Cooperation Game II
Poll
 | 23 votes (69.69%) | ||
| | 3 votes (9.09%) | ||
| | 4 votes (12.12%) | ||
| | 1 vote (3.03%) | ||
| | 3 votes (9.09%) | ||
| | 2 votes (6.06%) | ||
| | 1 vote (3.03%) | ||
| | 1 vote (3.03%) | ||
| No votes (0%) | |||
| | 4 votes (12.12%) |
33 members have voted
Probably a sexual harassment lawsuit nowadays.Quote: WizardWhat is in it for me?
Quote: Mission146Just How Badly Did The Big Pool Screw Up?
Let's see how badly the big pool screwed this last round up, just for kicks!
The big pool has currently amassed a total of...
...AND, the Wizard pays an extra $50.
Well played, Big Pool, well played.
I edited the quote above as per request.
That's a great analysis! One question... Do writers get paid by the character?
Step up Mr. "I was only Captian once"
Quote: prozema
That's a great analysis! One question... Do writers get paid by the character?
Step up Mr. "I was only Captian once"
Thanks!
I actually had to make a couple of corrections, so if you would be kind enough to delete the quote in your post and replace it with what it says now, I'd really appreciate that.
Basically, I had the ALL SHARE at $3.33/player, but it's $3.03/player. I don't know why, but I did it as if it was 30 players in the game.
It didn't change much, the big pool is still basically making the most inept decision possible.
Quote: Mission146Thanks!
I actually had to make a couple of corrections, so if you would be kind enough to delete the quote in your post and replace it with what it says now, I'd really appreciate that.
Basically, I had the ALL SHARE at $3.33/player, but it's $3.03/player. I don't know why, but I did it as if it was 30 players in the game.
It didn't change much, the big pool is still basically making the most inept decision possible.
Of course sir. Please let me know if my edit is unacceptable in any way.
Quote: Mission146, the big pool is still basically making the most inept decision possible.
Fyi - I took the over on the number of pages this thread would run. If you could maybe describe our shortcomings in a different way... Maybe with a limerick, it would be very helpful.
Quote: WizardI'm listening. What is in it for me?
Nathan... Offer him a cut of the lotto winnings. I hear the wizard loves lottery. You can do this!
Quote: SOOPOOIN NO WAY will I vote to give some big pool money to non big pool players, regardless of the potential EV. I WILL NOT reward non cooperative behavior. If the non big pool players commit to sharing, which they by definition they cannot do as lying is allowed, then all would do better at Wizard's expense. I trust Mission to share, although technically he can be lying. If I was a captain I would vote steal. This way the $25 is split among as many people as possible, both big pokers and non big poolers.
Bah, humbug, SOOPOO. Cutting off your nose to spite your face, and all of our faces.
Just silly. 3 teams are stealing. Probably more. The best those people can expect is about $3.33-$3.50 out of $50. And it will almost surely be less.
So.
Here's me taking charge. If Y'all want to continue like cats on linoleum with no litter box in sight, we'll all be the poorer for it.
There are 7 non-big poolers. Let's offer them $4.00 each out of the all-share $100. That's more than they will get otherwise. That is $28, leaving $72 for the large pool, more than we would have gotten as well.
Let's not be stupid. All share, with extra for those 7, is a Win/Win. Captains? Can you do this?
Boo to SOOPOO and Romes for slamming the door before the round even got started. I'm crowbarring it back open.
Quote: beachbumbabsBah, humbug, SOOPOO. Cutting off your nose to spite your face, and all of our faces.
Just silly. 3 teams are stealing. Probably more. The best those people can expect is about $3.33-$3.50 out of $50. And it will almost surely be less.
So.
Here's me taking charge. If Y'all want to continue like cats on linoleum with no litter box in sight, we'll all be the poorer for it.
There are 7 non-big poolers. Let's offer them $4.00 each out of the all-share $100. That's more than they will get otherwise. That is $28, leaving $72 for the large pool, more than we would have gotten as well.
Let's not be stupid. All share, with extra for those 7, is a Win/Win. Captains? Can you do this?
Boo to SOOPOO and Romes for slamming the door before the round even got started. I'm crowbarring it back open.
Baller! Go girl.
Quote: beachbumbabs
Here's me taking charge. If Y'all want to continue like cats on linoleum with no litter box in sight, we'll all be the poorer for it.
There are 7 non-big poolers. Let's offer them $4.00 each out of the all-share $100. That's more than they will get otherwise. That is $28, leaving $72 for the large pool, more than we would have gotten as well.
The big pool gets, at most, $69.69 ($3.03 * 23) with the ALL SHARE as it stands now.
Quote:Let's not be stupid. All share, with extra for those 7, is a Win/Win. Captains? Can you do this?
Boo to SOOPOO and Romes for slamming the door before the round even got started. I'm crowbarring it back open.
If you look at my long post (I'll quote it below this post really quick) you'll see every possible avenue that will work better for the big pool than the current one...which is actually the worst avenue possible.
I'll offer a few added comments after that.
Quote: Mission146If you look at my long post (I'll quote it below this post really quick) you'll see every possible avenue that will work better for the big pool than the current one...which is actually the worst avenue possible.
I'll offer a few added comments after that.
I saw it. I'm keeping it simple.
I'm counting several times. There are 33 people playing. I see 7 not in the big pool, which leaves 26. So where are you getting 23? This discrepancy confuses me.
Quote: Mission146Just How Badly Did The Big Pool Screw Up?
Let's see how badly the big pool screwed this last round up, just for kicks!
The big pool has currently amassed a total of $275.95, which comes out to $11.997826087 per person.
Second Best Case
Other than an ALL SHARE, the best the Big Pool could have done would be a Team 3 ONLY Steal, because Team 3 is all Big Poolers. If that would have happened, the final total for the game would be:
$325.95 for the big pool, which is $14.171739 per player.
???? Case Scenario
What's actually going to happen now is not even the third best case scenario for the Big Pool because they could have at least tried to get DJTeddyBear, MidwestAP or myself to share. It looks like DJTeddyBear and I were already sharing, until certain players on the big pool decided to shoot off their mouths.
Assuming that DJTeddyBear, MidwestAP and myself all steal (and we will), the best thing the big pool can do is have Team 6 Share and the rest steal because only three Big Poolers get knocked out that way.
As a result, $50 will be split amongst 29 players of whom 20 will be big poolers.
(20/29) * 50 = 34.4827586207
That means that the big pool will add a comparably paltry $34.48 to their pool for a total of:
275.95 + 34.48 = 310.43 which is $13.4969565217 per player.
The Wizard gets to save $50 and the Big Pool loses at least $15.52 compared to what it could have done.
Better Case Scenario
The Big Pool had a few different options:
The $3.03 for everyone ALL SHARE would have brought the Big Pool $69.69 in total, so:
1.) The big pool could have used $19.69 to improve the equity of small poolers and independents to get them to share.
2.) The big pool could have used $19.69 to bribe MidwestAP and DJTeddyBear (the only people they really needed) to Share since I was going to Share anyway. Of course, they've given me no choice but to steal. Turns out DJTeddyBear was going to share anyway, but they had no way of knowing that.
3.) The big pool could have offered to let DJTeddyBear and MidwestAP to join the big pool. The big pool is currently worth about $12.00 per person, DJTeddyBear has amassed $7.87 in this game and MidwestAP has $7.15.
That brings the big pool up to $290.97 among 25 people for $11.6388 each.
Except, now there would be 25 Big Poolers who each get $3.03 for a total of $75.75 added to the big pool.
The final Big Pool total would be $366.72 which would be divided amongst 25 people for $14.6688 each.
As you can see:
A.) The only way that DJTeddyBear or MidwestAP could do better than that would be to be the lone stealing team.
B.) Every big pool player does about $1.17 better than what is now going to happen.
C.) The big pool banks $56.29 more than they are going to now.
D.) The Wizard pays out an extra $50
IN FACT
In fact, if everyone were to NOW join the big pool, the big pool would have all $350 in the game.
$350/33 = $10.6060606/player.
The ALL SHARE would be a mortal lock, so the overall pool would go from $350 to $450.
$450/33 = $13.6363636/player
Which is more than the $13.4969565217/player they will now get in the big pool.
AND, the Wizard pays an extra $50.
Well played, Big Pool, well played.
So, from easiest to hardest:
1.) Just let everyone in the big pool now if they want to join. The big pool makes more money in the end, the players who join the big pool make more money in the end, Wizard pays out more money in the end. Everybody wins.
2.) Invite DJTeddyBear and MidWestAP to join the big pool. I'll share if you can get them in the big pool and have them share. They make more money and the big pool makes more money. Technically, you only need the three of us.
3.) Pay off DJTeddyBear, MidwestAP and myself with added equity to share. You guys wouldn't have had to pay me off before, but now you went and screwed that up.
4.) Pay off ALL small poolers and independents with added equity so everyone can share. (This is technically possible, but it would be easier just to invite everyone to join the big pool)
Quote: Mission146
I saw it. I'm keeping it simple.
I'm counting several times. There are 33 people playing. I see 7 not in the big pool, which leaves 26. So where are you getting 23? This discrepancy confuses me.
There are four side poolers and six independents, I believe.
Side Pool:
Mission146
RS
GWAE
MaxPen
Independents:
DJTeddyBear
MidwestAP
DJATC
SM777
AyeCarumba
OneNickelMiracle
Quote: Mission146There are four side poolers and six independents, I believe.
Side Pool:
Mission146
RS
GWAE
MaxPen
Independents:
DJTeddyBear
MidwestAP
DJATC
SM777
AyeCarumba
OneNickelMiracle
Ok, thanks. Must have been looking at the wrong chart.
So, stay at $4.00 for those 10. $60 into the pool. Easy.
Quote: beachbumbabsOk, thanks. Must have been looking at the wrong chart.
So, stay at $4.00 for those 10. $60 into the pool. Easy.
That's $40 total for those ten. With the ALL SHARE, they would be getting $30.30 anyway.
NO DEAL!
I've already outlined the four possible paths:
1.) Just let everyone in the big pool now if they want to join. The big pool makes more money in the end, the players who join the big pool make more money in the end, Wizard pays out more money in the end. Everybody wins.
2.) Invite DJTeddyBear and MidWestAP to join the big pool. I'll share if you can get them in the big pool and have them share. They make more money and the big pool makes more money. Technically, you only need the three of us.
3.) Pay off DJTeddyBear, MidwestAP and myself with added equity to share. You guys wouldn't have had to pay me off before, but now you went and screwed that up.
4.) Pay off ALL small poolers and independents with added equity so everyone can share. (This is technically possible, but it would be easier just to invite everyone to join the big pool)
That's path #4 which is the hardest. I'm going to say if you want to go with that, then those 10 get $5.00 each. The big pool can have $50.
That's still better than the big pool can even conceivably do without us. Again, though, there are three other possible paths to getting a share done if we can't work this one out.
It was your own teammates in the big pool that did this, don't forget. I know I had my share vote submitted and was perfectly happy to share and so was DJTeddyBear, apparently.
Quote: OnceDearYou might sound as bright as Baldrick
Quote: OnceDearI'm going to have to ban myself now for what I'm thinking. See you in 24 hours.
Should make it 72 hours, IMO. Or 72,000 hours. That'd be nice, too.
Quote: WizardI'm listening. What is in it for me?
The fact that a Ploppy tried to make an AP move. ;)
Do you work for the associated press?Quote: NathanThe fact that a Ploppy tried to make an AP move. ;)
Quote: onenickelmiracleDo you work for the associated press?
Come on, you know I meant Advantage Player. ;)
Yes the development of a "BIG POOL" of people sharing their winnings has complicated matters but still when you look at what can be won and split it should still be simple.
If we don't vote "Share" then WE ALL LOSE, it is that simple.
I know I posted saying it may be difficult to get a unanimous "Share" vote and that may have ruffled some feathers but still, sometimes you shouldn't cut your nose off to spite your face.............so if the independents and Non Big Pool players cannot or will not share then you will lose out the most.
Two ends of possibility (using a possible out of date table) I have the Big Pool getting roughly $38 with the rest getting $12 OR the Big Pool getting $28 and the rest $22
If WE ALL SHARE then the Big Pool get $75 and the rest $25 (based on 25 in Big Pool, 8 others and a total of 33 - does anyone have a definitive list???)
Now going back to what Beachbumbabs posted, surely it makes sense to all share and the non big pool members get $40 to split regardless, meaning $4 (10 members) or $5 (8 members) each whilst the big pool members only get $2.40 each, if that can't be seen as a good deal then I don't know what is, It's certainly a better deal than any steal/share combo I've looked at.
Well, I already had my share vote in, didn't I?
It was your buddies in the big pool that made me change it. I have a screen shot that my vote was once to share.
Like I said, there are four ways I can see us getting to an ALL SHARE at this point, what you are talking about is possibility #4.
I'm a team leader and you need me, so what I'm saying is I want $5 for each of the non Big Pool members.
Side Poolers/Independents: $50
Big Poolers: $50
The only way the Big Pool would have gotten $50 is to have one of the two Big Pool only teams steal, which you probably could have pulled off, except you guys decided not to work with us right away. You also decided to be suspicious of me, who has done nothing but share this entire game AND who has been preaching that this game is all of us against Mike the entire time.
So, if you want to go with Option #4, here is my offer:
Side Poolers/Independents: $50
Big Poolers: $50
This is an offer, not a negotiation. It's also not an offer to negotiate. If you don't think you can do this, then look into one of the other three possibilities that could get us to an All Share.
My last post in the thread until after the vote results are announced. If anyone takes some of my money from the big pool and gives it away I consider that theft. Of 43 cents. Or so.
Quote: SOOPOOMission writing a post for two hours about how I can make an extra 79 cents by paying off non cooperating players disgusts me. It is not even a guarantee as lying is permitted. None of you see Nathan putting in a steal NO MATTER WHAT we decide in the thread? It will be Mikes crowning glory. You guys must have an inkling why Wiz has not banned Nathan. Doesnt take a rocket scientist.
I voted Share.
Quote: UKMarkIt seems like some people are throwing their toys out of the pram, which is rather funny when you consider how easy this game should be.
Yes the development of a "BIG POOL" of people sharing their winnings has complicated matters but still when you look at what can be won and split it should still be simple.
If we don't vote "Share" then WE ALL LOSE, it is that simple.
I know I posted saying it may be difficult to get a unanimous "Share" vote and that may have ruffled some feathers but still, sometimes you shouldn't cut your nose off to spite your face.............so if the independents and Non Big Pool players cannot or will not share then you will lose out the most.
Two ends of possibility (using a possible out of date table) I have the Big Pool getting roughly $38 with the rest getting $12 OR the Big Pool getting $28 and the rest $22
If WE ALL SHARE then the Big Pool get $75 and the rest $25 (based on 25 in Big Pool, 8 others and a total of 33 - does anyone have a definitive list???)
Now going back to what Beachbumbabs posted, surely it makes sense to all share and the non big pool members get $40 to split regardless, meaning $4 (10 members) or $5 (8 members) each whilst the big pool members only get $2.40 each, if that can't be seen as a good deal then I don't know what is, It's certainly a better deal than any steal/share combo I've looked at.
Quote: RS
Small pool is already up $30 due to an anonymous donation I'll be making to our pool. :)
As of round 8, we had $21.05 in the small pool. That has gained a 119.5% profit due to my super secret play, so there's an additional $25.15 to be added to our pool.
I owe the small pool $55.15 right now ($30 of which is anonymous :) ). We have $27.49 (from Wizard) plus the $55.15 I owe; that's $82.64 in total or $20.66 per person (minus the non-negotiable $20 cash-out fee, of course).I'm not serious about a $20 cash-out fee. Calm down.
Thanks, RS, I'm not sure how I missed this! Great news for Three Square-Las Vegas' only foodbank!
Quote: SOOPOOMission writing a post for two hours about how I can make an extra 79 cents by paying off non cooperating players disgusts me. It is not even a guarantee as lying is permitted. None of you see Nathan putting in a steal NO MATTER WHAT we decide in the thread? It will be Mikes crowning glory. You guys must have an inkling why Wiz has not banned Nathan. Doesnt take a rocket scientist.
I'm going to go with because Nathan didn't do anything wrong.
Also, Nathan happens to be a team leader and represents (chuckle) YOUR big pool, which is just another sign of the big pool's complete, total, indubitable, boundless and enduring total ineptitude at playing this game.
You don't even trust your own pool members! That's too good!
Anyway, it could have been a guarantee. I could have sent a screenshot of my PM to share and publicly stated that I was revoking any right to change from my current vote.
And, I did, indeed, share already.
It was you and a couple other people who convinced me to steal. It looks like DJTeddyBear had shared already, too.
Just take some responsibility for how poorly you have played this round and apologize to the rest of the big pool for your mistakes. It will be okay.
Oh, and had everybody just shared and you had been willing to cut MidwestAP in on the extra takings, I wouldn't have had to write that post, so that's your fault, too.
Quote: troopscottIf all big pool team leaders vote steal I will send $40 to the wiz via paypal to be distributed to the big pool.
He's lying. He's also a mark for the Wizard. He tried to orchestrate an All Steal in an earlier round so that no money would go out.
The $40 he is claiming that he will do is actually coming from the Wizard AND saves the Wizard $10.
EDIT: Although, it is possible that Wizard didn't put TroopScott up to this post, in which case, TroopScott is just straight lying. He's wanted nothing more than to see an All-Steal, for whatever reason. He's going to pull out of the big pool and not pay the $40 if you do this.
But Im also reminded of two old sayings. One regarding assumptions, the other regarding good deeds.
Quote: Mission146He's lying. He's also a mark for the Wizard. He tried to orchestrate an All Steal in an earlier round so that no money would go out.
The $40 he is claiming that he will do is actually coming from the Wizard AND saves the Wizard $10.
EDIT: Although, it is possible that Wizard didn't put TroopScott up to this post, in which case, TroopScott is just straight lying. He's wanted nothing more than to see an All-Steal, for whatever reason. He's going to pull out of the big pool and not pay the $40 if you do this.
Nice try I have had no communication with wizard other than my votes in rounds where it was individual. You are correct though. I feel you are trying to hold the big pool hostage for $50 if I read your previous post correctly for you to vote share again. I would much rather kick in $40 which is more than the big pool would get if one voted share so everyone got something and see the small pool skunked or left voting share so they get a little something.
Quote: SOOPOOMission writing a post for two hours about how I can make an extra 79 cents by paying off non cooperating players disgusts me. It is not even a guarantee as lying is permitted. None of you see Nathan putting in a steal NO MATTER WHAT we decide in the thread? It will be Mikes crowning glory. You guys must have an inkling why Wiz has not banned Nathan. Doesnt take a rocket scientist.
idk if ur srs but its hilarious nonetheless
Quote: Mission146UKMark,
Well, I already had my share vote in, didn't I?
It was your buddies in the big pool that made me change it. I have a screen shot that my vote was once to share.
Like I said, there are four ways I can see us getting to an ALL SHARE at this point, what you are talking about is possibility #4.
I'm a team leader and you need me, so what I'm saying is I want $5 for each of the non Big Pool members.
Side Poolers/Independents: $50
Big Poolers: $50
The only way the Big Pool would have gotten $50 is to have one of the two Big Pool only teams steal, which you probably could have pulled off, except you guys decided not to work with us right away. You also decided to be suspicious of me, who has done nothing but share this entire game AND who has been preaching that this game is all of us against Mike the entire time.
So, if you want to go with Option #4, here is my offer:
Side Poolers/Independents: $50
Big Poolers: $50
This is an offer, not a negotiation. It's also not an offer to negotiate. If you don't think you can do this, then look into one of the other three possibilities that could get us to an All Share.
Thanks for the offer.
How about this offer, which is an offer and not an offer to negotiate (to coin a phrase :-) ):
Side Poolers/Independents: $40
Big Poolers: $60
OR
Take your chances and get a lot less than the $40 on offer for the Side Poolers/Independents in a share/steal vote.
OR
Take your chances and get less than the $40 on offer if by some miracle we do ALL share
We need all team leaders to agree to this (typing this whilst chuckling to myself)
Note: I cannot confirm any deal and any deal agreed cannot be guaranteed, however if you agree I confirm that as team 3 leader I will vote Share.
Quote: UKMarkThanks for the offer.
How about this offer, which is an offer and not an offer to negotiate (to coin a phrase :-) ):
Side Poolers/Independents: $40
Big Poolers: $60
OR
Take your chances and get a lot less than the $40 on offer for the Side Poolers/Independents in a share/steal vote.
OR
Take your chances and get less than the $40 on offer if by some miracle we do ALL share
We need all team leaders to agree to this (typing this whilst chuckling to myself)
Note: I cannot confirm any deal and any deal agreed cannot be guaranteed, however if you agree I confirm that as team 3 leader I will vote Share.
NO DEAL.
The fact of the matter is that the Big Pool needs us just as much as we need them if anybody is going to maximize anything, and TroopScott's offer of $40 still pales in comparison to the $50 that the Big Pool would get to split up the other way.
More than that, TroopScott's offer would have everybody steal which means $0.00 comes out of Wizard's pocket, which is the whole entire purpose of the game.
But, that's because TroopScott is indescribably bad at this game. There aren't even words. How vindictive can he possibly be?
Three Ways to Go
We're not going to agree on #4 for getting an All Share done, so let's look at one of the other three options:
1.) Just let everyone in the big pool now if they want to join. The big pool makes more money in the end, the players who join the big pool make more money in the end, Wizard pays out more money in the end. Everybody wins.
2.) Invite DJTeddyBear and MidWestAP to join the big pool. I'll share if you can get them in the big pool and have them share. They make more money and the big pool makes more money. Technically, you only need the three of us.
3.) Pay off DJTeddyBear, MidwestAP and myself with added equity to share. You guys wouldn't have had to pay me off before, but now you went and screwed that up.
It seems that our small pool is doing very well and RS has already significantly added to our take, both with his donations and with his gains from the Advantage Play he is doing.
In short, the small pool is in very good shape as it is.
I'm going to go with Option #1 and here is my offer:
---Let all Independent players join the big pool, and I will share.
The big pool has currently amassed a total of $275.95, which comes out to $11.997826087 per person.
1.) The third best case scenario is a 20/29 share of $50, which would give you $34.48 to add to the pool. That would bring the total up to $310.43, which would be $13.4969565217/person.
2.) The second-best case scenario is allegedly an All Steal, in which TroopScott will probably not contribute $40 to the Big Pool, but let's pretend that he will.
The big pool's take is $315.95, so the Big Pool finishes with $13.7369565/player.
3.) The best case scenario is you let the six independents join the big pool, unless any of them refuse. $43.98 gets added to the Big Pool and the Big Pool now has 29 players.
The big pool has $319.93 total going into this round.
The Big Pool will get 100 * (29/33) = $87.878787 on the ALL SHARE
That brings the Big Pool up to $407.81, which is $14.0624 per player in the big pool.
Obviously, I would not hold the Big Pool accountable for any players who refuse to join or do not respond on the condition that BOTH MidwestAP and DJTeddyBear join the Big Pool.
I've been willing to cooperate the whole game. This last round, with Mission trying to broker a deal for the big pool to GIVE MONEY to the small pool and independents on our behalf was beyond suspicious... not to mention the small pool and independents have a mathematical reason to STEAL from the big pool.Quote: RSI love how Romes is basically the only person here who's not willing to cooperate with other players. He'd rather make less money if it means the small pool gets less as well...
Also, after all that is said and done, the Wiz is pumping out a little coin for this game. Might as well give him some popcorn eating entertainment along the way.
Mission - Your two best ideas, in my opinion, are based on flawed logic.
1) Invite others to the big pool and/or pay them off... Yeah neither of these is an option, or ever going to happen... for a lot of reasons. One, like DJT, he stated he doesn't want to be part of any pool. So even IF we allowed them to join right now they still wouldn't, or they could still LIE about it since that's allowed. That's IF we allowed that, which we don't want to. We don't want to give an easy out or more EV to players that refused to join the group to begin with. Again, I'd rather take my money FROM the big pool and be an independent before I see one single cent go towards "bribing" other players. They should have to bribe us NOT to steal from all of you. We are the big pool. We have the majority. So stop trying to push us around with your "big poolers have to do this!" mentality. If we want to burn it all down, then you'll just have to deal with it because we're the majority... Bribe us NOT to.
2) Everyone sharing in this last round may not even be an option! That's like me saying, omg if we all share maybe we'll all get a billion dollars... but if one person steals they'll 2 billion. The "potential EV" you keep throwing in our faces is MEANINGLESS if it's not PROBABLE. "Omg you idiots could make another $2!!!" Well omg what if that's not even a probable outcome since we're rather confident one or more are going to STEAL? Confidence levels about stealing plays a part in the EV equation, which you're conveniently (for the small pool) LEAVING OUT.
If we can all make $1 with 100% confidence, or $1.50 with an 20% confidence, then the $1 is the CLEAR CHOICE and not your "OMG WHY NOT $1.50 YOU MATH IDIOTS?!?!"
#SimpleMath
Especially at this point, I think it's obvious the "max EV" the big pool can get (including our confidence levels) is going to be to STEAL. So no, I don't think we're "missing out" by stealing. I think it's the best mathematical EV choice.
The first thing is, with thanks to RS, the side pool is already going to do better, on average, than will the main pool. You can see the quote from RS at the bottom on that. Long story short, even without RS' $30 anonymous donation to the small pool, we're already up to $52.64 ($13.16 each) plus whatever happens this round. We're going to end up almost as well off, or better, than the average big pooler.
Therefore, I want the Big Pool to extend an offer to the six Independents (but NOT side poolers) that they may now join the big pool. If DJTeddyBear and MidwestAP accept the offer, then I will share.
1.) If DJATC declines your offer, that's up to him. The only ones who MUST accept your offer are DJTeddyBear and MIdwestAP, but the offer must be made to all six independents.
I'm not going to bribe you not to do anything. I am going to STEAL unless my conditions are met.
I went into this round sharing, but because of players like SOOPOO, TroopScott and yourself with this mob mentality stuff, you forced me to steal. You think that because you have the majority you can just run around forcing people to do whatever you want, but that's not how it's going to work.
Also, if there is an ALL STEAL and TroopScott actually does pay out the $40...that's honestly the most hilarious possible result I can think of, so that's fine with me. Us small poolers are doing fine either way.
2.) Of course it's probable. DJTeddyBear and MidwestAP would become big poolers. The only way they could do better than that would be to be the only stealing team, but they WILL NOT be the only stealing team, because I'm going to steal unless you guys find a way to make a deal with them.
There would be me and six Big Pool leaders. The All Share would be a lock.
Quote: RSI love how Romes is basically the only person here who's not willing to cooperate with other players. He'd rather make less money if it means the small pool gets less as well.
Small pool is already up $30 due to an anonymous donation I'll be making to our pool. :)
As of round 8, we had $21.05 in the small pool. That has gained a 119.5% profit due to my super secret play, so there's an additional $25.15 to be added to our pool.
I owe the small pool $55.15 right now ($30 of which is anonymous :) ). We have $27.49 (from Wizard) plus the $55.15 I owe; that's $82.64 in total or $20.66 per person (minus the non-negotiable $20 cash-out fee, of course).I'm not serious about a $20 cash-out fee. Calm down.
Quote: UKMarkIt seems like some people are throwing their toys out of the pram.
For the benefit of the Americans playing, a pram is what they call a stroller in Australia and evidently the UK too.
Quote: SOOPOOI would like a ruling from Wiz. Is it in the game when one said they were part of the big pool, or would lying be permitted in that statement. I want to know if Nathan can pull out of the big pool after a steal on the final round, which if legal would be a cunning AP move netting Nathan an extra couple dollars.
My last post in the thread until after the vote results are announced. If anyone takes some of my money from the big pool and gives it away I consider that theft. Of 43 cents. Or so.
I do not respect any pool. When the game is over I'll give everybody an opportunity to cash our their share directly. I will have no problem doing direct payments with people who are in pools, as I consider a promise to split money a permissible lie under the rules of the game.
However, since it makes things easier for me, I will allow anyone to direct their money to any pool they wish. Such requests must be made to me directly from each player by PM. I would prefer such pools have names of those in charge, like the RS or Romes pool.
Also, I will not declare publicly who did what with their winnings. I will only announce the total amount in each pool. So, players can double dip by cashing out directly and then asking for a slice of their pool.
On a different topic, I'd like to remind everyone that if there is at least one steal vote, the only way to win anything is to also vote steal. This serves two purposes:
1. To get more money for yourself.
2. To punish the other selfish players voting steal by diluting their winnings.
I will try not to make any assumptions, however, you make it difficult when you won't even respond to a member of your own team.Quote: DJTeddyBearNo matter what happens, Id like to say Thank You, for all these entertaining posts.
But Im also reminded of two old sayings. One regarding assumptions, the other regarding good deeds.
lol.. so he's already playing your theoretical money (which players could "pull out of at the end as the Wizard stated) and because he's made some money with it this POST-FACTO information makes your previous decision the right one? Fiction can be fun... Good for you guys. We haven't even VOTED on what we want to do with the big pool money yet. So, okay? Good one? You got us or something?Quote: Mission146Romes,
The first thing is, with thanks to RS, the side pool is already going to do better, on average, than will the main pool. You can see the quote from RS at the bottom on that. Long story short, even without RS' $30 anonymous donation to the small pool, we're already up to $52.64 ($13.16 each) plus whatever happens this round. We're going to end up almost as well off, or better, than the average big pooler.
You have absolutely no bargaining power, and no control. You own no majority, and if you want to steal, go for it, we'll get the majority from a mostly STEAL round. So, good one?Quote: Mission146..I'm not going to bribe you not to do anything. I am going to STEAL unless my conditions are met.
So you're just able to speak on their behalf now, even after DJT has expressly posted his opinion of NOT joining ANY pool? Wow. This is the most obvious lie yet.Quote: Mission1462.) Of course it's probable. DJTeddyBear and MidwestAP would become big poolers.
Yeah, I'm still rather comfortable and confident the best EV play, the entire round, would be for us as the big pool to organize a big steal with 1 "share" team.
Quote: PokerGrinderWell it took 12 rounds but Mike has succeeded in getting a bunch of grown men to fight like children. Congrats Mike! That is sincere by the way as I assume you were hoping for this.
Well tomorrow IS D-day, so it's normal for the heat to turn up more today. Expect tomorrow to be the figurative Death Valley. ;)
What are you trying to say about BBB and Nathan?Quote: PokerGrinderWell it took 12 rounds but Mike has succeeded in getting a bunch of grown men to fight like children. Congrats Mike! That is sincere by the way as I assume you were hoping for this.
Quote: AxelWolfWhat are you trying to say about BBB and Nathan?
BBB has not participated in any bickering and I like to pretend that Nathan isnt here as it makes my life easier lol.
Quote: Wizard... snip ...
Also, I will not declare publicly who did what with their winnings. I will only announce the total amount in each pool. So, players can double dip by cashing out directly and then asking for a slice of their pool.
...
Well, that adds a whole new wrinkle to things. Makes me glad Im not joining any pool.
But I cant believe all you math nerds are writing so many long posts with a net result of less than a buck! It makes me want to change my vote, again!
Holy crap. I finally figured it out.Quote: WizardCongratulations to all for making it to 200 pages.
The whole point of this stupid game was to drive traffic to this site. Get visitor counts up etc.
Those are the kinds of metrics that Google loves...
LMAO. Only just figured it? The kind of traffic that this generated would have cost thousands in adwords or content writing contracts.Quote: DJTeddyBearHoly crap. I finally figured it out.
The whole point of this stupid game was to drive traffic to this site. Get visitor counts up etc.
Those are the kinds of metrics that Google loves...
Now... Off to edit every single post to include links to my website $:o)...
...Only kidding on that last bit
.
.
.
Mind you, the idea's not without merit
Quote: Romeslol.. so he's already playing your theoretical money (which players could "pull out of at the end as the Wizard stated) and because he's made some money with it this POST-FACTO information makes your previous decision the right one? Fiction can be fun... Good for you guys. We haven't even VOTED on what we want to do with the big pool money yet. So, okay? Good one? You got us or something?
1.) I'm actually glad he took the initiative and set aside an amount equal to our earnings through Round 8 and started playing it. He said it was possible that the play he was planning to do it on could end, so it was pretty cool of him to do that.
2.) We already all knew that the pooled funds would go to RS' play, because RS decided that before he made the offer to start the Small Pool. Anyone who joined the pool already knew where the money was going.
Quote:You have absolutely no bargaining power, and no control. You own no majority, and if you want to steal, go for it, we'll get the majority from a mostly STEAL round. So, good one?
That's fine, good job. That's the way to play the, "Cooperation," game. First, alienate the people who wanted to work with you (and had been working with you) and then declare yourself the winner for getting a majority of the money.
You have 23/33 players, it would take an even more colossal failure than the Big Pool is even capable of for the Big Pool to NOT get the majority of the money.
Anyway, the Share vote was in. Wizard can confirm that my first vote was share, if he likes. I have a screenshot. It was as good as done, but then you, TroopScott and SOOPOO wanted to all shoot off your mouths. I was just trying to make sure the non Big Poolers got some sort of equitable arrangement.
Quote:So you're just able to speak on their behalf now, even after DJT has expressly posted his opinion of NOT joining ANY pool? Wow. This is the most obvious lie yet.
What lie? I said I would change my vote back to share if you could get DjTeddyBear and MidwestAP to join the big pool. If DJTeddyBear does not join the big pool, then the condition has not been met.
If you invite all six independents into the Big Pool and find some way to take care of DJTeddyBear (if he refuses to join the big pool) then I would share.
Let's figure that the money gets split 29 ways and the Big Pool has 20 of them covered:
(20/29) * 50 = $34.48 ($1.724/player)
But, if the Big Pool splits TroopScott's $40:
40/23 = ($1.73913/player)
---
Therefore, Wizard would save $50 and the Big Pool would split TroopScott's $40 up thereby netting an additional 1.5 pennies per player rather than having one team share. As a whole, the Big Pool would make an additional $5.52 and it would cost TroopScott $38.26 ($40 less his $1.74 share of the $40).
