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Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 9:05:02 AM permalink
Question for the veteran craps players:

Is leaving place/buy/come-odds bets ON during comeout rolls considered bad etiquette? Sort of like betting the don’t since you can be winning/losing while everyone else is pushing ?

I’ve set come odds to ON a few times and some other players shook their heads. And when a seven is rolled during comeout, making my bet lose, they have this smug look like “that’s why you leave it OFF”

Also, do dealers care if you leave bets on? I suppose it’s more work for them tracking which bets are on instead of knowing everything is off during comeout.
It’s all about making that GTA
ChumpChange
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July 9th, 2022 at 9:11:20 AM permalink
I'm not above throwing five 7's on the come-out rolls. All I can say is "7-11 coming out!"
If playing the DP, just lower the bets and increase the odds to avoid losing big on the come-outs.
As for having 4 to 6 PB's up and ON during the come-out, I can only say it's a mistake and you'll be seeing your chips disappear in rapid succession. Now for point 7-outs, you'll still be seeing your chips disappear in rapid succession whether your bets were ON or OFF during the come-out.

As for Come-bets with odds, I'd have two $20 Come bets up with a $40 PL bet, so a 7-winner is basically a Push with the Come-odds OFF. On a 10X Odds table I could have 3,4,5X Odds on the PL and 6,8,10X Odds on each of the Come bets.
AlanMendelson
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July 9th, 2022 at 10:26:45 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Question for the veteran craps players:

Is leaving place/buy/come-odds bets ON during comeout rolls considered bad etiquette? Sort of like betting the don’t since you can be winning/losing while everyone else is pushing ?

I’ve set come odds to ON a few times and some other players shook their heads. And when a seven is rolled during comeout, making my bet lose, they have this smug look like “that’s why you leave it OFF”

Also, do dealers care if you leave bets on? I suppose it’s more work for them tracking which bets are on instead of knowing everything is off during comeout.
link to original post



It has nothing to do with etiquette.
It should have no effect on dealers.

I'm kind of surprised an experienced craps player would ask these questions.
MDawg
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July 9th, 2022 at 10:37:51 AM permalink
As I recall the dealers always ask "Off on the come out?" when you place those bets, so I assume Off is the standard.

A craps player I knew used to say that Come bets are only for when the table is hotter than hot and only 11s and points are being rolled. The rest of the time I suppose he suggested just buying the numbers, and not all of them unless things were really happening.

When I used to play mostly I'd just bet the line and max odds and that was it.

Over all, I just never got into craps because my wins and losses in that game more or less evened out.
I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
ChumpChange
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July 9th, 2022 at 10:49:52 AM permalink
Craps is a horribly slow game compared to BJ or Baccarat. But a Hot Shooter once an hour can make up for an hour of losses.
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 11:43:21 AM permalink
Quote: MDawg

As I recall the dealers always ask "Off on the come out?" when you place those bets, so I assume Off is the standard.
]

I don’t ever recall them asking. Off by default and it’s rare to see people keep them on
It’s all about making that GTA
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 11:48:56 AM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

Craps is a horribly slow game compared to BJ or Baccarat. But a Hot Shooter once an hour can make up for an hour of losses.
link to original post

I suggest you try “always coming”. You can have up to seven active bets (all six points covered plus a PL bet). At that stage you have a bet resolved every roll…about every 35 seconds. It’s actually too fast IMO. You could also buy/place all the numbers if you don’t mind paying five to ten times higher edge

One of the best features of craps is you can probably make it as fast or slow as you like
It’s all about making that GTA
odiousgambit
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July 9th, 2022 at 11:51:46 AM permalink
I have my odds working all the time, usually. It is an 'ouch' I really feel when the 7-winner is a loser for your still-standing odds bets ... other players 'knowing looks' not needed. I usually just sort of agree, then say 'overall it just seems to be lucky for me' ... they can accept that kind of thinking.

If you want to experience confirmation bias, btw, this is a great time for that. If you [if you're like me] review the number of times you benefited from leaving them on, with the number of times it hurt you... if you didn't write it down and just go on memory, you'll definitely conclude you got burned. Ha! Guarantee it. Of course, you'll likely forget you are expected to lose more often than you win; if it was about 50% of the time you are killing it!

playing the darkside, the odds are always on btw
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!”   She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
odiousgambit
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July 9th, 2022 at 11:55:43 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: ChumpChange

Craps is a horribly slow game compared to BJ or Baccarat. But a Hot Shooter once an hour can make up for an hour of losses.
link to original post

I suggest you try “always coming”. You can have up to seven active bets (all six points covered plus a PL bet). At that stage you have a bet resolved every roll…about every 35 seconds. It’s actually too fast IMO. You could also buy/place all the numbers if you don’t mind paying five to ten times higher edge

One of the best features of craps is you can probably make it as fast or slow as you like
link to original post

too fast and too much in action [for me]
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!”   She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
ChumpChange
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July 9th, 2022 at 11:56:55 AM permalink
Too many shooters shooting less than the average 8.5 rolls per turn. I've had to cut back to one or two numbers to be bet on.
Some day I'll give up my optimism and bet 2 Don't numbers per turn and triple my session money in the first hour.
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 11:58:36 AM permalink
Quote: odiousgambit

I have my odds working all the time, usually. It is an 'ouch' I really feel when the 7-winner is a loser for your still-standing odds bets ... other players 'knowing looks' not needed. I usually just sort of agree, then say 'overall it just seems to be lucky for me' ... they can accept that kind of thinking.

If you want to experience confirmation bias, btw, this is a great time for that. If you [if you're like me] review the number of times you benefited from leaving them on, with the number of times it hurt you... if you didn't write it down and just go on memory, you'll definitely conclude you got burned. Ha! Guarantee it. Of course, you'll likely forget you are expected to lose more often than you win; if it was about 50% of the time you are killing it!

playing the darkside, the odds are always on btw
link to original post

Since these are free odds, the net effect is zero. Leaving them on just effectively increases your playing time and variance since your bets are working for more rolls
It’s all about making that GTA
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 12:08:16 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

[

I'm kind of surprised an experienced craps player would ask these questions.
link to original post

I’ve been playing about five years but I struggle understanding some of the superstitions. For instance, I will never understand the animosity that sometimes exists toward Don’t bettors…you’re betting. heads and I’m betting tails and the casino is holding about 1.4% on both of us.
It’s all about making that GTA
AlanMendelson
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July 9th, 2022 at 12:09:51 PM permalink
Free odds is a misnomer.

Better to say the payoff on odds has no house advantage and no player advantage.

But they're not free.

I don't know why or how the term "free odds" came to be and why it's been repeated. But no bet on a craps table is really free... unless you're using a promo chip.
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 12:17:15 PM permalink
Over the long run you lose nothing on the odds bet. Costs nothing. Meets my definition of free
It’s all about making that GTA
AlanMendelson
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July 9th, 2022 at 12:28:29 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Over the long run you lose nothing on the odds bet. Costs nothing. Meets my definition of free
link to original post



I'd love to see a poll on this:

Over your life playing craps on the odds I

A. Lost money
B. Broke even
C. Made money
D. Broke even but I dont understand why I lost more than 1.41% of my bankroll
ChumpChange
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July 9th, 2022 at 12:33:21 PM permalink
You win 400 odds bets and lose 600 odds bets, hopefully that pays out to even, but maybe you'll hit some win goals or loss goals along the way.
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 2:11:09 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

Quote: Ace2

Over the long run you lose nothing on the odds bet. Costs nothing. Meets my definition of free
link to original post



I'd love to see a poll on this:

Over your life playing craps on the odds I

A. Lost money
B. Broke even
C. Made money
D. Broke even but I dont understand why I lost more than 1.41% of my bankroll
link to original post

That’s easy. Assuming 100,000 bets resolved, 99% chance your answer will be B +/- 1% of total amount wagered. Half a percent chance you won more than 1% and half a percent chance you lost more than 1%.
It’s all about making that GTA
AlanMendelson
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July 9th, 2022 at 2:54:07 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: AlanMendelson

Quote: Ace2

Over the long run you lose nothing on the odds bet. Costs nothing. Meets my definition of free
link to original post



I'd love to see a poll on this:

Over your life playing craps on the odds I

A. Lost money
B. Broke even
C. Made money
D. Broke even but I dont understand why I lost more than 1.41% of my bankroll
link to original post

That’s easy. Assuming 100,000 bets resolved, 99% chance your answer will be B +/- 1% of total amount wagered. Half a percent chance you won more than 1% and half a percent chance you lost more than 1%.
link to original post



So... how much more than 1% ??
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 2:58:48 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson



So... how much more than 1% ??
link to original post

Please elaborate. I don't understand the question
It’s all about making that GTA
ChumpChange
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July 9th, 2022 at 3:39:37 PM permalink
Say the average odds bet is $80, times 100,000 odds decisions, equals $8 million total bet, times 1% equals $80,000. So you have a 99% chance of winding up between -$80,000 and + $80,000 just on the odds bets. With $20 PL bets times 100,000 decisions (there's more decisions but I don't know how many yet) that's $2 million bet on the PL, times 1.41% equals $28,200 house advantage. So already it's looking like -$110K to + $50K and it's not complete.
AlanMendelson
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July 9th, 2022 at 3:41:28 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: AlanMendelson



So... how much more than 1% ??
link to original post

Please elaborate. I don't understand the question
link to original post



You wrote:

"Half a percent chance you won more than 1% and half a percent chance you lost more than 1%."

My question is how much more than 1% am I winning or losing?
tuttigym
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July 9th, 2022 at 4:27:39 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: ChumpChange

Craps is a horribly slow game compared to BJ or Baccarat. But a Hot Shooter once an hour can make up for an hour of losses.
link to original post

I suggest you try “always coming”. You can have up to seven active bets (all six points covered plus a PL bet). At that stage you have a bet resolved every roll…about every 35 seconds. It’s actually too fast IMO. You could also buy/place all the numbers if you don’t mind paying five to ten times higher edge

One of the best features of craps is you can probably make it as fast or slow as you like
link to original post


Isn't that 30 ways to win an only six ways to lose? 4th grade arithmetic I knew you would come around Ace2. Just jump in, the water is really fine.

tuttigym
tuttigym
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July 9th, 2022 at 4:32:23 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: AlanMendelson

[

I'm kind of surprised an experienced craps player would ask these questions.
link to original post

I’ve been playing about five years but I struggle understanding some of the superstitions. For instance, I will never understand the animosity that sometimes exists toward Don’t bettors…you’re betting. heads and I’m betting tails and the casino is holding about 1.4% on both of us.
link to original post


You need to complete that strategy, i.e., that is the PL bet only. The rest of the wagers are nowhere close to 1.4%. So what is the "casino holding" on the rest of the wagers?

tuttigym
tuttigym
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July 9th, 2022 at 4:36:04 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Over the long run you lose nothing on the odds bet. Costs nothing. Meets my definition of free
link to original post


I will wager that that statement comes directly from computer simulations which of course are so accurate that they are impossible to perform.

tuttigym
tuttigym
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July 9th, 2022 at 4:44:02 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2


That’s easy. Assuming 100,000 bets resolved, 99% chance your answer will be B +/- 1% of total amount wagered. Half a percent chance you won more than 1% and half a percent chance you lost more than 1%.
link to original post


Really? Really? Suppose you, starting tomorrow or whenever you get to your nearest casino, start tracking 100,000 of YOUR bets and give us all the results. We trust you to be accurate. BTW how many potty breaks will that entail?

tuttigym
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 5:10:11 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

Quote: Ace2

Quote: AlanMendelson



So... how much more than 1% ??
link to original post

Please elaborate. I don't understand the question
link to original post



You wrote:

"Half a percent chance you won more than 1% and half a percent chance you lost more than 1%."

My question is how much more than 1% am I winning or losing?
link to original post

Well, 1% is about 3 standard deviations which is why it gives 99% confidence. 2% would be about 6 SDs…meaning around a 1 in 500 million chance (essentially zero) of being up or down more than 2% after 100k bets. You have a better shot at winning the Powerball jackpot tonight (1 in 292 million )
It’s all about making that GTA
AlanMendelson
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July 9th, 2022 at 5:17:13 PM permalink
Quote: tuttigym

Quote: Ace2

Over the long run you lose nothing on the odds bet. Costs nothing. Meets my definition of free
link to original post


I will wager that that statement comes directly from computer simulations which of course are so accurate that they are impossible to perform.

tuttigym
link to original post



I think it comes from a textbook or Internet article or definition that explains the perfect world of theory but is something no one has ever experienced in actual play.

I'd like to see just one YouTuber post a video of a craps session where they actually had the results dictated by the math, i.e., they won 1 out of 3 points when the point was 4 or 10; they won 2 out of 3 points when the point was 5 or 9; they won 5 out of 6 points when the point was 6 or 8.

What I'd really like to see is the actual play of those who quote the math.
MDawg
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July 9th, 2022 at 7:08:49 PM permalink
I can report actual table game play based on me and my winning results are nothing like what might be expected based on playing with no advantage, a small advantage, or a small disadvantage.

Similarly I don't see the loss that might be expected with most of these other players who are playing with no advantage. I see most of them dump their entire bankrolls trip after trip, or even if they do have a winning trip it gets eclipsed by many losers.

This and some other posts of mine pretty much sum up what I have observed.

I suppose if someone flat bets then over the amount of time that the average player puts in things might even out, but given first of all that the average player has a limited bankroll and all players have limits on max bets, over the period of time that the average player puts in if he varies his bet greatly you can't really say with certainty that things will even out to where he loses exactly the house edge, and my empirical evidence and observation confirm this as well. Time is part of the key - the average player doesn't necessarily put in the amount of time for expected probability to gibe with actual results, but especially so if the player wildly varies his bet and just happens to bet big when the variance is going strongly against him, which as unscientific as that may sound, seems to happen a lot more than the opposite, betting big when things are going well.

You just see that all the time, someone betting small when winning 80% of his hands, and betting ridiculously big when losing almost every hand.
I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
Ace2
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July 9th, 2022 at 7:23:49 PM permalink
If you are widely varying your bets then there is no reliable way to predict your results. They might come down to just a few huge bets.

But if you are flat betting then the house edge % is already quite noticeable after 1000 bets, and some of us will make that many bets in one trip to Vegas. By noticeable I mean that the guy flat betting red at the double zero roulette table will almost always leave a loser and the guy flat betting 3:2 blackjack with proper strategy will win nearly half of his trips.
It’s all about making that GTA
MDawg
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July 9th, 2022 at 7:32:28 PM permalink
I would agree with that.

I just don't see very many flat betting at Blackjack or Baccarat. Time and again you see that huge case bet and the player slinking away unhappily.

And very rarely do I see that flat betting Bank only Baccarat player.

Maybe at craps there is more flat betting?

I suppose given enough TIME if someone were wildly varying his bet EVENTUALLY things might even out to where the expected house advantage or player advantage would equal the result, but I don't think a player could necessarily put in enough time and have the bankroll to ENSURE that that happened.
I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
Ace2
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UP84
July 9th, 2022 at 7:40:21 PM permalink
If your trip results basically come down to ten huge bets, then what’s the point of even making the other 990 small bets ? Kill time and get free drinks ?
It’s all about making that GTA
MDawg
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July 9th, 2022 at 7:44:20 PM permalink
Looking back on sessions yes sometimes it comes down to one or two huge bets that end up equaling the total win (or loss) for that session, however for whatever reason these bets don't seem to come in the beginning, at all. They don't necessarily come at the end either, although sometimes they do.

Whether it's blackjack or baccarat people don't like to just lay it all out there first hand....
I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
Tanko
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July 10th, 2022 at 3:49:17 AM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

I'd like to see just one YouTuber post a video of a craps session where they actually had the results dictated by the math, i.e., they won 1 out of 3 points when the point was 4 or 10; they won 2 out of 3 points when the point was 5 or 9; they won 5 out of 6 points when the point was 6 or 8.



Rusty from 'The Craps Lab' does that in this video. He begins discussing pass line results by point, and place bet results at 8:00

UP84
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July 10th, 2022 at 6:24:41 AM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson


I'd love to see a poll on this:

Over your life playing craps on the odds I

A. Lost money
B. Broke even
C. Made money
D. Broke even but I dont understand why I lost more than 1.41% of my bankroll
link to original post

Over a lifetime of of craps on 3x-4x-5x tables only where my only play consists of flat bets (switching back and forth between Do an Don't about equally) and always taking max odds, my answer would be:

A. Lost money...the loss being about 0.3275% of my total lifetime wagers.
Ace2
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July 10th, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM permalink
Quote: UP84

Over a lifetime of of craps on 3x-4x-5x tables only where my only play consists of flat bets (switching back and forth between Do an Don't about equally) and always taking max odds, my answer would be:

A. Lost money...the loss being about 0.3275% of my total lifetime wagers.
link to original post

Sounds about right !
Last edited by: Ace2 on Jul 10, 2022
It’s all about making that GTA
tuttigym
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July 10th, 2022 at 9:27:28 AM permalink
Quote: UP84


Over a lifetime of of craps on 3x-4x-5x tables only where my only play consists of flat bets (switching back and forth between Do an Don't about equally) and always taking max odds, my answer would be:

A. Lost money...the loss being about 0.3275% of my total lifetime wagers.
link to original post


1. Define "lifetime."
2. Average table minimum?
3. "lifetime" total estimated wagers?
4. So, no other wagers during your craps session?

tuttigym
tuttigym
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July 10th, 2022 at 9:47:19 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2


Well, 1% is about 3 standard deviations which is why it gives 99% confidence. 2% would be about 6 SDs…meaning around a 1 in 500 million chance (essentially zero) of being up or down more than 2% after 100k bets. You have a better shot at winning the Powerball jackpot tonight (1 in 292 million )
link to original post


This post should come with a "parental warning": BEWARE: Don't try this at your local casino 100k bets may be hazardous to one's financial security and mental well-being.

And you always seem to leave out that the statements ONLY pertain to the PL wagers. Why is that?

tuttigym
tuttigym
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July 10th, 2022 at 9:54:17 AM permalink
Quote: MDawg

I can report actual table game play based on me and my winning results are nothing like what might be expected based on playing with no advantage, a small advantage, or a small disadvantage.


In craps, MDawg, define actual Advantage Play specifically related to the game.

Mr. Mendelson: Please answer this question AFTER MDawg posts his response, if he does.

tuttigym
tuttigym
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July 10th, 2022 at 10:04:46 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2

If you are widely varying your bets then there is no reliable way to predict your results. They might come down to just a few huge bets.

But if you are flat betting then the house edge % is already quite noticeable after 1000 bets, and some of us will make that many bets in one trip to Vegas. By noticeable I mean that the guy flat betting red at the double zero roulette table will almost always leave a loser and the guy flat betting 3:2 blackjack with proper strategy will win nearly half of his trips.
link to original post


Let's see, 1000 $10 PL bets or $10,000 will result in a loss of $141 (theoretically). So, how long at a table averaging 6 players playing will it take to make those 1000 $10 PL wagers, and is a total small loss of $141 really "quite noticeable"?

Just keep coming up with those great reality table plays, and I will keep asking the hard questions waiting for the real answers or crickets.

tuttigym
UP84
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July 10th, 2022 at 10:19:23 AM permalink
Quote: tuttigym

Quote: UP84


Over a lifetime of of craps on 3x-4x-5x tables only where my only play consists of flat bets (switching back and forth between Do an Don't about equally) and always taking max odds, my answer would be:

A. Lost money...the loss being about 0.3275% of my total lifetime wagers.
link to original post


1. Define "lifetime."
2. Average table minimum?
3. "lifetime" total estimated wagers?
4. So, no other wagers during your craps session?

tuttigym
link to original post


1. Define "lifetime."
More than 25 girlfriends ago, which for some members of this forum would be over two dozen lifetimes.

2. Average table minimum?
21. But over in Macau I definitely saw some teenagers at the tables.

3. "lifetime" total estimated wagers?
A lot.

4. So, no other wagers during your craps session?
Well to be honest once, in July 1999, for thrills I put $25 on the hard 10 just to see what it feels like to be a sucker.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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July 10th, 2022 at 10:19:28 AM permalink
I'm going to GUESS that a passline bet on average takes 8 rolls to resolve. At a typical table there's a roll every 30 seconds is my guess. So a passline bet takes 4 minutes to resolve.

With buyins and colorups I'm guessing a passline bet is made and resolved each 5 minutes or 12 times per hour.

1000 bets ÷ 12 = 83 hours

Playing 8 hours a day it would take 10 days to report the action on 1,000 passline bets.

This again is my guess. And I'm including long rolls as well as winner-7s and winner-11s in my guesstimate.
Ace2
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July 10th, 2022 at 10:42:37 AM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

I'm going to GUESS that a passline bet on average takes 8 rolls to resolve.

Without using basic math, GUESS is all you can do
It’s all about making that GTA
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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July 10th, 2022 at 10:53:32 AM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: AlanMendelson

I'm going to GUESS that a passline bet on average takes 8 rolls to resolve.

Without using basic math, GUESS is all you can do
link to original post



Yeah but I actually play... not just read Internet articles.
MDawg
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July 10th, 2022 at 10:56:44 AM permalink
In the past, I estimated my handle (over a billion dollars as of about two decades ago before I took a decade or so break from casino play) based on what hosts told me it was on given nights (over a million on some sessions), and then extrapolating, but really, it would be difficult if not impossible for me to calculate it exactly over time based on that I vary my bets greatly.

Anyone who comes on here to calculate his handle easily must be flat betting and even then must have a very good record of hours played. Otherwise, I'd have to say that offering imprecise calculations of the handle obviate the ability to calculate what % of money wagered was won or lost.

It also doesn't make a lot of sense that anyone would flat bet over an entire lifetime - so, this person started off rich and always bet the same, or this person started off poor and remained poor? Most people will not bet the same their entire lifetimes. (An exception might be someone like Bill Gates - I saw him play blackjack and it was with red chips only, and I understand that if he plays at all, he always plays very small, which is probably the same as he bet before he struck it rich - but even so, if Bill Gates wants to play today unless he goes to some dump he will have to play green chips, so even he would have a hard time flat betting his entire lifetime.)

If you don't really know exactly how much you wagered then you can't calculate what % you won or lost.

At at least one of the casinos, after I complained about that they were underreporting my average bet, they started "bet tracking" me which means that the pit boss was writing down every single bet I made on a piece of paper and later calculating the exact average of these bets. Not an easy feat given hundreds of bets made per session. Absent doing that and then adding up every bet, you can't know exactly what your handle was for a session, let alone for many sessions.
Last edited by: MDawg on Jul 10, 2022
I tell you it’s wonderful to be here, man. I don’t give a damn who wins or loses. It’s just wonderful to be here with you people. https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/betting-systems/33908-the-adventures-of-mdawg/
Ace2
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July 10th, 2022 at 12:54:45 PM permalink
Quote: UP84


4. So, no other wagers during your craps session?
Well to be honest once, in July 1999, for thrills I put $25 on the hard 10 just to see what it feels like to be a sucker.
link to original post

Years ago I did something similar. I placed the 5 once
It’s all about making that GTA
UP84
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July 10th, 2022 at 1:36:08 PM permalink
Quote: Ace2

Quote: UP84


4. So, no other wagers during your craps session?
Well to be honest once, in July 1999, for thrills I put $25 on the hard 10 just to see what it feels like to be a sucker.
link to original post

Years ago I did something similar. I placed the 5 once
link to original post

Yeah, gotta live dangerously every now and then!

Anyway, back to your original questions, I always keep my come odds working on the come out roll. No particular reason other than consistency (I don't mind the added variance).

Sometimes when a seven appears on the come out I'll get a disapproving look from another player...of course these scornful glances usually occur as he or she eagerly puts down a center-of-the-table bet. It really doesn't bother me.

For the most part keeping the come odds working on the come out roll is not a problem for the dealers, as long as you're consistent. What bothers them most are players who sometimes keep the odds working and sometimes do not.
Ace2
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July 10th, 2022 at 3:02:35 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson


Yeah but I actually play... not just read Internet articles.
link to original post

No idea what you're talking about
It’s all about making that GTA
ChumpChange
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July 10th, 2022 at 3:05:53 PM permalink
Betting $3 on the PL with $3, $4, $5 odds, the average bet is $7 per point, the average win is $9 per point. If I bet $1,400 total wagers, that'd be near 200 points not counting come-out rolls. I could include Come bets in this calculation.

But I'm getting fed up waiting around for the 2nd point to hit, so next time I may just put $7 on the Buy 5 or/& 9. If I hit one of those 9 times in a turn on my progression, I'd win $405. If I hit 5 times on one number, that'd be over 10X my $7 bet won. I wouldn't keep my Buy bets ON during the come-out because I don't want to reset my progression until after a 7-out.
Last edited by: ChumpChange on Jul 10, 2022
AlanMendelson
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July 10th, 2022 at 3:14:13 PM permalink
I don't understand why any other player would care if you keep your place or come bet odds working on a come out throw. I don't understand why any player would give you a scornful look if you did keep your bets working.

Why would another player criticize you?

Play your game. It's your money.

It has no impact on dealers either as long as the dealers are understanding your bet.

Is this a group troll?
ChumpChange
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July 10th, 2022 at 3:18:20 PM permalink
I notice DP players tend to pass the dice so they don't piss off the table by throwing "craps 3" 4 times on the come-out.
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