until I know there's a guarantee of payment.
This is a very little issue on my list of issues. If can Fake a hundred thousand dollars in markers, I can certainly make a millions worth. It's like he's trying to feed people's heads into thinking that the Adventures of MD is some Grand complicated massive thing. I assure you it's not, most of it's just a bunch of empty words going back and forth doubting his claims and what have you.
You did send me some and that, and that cleared up the out of Focus issue for me. You are the one that seems to have an issue with it now, not me.Quote: MDawgI offered to PM you the pictures of some other markers from that November 2019, trip, clear pictures, I did in fact PM you some images of a hundred K or so of paid markers from that trip, I just checked my PMs. Those were what I could find on short notice.
Anyway first off, for about the sixth time I am repeating this, this thread this Adventures thread has only the trip reports going back about a year. The prior trip reports were in different threads at WOV, going back to 2018. And that one slightly out of focus picture isn't even the first one of this thread either. Which even in that picture you may read the denominations of the markers 5000, 10000, 20000, so, what?
Anyway, there are pictures of an average of a hundred K of markers posted per each week of my trip reports, over a three year or so period, and here is a picture of the markers that were posted for the third resort of the most recent trip, where the action was pretty heavy - more like 200K in markers per week. These alone for that month or so, add up to about a million. Some of the Imgur images dropped off not sure why but I posted the same at TruePassage a month ago. The marker images did not drop off they are all right there at WOV, complete. In that picture the markers are spread out in one picture, and stacked in another, but in my other pictures of markers for my trip reports every marker is set separate from the other, clearly. And again, you'll need to look over this stuff more carefully actually LOOK at it to know.
You're the one who stands to get paid. And going on and on about how easy it would be to fake all this. You haven't even looked closely at what it is you claim you may fake?
If we have to keep going back and forth like this over "what my trip reports mean" and "what my pictures mean" how are we ever going to undertake this challenge?
And if you want to keep saying stuff like "can't even come up with 5K" that's a personal insult that you know is untrue. I don't WANT to post the money up front, I don't believe that should be a requirement, that's different from not having it. This appears to be very important to you, so I'd suggest being on better behavior if you hope to entice me into doing what you want me to do.
I don't care what you posted up on true passages or whatever, this is about me faking The Adventures of MD here.
I have all but agreed to almost everything so far. I put money up with The Wizard. I came up with reasonable ways in which you can do so as well.
You claim we are significantly far apart and there's no meetings of the Mind. There's only two issues. A LEGITIMATE way to judge if I have been successful or not, and a way to guarantee payment if I succeed. You are the one holding up on those two issues. Come up with something reasonable, I HAVE.
Picking your own judge (especially the one you have) and requiring it to be a unanimous decision is absolutely ludicrous and everyone knows that.
Given how nitpicky you are being all of this is a potential problem.
And once money is posted, you might get even more nitpicky coming up with excuses for why you don't have to post this or that, is my point.
I've stated clearly what you must post, and do, to win, and that is my original challenge and not one bit of that is negotiable.
The judge thing, okay, that's something we may talk about.
I CAN'T COME BACK LATER AND SAY ANYTHING, THAT'S WHAT JUDGES ARE FOR.Quote: MDawgThat's a problem right there then, because just because some images fell off Imgur isn't my fault. I don't want you to come back later and say they don't exist.
Given how nitpicky you are being all of this is a problem.
And once money is posted, you might get even more nitpicky coming up with excuses for why you don't have to post this or that, is my point.
You act as if I'm the one that would be making the decision.
wonderful, we can talk about all we want and even elect judges and figure that all out, but you still need to come up with a way to guarantee payment if I'm successful.Quote: MDawg
The judge thing, okay, that's something we may talk about.
You still haven't come up with any ways or suggestions of how to do that.
You haven't given a logical or good reason why the Bitcoin thing isn't the best option. It solves all the issues and it looks as if it's the easiest most convenient method.
There's no reason we should sit there and approach people asking them if they want to be a part of this only to find out you won't guarantee payment if I'm successful.
My conditions are absolute. They are like issues of law. If I say you must post images of television screens in your suite and hotel folios to prove you were comp'ed, the way I have, that is an issue that doesn't get to the jury. The judges (jury) are not allowed to let up on that condition.
All they are allowed to do, is interpret (issue of fact) whether you have fulfilled that term, with whatever you post.
Similarly, no judges (jury) are allowed to let up on the condition that millions in markers must be posted by you. That is another condition of the Challenge.
And given how imprecise people are with reading through a lot of this stuff, so far the only ones I see who seem to be following closely are UnJon and CoachBelly. If I were to pick them as judges, it would not be because either is biased towards me, but because they seem meticulous.
I mean I think UnJon has said plenty of things against me in the past, but it at least looks like he is reading everything thoroughly. Which is more than I may say for you! who is an actual contestant in this Challenge.
Anyway, I'll be back tomorrow to continue this discussion see if we may come to an understanding. Good night.
If you can come up with a way to guarantee payment and reasonable terms, I will probably go way above and beyond the requirements. For example, if you say I need pictures of $1000000 unpaid markers I would probably put up 3-5 million. Whatever the case, you shouldn't care if my evidence falls short, that only benefits you.Quote: MDawgIf I may make an analogy, in law there are issues of fact, and then there are issues of law.
My conditions are absolute. They are like issues of law. If I say you must post images of television screens in your suite and hotel folios to prove you were comp'ed, the way I have, that is an issue that doesn't get to the jury. The judges (jury) are not allowed to let up on that condition.
All they are allowed to do, is interpret (issue of fact) whether you have fulfilled that term, with whatever you post.
Similarly, no judges (jury) are allowed to let up on the condition that millions in markers must be posted by you. That is another condition of the Challenge.
And given how imprecise people are with reading through a lot of this stuff, so far the only ones I see who seem to be following closely are UnJon and CoachBelly. If I were to pick them as judges, it would not be because either is biased towards me, but because they seem meticulous.
I mean I think UnJon has said plenty of things against me in the past, but it at least looks like he is reading everything thoroughly. Which is more than I can say for you! who is an actual contestant in this Challenge.
Anyway, I'll be back tomorrow to continue this discussion see if we may come to an understanding. Good night.
Actually I just realized one thing.
One of the things AxelWolf mentioned, was that he thought that the player WIN statements I posted via video at the end of each year belonged to some other player, and not to me. But that's so unlikely as to be practically impossible.
All year long, I'm posting trip reports claiming I won this or that per session, per trip. The trips all together add up to a certain amount, and the sums claimed that I won per casino, add up a certain amount for that casino.
Then all of a sudden at the end of the year I post a win statement of me logged into a player account that corroborates those exact wins, both in sum total, and in total per casino.
Well, if, as AxelWolf claims, I am providing the WIN statement of some other player, how could I have known as I was posting along all year long, that these amounts I "faked" in my simulated play (remember that AxelWolf claims I am not even playing, that this is all a hoax) would end up equaling the exact sums that this player whose player account I "borrowed" for this elaborate hoax, would match the exact sums I had claimed in sum, all year.
Or do I know so many casino players that I was able to find one for each casino who won exactly the sums I needed, to corroborate my claims.
I mean AxelWolf's story falls apart in so many ways, it's just not feasible. I'd have to know a year ahead! what this player whose account I was going to borrow, had won, so that as I posted away over the year, what I claimed to win, would equal what he was going to win, by the end of a year in the future.
Which brings me to this Challenge. AxelWolf is going to have to post enough trips, for a long enough period, to get to the end of 2021, to be able to post win statements for at least 2021. I mean otherwise, he isn't doing what I am doing, OR what HE claims I am doing.
He can't just find some buddy of his out there who won 80K in 2019, and then make up 80K worth of fake sessions, after the fact. That's not equivalent to what I did. What I did is post the sessions FIRST, over the course of the year, then at the end of the year post the win statement.
The point of this is to prove that what I did could be faked.
Two things:
Number one, it sounds like MDawg wants you to create a thread that is the same size as his. He is demanding you post millions of dollars worth of markers for example and demanding that many things match what he has always claimed is for you to create a "three years long thread"
AXEL, IT TOOK MDAWG THREE YEARS TO CREATE IT!!!!
If he is asking you to create in one week or one month what it took him three years to do, then you aren't duplicating what MDawg did, you are surpassing it by mother, effing multiples.
You really don't see what he is doing here. He isn't challenging you to do what he did but something he never could do (create a three years long thread in a matter of weeks of month)
2) You really need to counter his argument about this being similar to a court of law
Courts of law the jury must be unanimous. COURTS OF LAW THE PLAINTIFF AND DEFENDANT DON'T GET TO PICK THEIR JURORS(not in the sense that they may be people they already have past biased interaction)
I can explain it to you, but I can’t understand it for you.Quote: coachbellyWhat is the point that AW will have proved?
Exactly, so let's move on and figure out how you can guarantee payment and find some judges. The rest is just you posting words that are meaningless to me.Quote: MDawg
The point of this is to prove that what I did could be faked.
Quote: AxelWolfExactly, so let's move on and figure out how you can guarantee payment and find some judges. The rest is just you posting words that are meaningless to me.
AxelWolf,
I have one further suggestion to try to move this forward.
Quote the post with the actual challenge and say you accept those terms (or point out which ones you have an issue with), subject to guarantee of payment and resolution of how challenge will be judged.
If you are willing to do that it will close off one of the three issues.
If he is tossing out unreasonable terms then its a dishonest challenge and people will see that and judge the rest of his post and him as such.Quote: darkozAXEL,
Two things:
Number one, it sounds like MDawg wants you to create a thread that is the same size as his. He is demanding you post millions of dollars worth of markers for example and demanding that many things match what he has always claimed is for you to create a "three years long thread"
AXEL, IT TOOK MDAWG THREE YEARS TO CREATE IT!!!!
If he is asking you to create in one week or one month what it took him three years to do, then you aren't duplicating what MDawg did, you are surpassing it by mother, effing multiples.
You really don't see what he is doing here. He isn't challenging you to do what he did but something he never could do (create a three years long thread in a matter of weeks of month)
2) You really need to counter his argument about this being similar to a court of law
Courts of law the jury must be unanimous. COURTS OF LAW THE PLAINTIFF AND DEFENDANT DON'T GET TO PICK THEIR JURORS(not in the sense that they may be people they already have past biased interaction)
Here is what he asked for....
-stacks of cash
-stacks of chips
-millions of dollars in paid off markers
-casino checks issued for wins
-pictures and videos of high end timepieces
-pictures of winning Baccarat shoes
-pictures of large Vegas high roller suites
-pictures of gourmets meal eaten at casino resort restaurants
-pictures of the television screen inside the suites, and paper folios, that prove full RFB comps.
-actual video of WIN statements while logged in live to player card accounts to substantiate all alleged wins
to back up a faked AxelWolf narrative to rival MDawg’s.
Well, he has either obliquely or directly stated this more than once. And this MDawg challenge by the way, goes for anyone, not just for AxelWolf.
If anyone, AxelWolf included, is able to produce a three year long faked Adventures thread that supports the evidence to anywhere near the same level I have, I will pay that person $5000. If he keeps adding to that then well we all know what's going on.
LOL I was thinking the same thing and was looking for it and posted as you were typing this.Quote: unJonAxelWolf,
I have one further suggestion to try to move this forward.
Quote the post with the actual challenge and say you accept those terms
I said I accept the challenge so long as he guarantees payment if I succeed and theres a reasonable method of judging it. I don't know what else I can do, or say.
Quote: AxelWolfIf he is tossing out unreasonable terms then its a dishonest challenge and people will see that and judge the rest of his post and him as such.
Here is what he asked for....
-stacks of cash
-stacks of chips
-millions of dollars in paid off markers
-casino checks issued for wins
-pictures and videos of high end timepieces
-pictures of winning Baccarat shoes
-pictures of large Vegas high roller suites
-pictures of gourmets meal eaten at casino resort restaurants
-pictures of the television screen inside the suites, and paper folios, that prove full RFB comps.
-actual video of WIN statements while logged in live to player card accounts to substantiate all alleged wins
to back up a faked AxelWolf narrative to rival MDawg’s.
Well, he has either obliquely or directly stated this more than once. And this MDawg challenge by the way, goes for anyone, not just for AxelWolf.
If anyone, AxelWolf included, is able to produce a three year long faked Adventures thread that supports the evidence to anywhere near the same level I have, I will pay that person $5000. If he keeps adding to that then well we all know what's going on.
UnJon, you see, he hasn't accepted my Challenge whatsoever. He's still going back to claiming that <<If he is tossing out unreasonable terms then its a dishonest challenge and people will see that and judge the rest of his post and him as such. >> He did that with the markers, he did that with his talk about one out of focus posts, etc.
We're not on the same page yet.
He has to accept my Challenge in its entirety to move on. What he's doing is just giving lip service to accepting it, and then coming back later with objections.
What he's really saying is, I'm hoping not to have to post all that, and I'm not committing to posting all that yet.
My terms are absolute. Neither AxelWolf nor the judges have a right to state, yes well, I don't think AxelWolf has to post millions in markers. Yes well, I don't think he has to produce three years of trip reports. Yes well, I don't think he has to post pictures and videos of high end timepieces. Yes well, I don't think he has to post actual video of WIN statements while logged in live to player card accounts to substantiate all alleged wins. etc. Those are the terms for the Challenge! these are absolute.
Yes I came up with those terms because I myself posted all of that, but either he accepts the terms or we're done here.
Just like I said in my courtroom analogy, those are like issues of law. They don't get to the jury. The jury just has a right to decide issues of fact - whether AxelWolf has successfully produced evidence that qualifies for each of these terms.
If we can't get past that part, there is nothing more to talk about. The terms are not open to negotiation. I'm not going to waste a bunch of time just to have AxelWolf come back with some conniving qualifier again like the "only if it's a good deal" one he imposed on his unconditional watch offer.
