Celebrate Religion here

Quote: AxelWolf

Wow you must have a seeing eye dog then.

The title of this thread is Celebrate Religion here, not Bash Religion here. Even I, a non religious person, can see the bashing that goes on here and in other threads that discuss religion. While nothing apparently rises to the definition of a personal insult, FrGamble, his church and his religion receive their share of nasty, vile comments. It has always been open season on religion at this gambling site. There are some good ,thoughtful, respectful discussions and the there is the rest of it.

Let's contrast that with something that took place in this forum yesterday. Does anyone find it curious that the Quote of the Day thread, started by soxfan, was closed after 90 minutes because it was "just another thread to bash Obama"? Has anyone noticed that more threads are being closed than ever before? If one didn't know better they might think it was censorship. To be fair, the offer was extended to continue soxfan's thread on the DT site.

Sorry, Axel. I didn't mean to quote you, I just hit the wrong button. How ya doin' this morning?

Quote: djatc

Does he kill a kitten everytime I masturbate?

No, He has someone else do it.

Quote: 1BB

Sorry, Axel. I didn't mean to quote you, I just hit the wrong button. How ya doin' this morning?

Very good, I just hit something good on a new(to me) online casino, crossing fingers ill get paid, no big deal if I don't because because the investment was minimal. And you, how are you doing ?

I seen your post and I was like WTF does that have to do with bashing religion. I was trying to figure out how it was correlated. I just couldn't make the connection.

However, I have been guilty of bashing religion, I even had one of my posts removed, It was a religious/gay 1 line joke/comment. And then there was the one that made fun of Jewish people and Catholics at the same time. it was very funny. I didn't know FM was a minster/priest? So i guess it was ok the one post was removed. Not suspension worthy IMO however, it could have been offensive IF you are judgmental and think being gay is a bad thing. To me a joke is a joke and that's it.

I don't know really know why people are so hard on religion, I sincerely think religion is a good thing and I would make my kids go if i had any (with a very watchful eye) I spent a ton of time in church when i was a kid(4 days a week) and it was a great experience. My child hood Best friend was a PK and his older sister was my first sexual experience.

What I don't like are bible thumpers, so many have completely closed minds. Most if not all are very hypocritical and fake. I know the bible advocates spreading the word of god but, if its causing more damage then good and your pushing your religious views on people. That annoys the hell out of me. There are plenty of message boards that actually do celibate religion and there may be some lost souls who really need someone like FM possibly someone on the brink of suicide. People on this forum are not going to change their minds so the time spent on disusing it here is taking away from people who may really need it.

Trying to PROVE religion here is selfish. Come to think of it trying to prove religion seems like an egotistical self righteous thing to do. They seem to not want is to love god they just want us to think they are right. I have a feeling God would not approve with religious people arguing with the haters here.

this is a gambling and math Vegas forum, add religion and it's oil and water with a match ready to go. Just the tittle of the thread is going to cause a ruckus. Never will any thread like this became a celebration or sanctuary. I would bet you anything, if Somehow Mike could block all the non believers. All the believers would abandon this thread like it was a hooker with herpes.

OH! crap it's Sunday (My GF's, who im living in sin with of course, favorite day of the week...... yep, but not because its a holy day, but a day of rest with the NEWS PAPPER! she likes reading and cutting coupons with that flavored 7-11 coffee ) looks like going to hell where all the fun people and casinos are.

Quote: AxelWolf

I don't know really know why people are so hard on religion, I sincerely think religion is a good thing and I would make my kids go if i had any (with a very watchful eye) I spent a ton of time in church when i was a kid(4 days a week) and it was a great experience.

I was a kid 7 days a week.

But I digress. Which church would you make your kids go to?

Quote: gpac1377

I was a kid 7 days a week.

But I digress. Which church would you make your kids go to?

One they could walk to preferably ;) Probably something that is non denominational with a 5% extortion fee and not 10%. Perhaps one with a good loss rebate. not some church that allows you to get away with murder and all is forgiven. That just seems to be something they made up so even sinners wouldn't give up and keep they would keep coming back to church, you have to keep that money flowing in. Everything I see in religion I can tie back to the money.

Flip a coin, because if their is a God, certainly he would have it land on the right side.

Quote: AxelWolf

One they could walk to preferably ;)

Correct.

It's bad enough having to drive them in the station wagon to soccer practice. There's no possible way I'm putting on pants to transport them to Sunday School :(

Quote: 1BB

The title of this thread is Celebrate Religion here, not Bash Religion here.

I grant you some comments are over the top.

My reason to bash religion is simple: religious people all over the world keep trying to legislate their beliefs, and their prejudices, into law. That is to say, they are trying to impose their beliefs and prejudices on the rest of us by force. So long as that goes on, the bashing will continue.

Quote: 1BB

The title of this thread is Celebrate Religion here, not Bash Religion here. Even I, a non religious person, can see the bashing that goes on here and in other threads that discuss religion. While nothing apparently rises to the definition of a personal insult, FrGamble, his church and his religion receive their share of nasty, vile comments. It has always been open season on religion at this gambling site. There are some good ,thoughtful, respectful discussions and the there is the rest of it.

Let's contrast that with something that took place in this forum yesterday. Does anyone find it curious that the Quote of the Day thread, started by soxfan, was closed after 90 minutes because it was "just another thread to bash Obama"? Has anyone noticed that more threads are being closed than ever before? If one didn't know better they might think it was censorship. To be fair, the offer was extended to continue soxfan's thread on the DT site.

I am happy to contrast the two threads, actually. I missed the Quote of the Day before it was closed, so had no preconceived opinion before you called it to my attention and I read it. I think the Wizard was 100% correct in both cases.

In the Celebrate Religion thread, Fr. Gamble started it almost 2 1/2 years ago, labeled it for what he intended to talk about, and has tended it thoughtfully and politely as a gentleman despite more than a few ugly posts (I'm talking about decorum/how he was addressed or how things were said, not what position the posters took on religion). It has brought a significant amount of thoughtful, valuable conversation to the board.

In the Quote of the Day thread, soxfan started it with what turned out to be a sarcastic title, and quoted a mean-spirited and profane email that turned out to be falsely attributed to V. Putin. Thread devolved immediately into political bashing duplicated elsewhere. Value right down around zero, from the negative side of that number.

I'd like to see us have a legitimate Quote of the Day and/or Favorite Quotes thread; I think both could be lively and interesting. But this wasn't it, sorry, soxfan.

The Wizard made the statement a couple of weeks ago that he (and under his direction, we) would be closing off-topic, non-gambling, non-productive threads rather than letting them keep lowering the standard of the forum discussion, so it follows that you are seeing that happen. This one qualified.

Quote: beachbumbabs

I am happy to contrast the two threads, actually. I missed the Quote of the Day before it was closed, so had no preconceived opinion before you called it to my attention and I read it. I think the Wizard was 100% correct in both cases.

In the Celebrate Religion thread, Fr. Gamble started it almost 2 1/2 years ago, labeled it for what he intended to talk about, and has tended it thoughtfully and politely as a gentleman despite more than a few ugly posts (I'm talking about decorum/how he was addressed or how things were said, not what position the posters took on religion). It has brought a significant amount of thoughtful, valuable conversation to the board.

In the Quote of the Day thread, soxfan started it with what turned out to be a sarcastic title, and quoted a mean-spirited and profane email that turned out to be falsely attributed to V. Putin. Thread devolved immediately into political bashing duplicated elsewhere. Value right down around zero, from the negative side of that number.

I'd like to see us have a legitimate Quote of the Day and/or Favorite Quotes thread; I think both could be lively and interesting. But this wasn't it, sorry, soxfan.

The Wizard made the statement a couple of weeks ago that he (and under his direction, we) would be closing off-topic, non-gambling, non-productive threads rather than letting them keep lowering the standard of the forum discussion, so it follows that you are seeing that happen. This one qualified.

That's good to hear. I'm looking forward to the closing of more threads. Are you taking suggestions?

Quote: beachbumbabs

I am happy to contrast the two threads, actually. I missed the Quote of the Day before it was closed, so had no preconceived opinion before you called it to my attention and I read it. I think the Wizard was 100% correct in both cases.

In the Celebrate Religion thread, Fr. Gamble started it almost 2 1/2 years ago, labeled it for what he intended to talk about, and has tended it thoughtfully and politely as a gentleman despite more than a few ugly posts (I'm talking about decorum/how he was addressed or how things were said, not what position the posters took on religion). It has brought a significant amount of thoughtful, valuable conversation to the board.

In the Quote of the Day thread, soxfan started it with what turned out to be a sarcastic title, and quoted a mean-spirited and profane email that turned out to be falsely attributed to V. Putin. Thread devolved immediately into political bashing duplicated elsewhere. Value right down around zero, from the negative side of that number.

I'd like to see us have a legitimate Quote of the Day and/or Favorite Quotes thread; I think both could be lively and interesting. But this wasn't it, sorry, soxfan.

The Wizard made the statement a couple of weeks ago that he (and under his direction, we) would be closing off-topic, non-gambling, non-productive threads rather than letting them keep lowering the standard of the forum discussion, so it follows that you are seeing that happen. This one qualified.

So you will be closing this one as well correct?

I feel like I have to give a little apologia pro vita sua here on this forum. Everybody seems to be guessing about why I'm even here and what I am hoping to do by posting religious ideas and trying to defend the faith, etc. Well the reason I am here is the reason I imagine we are all here on this forum, which is to learn a little bit about gambling and how to have the most fun with it and lessen the house edge as much as possible. I was amazed after I first joined and did not tell anyone I was a priest how many threads were concerning religion. I did not expect that. Many of them were started by or encouraged by the Wizard. Finally, one came up without my provocation about transubstantiation. Well at that point I thought I really need to tell people I am a Catholic Priest and the rest is history.

I used to post some homilies as blogs but people thought that was too much so I stopped doing that. A while a go I decided I wouldn't start any new threads about religion and check out the DT site as a more appropriate place to talk about God. I started this thread only as a counter to the thread titled, there is no God. I like to read the threads and posts about VP, blackjack, and craps and I don't have any grandiose ideas of mass conversions. I do actually learn a lot about the opinions towards the Church and God out there through the posts and have learned more about my own faith in defending it, but those are side benefits to being part of what I think is an intelligent and well run forum about Vegas and gambling.

Finally, I think those who are constantly calling for threads like this one and others about God, religion, philosophy, metaphysics, and the supernatural to be blocked or stopped might want to ask themselves why are they so against them? It is so easy now a days to ignore or not think about these important questions that we all must answer, why not allow a little deep thinking into the midst of our betting systems, hotel reviews, and probability analyses? It is only natural that questions about the purpose and meaning of life come up and I think we do ourselves a disservice if we treat these types of threads like the plague and only want to block and get rid of them. Don't be scared. Nobody has changed their minds about these things yet, even though I think s2dbaker is close (just kidding), the worst that can happen is you might hear something you don't often get exposed to in your daily life and maybe even get and idea to chew on and learn from, I know that this has happened to me and I sincerely hope that it might happen to you too.

Quote: AxelWolf

So you will be closing this one as well correct?

Not correct. Nice try. :)

Quote: FrGamble

I like to read the threads and posts about VP, blackjack, and craps and I don't have any grandiose ideas of mass conversions.

It would qualify for a miracle.

But this reminds of a plot of a movie (or a couple movies I've seen). But I think it was nuns. One of them gets assigned "problem children" or some other area. Hilarity ensues. Or something.

Are you sure you aren't assigned here like "Maria" in the Sound of Music?

Quote: FrGamble

I know that this has happened to me and I sincerely hope that it might happen to you too.

The trouble with religion is, it closes your mind.
It's an axiom, and when you accept an axiom,
your mind closes off to creativity. You curve fit
all new info to fit the axiom. It has to be this
way for religion, or it would collapse. There
are many people who are fine living this way,
creative thinking hurts their heads. They let
somebody do that for them, and look at all
the free time it provides.

Why would I do that to myself.

Quote: FrGamble

Finally, I think those who are constantly calling for threads like this one and others about God, religion, philosophy, metaphysics, and the supernatural to be blocked or stopped might want to ask themselves why are they so against them? It is so easy now a days to ignore or not think about these important questions that we all must answer, why not allow a little deep thinking into the midst of our betting systems, hotel reviews, and probability analyses? It is only natural that questions about the purpose and meaning of life come up and I think we do ourselves a disservice if we treat these types of threads like the plague and only want to block and get rid of them. Don't be scared. Nobody has changed their minds about these things yet, even though I think s2dbaker is close (just kidding), the worst that can happen is you might hear something you don't often get exposed to in your daily life and maybe even get and idea to chew on and learn from, I know that this has happened to me and I sincerely hope that it might happen to you too.

I've always felt like probability and odds are a glimpse into the workings of the universe. It is only natural that a discussion of religion would be complementary to that. It never bothered me one bit.

Quote: FrGamble

I was amazed after I first joined and did not tell anyone I was a priest how many threads were concerning religion.

aside the fact that handle gives it away, the first thing I recall you ever posted was whether a priest could gamble. That kind of gives it way, too ;)

Quote: beachbumbabs

Not correct. Nice try. :)

Personally I don't care if threads get closed, im not for closing threads unless its just totally dumb stuff like cooking, cleaning or pets, possibly the, "I win at craps and Bac everyday" threads should be closed.

I just don't understand why this thread is any different then others. Have you read it? Its just an attack on religion, with 1 or 2 people defending it (sending mixed signals). It's certainly not in the apparent direction you indicated the Wizard wants the forum to move towards. (religion and gambling, casinos math? They are polar opposites.)This would indicate mod's are using personal views( likes and dislikes) to decide what should stay and what should go. I have no problem with that, I just want to know if that how it is, since I normally don't start threads that have nothing to do with gambling or casinos anyways.

Others may think this is not fair. Again, I don't care about fair myself, case by case if fine with me, I know life is not fair.

Quote: AxelWolf

Personally I don't care if threads get closed, im not for closing threads unless its just totally dumb stuff like cooking, cleaning or pets, possibly the, "I win at craps and Bac everyday" threads should be closed.

I just don't understand why this thread is any different then others. Have you read it? Its just an attack on religion, with 1 or 2 people defending it (sending mixed signals). It's certainly not in the apparent direction you indicated the Wizard wants the forum to move towards. (religion and gambling, casinos math? They are polar opposites.)This would indicate mod's are using personal views( likes and dislikes) to decide what should stay and what should go. I have no problem with that, I just want to know if that how it is, since I normally don't start threads that have nothing to do with gambling or casinos anyways.

Others may think this is not fair. Again, I don't care about fair myself, case by case if fine with me, I know life is not fair.

If you don't care, why have you now posted twice about it? I support vigorous debate and free speech. Fr Gamble has invited people to discuss religion here and has proven himself more than able to debate opposite opinions and keep the topic alive. If this thread had dwindled down to name calling and repetitive stances set in stone, perhaps its time would have come. It has not done either, and continues to provide the opportunity for interesting discussion after more than 100 pages of posts. So why close it?

Too many questions about forum rules may eventually lead to some sort of limit on questions about forum rules.

: )


(It's like kids screaming in the back seat. We aren't stopping! No ice cream! Stop hitting your sister! I don't care if it's fair! Finally, WHAP!!!)

Quote: rxwine

Too many questions about forum rules may eventually lead to some sort of limit on questions about forum rules.

: )


(It's like kids screaming in the back seat. We aren't stopping! No ice cream! Stop hitting your sister! I don't care if it's fair! Finally, WHAP!!!)

This seems like it was directed at me since i was the last to have a conversation about it.

Who is asking specifically about forum rules? I was discussing what started off as a joke about closing it. I don't want to know about the exact rule, I just wanted to know if its a personal preference rule. I don't even think I wrote the word RULE in the other 2 or 3 comments. I'm not even asking for clarification of a rule or what the rule is.

How any times have I asked about forum rules or objected to them? or asked for a rule to be enforced? Only rule I care about is spamming. Don't put me in the Nareed, I need to know the rules and want them to be fair category.

Not intending to make you the scapegoat for what goes on a lot by so many. Just noticed it is fairly constant.

Quote: rxwine

Not intending to make you the scapegoat for what goes on a lot by so many. Just noticed it is fairly constant.

There is a specific thread for that, would you like the link?

Quote: AxelWolf

There is a specific thread for that, would you like the link?

Thanks for asking.

No.

Quote: rxwine

Thanks for asking.

No.

Are you sure? It's really a page turner, lots of drama.

Quote: Nareed

aside the fact that handle gives it away, the first thing I recall you ever posted was whether a priest could gamble. That kind of gives it way, too ;)

Actually my first posts and threads were not about religion at all and then you and I, even before I mentioned I was a priest, had some good conversation about does God exist? I am actually a little hurt that you forgot about the beginning of our relationship ;)

Quote: FrGamble

Actually my first posts and threads were not about religion at all and then you and I, even before I mentioned I was a priest, had some good conversation about does God exist? I am actually a little hurt that you forgot about the beginning of our relationship ;)

Shh! You're letting out that we're not mortal enemies!!! ;)

Quote: beachbumbabs

I am happy to contrast the two threads, actually. I missed the Quote of the Day before it was closed, so had no preconceived opinion before you called it to my attention and I read it. I think the Wizard was 100% correct in both cases.

In the Celebrate Religion thread, Fr. Gamble started it almost 2 1/2 years ago, labeled it for what he intended to talk about, and has tended it thoughtfully and politely as a gentleman despite more than a few ugly posts (I'm talking about decorum/how he was addressed or how things were said, not what position the posters took on religion). It has brought a significant amount of thoughtful, valuable conversation to the board.

In the Quote of the Day thread, soxfan started it with what turned out to be a sarcastic title, and quoted a mean-spirited and profane email that turned out to be falsely attributed to V. Putin. Thread devolved immediately into political bashing duplicated elsewhere. Value right down around zero, from the negative side of that number.

I'd like to see us have a legitimate Quote of the Day and/or Favorite Quotes thread; I think both could be lively and interesting. But this wasn't it, sorry, soxfan.

The Wizard made the statement a couple of weeks ago that he (and under his direction, we) would be closing off-topic, non-gambling, non-productive threads rather than letting them keep lowering the standard of the forum discussion, so it follows that you are seeing that happen. This one qualified.

Apparently it didn't qualify to be closed at the DT site. Are there different standards over there?

The Wizard's response to soxfan when closing the thread was "please take that over to DT". That sounds to me like it would be allowed there. Does that mean that the Wizard did not find it sarcastic, mean spirited and profane as you did?

Do you not find it mean spirited when someone is ridiculed over and over for their religious beliefs especially when that person who started the thread, in good faith, is a priest? Do you not find it mean spirited when the terms flying spaghetti monster, noodly appendage and invisible friend are used over and over when discussing one's religion and the God that they worship?

Make just one comment about someone's lifestyle or orientation and see how long you last. Innocently use a politically incorrect term that may have just been coined and see what happens.

I'll say again that I am not religious but I am respectful to everyone that deserves it and that includes priests, atheists, gays etc. It doesn't hurt, it doesn't cost anything and it actually feels good.

Quote: 1BB

I'll say again that I am not religious but I am respectful to everyone that deserves it and that includes priests, atheists, gays etc. It doesn't hurt, it doesn't cost anything and it actually feels good.

There is some system players in much need of respect perhaps you can go cheer them up and everybody can feel god

Quote: AxelWolf

There is some system players in much need of respect perhaps you can go cheer them up and everybody can feel god

Only on DT. I'll get right over there. :-)

Quote: 1BB

Only on DT. I'll get right over there. :-)

I really don't know what this DT site is all about, I can guess, but I have only read one link that pertained to the all female ban week. Better known as the Evil Wizard ;).

Quote: 1BB

Do you not find it mean spirited when someone is ridiculed over and over for their religious beliefs especially when that person who started the thread, in good faith, is a priest? Do you not find it mean spirited when the terms flying spaghetti monster, noodly appendage and invisible friend are used over and over when discussing one's religion and the God that they worship?

Nah. The Christian text is pretty harsh on non-believers.

Quote:

And they entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and with all their soul, but that whoever would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, should be put to death, whether young or old, man or woman.


And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Quote: 1BB

Do you not find it mean spirited when someone is ridiculed over and over for their religious beliefs especially when that person who started the thread, in good faith, is a priest? Do you not find it mean spirited when the terms flying spaghetti monster, noodly appendage and invisible friend are used over and over when discussing one's religion and the God that they worship?

Ridiculing someone for their beliefs is rude. Ridiculing the beliefs themselves is not. That's a subtle distinction, and it may seem to some to be a distinction without a difference.

The Pastafarian "creed" is a case in point. It's used to illustrate how some atheists perceive religion and religious dogma.

BTW believers (used to mean religious people, regardles of a specific religion) make some pretty outrageous statements about atheists. I will readily admit the Good Father hasn't done so much. Things like saying "Atheism is a religion," which prompts naturally the very sarcastic response "and not collecting stamps is a hobby." Or "atheists are angry at god," usually elliciting "and unicorns and dragons, too."

There is disrespect on both sides.

Quote: rxwine

Nah. The Christian text is pretty harsh on non-believers.

Excellent. These are the things that should be used when arguing/discussing religion and it would not be mean spirited.

Harsh is an understatement for this particularly disturbing quote and I'm sure there are many more. Yikes!

Quote: rxwine

Nah. The Christian text is pretty harsh on non-believers.

You mean things like we are all going to hell?

I believe the bible says believers will hate and betray. Their own bible says believers are bad people.

Quote: Nareed

Ridiculing someone for their beliefs is rude. Ridiculing the beliefs themselves is not. That's a subtle distinction, and it may seem to some to be a distinction without a difference.

The Pastafarian "creed" is a case in point. It's used to illustrate how some atheists perceive religion and religious dogma.

BTW believers (used to mean religious people, regardles of a specific religion) make some pretty outrageous statements about atheists. I will readily admit the Good Father hasn't done so much. Things like saying "Atheism is a religion," which prompts naturally the very sarcastic response "and not collecting stamps is a hobby." Or "atheists are angry at god," usually elliciting "and unicorns and dragons, too."

There is disrespect on both sides.

Atheism is religious in nature but not a religion itself. There are atheistic religions however, there are also religious people who are atheist. Many years ago My daughter and I were driving and I was listening to an atheist talk show on the radio and she looked at me and said, what do they do? get together and not read the bible? "out of the mouth of babes". I thought that was pretty perceptive for a little kid.

Quote: pew

Atheism is religious in nature but not a religion itself. There are atheistic religions however, there are also religious people who are atheist. Many years ago My daughter and I were driving and I was listening to an atheist talk show on the radio and she looked at me and said, what do they do? get together and not read the bible? "out of the mouth of babes". I thought that was pretty perceptive for a little kid.

Yeah, that's pretty good, pew. She's a smart kid.

Quote: pew

Atheism is religious in nature but not a religion itself.

Sorry, I don't follow. Religion is belief. Atheism is absence of belief. What am I missing?

Quote: gpac1377

Sorry, I don't follow. Religion is belief. Atheism is absence of belief. What am I missing?

Gonna sound like splitting hairs, but believing in God requires a leap of faith, a thought process. Atheism also involves a thought process on the existence of God, but in this case, choosing non-belief, or not taking that leap of faith. It is still a belief system, but a rational (as in reasoning, not as in the opposite of irrational) choice.

Quote: pew

Atheism is religious in nature but not a religion itself.

How?

I treat the claim of a deity the same way I treat claims of astrology, phrenology, numerology, etc. I require evidence for such claims. If any is available, the evidence can be reviewed and assesed.

Quote:

There are atheistic religions however, there are also religious people who are atheist.

There are faith-based ideologies with practices approaching religious conventions, complete with dogma, ritual, sins, penance, indulgences, etc. Politics is rife with it. But calling it an atheistic religion misses the point. Religious people may not adhere to a faith or church, but they're not atheists.

Some would say that atheism is very irrational. It certainly cannot be proved. And they do get clobbered when debates come up on the highest levels.

Quote: Nareed

How?

I treat the claim of a deity the same way I treat claims of astrology, phrenology, numerology, etc. I require evidence for such claims. If any is available, the evidence can be reviewed and assesed.



There are faith-based ideologies with practices approaching religious conventions, complete with dogma, ritual, sins, penance, indulgences, etc. Politics is rife with it. But calling it an atheistic religion misses the point. Religious people may not adhere to a faith or church, but they're not atheists.

Buddhism is atheistic, scientology may also be. Many Jews are atheist and attend temple, get married in their faith ect. You can also go down the road of Marxism as religion but we don't need to go there to prove the point. Religious people by definition do adhere to a faith and or church.
"I treat the claim of a deity the same way I treat claims of astrology, phrenology, numerology, etc. I require evidence for such claims. If any is available, the evidence can be reviewed and assesed."
I think you answered your own question.

Quote: pew

You can also go down the road of Marxism as religion but we don't need to go there to prove the point.

Communism as practiced in the Soviet Union since the days of Stalin was a religion.

Quote:

I think you answered your own question.

I think you evaded the question. There's nothign religious about science and evidence.

Quote: DeMango

Some would say that atheism is very irrational. It certainly cannot be proved. And they do get clobbered when debates come up on the highest levels.

Atheism is a negative view so doesn't lend itself to proof. I've found that most people who don't believe in God do so not because of the arguments for or against but just the fact that they feel they just don't need God in their daily existence, and I would agree that that's a legit view even though I think it's flawed.

I hope to God pun not intended God exists. The fear of not knowing life after death makes many people believe in something.

Quote: beachbumbabs

It is still a belief system, but a rational (as in reasoning, not as in the opposite of irrational) choice.

A true agnostic doesn't think about it
either way. He doesn't think about it
at all because there's nothing to think
about. It's like unicorns. I have no
reason to think one way or the other,
it's not part of my life.

Native cultures left to their own devices
don't have problems with believers and
non believers. They accept what they see
and don't add or subtract from it. It is
what it is.

The religion of Asasquatch.

Anyone who doesn't believe in a Sasquatch is practicing a religion. Because not believing in Sasquatch requires a religion. Likewise, swamp apes, Jackalopes, abominable smowmen.

Doesn't make sense. You don't need a specified religion to not believe in something.

This:

Quote: pew

Atheism is a negative view so doesn't lend itself to proof. I've found that most people who don't believe in God do so not because of the arguments for or against but just the fact that they feel they just don't need God in their daily existence, and I would agree that that's a legit view even though I think it's flawed.

This is exactly what I meant earlier about outrageous statements regarding atheism. For one thing this quote completely misunderstands the most common basis for atheism (lack of evidence). But most important, shifts the burden of proof to atheists. I am getting tired fo saying this: those whoclaim a deity must prove its existence, not the other way around.

So you see, there's plenty of disrespect on both dies. It's not something unique to atheists.

Quote: rxwine

Doesn't make sense. You don't need a specified religion to not believe in something.

Thank you.

But the aquatic ape idea is rather tantalizing. We do share some physiological characteristics with aquatic mammals. And for land mammals, we swim extremely well.

Quote: Nareed

This:



This is exactly what I meant earlier about outrageous statements regarding atheism. For one thing this quote completely misunderstands the most common basis for atheism (lack of evidence). But most important, shifts the burden of proof to atheists. I am getting tired fo saying this: those whoclaim a deity must prove its existence, not the other way around.

So you see, there's plenty of disrespect on both dies. It's not something unique to atheists.

When I say atheism doesn't lend itself to proof I'm agreeing with you. Atheism doesn't require evidence as far as I'm concerned. Belief in God does require support scientifically, philosophically, historically, ect. And the fact is it does stand up to rigorous scrutiny.