Stolen iPad
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 | 16 votes (53.33%) | ||
| | 14 votes (46.66%) |
30 members have voted
January 18th, 2011 at 1:16:37 PM
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Yesterday my kids left my iPad in the car. Today my wife went to the car wash without knowing the iPad was in there. When we got home it was gone.
My wife wanted to complain to the manager, but I said it wouldn't do any good. I'm sure there is a sign somewhere saying the car wash isn't responsible for items left in the car, and every worker would deny everything.
I suggested we offer a reward of $150 for its return -- no questions asked. We would ask the manager to post the sign where only employees would see it. My wife said it would only reward the thief and incentive him to do it again. Good points, but I view it more like the theft was already done, and I'm offering a trade, which would be a win/win situation for both parties.
It was already password protected, and we reported it stolen to Apple, so it won't do the thieves any good. For what it is worth, the cost of an iPad 3G 16GB is $629, plus tax. The case was worth about $70.
The question for the poll is would you offer the reward or not?
Also, how should blame within the family be distributed? Here are the charges against each family member involved:
Daughter (13 years old): Took the iPad into the car. At some point during the trip she let me son play with it.
Son (8 years old): Left the iPad in the car, which is not where it is supposed to be. Everyone knows that I get annoyed when I can't find it, and it is supposed to be kept in a certain place indoors.
Wife: Didn't check the car before handing over the keys at the car wash.
Me: I'm the owner and ultimately should be keeping track of it.
My wife wanted to complain to the manager, but I said it wouldn't do any good. I'm sure there is a sign somewhere saying the car wash isn't responsible for items left in the car, and every worker would deny everything.
I suggested we offer a reward of $150 for its return -- no questions asked. We would ask the manager to post the sign where only employees would see it. My wife said it would only reward the thief and incentive him to do it again. Good points, but I view it more like the theft was already done, and I'm offering a trade, which would be a win/win situation for both parties.
It was already password protected, and we reported it stolen to Apple, so it won't do the thieves any good. For what it is worth, the cost of an iPad 3G 16GB is $629, plus tax. The case was worth about $70.
The question for the poll is would you offer the reward or not?
Also, how should blame within the family be distributed? Here are the charges against each family member involved:
Daughter (13 years old): Took the iPad into the car. At some point during the trip she let me son play with it.
Son (8 years old): Left the iPad in the car, which is not where it is supposed to be. Everyone knows that I get annoyed when I can't find it, and it is supposed to be kept in a certain place indoors.
Wife: Didn't check the car before handing over the keys at the car wash.
Me: I'm the owner and ultimately should be keeping track of it.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
January 18th, 2011 at 1:24:30 PM
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I'd contact one of your attorney friends, but I don't think a posted sign can eliminate liability in this case. There's a big difference between parking in a parking lot vs. taking your car to a detailer and having them work inside it. I think there's a presumption that when you hand your keys to a service shop, everything that was in the car beforehand should be there when you get it back. If that didn't happen, it's their responsibility. Who else's would it be?
Perhaps you could offer the owner of the car wash a deal between (a) get your iPad back to you by tomorrow or (b) lawsuit and reams of bad publicity. The cost to the owner will be far lower with option (a). It's up to him not to hire thieves, and you shouldn't have to pay for his bad hiring practices.
Perhaps you could offer the owner of the car wash a deal between (a) get your iPad back to you by tomorrow or (b) lawsuit and reams of bad publicity. The cost to the owner will be far lower with option (a). It's up to him not to hire thieves, and you shouldn't have to pay for his bad hiring practices.
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice."
-- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
January 18th, 2011 at 1:28:49 PM
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Quote: Wizard...Also, how should blame within the family be distributed?
...
Me: I'm the owner and ultimately should be keeping track of it.
In my view, there's the answer. If you treat it like a toy for the kids to play with while they're out and about, then expect it to get lost, destroyed, or possibly even stolen.
As for the reward, I don't have a clear opinion at the moment. Do you think the person who has it will feel safer returning it to the owner for a reward or trying to turn it into cash in some other manner?
January 18th, 2011 at 1:32:18 PM
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I'd speak to the manager. He may be able to do sweet diddly all, but if he never hears these problems, he has no idea if he has an endemic thief on his hands.
As for a reward, I wouldn't bother. It's gone... and as for the next one, your kids have probably had their licence to use it revoked, it would seem.
As for a reward, I wouldn't bother. It's gone... and as for the next one, your kids have probably had their licence to use it revoked, it would seem.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
January 18th, 2011 at 1:37:14 PM
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Inform the manager about the stolen merchandise. Although he'll regurgitate the company policy, ask him to inquire from his employees about the matter. Perhaps it was "mistakenly" moved to prevent it from being stolen. *wink*wink* Who knows you might get a response that an employee was concerned about the item being left out in the open, and decided to move it into a safer location =D Be thankful if you can get it back for a simple misunderstanding even if he/she wanted to play with it.
Yes offer the reward. There might actually be some good people out there, or someone who will realize that the merchandise is stolen. The opportunity cost is you buying another $600 ipad. $150 is a fair offer.
Blame. <sigh> Blame goes to the children I suppose. Let that be a lesson to never bring the ipad out of the house w/o permission.
Yes offer the reward. There might actually be some good people out there, or someone who will realize that the merchandise is stolen. The opportunity cost is you buying another $600 ipad. $150 is a fair offer.
Blame. <sigh> Blame goes to the children I suppose. Let that be a lesson to never bring the ipad out of the house w/o permission.
January 18th, 2011 at 1:41:22 PM
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Quote: MathExtremistI think there's a presumption that when you hand your keys to a service shop, everything that was in the car beforehand should be there when you get it back. If that didn't happen, it's their responsibility. Who else's would it be?
This is true. But you'd have to prove the ipad was in the car to begin with. I think, chances of winning such a suit are pretty slim.
Now, if you do offer the reward, and the thief bites, and returns the ipad - then you can turn around a sue the carwash, because you'll now have proof that the ipad was taken there. If the owner isn't an idiot (which is not a given), he'll, of course, refuse to post the ad about the reward.
As for the distribution of blame, I would blame the wife, but not for not checking the car, but rather for taking it into a place where it needs to be checked in the first place.
"When two people always agree one of them is unnecessary"
January 18th, 2011 at 1:43:50 PM
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If you have the ability to look at this situation purely in terms of money then I would offer $150 for it back. Personally, I wouldn't be able to get over the fact that I'm paying to get back my own iPad. Before you threaten anything legally - the owner may have somebody in mind that's had a handful of complaints. Depending on his knowledge of legal matters, or lack thereof, he might admit to you who it might be and you can go from there.
I'd say 70% is on your wife and 30% is on your 13 year old. Your boy is eight ('nuff said), your daughter should understand the concept of using others' belongings, your wife is the boss and all blame falls on her.
I'd say 70% is on your wife and 30% is on your 13 year old. Your boy is eight ('nuff said), your daughter should understand the concept of using others' belongings, your wife is the boss and all blame falls on her.
Its - Possessive; It's - "It is" / "It has"; There - Location; Their - Possessive; They're - "They are"
January 18th, 2011 at 1:45:07 PM
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Pretty easy answer -- forgetting that it was originally yours, it's essentially an offer to buy an iPad at an extremely discounted price, hence it is a highly +EV move.
"Who would have thought a good little girl like you could destroy my beautiful wickedness!"
January 18th, 2011 at 1:45:38 PM
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>My wife wanted to complain to the manager, but I said it wouldn't do any good.
Well, it won't do any harm either. What are they going to do? Lower your comp rate?
> I'm sure there is a sign somewhere saying the car wash isn't responsible for items left in the car
Sure, not necessarily legally effective though.
>and every worker would deny everything.
Probably, particularly if approached as a group.
>I suggested we offer a reward of $150 for its return
Hold it. What programs exist that would announce its location if someone tried to use it? GPS enabled device??
>Daughter (13 years old): Took the iPad into the car.
> At some point during the trip she let my son play with it.
So what? Daughters can do no wrong.
>Son (8 years old): Left the iPad in the car, which is not where it is supposed to be.
Depends upon what use he made of it. Educational or recreational.
>Wife: Didn't check the car before handing over the keys at the car wash.
Probably in the back seat. Not a good security alertness. Person could have been there. Did she check for coins in the ash tray before going to the car wash?
Send her for rehabilitative training. Self-defense class and firearm safety class.
>Me: I'm the owner and ultimately should be keeping track of it.
You did keep track of it. You knew where you left it. You know who had it in the interim. You know the inconvenience of its loss and the availability of programs and devices to signal its loss.
Well, it won't do any harm either. What are they going to do? Lower your comp rate?
> I'm sure there is a sign somewhere saying the car wash isn't responsible for items left in the car
Sure, not necessarily legally effective though.
>and every worker would deny everything.
Probably, particularly if approached as a group.
>I suggested we offer a reward of $150 for its return
Hold it. What programs exist that would announce its location if someone tried to use it? GPS enabled device??
>Daughter (13 years old): Took the iPad into the car.
> At some point during the trip she let my son play with it.
So what? Daughters can do no wrong.
>Son (8 years old): Left the iPad in the car, which is not where it is supposed to be.
Depends upon what use he made of it. Educational or recreational.
>Wife: Didn't check the car before handing over the keys at the car wash.
Probably in the back seat. Not a good security alertness. Person could have been there. Did she check for coins in the ash tray before going to the car wash?
Send her for rehabilitative training. Self-defense class and firearm safety class.
>Me: I'm the owner and ultimately should be keeping track of it.
You did keep track of it. You knew where you left it. You know who had it in the interim. You know the inconvenience of its loss and the availability of programs and devices to signal its loss.
January 18th, 2011 at 2:19:54 PM
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Assuming you've told your kids not to take your things without permission and to return them when they do have permission, I'd spread the blame 33% across the non-Wizard parties here. If you've previously asked your wife to look extra-closely for stuff left in the car I'd move her blame to >50%.
I'd also definitely ask to publish the reward letter. My understanding of the goal here is to maximize utility to the Wizard, not the world as a whole. Therefore I'm not terribly concerned with the incentive problems of rewarding a thief. If I did care about the incentives here I'd still suggest your wife's idea (not offering a reward so as to not reward the criminal) is way down the list of incentive issues. First, the thief stole the iPad already and it's very unlikely the tipping point in their decision making was a hypothetical non-offered reward. Second, since you can't do much to add to the cost of the employee to try and steal from your directly, you're better off trying to act indirectly if you really want to create less theft. For example, by letting the owner/manager know your business and your recommendations will be directed elsewhere so long as they have a culture of theft in their shop.
I'd also definitely ask to publish the reward letter. My understanding of the goal here is to maximize utility to the Wizard, not the world as a whole. Therefore I'm not terribly concerned with the incentive problems of rewarding a thief. If I did care about the incentives here I'd still suggest your wife's idea (not offering a reward so as to not reward the criminal) is way down the list of incentive issues. First, the thief stole the iPad already and it's very unlikely the tipping point in their decision making was a hypothetical non-offered reward. Second, since you can't do much to add to the cost of the employee to try and steal from your directly, you're better off trying to act indirectly if you really want to create less theft. For example, by letting the owner/manager know your business and your recommendations will be directed elsewhere so long as they have a culture of theft in their shop.
Sure you CAN sue them, but what is your claim for damages? Remember, the stolen item has been recovered.Quote: weaselmanNow, if you do offer the reward, and the thief bites, and returns the ipad - then you can turn around a sue the carwash, because you'll now have proof that the ipad was taken there. If the owner isn't an idiot (which is not a given), he'll, of course, refuse to post the ad about the reward.
January 18th, 2011 at 2:27:03 PM
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I'm sorry to hear about that - I'm torn, but I voted not to offer a reward. I think people expect things too often, and who knows, maybe the thief took it expecting that you'll offer some money to get it back. For him, that's +EV, esp. if he does it multiple times.
As for the blame, I think it falls between your wife and your daughter. Unfortunately, blaming your wife for things rarely ends in a +EV situation. ;)
-B
As for the blame, I think it falls between your wife and your daughter. Unfortunately, blaming your wife for things rarely ends in a +EV situation. ;)
-B
January 18th, 2011 at 2:31:31 PM
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Blame's not relevant. The important thing is how to keep the same thing from happening again. A good rule would be "Do not EVER take the ipad into the car."
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
January 18th, 2011 at 2:44:22 PM
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Explain what happened to the manager and tell him you are going to file a police report by the end of the day if this is not resolved. Then do it. Who knows how many others are victims of this business? You can't be the first. The police may recognize a pattern and may know just where to look.
Don't offer a reward because either the iPad is already gone or the thief will think it's a trap. Without knowing more details, it's hard to assess blame, however it appears to me that your son is blameless.
Don't offer a reward because either the iPad is already gone or the thief will think it's a trap. Without knowing more details, it's hard to assess blame, however it appears to me that your son is blameless.
January 18th, 2011 at 3:43:20 PM
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Quote: Wizardhow should blame within the family be distributed?
Here are the charges against each family member involved:
Daughter (13 years old): with a bit of a frown, a gentle reminder to be more careful and more responsible.
Son (8 years old): with a smile, just ask him to note he can't be careless about valuable things, and learn something from this.
Me: assuming you would look like an ogre for denying your family your new toy, you are faultless here.
Wife: should get some slack for having to deal with the chaos of kids, otherwise totally at fault. This is how you meet out the punishment: " Sorry, dear, that you had to deal with such a bad experience, I [the WoO] will just have to go buy another one if the reward doesnt work. Forget about the whole thing"
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell! She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
January 18th, 2011 at 4:04:56 PM
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I am sorry for your loss Wizard, but I voted "no reward".
What if you get a call, asking for a meet behind some downtown dumpsters at midnight? Not worth the trouble.
As for blame (what some may rephrase as "responsibility"), it is hard to put any of it on your wife. She never knew it was there. Your son is eight. You're lucky if he remembers to bring home his jacket on a cold day.
I think your daughter should bear the most burden. She originally took it out of the house, and should be responsible for getting it back into the house. Even if she passed that responsibility on to an irresponsible party, it was at her peril. Take the replacement cost out of her allowance. It is a good opportunity for a life lesson.
What if you get a call, asking for a meet behind some downtown dumpsters at midnight? Not worth the trouble.
As for blame (what some may rephrase as "responsibility"), it is hard to put any of it on your wife. She never knew it was there. Your son is eight. You're lucky if he remembers to bring home his jacket on a cold day.
I think your daughter should bear the most burden. She originally took it out of the house, and should be responsible for getting it back into the house. Even if she passed that responsibility on to an irresponsible party, it was at her peril. Take the replacement cost out of her allowance. It is a good opportunity for a life lesson.
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
January 18th, 2011 at 4:05:28 PM
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I'm on both sides of the fence with the reward thing.
Reward the very person who stole it? Or write it off as purchasing a used iPod cheaply?
The blame thing is equally problematic. Of course, since I don't have kids, it's hard for me to respond.
Did they often take it out of the house? If so, do they frequently forget to return it?
Answer those questions and you'd have a better answer where to lay the blame.
Reward the very person who stole it? Or write it off as purchasing a used iPod cheaply?
The blame thing is equally problematic. Of course, since I don't have kids, it's hard for me to respond.
Did they often take it out of the house? If so, do they frequently forget to return it?
Answer those questions and you'd have a better answer where to lay the blame.
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January 18th, 2011 at 4:08:44 PM
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Quote: FleaStiff>My wife wanted to complain to the manager, but I said it wouldn't do any good.
Well, it won't do any harm either. What are they going to do? Lower your comp rate?
> I'm sure there is a sign somewhere saying the car wash isn't responsible for items left in the car
.
I complain. Maybe they need one more complaint to fire someone.
There is also a remote possibility that the management is already hanging on to it and perhaps are waiting for the owner to claim it. Assume for a second the employee that took it, didn't leave it in the car for another thief to take it, but gave it to his boss, knowing just leaving it in the open in the car was a bad idea.
Vacuum, Washers, dryers, etc,. may be separate teams so the first person who saw it might turn it in.
(I doubt you'll see it again though)
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
January 18th, 2011 at 4:11:45 PM
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Thank you for all the comments. We decided to report the theft to the manager and ask to post the sign. The sign indicates our phone number. I could imagine a third party meeting me somewhere for the transaction.
My wife did already went back, and the manager agreed to post it. The manager also showed my wife some footage of our car while she was there, but at times it was so far from the camera that it didn't help. The manager also agreed to ask some likely suspects about it, but of course promised nothing, and never admitted fault.
I tend to doubt going to a lawyer or the police would help. As some have said, we would have to prove the iPad was in the car to begin with. How could we do that? If the legal system were one to rule in our favor then you would see false reports of such thefts all the time.
No decision yet on how to divide up the blame. I think my wife knows she gets some of it, and I don't.
About no iPads in the car, that is one of the best places for them. They make a great GPS device. That was a major reason I purchased it. However, on this trip I didn't need a GPS, and it was my daughter's idea to take it. If I get another one I will only let my 4-year-old play with it. That will drive the older two nuts.
My wife did already went back, and the manager agreed to post it. The manager also showed my wife some footage of our car while she was there, but at times it was so far from the camera that it didn't help. The manager also agreed to ask some likely suspects about it, but of course promised nothing, and never admitted fault.
I tend to doubt going to a lawyer or the police would help. As some have said, we would have to prove the iPad was in the car to begin with. How could we do that? If the legal system were one to rule in our favor then you would see false reports of such thefts all the time.
No decision yet on how to divide up the blame. I think my wife knows she gets some of it, and I don't.
About no iPads in the car, that is one of the best places for them. They make a great GPS device. That was a major reason I purchased it. However, on this trip I didn't need a GPS, and it was my daughter's idea to take it. If I get another one I will only let my 4-year-old play with it. That will drive the older two nuts.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
January 18th, 2011 at 4:12:07 PM
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I can't imagine the business is all that keen on thieves, and certainly shouldn't have problem finding someone more honest to replace them.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
January 18th, 2011 at 4:13:28 PM
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Quote: sunrise089Sure you CAN sue them, but what is your claim for damages? Remember, the stolen item has been recovered.
The reward amount plus court fees.
"When two people always agree one of them is unnecessary"
January 18th, 2011 at 4:14:39 PM
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Quote: WizardAbout no iPads in the car, that is one of the best places for them. They make a great GPS device. That was a major reason I purchased it. However, on this trip I didn't need a GPS, and it was my daughter's idea to take it. If I get another one I will only let my 4-year-old play with it. That will drive the older two nuts.
My 2 year old niece thought that drawing on the iPad was the best thing since rusks and milk.
I used one as a GPS device in Vegas, and it was definitely far superior to any sort of of GPS talky map I'd ever tried to use. Though it helped I was playing the role of navigator, not driver.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
January 18th, 2011 at 4:22:39 PM
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Quote: Wizard
Me: I'm the owner and ultimately should be keeping track of it.
Yup, you should have never let the kids even touch such an expensive piece of equipment. The blame falls solely on you, kids have no appreciation for the value of anything. Also, your wife should have checked the vehicle before it went thru. Car wash people are typically the dregs of society and will steal anything not nailed down. Because it was ultimately your fault, here's your punishment. Remember the Albino in 'The Da Vinci Code?' Remember his hobby? Half an hour of that and you'll never repeat your mistake in this lifetime.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
January 18th, 2011 at 4:23:42 PM
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Quote: WizardIf I get another one I will only let my 4-year-old play with it. That will drive the older two nuts.
Whoa... check out this youtube video, of two guys, KFC "Double Down" sandwiches, and a friend's iPad, before letting the four year old have at it. Hilarious.
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication - Leonardo da Vinci
January 18th, 2011 at 4:37:37 PM
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Most of the blame falls on you, some on your wife, and a fair amount on you kids as well. Neither of them is too young to understand that some items are valuable, and therefore need to be taken care of, as well as the simple fact that actions have consequences. However, the punishment for your kids should be limited to that they don't get to handle expensive, hard-to-replace items until they show the necessary sense of responsibility.
You, on the other hand, should kick yourself once an hour for the next week or so :)
Now, on to the reward: not only is an IPad valuable, but THIS IPad is worth more than one off the shelf: it has your personal info, programs, etc. So I think it is extremely +EV to offer a substantial reward. The way to calibrate that would be the rule of thumb that a fenced piece of stolen property usually fetches about 20% of actual value (a pawnshop will only loan about 15%). So if it was indeed stolen by someone who planned on reselling it, a reward of, say, $150 would give that person incentive to return it to you instead. Of course, you would have to say explicitly that you would pay the $150 "no questions asked".
Another benefit of offering the reward is that people might pay a bit more attention to finding and returning your IPod if it IS simply lost/misplaced.
You, on the other hand, should kick yourself once an hour for the next week or so :)
Now, on to the reward: not only is an IPad valuable, but THIS IPad is worth more than one off the shelf: it has your personal info, programs, etc. So I think it is extremely +EV to offer a substantial reward. The way to calibrate that would be the rule of thumb that a fenced piece of stolen property usually fetches about 20% of actual value (a pawnshop will only loan about 15%). So if it was indeed stolen by someone who planned on reselling it, a reward of, say, $150 would give that person incentive to return it to you instead. Of course, you would have to say explicitly that you would pay the $150 "no questions asked".
Another benefit of offering the reward is that people might pay a bit more attention to finding and returning your IPod if it IS simply lost/misplaced.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
January 18th, 2011 at 4:48:24 PM
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Reminds me of when I was a kid, my dad had a real expensive pair of binoculars that we were not allowed to touch or use, ever. Of course I took them fishing one summer day and left them there and they were gone when I went back. My dad went ballistic, needless to say, and I don't blame him. But you know what, they were covered under our home insurance policy so he got another pair. And locked them up. Could this Ipad be covered under your home owners insurance? You never know.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
January 18th, 2011 at 5:31:17 PM
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Quote: WizardAbout no iPads in the car, that is one of the best places for them. They make a great GPS device. That was a major reason I purchased it. However, on this trip I didn't need a GPS, and it was my daughter's idea to take it.
Ok, the ipad as GPS is a good reason. But I really don't see any other, save taking it along for business. If your kids want to play with it, well, get them something else.
I've thought about getting an ipod or some other MP3 player, and every time I look at the price I decide not to. I wouldn't feel comfortable carrying around an expensive device that can be easily lost or stolen. But then, too, I've managed to lose every single pair of eye glasses I ever owned. Next time I see the opthalmologist, I'll either opt for contacts or lasik.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
January 18th, 2011 at 5:42:25 PM
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Quote: WizardI tend to doubt going to a lawyer or the police would help.
I would encourage you to report the theft to the police. The main reason to do so is that if your iPad does show up at a pawn shop somewhere, or somebody is arrested for another crime and your stolen iPad is found, it will get returned to you. I find a lot of people don't want to report thefts to the police, and I can't figure out why so many people feel that way. I think maybe a lot feel like it will take a really long time to report something stolen, because most people deal with the police when they have a car wreck, and a car wreck does generally take a long time for the police to handle. But for most agencies when you call to report a theft, they send a road officer out to take an initial report, that officer can get the info. to track your stuff (like serial numbers or distinctive markings) and that takes just a few minutes. If it's found even a year or two later, you get it back. But if you don't report it stolen, you have almost zero hope of getting it back (for free).
January 18th, 2011 at 5:44:08 PM
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Quote: NareedBut then, too, I've managed to lose every single pair of eye glasses I ever owned.
I lose every pair of sunglasses. But I got one of those neckband cord things, so they stay around my neck. My mother use to have them on her reading glasses. I resisted for awhile, but i think it's saved me a few purchases already.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
January 18th, 2011 at 5:48:38 PM
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Quote: WizardThank you for all the comments. We decided to report the theft to the manager and ask to post the sign.
My wife did already went back, and the manager agreed to post it. The manager also showed my wife some footage of our car while she was there, but at times it was so far from the camera that it didn't help. The manager also agreed to ask some likely suspects about it, but of course promised nothing, and never admitted fault.
Also sorry about your family having to learn these lessons the hard way. But unfortunately,
we've all been there at one time or another.
So I think some good can come of this because you posted your experiences. It reminds
all of us to be careful about things like this.
I think going back to talk to the manager at the car wash was a good step to take.
There's emptiness behind their eyes
There's dust in all their hearts
They just want to steal us all and take us all apart
January 18th, 2011 at 6:06:36 PM
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Quote: rxwineI lose every pair of sunglasses. But I got one of those neckband cord things, so they stay around my neck. My mother use to have them on her reading glasses. I resisted for awhile, but i think it's saved me a few purchases already.
Hmm. A proper answer would hijack the thread. Look for a "Missing glasses" thread soon.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
January 18th, 2011 at 6:06:48 PM
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Quote: mkl654321Most of the blame falls on you... However, the punishment for your kids should be limited to that they don't get to handle expensive, hard-to-replace items until they show the necessary sense of responsibility.
Ouch! I must admit that I let the kids run a little loose with the iPad. It especially made me nervous to see my four-year-old carrying it around, but she LOVED the thing. It could keep her entertained for hours. In particular it has a talking cat application that repeats what you say. She just loved it. I didn't have the heart to not let her play with it. Apple should come up with a version that is more kid friendly. Seriously, I think that is a million-dollar idea.
Quote: EnvyBonusI would encourage you to report the theft to the police. The main reason to do so is that if your iPad does show up at a pawn shop somewhere, or somebody is arrested for another crime and your stolen iPad is found, it will get returned to you. I find a lot of people don't want to report thefts to the police, and I can't figure out why so many people feel that way. I think maybe a lot feel like it will take a really long time to report something stolen, because most people deal with the police when they have a car wreck, and a car wreck does generally take a long time for the police to handle. But for most agencies when you call to report a theft, they send a road officer out to take an initial report, that officer can get the info. to track your stuff (like serial numbers or distinctive markings) and that takes just a few minutes. If it's found even a year or two later, you get it back. But if you don't report it stolen, you have almost zero hope of getting it back (for free).
Good point. When my house was robbed about five years ago it took them three days to show up to do a report. Of course, nothing came of it. I wonder if there is a way to just fax or Email the report to them. It seems a waste of time to make a house call over it. I'll look into it.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
January 18th, 2011 at 6:21:53 PM
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Not leaving valuable, easily carried things in the car can certainly be a good idea. But down that road you should also clear out the glovebox, remove the GPS unit (in cars without built-in one), grab the medkit, empty the trunk, and take out the stereo. "We are not responsible..." is a standard boilerplate sign, but it's hardly unreasonable to expect things left in a car to stay there.
By 13 someone should to be sufficiently familiar with the concept of theft to know better, but for an 8 year old it's only normal to regard an owned, hard-top car as secure private space. Even many adults don't give a second thought to leaving electronics and small cash in their car. Lessons are indeed warranted, but it's nowhere the level of mistake that is worth assigning the blame. It's not like leaving it on a park bench or a cafe table. The blame is on the thief, you just made some careless choices and got unlucky.
Car wash management probably isn't much happier than you are about these thefts, so they may well take steps to look for the responsible party.
By 13 someone should to be sufficiently familiar with the concept of theft to know better, but for an 8 year old it's only normal to regard an owned, hard-top car as secure private space. Even many adults don't give a second thought to leaving electronics and small cash in their car. Lessons are indeed warranted, but it's nowhere the level of mistake that is worth assigning the blame. It's not like leaving it on a park bench or a cafe table. The blame is on the thief, you just made some careless choices and got unlucky.
Car wash management probably isn't much happier than you are about these thefts, so they may well take steps to look for the responsible party.
Resist ANFO Boston PRISM Stormfront IRA Freedom CIA Obama
January 18th, 2011 at 8:04:53 PM
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That would be an iTouch.Quote: WizardApple should come up with a version that is more kid friendly. Seriously, I think that is a million-dollar idea.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
January 18th, 2011 at 8:20:59 PM
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I'm with you. I get that ultimately you're responsible on some level for your own property, and I consider myself big on personal responsibility. But only in the most hardcore sense can I rationalize blaming the property owner when someone took/used/transferred his property without permission. I know one could say "you should have known better" but at some level you've taken reasonable precautions. I don't blame you for your home burglary because you "should have known to buy stronger windows."Quote: WizardOuch!
Quote: WizardApple should come up with a version that is more kid friendly. Seriously, I think that is a million-dollar idea.
I know you just made a casual remark, but it does illustrate some truth. Apple has no interest in a "million dollar idea." In the laptop market see the Panasonic "toughbook" line. There isn't a huge amount of competition there because while the market exists and is willing to pay a substantial premium for the product, it's just a pretty small market. If someone made a super rugged case for the iPad that didn't detract from the user experience (so a screen cover you would get dirty and wipe off with water but that didn't make it harder to type or whatnot) I could see that selling and being worthwhile to a case maker. Who knows though, maybe it's already out there.
In Arlington, VA they have online hit and run forms you can fill out and fax in. It's both cool and sad.Quote: WizardI wonder if there is a way to just fax or Email the report to them. It seems a waste of time to make a house call over it. I'll look into it.
January 18th, 2011 at 8:21:57 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearThat would be an iTouch.
The touchy Bear is already excited enough about iProducts, there is no need to indulge him further.
Oh wait [::notices the nickname::]
Quote: sunrise089I don't blame you for your home burglary because you "should have known to buy stronger windows."
Proper doors
Samsung's hottest product
The duty of every responsible homeowner.
Resist ANFO Boston PRISM Stormfront IRA Freedom CIA Obama
January 18th, 2011 at 8:32:43 PM
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I would for sure file a police report. It never hurts and not filing one can work against you.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
January 18th, 2011 at 9:00:53 PM
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1. File a police report. Let them know where it was stolen and see if they investigate. Perhaps there's other thefts reported from the same car wash. The reward's a good idea, but that iPad has likely been fenced by now.
2. This is not your wife's fault at all as it isn't her job to track expensive items in the car.
3. Your kids share responsibility for not bringing the IPad back into the house. But who was driving the car when the IPad was in the car? Certainly the blame belongs with the adult driving the car with the kids to ensure that the iPad makes it back into the house. When the kids get home, the car should be checked to be sure that the IPad returns to its location. That responsibility ultimately belongs with the person driving the car and the children who know the rules.
4. That said, with your kids leaving the iPad in the house and your wife not seeing the iPad in the car, how can you be sure that the iPad wasn't stolen while the car was in the driveway or garage? (I once left my garage open for an hour after returning car only to find my cell phone and about $10 in cash missing - some kids had gotten into the garage. How can you be absolutely sure that one of your kids brought it in to the house and didn't recall it?
As punishment, the 8 year old and 13 year old should not be allowed to play with the iPad for a period of time. The adult will need to be more careful to ensure that valuable items make it back into the house.
2. This is not your wife's fault at all as it isn't her job to track expensive items in the car.
3. Your kids share responsibility for not bringing the IPad back into the house. But who was driving the car when the IPad was in the car? Certainly the blame belongs with the adult driving the car with the kids to ensure that the iPad makes it back into the house. When the kids get home, the car should be checked to be sure that the IPad returns to its location. That responsibility ultimately belongs with the person driving the car and the children who know the rules.
4. That said, with your kids leaving the iPad in the house and your wife not seeing the iPad in the car, how can you be sure that the iPad wasn't stolen while the car was in the driveway or garage? (I once left my garage open for an hour after returning car only to find my cell phone and about $10 in cash missing - some kids had gotten into the garage. How can you be absolutely sure that one of your kids brought it in to the house and didn't recall it?
As punishment, the 8 year old and 13 year old should not be allowed to play with the iPad for a period of time. The adult will need to be more careful to ensure that valuable items make it back into the house.
-----
You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
January 18th, 2011 at 10:01:17 PM
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Quote: boymimbo
2. This is not your wife's fault at all as it isn't her job to track expensive items in the car.
3. Your kids share responsibility for not bringing the IPad back into the house..
I disagree. Every time I get a car washed, its my responsibility to see nothing of value is left out where it can be stolen, no matter who's car it is. I worked in a car wash when I was in high school and half the guys there were ex cons. I'm sure its no better now. And I don't play the 'blame game', its never ending. I'm responsible for what I own, and that includes when I let my kids use it. I may not be happy with what happens, but I never blame them, I just learn what not to do next time. Like my dad did with the binoculars.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
January 20th, 2011 at 9:31:14 AM
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I think the business is completely to blame. If they are going to hire trash they need survey cameras to watch them. What if she had dropped it on the cement when she was getting it out of the car? Did you check for your spare tire, tire changing tools? Did they take the cigarette lighter? Floor mats? Was the glove box unlocked? They didn't key the car anywhere did they? Hope they didn't pee on your carpet.
January 20th, 2011 at 10:01:27 AM
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Funny you should mention that.Quote: dmFloor mats?
My wife recently discovered that the mats from the back seat of her car are missing.
The assumption is that they were removed to be cleaned, and never replaced. But by whom, where and when? No way to tell.
It's no big deal. We don't have kids so nobody ever rides in back, but...
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
January 20th, 2011 at 12:36:54 PM
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Just had a thought - any other keys on the car key chain?
January 23rd, 2011 at 9:28:40 PM
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As an update, the police told me I had to come into a substation in person to file a report. They also said I could enter a queue for a report to be taken, and the queue wait was 2.5 weeks. There is no substation close to my house so I will probably just blow it off.
In my opinion there should be a convenient way to Email or fax in simple reports such as this. The next time Doug Gillespie runs for reelection, I will vote for whoever runs against him.
In my opinion there should be a convenient way to Email or fax in simple reports such as this. The next time Doug Gillespie runs for reelection, I will vote for whoever runs against him.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
January 23rd, 2011 at 10:08:26 PM
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Quote: WizardAs an update, the police told me I had to come into a substation in person to file a report. They also said I could enter a queue for a report to be taken, and the queue wait was 2.5 weeks. There is no substation close to my house so I will probably just blow it off.
In my opinion there should be a convenient way to Email or fax in simple reports such as this. The next time Doug Gillespie runs for reelection, I will vote for whoever runs against him.
I have filed four police reports in my life. To summarize the reactions of the officers who took down the information:
1. "We can't do anything."
2. "Sorry, we can't do anything."
3. "We'll keep your report on file, but we really can't do anything."
4. "We don't take action on incidents like this." (Someone had physically removed the front door to my business and carried off all our computers.)
The police are good for two things: writing traffic tickets and keeping donut shops solvent. In Vegas, they also help keep the homeless population down by executing a few of them every year.
The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one. The happiness of credulity is a cheap and dangerous quality.---George Bernard Shaw
January 23rd, 2011 at 10:17:27 PM
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Quote: mkl654321
In Vegas, they also help keep the homeless population down by executing a few of them every year.[/q
Is it bad this made me laugh? Gosh if the San Francisco PD did that 1/4 of the population would be gone.
January 23rd, 2011 at 11:30:02 PM
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Quote: Wizard
In my opinion there should be a convenient way to Email or fax in simple reports such as this. .
We had a robbery in the 90's and the cop who came never even got out of his car. He never made eye contact with me, he filled out the report, I signed it and he drove off without a word. So much for crime scene detective work. But you have to have the report, without it you're sunk if anything happens.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
January 23rd, 2011 at 11:46:23 PM
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When my car was broken into here, a screwdriver stuck in the ignition (thief didn't notice the big lock on my clutch while trying to steal it) I naively hoped they would come out and look for fingerprints. They didn't even come out. I mean, I'm glad for the police generally for all things crime, but you need no less than someone with a gun to get any kind of immediate action it seems.
There's no secret. Just know what you're talking about before you open your mouth.
January 24th, 2011 at 6:45:09 AM
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Quote: WizardAs an update, the police told me I had to come into a substation in person to file a report. They also said I could enter a queue for a report to be taken, and the queue wait was 2.5 weeks. There is no substation close to my house so I will probably just blow it off.
In my opinion there should be a convenient way to Email or fax in simple reports such as this. The next time Doug Gillespie runs for reelection, I will vote for whoever runs against him.
This sucks. My sister's stepdaughter is an addict, and one day my sister couldn't find the external hard drive she uses to back up the files on the computer system at work. She told the lawyers she may have left it on top of her car by accident, then asked if it was something that could be sold for cash by a lowlife. They told her it was, so she went to the local Cash Converters, and they said they couldn't tell her if the girl had fenced anything like that unless they had a police report, but if she filed a report there was a good chance they would have something like that on their list *hint hint.*
So the system basically gives people a license to steal with impunity. All her stepdaughter had to do was sign an affadavit that the items she was selling were her own property and they would accept them, and they couldn't even tell the rightful owners what she had sold. The law firm is an ethical one and reported to the Bar that clients' confidential information may have been breached even though the place had slicked the drive before reselling it. This isn't victimless and they make it way too inconvenient to do the right thing.
At least around here the cops will come out and do theft reports, and usually on the same day.
Each of us is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.
Preparing for a fight about your bad decision is not as smart as making a good decision.
January 24th, 2011 at 8:13:36 PM
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Man that sucks, but before you react make absolutely sure that it was stolen at the car wash. On the road, I must have had hundreds of golf discs stolen from me over the years. But one time I actually got into a fight with someone I acused of stealing, and later found the missing plastic. I sat there thinking about how stupid it is to get into a fight over a bunch of toys. An Ipad isn't a toy, but darn close to it! Are you POSITIVE they stole it at the car wash? Anything else missing?
Blame? Lets see...
Wizard... 3%
Wife... 2%
Kids... 4%
Dog,...
The idiots who steal from us hard-working people and get back 3 cents on our hard-earned dollars doing so to feed their stupid drug habit ... 90%
marty
Look in the trash at your house and perhaps at the car wash if posible. Also, look under the rugs, maybe your Ipad got covered up with a cleaned car mat...
Blame? Lets see...
Wizard... 3%
Wife... 2%
Kids... 4%
Dog,...
The idiots who steal from us hard-working people and get back 3 cents on our hard-earned dollars doing so to feed their stupid drug habit ... 90%
marty
Look in the trash at your house and perhaps at the car wash if posible. Also, look under the rugs, maybe your Ipad got covered up with a cleaned car mat...
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1.
The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
January 24th, 2011 at 8:38:46 PM
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wow, I get to break the 12-12 tie.....I voted for a reward because something might happen that way........no reward and this story is over.
January 24th, 2011 at 9:01:58 PM
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Thinkin bout it more, if I were a kid and broke my dad's I-pad, I might bury it in the back yard and say it was stolen...
Look through the trash and all over the house, under the floor mats in the car, and into your kids eyes.
I doubt it was stolen at a full-service car wash.
Why isn't this covered under home insurance? I had a camera stolen from my car in Kansas (on the way back from a Vegas road trip) and my home insurance paid for a new one ($1,200).
Look through the trash and all over the house, under the floor mats in the car, and into your kids eyes.
I doubt it was stolen at a full-service car wash.
Why isn't this covered under home insurance? I had a camera stolen from my car in Kansas (on the way back from a Vegas road trip) and my home insurance paid for a new one ($1,200).
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1.
The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
