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Nareed
Nareed
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December 27th, 2011 at 9:30:02 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Somewhere I read about this before. Maybe it was here. So, it would seem there are four meals a day in Mexico:



Five.

But most people eat three: Deasyuno, ComIda y Cena.

The timing depends on your shcedule. mine is about like this:

Desayuno 7:20 am
Comida 2-3 pm
Cena 8-9 pm

Quote:

Where it gets confusing for me is the word comeda seems to also carry connotations of "lunch," and comer can mean to eat lunch.



Double duty words.. <sigh>

ComIda literally means food, which answers your other question. Comer means to eat. But Comida also means the mid-day meal, or lunch, and comer can mean eating the comida.

Quote:

Is there any word that just means "food" in general? I know you said that your job is selling food, but how would you put that in Spanish?



There's a number of words for food: víveres, comida and alimentos are the most common.

Quote:

"Date prisa. Tienes que merendar," ordenó a Ramona mientras su abuela veía la televisión y tejia. Resultó que la merienda era un jugo de piña y galletas de centeno,...



Wow. Find out where that was translated. "Centeno" is a type of grain, but I'm not sure which. It seems odd to reffer to the grain the cookies are made of. Whats' the original English say?

Quote:

Finally, there is an interesting discussion of American vs. Mexican Coke in this thread.



I saw. I posted a bit. The last time I drank a soda with sugar in it on prupose was after donating blood. I downed it so fast I don't think I tasted it.

Edited to add:

The day you and Teddys and I met, I debated whether to have breakfast or not, seeing as we would be eating lunch by noon or so, which is too early for me. Since I was still running on Mex City time, though, and woke up far too early, I had a light breakfast only.
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pacomartin
pacomartin
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December 27th, 2011 at 9:49:32 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Is there any word that just means "food" in general?



alimento as a noun means "food" or "nourishment" . An English cognate would be alimony
alimentar means "to feed"
alimento means "I feed" as first person present indicative of verb. Distinguished from the noun by context.
alimentarse means "to feed myself" (I don't know if this form is used very often. I suspect not.)
pacomartin
pacomartin
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December 28th, 2011 at 5:01:37 AM permalink
Quote: Nareed

Wow. Find out where that was translated. "Centeno" is a type of grain, but I'm not sure which. It seems odd to reffer to the grain the cookies are made of. Whats' the original English say?



The speaker is a five year old girl at her grandmother's house. She is talking to a slightly older girl named Ramona. The book is about 30 years old.

"Hurry up and have your snack," she ordered, while her grandmother sat watching television and crocheting.
"Date prisa. Tienes que merendar," ordenó a Ramona mientras su abuela veía la televisión y tejia.

The snack turned out to be pineapple juice and Rye Crisp,...
Resultó que la merienda era un jugo de piña y galletas de centeno,...

Rye Crisp crackers are very popular in Scandinavia where they are eaten constantly. Americans tend to prefer saltier crackers.
Nareed
Nareed
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December 28th, 2011 at 7:04:29 AM permalink
Quote: pacomartin

The snack turned out to be pineapple juice and Rye Crisp,...



What's really odd is juice with crackers....

Seriously, the grain a cookie or cracker si amde of doesn't get much mention in Mexico. Partly because 99% are made of wheat, I guess.

Also there's no word for crackers in Spanish. The closest term is "galletas saladas."
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Wizard
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Wizard
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December 28th, 2011 at 7:51:31 AM permalink
I haven't thought about Rye Crisp crackers in decades. My father used to eat them all the time, and they were often the only decent snack in the house. Did they quit making them? I haven't seen them around their house for at least 25 years.

Quote: Nareed

Five.

But most people eat three: Deasyuno, ComIda y Cena.



Do I have this right and in order?

desayuno, merienda, comida, almuerzo, cena?

Fecha: 28-12-11
Palabra del día: Partir


Today's word is one of those tricky words that generally means to divide or crack open, but finds its way into other expressions as well. Since Paco enjoyed dissecting the last passage from Ramona, let's look at where I found today's SWD.

Quote: English

Nothing in the whole world felt as good as being able to make something from a sudden idea.



Quote: Spanish

No hay nada mejor en el mundo entero que ponerse a hacer algo partiendo de una idea repentina.



Here we see partir being used in a sense that the sudden idea cracked open and Ramona made something from it.

When I read through the Spanish version I was also confused by que ponerse. Normally poner means to put. I've also seen it used in a sense of turning something on or doing something. Using it in a sense of "to feel good" is totally new to me, and would appreciate comment.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
pacomartin
pacomartin
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December 28th, 2011 at 8:49:07 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I haven't thought about Rye Crisp crackers in decades. My father used to eat them all the time, and they were often the only decent snack in the house. Did they quit making them? I haven't seen them around their house for at least 25 years.

Today's word is one of those tricky words that generally means to divide or crack open, but finds its way into other expressions as well. Since Paco enjoyed dissecting the last passage from Ramona, let's look at where I found today's SWD.

When I read through the Spanish version I was also confused by que ponerse. Normally poner means to put. I've also seen it used in a sense of turning something on or doing something. Using it in a sense of "to feel good" is totally new to me, and would appreciate comment.



Rye crisps are very popular in Scandinavia where the government has a campaign to eat them every day. They are too bland for most Americans who prefer their snacks much saltier.

I dissected the sentence to show how many decisions go into translating a book for children. I noticed Nareed doesn't read my longer posts because she repeats some of the things I say. I suspect the rather lengthy discussion of grammar points are tedious if you know the language. But for Wiz, try and translate one passage yourself from English, and then compare it to the Spanish version and see how many verb tenses you both agree on. You are more likely to use a "-ing" form of a verb because they are so prevalent in English.

The word "mejor" means "to feel good", not "ponerse".

que ponerse a hacer means "to start doing " ... or more literally "to start to make "...
Wizard
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Wizard
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December 28th, 2011 at 9:29:01 AM permalink
My father would put butter on Rye crisps but I just ate them plain. Do they still sell them? I bet Whole Foods at least has something similar to them.

I've noticed the translator of Ramona seems to put a priority over something that sounds good in Spanish, to a close translation of the English text. In all fairness, how many readers of the Spanish version are judging it against the English one?

Verb tenses are one of my weakest areas when it comes to Spanish, and one I seldom get right. The book I mentioned earlier "Breaking out of Beginner's Spanish" at least agrees with me that this is one of the toughest areas to master in Spanish, and that books can only go so far to explain it. You have to develop a touch to it that is only acquired though immersion.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
pacomartin
pacomartin
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December 28th, 2011 at 10:41:09 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Verb tenses are one of my weakest areas when it comes to Spanish, and one I seldom get right. The book I mentioned earlier "Breaking out of Beginner's Spanish" at least agrees with me that this is one of the toughest areas to master in Spanish, and that books can only go so far to explain it. You have to develop a touch to it that is only acquired though immersion.



Well, it is difficult. In some cases (like the one below) you use a different form in English than they do in Spanish. Just be happy that Spanish only changes nouns by gender. If you had to inflect nouns by whether they are the subject, direct object, indirect object, or possessive than it would be very difficult. Spanish retained the inflection in the verbs from Latin, but they lost most of the noun inflections (except for gender).

==========================
Nareed
The literal translation of the English verb to be is either ser or a ser. Could we use that form of the verb instead of era in the translation? Would it still make sense?

The snack turned out to be pineapple juice.
(1) Resultó que la merienda era un jugo de piña.
(2) Resultó que la merienda a ser un jugo de piña.
pacomartin
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December 28th, 2011 at 11:35:51 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Somewhere I read about this before. Maybe it was here. So, it would seem there are four meals a day in Mexico:

desayuno = breakfast
almuerzo = snack/first lunch
merienda = lunch
cena = dinner

Where it gets confusing for me is the word comeda seems to also carry connotations of "lunch," and comer can mean to eat lunch.



Yahoo answers says:
  • first meal, usually around 7-8 am (breakfast) => 'desayuno'. It is usually light.
  • a late breakfast, around 10-11 am (lunch) => 'almuerzo'. Usually, it is heavier than breakfast.
  • 'dinner' is used for the main meal of the day, around 6 pm, but in Mexico the main meal is taken around 2-3 pm => 'comida'.
  • 'night snack' would be around 8-9 pm, but in Mexico is taken around 7-8, usually by children, before going to bed => 'merienda'.
  • a late meal, usually taken by adults or in a social environment, around 9-10 pm => 'cena'


In restaurants I've always seen 'comida corrida' for meals before 5 pm and after 1-2 pm.

But that meal schedule seems more suited to a traditional economy where you open a shop at 8 am and close at 8 pm with a mid day break. Some variant would work for farm work, possibly where the meal is portable. I can't imagine most office workers eat on that schedule.

I have never associated "comer" with eating a specific meal. There are verbs like "desayuner" and "almorzar" and "cenar" which involve eating a specific meal.

"Almorzar" is actually from an Arabic word. The "al" at the beginning reveals it's origin.

Strangely enough the French verb déjeuner means to have lunch. That is confusing.
Wizard
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December 28th, 2011 at 2:52:36 PM permalink
I'd be interested to see a study on how obesity is correlated to the number of meals consumed per day. Here is the US we're strictly three. However, we have got to be one of the heaviest countries on earth. Don't believe me? Look at any cruise ship passengers out of the US and all doubt will be removed.

Here it is common to snack between lunch and dinner, and it isn't unusual to get the munchies again before going to bed. Judging from the convenience stores, what counts as a snack here is usually laden with salt, sugar, and fat. Perhaps if we took the time to call these snacks a meal, and prepare something decent, we would be better off.

On another topic, I finally heard from my tutor about the Se puede/pueden ver muchas estrellas en noche clara. You may recall that she said puede. Then I challenged her on the argument behind pueden. She said technically pueden is correct, but also says puede isn't incorrect. She said that when she was a teacher she would have never taken away points for puede, and some rules in Spanish could justify it. However, if one were to have a heavy academic debate on it, pueden would win.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.

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