Bethlehem Sands Casino Travel tips

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March 31st, 2011 at 3:19:22 PM permalink

Quote: pacomartin
The point is that instead of approving two 200 rooms as a way to stimulate new growth, they may be better off approving forty 15 machine slot club/restaurants.

The boutique idea has been around for years with no visible signs of progress. (What else in new?)

Vol. 4, No. 3, March 2007, Q & A
Q&A with Curtis Bashaw
By Frank Legato Tue, Feb 20, 2007
Q&A with Curtis Bashaw

Before returning in 2005 to his former role as a prominent Cape May hotelier, Curtis Bashaw reshaped the Casino Reinvestment Development Authority. As executive director of CRDA, Bashaw led efforts to re-brand the Jersey Shore as a cohesive tourist destination, and oversaw improvements to Atlantic City that included the Walk retail center and revitalization of the Boardwalk. More recently, Bashaw partnered with former Bally�s chief Wallace Barr on an as-yet-unspecified new casino project for the southwest corner of the Boardwalk, and has forged a new venture to transform the adjacent Holiday Inn and Howard Johnson Boardwalk hotels in the Chelsea neighborhood into an upscale boutique hotel the likes of which have not been seen before in Atlantic City.
Casino Connection Managing Editor Frank Legato talked with Bashaw about his newest plan recently at his Congress Hall hotel in Cape May.

Casino Connection: After you left CRDA, we thought you�d go back to Cape May and become the gentleman hotelier. Instead, you�ve remained involved in Atlantic City. Tell us what you�ve been doing since leaving the CRDA.

Bashaw: The CRDA was really a full-time job for me, and I did spend a great deal of time after leaving the CRDA sort of connecting with my own company both in the New York and Cape May offices. We have continued to work on opportunities to participate in the Atlantic City market, but this time from the private-sector side.

CC: Can you tell us about your latest plan to create a boutique hotel?

Bashaw: We recently closed on the purchase of the Holiday Inn and Howard Johnson, both located on Chelsea Avenue between Pacific and the Boardwalk. Our vision there is to close the hotels after the summer, combine them and renovate them into a 337-room upscale boutique hotel, similar to the Gansevoort in New York, or the W or the Mercer�one of these independent but stylish properties that cater to an upscale market. . . . -- casino connection

buzzpaff

buzzpaff

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April 14th, 2011 at 9:33:46 AM permalink

PARX's nearly doubling of table games since November 2010 has made them the clear leader in revenue. As a sidenote, they seem to be eliminating their electronic tables.

Are you talking about the electronic BJ tables that dealt the players and dealers hands from separate 6 deck shoes ?

FleaStiff

FleaStiff

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April 14th, 2011 at 11:02:42 AM permalink

Okay, so gambling outside of Las Vegas is pretty much the same as gambling inside Las Vegas.

Table games are in decline in Vegas, alot of visitors to Vegas seem to be considering the gambling as sort of a side-dish to a meal. Its not the purpose of going to the restaurant its not really a goal. Its becoming sort of a whimsical visit to a casino. There are restaurants, wine, clubs, ... and somewhere along the line a visitor will also "drop by" the casino. Oh now maybe these analogies are not quite perfect ones but it seems that Vegas casinos are in the same situation. There are competitors in the sense of other casinos but there are also competitors in the sense of other activities.

Pennsylvania? Not much different than Vegas. Its just that if you live in the highly populous areas in the North East you don't have to take a long flight to get to Vegas. You might even be able to drop by a casino and get a room for only one night because you live close enough to make it a real trip but won't have to deal with jet lag or sore legs from sitting on an airplane.

Some New Yorkers have been shooting craps since infancy. I've posted before about the Atlantic City neophyte craps dealer who on opening night was told "if you don't know how much a bet pays off, drop chips until the New Yorker smiles, then take one back". These New Yorkers probably still gamble and probably have not switched to slot machines, but they no longer fly to Vegas. Some of them may do more restaurants, shows and golf than they ever did when they were flying to Vegas. They used to fly to The Horseshoe, shoot craps for three days and chat with Benny Binion about his chili. Now they spend three days at a luxury resort but probably only gamble for three hours.

Fewer gamblers, fewer table games players, more casinos, closer casinos... Vegas or Pennsylvania? What difference does it make?

pacomartin

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May 1st, 2011 at 8:31:51 AM permalink

DJTeddyBear

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May 1st, 2011 at 12:28:59 PM permalink

Quote: pacomartin
... the stage will use the old blast furnaces as a backdrop.

Sounds like an interesting venue.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

FleaStiff

FleaStiff

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May 1st, 2011 at 2:35:02 PM permalink

Probably a way to get taxpayer funds expended on parking and transportation that will aid the casino.

DJTeddyBear

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May 30th, 2011 at 5:07:32 PM permalink

I was there this past Saturday. The hotel opened Friday. Dealers said it was sold out Friday, although in typical casino fashion, a high roller was able to get a room at around 3:30am.

After I went broke at about 4:00pm, I walked to the hotel lobby. It felt like it was a mile away. For anyone who has been to the Sands, the hallway to the lobby runs parallel to the food court, on the other side of the Cobalt restaurant. It's about 3 or 4 times as long as the food court - which is already long. It has two small turns (i.e. a left then a quick right) but I suspect that's just to break it up so it doesn't LOOK like it's a mile long. You would expect it to be lined with retail or restaurants or banquet facilities or SOMETHING, but the bulk of the walkway has nothing. Just one restaurant, Emeril's Italian at the casino end, and a couple banquet halls on the hotel end.

There is no shortcut to the back end of the food court. If you're in the hotel and want to eat something, you have to go all the way to the casino first.

At the end if the hallway is the elevators. The lobby is one flight down. It was very small. A little smaller than two average hotel rooms - and it was PACKED. Then again, with it's small size, "packed" meant about 15 groups waiting to do business. With it's small size, I almost thought it was a temporary lobby. But it was the only thing between the elevators and the doors which lead to the valet driveway. So that really was the lobby. It had a counter with room for three clerks, and a table with three self-serve terminals. And the typical couple couches, chairs and a coffee table. All three clerk stations were manned, as well as a manager behind helping out and a manager helping people at the self-serve terminals, although during the couple minutes I was there, only one guest used the self-serve terminal.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

DJTeddyBear

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June 21st, 2011 at 4:59:17 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin
No sign that NJ is planning to do anything radical to stop the slide which began in January 2007.

Whoa! What about all the tax money being dumped into the Revel project? True, that won't have an impact until it opens next year, but at least it's something.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

DJTeddyBear

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June 21st, 2011 at 7:25:37 AM permalink

You're right. Donating to a money pit is typical, not radical.

Yeah, since I live and work not far from the Meadolands, the #1 location in any of the gambling-outside-AC discussions, I too would welcome something more radical.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

hook3670

hook3670

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June 21st, 2011 at 8:01:29 AM permalink

I live in Baltimore and drive to A/C somewhat regularly(10-12 times a year) for the weekend. I am part of the evil empire club and used to get free rooms at the drop of a hat, now not so much however they are still somewhat reasonable, free Fridays $99-$159 Saturdays on season and acutally really cheap off or still free off season. We have done day trips to Harrah's Chester and yes the are is obviously a dump with a lovely view of a lake and a prison on either side. A/C is losing money and play like crazy to the Philly area casinos. We actually went to Sugar House recently and they were packed on a Sunday afternoon. For the Philly casinos it is relatively cheap to stay in Philly and get to them easily, Sugar House has three different free daily shuttles throughout the Philly area to pickup and drop customers off from noon to midnight every day. They run 3 different routes and each bus has about 10 stops to pick up and drop off passangers. The day we took the shuttle it was crowded going and coming.

pacomartin

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June 22nd, 2011 at 5:07:58 AM permalink

Although poker is not a huge part of the revenue of a casino, Pennsylvania seems to indicate that it is far more profitable to have poker within easy driving distance than to put it in a resort. While no doubt there are people that make poker a centerpiece of overnight stays, the PA poker tables make nearly double the per day average of those in Atlantic City, NJ. Overall take in poker is also higher in PA compared to NJ despite having fewer tables.

Even if NJ does not want to undermine the fragility of Atlantic City by opening slot parlors in the northern part of the state, they need to concede that they are losing poker players to the shorter drive to Pennsylvania. In at least this one area of gaming they should relent and open a first rate card club in NJ that most of the population can drive to in 45 minutes or less.

It is my understanding that people have been lobbying for poker at the Meadowlands for some time.

New Jersey	Tables	Per table day	Pennsylvania	Tables	Per table day
Borgata	85	$621	SANDS BETHLEHEM	23	$1,123
Trump Taj Mahal	54	$482	HARRAH'S CHESTER DOWNS	35	$879
Bally	26	$408	PARX	50	$841
Harrahs	40	$400	MOUNT AIRY	11	$811
Ceasars	32	$361	PENN NATIONAL	16	$798
Tropicana	34	$317	THE RIVERS	30	$736
Showboat	24	$278	MOHEGAN SUN	18	$639
Hilton	2	$178	THE MEADOWS	20	$540
Total	297	$454	Total	203	$811

AC Hilton cut back to 4 poker tables in November 2008. At some point they reduced to 2 tables. I am not sure why they don't discontinue entirely.

pacomartin

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July 18th, 2011 at 11:17:54 PM permalink

Pennsylvania finally published the table games results for June and for the first full year of table games in Pennsylvania.

Pennsylvania took in just over $1/2 billion for the full year at all casinos. Meaning it is still a distant second to New Jersey (although it is leading in poker).

The hotel at Bethlehem Sands seems to have secured them second place in Pennsylvania (ahead of the racino in Harrah's Chester), but it didn't make nearly the increase as I thought it would. The June increase was a mere 0.35% better than March.

It does look like table game players prefer a resort environment as opposed to a drive up local casino

PA and NJ table games for 12 months July 1 2010 to June 30 2011

Pennsylvania	Table Games	New Jersey	Table Games
		Borgata	$237,743,872
		Bally's	$159,808,335
		Caesars	$155,106,762
		Taj Mahal	$145,947,243
		Harrah's	$103,016,156
		Tropicana	$102,218,742
PARX	$90,616,757
SANDS BETHLEHEM	$73,121,094
HARRAH'S CHESTER DOWNS	$70,929,125
THE RIVERS	$57,692,101
SUGARHOUSE *	$52,554,279
* in low $60's if open all year
MOHEGAN SUN	$38,580,345	Trump	$58,563,929
MOUNT AIRY	$37,738,361	Showboat	$55,631,307
PENN NATIONAL	$34,669,240	Hilton	$47,148,030
THE MEADOWS	$32,032,157	Resorts	$41,903,093
PRESQUE ISLE	$20,053,468	Golden Nugget	$37,809,679
TOTAL	$507,986,927		$1,144,897,148

pacomartin

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August 17th, 2011 at 5:34:04 PM permalink

For July 2011 Pennsylvania greatly improved their table games getting to 60% of New Jersey. Sands Bethlehem broke $10 million and came close to the high for the state. The hotel appears to be a solid success.

In a rather surprise jump, New Jersey exceeded Pennsylvania by 12% in slots.

pacomartin

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September 21st, 2011 at 6:29:24 AM permalink

For August 2011 Bethlehem Sands once again took in the most money in table games. With the plans in for a shopping mall and a convention center and 2500 seat entertainment pavilion, they seem poised to be the solid leader in table games for Pennsylvania.

However, generally in Pennsylvania gaming does not seem to be growing like it did in NJ in the 1980's. Slots are almost immediately flat, and table games are still showing limited growth except for PARX and SANDS.

The hometown casino concept seems to meet a need, but does not necessarily result in growth.

DJTeddyBear

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September 21st, 2011 at 7:17:29 AM permalink

I'm not so sure about that.

Each time I've been to the Sands, at the hight of the day it seemed quite crowded. Although there were always slots available, it didn't have the elbow room / breathing space that would make it inviting. I.E. Although there were more slots available, I'd describe it as "at capacity". Of course, the tables were overcrowded, beyond capacity.

I.E. If Sands were to expand, I think you'll see their numbers jump to match the new capacity.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

FleaStiff

FleaStiff

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January 19th, 2012 at 5:08:14 AM permalink

From Bethelehem patch.com:
The Sands closed out 2011 setting a monthly table games record: grossed $11.7 million in revenue. Combined with slots revenue of $23.4 million, the Sands brought in more than $35 million in revenue in December. The casino�s total revenue for the year was $377 million. In December, Sands table revenues alone netted the state $1.6 million in tax revenue and $234,000 in local share taxes.

Niblick

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January 21st, 2012 at 8:25:17 AM permalink

I was in the Sands for the first time yesterday; they openly cater to the Asian market (there is a lot of bus traffic out of NY).

I was taken by the amount of table games in play. It seemed that one could combine Harrington, Dover, Mount Airy and still not come with what I saw at Sands.

I pass the Sands daily (on my way to craps class--which, by the way, is going well); I can't seem to shake the ambivalent feeling that the venue was once Bethlehem Steel, former paragon of American Industry (and testimony to the effects of corporate excess along with antagonistic labor/management relations), maker of the Golden Gate, Waldorf Astoria, George Washington Bridge, WWII battleships, etc. and it's now a casino. FWIW Once upon a time, I lived in Allentown during the time of Bethlehem Steel. If one was out looking for distaff companionship, the magic words were, "I work at Bethlehem Steel" and the effect was successful and instantaneous.

And now, I repeat, it's a casino.

I can't get over it.

I know there's a message in there somewhere but I don't know what it is.

Clearly though, the fact that PA is now second to Nevada is evidence of a dysfunctional legislature that lacks the political will to address the two largest problems extant in PA: 1. How to pay for education 2. The fact that there are 2467 municipalities in PA (the next closest is California with 800 something). We are talking about a legislature that took 3 years to enact a texting law. If they are unable to address low hanging fruit like anti texting, how are they going to address the larger, more esoteric issues?

Their answer?

More casinos.

Funny thing, it's easier to get a building permit in PA for a casino than it is for a three bedroom/two bath house.

Oh, well.

Nemo Omnibus Horis Sapit

DJTeddyBear

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January 21st, 2012 at 8:55:01 AM permalink

Quote: Niblick
I pass the Sands daily (on my way to craps class--which, by the way, is going well); I can't seem to shake the ambivalent feeling that the venue was once Bethlehem Steel, ....

Don't try to shake it. You're absoltely right.

Did you notice that orange ring around the bad in the middle of the casino?

It's a huge coil of steel that they found on the site. The bar is called "Coil."

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

cclub79

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January 21st, 2012 at 9:26:49 AM permalink

Quote: DJTeddyBear
Don't try to shake it. You're absoltely right.

I think he knows it was, but his point was the seeming ambivalence.

1BB

1BB

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January 21st, 2012 at 9:28:42 AM permalink

Niblick, your post reminded me of a Billy Joel song.

Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi

SanchoPanza

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January 21st, 2012 at 10:37:50 AM permalink

Quote: Niblick
I was taken by the amount of table games in play. It seemed that one could combine Harrington, Dover, Mount Airy and still not come with what I saw at Sands.

In view of the confiscatory tax rate on slots, that is more than understandable.

Niblick

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January 21st, 2012 at 12:18:46 PM permalink

Quote: DJTeddyBear
Did you notice that orange ring around the bad in the middle of the casino?

It's a huge coil of steel that they found on the site. The bar is called "Coil."

DJTB, interesting...I saw it and took note but didn't associate it with anything.

Thanks for the info. Do you have any other nuggets like that regarding the Sands? There has to be some kind of story behind the sign...

Nemo Omnibus Horis Sapit

SanchoPanza

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January 21st, 2012 at 5:56:53 PM permalink

Quote: pacomartin
There was no building where the casino now stands. It was a giant ore pit.

Adelson sure took down a lot of other buildings:

"BETHLEHEM, Pa. (AP) � A sprawling 130-year-old steel plant that armored hundreds of U.S. warships and provided the raw material for the Golden Gate Bridge, Madison Square Garden and many other famous landmarks will become a hive of activity over the next few days as workers start preparing some of its buildings for demolition.

More than a decade after its towering blast furnaces went cold, Bethlehem Steel's flagship plant is being transformed into a $600 million casino complex run by Las Vegas Sands Corp., owner of the Venetian Resort Hotel Casino in Las Vegas. Contractor Brandenburg Industrial Service Co. will take down 11 buildings representing about 460,000 square feet, including a locomotive repair shop and steel foundry.

Though historians and former steelworkers lament the loss of a part of Bethlehem Steel's history, Sands said it will save more than 20 buildings � including the 1,500-foot-long No. 2 Machine Shop, once the world's largest � and incorporate many of them into a resort featuring a hotel, restaurants, shops, entertainment venues and the slots casino.

Also staying put are the iconic, 20-story blast furnaces that have helped define Bethlehem's skyline for 100 years. . . . Actual demolition won't start until early June. Workers must first clean up the site and remove important artifacts � including a 60-foot-long, 187,000-pound gun from the USS Mississippi, a battleship that saw action during World War II. A fire truck, a diesel locomotive and the last piece of armor plate made in the United States also will be removed and stored for future display.--usatoday

pacomartin

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January 21st, 2012 at 6:57:02 PM permalink

Quote: SanchoPanza
Contractor Brandenburg Industrial Service Co. will take down 11 buildings representing about 460,000 square feet, including a locomotive repair shop and steel foundry.Though historians and former steelworkers lament the loss of a part of Bethlehem Steel's history, Sands said it will save more than 20 buildings � including the 1,500-foot-long No. 2 Machine Shop, once the world's largest � and incorporate many of them into a resort featuring a hotel, restaurants, shops, entertainment venues and the slots casino.

The actual casino is on the ore-fields in the map below (dark brown). The locomotive repair shop was where the mall is now, and some of the other large buildings (like the steel foundry, no 2 treatment, and weldment department are now parking lots.

You are talking about some incredibly ugly buildings. The #2 Machine shop described in the article above, is literally crumbling. Although the machine shop was saved, no one can afford to try and renovate such a building. No old buildings are part of the casino/hotel/shopping mall complex as of today. It isn't like some of the industrial buildings in central London which were saved at huge cost. This is a very ugly brownfield site.

The blast furnaces have become a kind of strangely lit post apocalyptic structure, an homage to the industrial past. They were used as a setting for one of the Transformers movies.

DJTeddyBear

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January 21st, 2012 at 11:54:11 PM permalink

Quote: Niblick
Do you have any other nuggets like that regarding the Sands? There has to be some kind of story behind the sign...

No. I don't remember where I learned that one. Paco might have more nuggets. Now that I think of it, I might have gotten that from Paco.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

pacomartin

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January 22nd, 2012 at 1:02:16 AM permalink

The sign was a derrick crane that used to work the ore pit.

Tiltpoul

Tiltpoul

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January 22nd, 2012 at 6:10:13 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin

The sign was a derrick crane that used to work the ore pit.

There is something about that Sands sign that gets me when I see it. Perhaps because it's really the last bit of Vegas still alive, albeit in PA. But think about it... Dunes, Sahara, Aladdin... they all had iconic fonts on their signs and they are all gone. Yeah, Flamingo still uses it's lettering, but it's not the same knowing the Evil Empire owns it.

Edit: I left the wrong pic up... oops.

"One out of every four people are [morons]"- Kyle, South Park

pacomartin

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January 22nd, 2012 at 6:58:00 AM permalink

Old photo of the ore crane (middle of page)

Bethlehem Steel was ranked #12 on the original Fortune 500 in 1955 (just behind CBS). BS stayed on the list for 48 years before selling off the remaining assets. They say that only 11 companies exist today that were on the original list.

Mosca

Mosca

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January 22nd, 2012 at 9:09:06 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin

You are talking about some incredibly ugly buildings. The #2 Machine shop described in the article above, is literally crumbling. Although the machine shop was saved, no one can afford to try and renovate such a building. No old buildings are part of the casino/hotel/shopping mall complex as of today. It isn't like some of the industrial buildings in central London which were saved at huge cost. This is a very ugly brownfield site.

The blast furnaces have become a kind of strangely lit post apocalyptic structure, an homage to the industrial past. They were used as a setting for one of the Transformers movies.

Eye of the beholder, and all that. I can sense your admiration for the power of the ugliness, actually.

There's currently a genre of photography that is casually known as "ruin porn". Detroit, old farms, abandoned malls, stuff like that.

This was taken by my friend David Smetak, inside USSteel Homestead Works: a photo of a photographer shooting ruin porn.

A falling knife has no handle.

PeteM

PeteM

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January 22nd, 2012 at 9:53:03 AM permalink

Great photo. Look at the intricacy of the brickwork and how the iron columns and beams interact with it. Even the graffiti adds to the overall picture. I know I sound like an overenthusiatic art history major, but I do appreciate the craftsmenship that went into the construction of these old buildings

"Win with a smile, lose with grace."

Niblick

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January 22nd, 2012 at 11:01:03 AM permalink

Frank, what's your take on SteelStacks? It has the appearance of the quintessential money pit (for me, at least). From what I understand, aside from being former Bethlehem Steel property, there is no connection with the Sands.

I find it hard to conceive of there being any positive cash flow from the current activities that I think I see (eg. Musikfest, etc.).

Nemo Omnibus Horis Sapit

pacomartin

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January 22nd, 2012 at 12:17:19 PM permalink

Quote: Niblick
Frank, what's your take on SteelStacks? It has the appearance of the quintessential money pit (for me, at least). From what I understand, aside from being former Bethlehem Steel property, there is no connection with the Sands.

I find it hard to conceive of there being any positive cash flow from the current activities that I think I see (eg. Musikfest, etc.).

The decision to turn old Blast furnaces into art exhibitions has been worldwide phenomena. Germany spearheaded the movement, and I think the furnaces in Bethlehem are one of three such sites in the USA. Although Sands was not part of the Steel Stacks, they have turned the ownership of the blast furnaces to the casino to protect them from possible lawsuits when the Steel went bankrupt and sold all their remaining assets.

Musikfest is non-ptrofit, but it usually breaks even for the series of concerts held in August. Last August, it lost a ton of money since it rained almost every day (not a good thing for an outdoor festival). The buildings around Steelstacks house the local public television station. In general with non-profit organizations, it is difficult to determine how much money they are losing.

From what little I've seen there is almost no traffic that goes from the casino to Steelstacks. Steelstacks is all local people going there to see art movies, to listen to concerts, the shop at the farmers market or to attend corporate parties. It's not a very inviting walk (1/2 mile) to go from the casino to Steelstacks.

SanchoPanza

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January 22nd, 2012 at 2:17:00 PM permalink

Quote: Niblick
What's your take on SteelStacks

The least that they can do is to paint the stacks to look like stacks of gambling chips.

SanchoPanza

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January 24th, 2012 at 7:13:55 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin

Harrah's $345 $94 $440

Harrah's	$345	$94	$440

That curious figure for Harrah's table games stands out. It is symptomatic of the attitude of that casino toward table players in general, notably craps players. It is one of the very few casinos I've seen that puts the craps pit off to the side and uncomfortably up against the wall.

pacomartin

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January 24th, 2012 at 8:07:37 AM permalink

Quote: SanchoPanza
That curious figure for Harrah's table games stands out. It is symptomatic of the attitude of that casino toward table players in general, notably craps players. It is one of the very few casinos I've seen that puts the craps pit off to the side and uncomfortably up against the wall.

Good point. It's almost as if they expect their table game player to go to Ceasars Palace. Tropicana ended up relatively high on the table game ranking despite being so isolated and having at least two big losing streaks.

NJ has a 57.50% lead in table games over PA. It will be interesting if PA can close it by next year (assuming NJ will continue to fall). PA casino operators have a powerful incentive as they are only being taxed 16% on table games vs 55% on slots. I suspect you won't see any change in slot revenue in PA. There is no incentive to improve, and only a single casino with 500 machines will open in Valley Forge. It is likely to get it's revenue from Harrah's Chester which is starting to crumble because it is located so near a city with such a high violent crime rate.

rdw4potus

rdw4potus

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January 24th, 2012 at 8:33:12 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin
Final numbers are in for both PA and NJ. Pennsylvania is now officially the largest of the two states in terms of gaming revenue (by just 2.44%). NJ still dominates in table games. Table includes promotional gaming credits, but with promotional credits removed it is still NJ $2.952 billion, and PA $3.024 billion.

The Borgata in Atlantic City is by far the casino with the dominant revenue in the mid-Atlantic.

The state of PA is collecting roughly $1.4 billion in direct taxes, while the state of NJ is collecting less that $1/4 billion.

CASINO Slots Table Total

Mount Airy $187 $40 $226

Presque Isle $213 $21 $233

SugarHouse $203 $74 $277

Penn National $276 $38 $314

Mohegan Sun $298 $42 $340

The Meadows $312 $34 $346

The Rivers $336 $67 $404

Harrah's Chester Downs $333 $81 $413

Sands Bethlehem $382 $106 $489

Parx $467 $114 $582

Total PA $3,006 $619 $3,625

CASINO Slots Table Total

Golden Nugget $98 $28 $125

Trump Plaza $101 $36 $137

Resorts $116 $38 $154

ACH $113 $30 $164

Showboat $213 $46 $258

Tropicana $192 $85 $277

Taj Mahal $229 $120 $349

Bally's $264 $114 $378

Caesars $242 $163 $404

Harrah's $345 $94 $440

Borgata $430 $221 $652

Total NJ $2,343 $975 $3,318

CASINO	Slots	Table	Total
Mount Airy	$187	$40	$226
Presque Isle	$213	$21	$233
SugarHouse	$203	$74	$277
Penn National	$276	$38	$314
Mohegan Sun	$298	$42	$340
The Meadows	$312	$34	$346
The Rivers	$336	$67	$404
Harrah's Chester Downs	$333	$81	$413
Sands Bethlehem	$382	$106	$489
Parx	$467	$114	$582
Total PA	$3,006	$619	$3,625
CASINO	Slots	Table	Total
Golden Nugget	$98	$28	$125
Trump Plaza	$101	$36	$137
Resorts	$116	$38	$154
ACH	$113	$30	$164
Showboat	$213	$46	$258
Tropicana	$192	$85	$277
Taj Mahal	$229	$120	$349
Bally's	$264	$114	$378
Caesars	$242	$163	$404
Harrah's	$345	$94	$440
Borgata	$430	$221	$652
Total NJ	$2,343	$975	$3,318

That's a very interesting table. We must define "by far" differently. I'd say Parx is very close to Borgata's revenue. And Parx won't take as big a hit when Revel opens. Speaking of opening...Does NY report the revenues of their investor-owned casinos? I wonder where Genting's property at the Aquaduct would slot into this list.

"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett

pacomartin

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January 24th, 2012 at 9:05:15 AM permalink

Quote: rdw4potus
That's a very interesting table. We must define "by far" differently. I'd say Parx is very close to Borgata's revenue. And Parx won't take as big a hit when Revel opens. Speaking of opening...Does NY report the revenues of their investor-owned casinos? I wonder where Genting's property at the Aquaduct would slot into this list.

Well Borgata is still double PARX in table games. Borgata is really the only casino in Atlantic City holding it's own, with less than 2% change in slots or table game revenue last year. Although PARX had a 9% lead in slot revenue over Borgata, this table includes promotional plays. Pennsylvania has nearly double the promotional plays as NJ, since they are trying to get people to drive the short distances to the casino frequently, and play for sometimes very short periods of time.

Borgata is also the only casino in AC with a thriving non-gaming business. PARX is not going to add a hotel (there are several nearby already), and it is not going to add shopping or dining or large scale venue. The Sands Casino in Bethlehem seems the only PA casino actively building hotels, shopping, convention center and an entertainment venue to rival Borgata. Mount Airy built a hotel, but it is doing very poorly in gaming revenue due to not being located in an urban area.

I don't know if Revel will steal as much from Borgata. I think it will destroy the Taj Mahal.

Total promotional play in NJ is $366 million, and in PA it is $600 million. From what I can see, the PA casinos hope you will spend some time in the casino every week, so they have a lot of "free play" promotions that last one or two days. If you don't come, you lose it.

pacomartin

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January 24th, 2012 at 9:22:08 AM permalink

Quote: rdw4potus
Does NY report the revenues of their investor-owned casinos? I wonder where Genting's property at the Aquaduct would slot into this list.

Article on opening of Aqueduct

This article says that the VLT's at Aqueduct make by far the most daily profit per machine that I have ever heard of in the USA. For the first three days they made $618 per machine per day, which dropped to $585 for the next six days. That exceeds the revenue from a Megabucks machine in Las Vegas.

But there are only 2,500 VLT's at Aqueduct, far short of the 3,400 slot machines at PARX. Right now the Aqueduct would have trouble exceeding $350-$400 million in a year. But they may be adding some new machines before long.

Queens and Brooklyn are 4.735 million people in 180 square miles. The 5 counties in PA that constitute the Philadelphia area are 4.0 million people in 2200 square miles. Yet Philadelphia has about 8000 slot machines, and Aqueduct has 2500 VLTs.

rdw4potus

rdw4potus

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January 24th, 2012 at 9:38:11 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin

Total promotional play in NJ is $366 million, and in PA it is $600 million. From what I can see, the PA casinos hope you will spend some time in the casino every week, so they have a lot of "free play" promotions that last one or two days. If you don't come, you lose it.

Harrah's Chester has offered me about $1,400 in promo credits in Feb. That's $60 every 2 days, plus $80/week, plus $120 on each of two seemingly random days. If I lived in Philly, I could probably pay my mortgage by going to Harrah's Chester 4 or 5 times a week for 10 minutes per trip. Of course, I don't live in Philly so I'm left asking my local host why my home casino gives me $50/month while a casino I've been to twice in my life (net loss of $500 in about 6 hours of play) is throwing $1,400/month at me.

"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett

DJTeddyBear

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January 29th, 2012 at 11:09:09 AM permalink

I know there are probably better places to post this, but....

I was at the Sands this past Wednesday evening. There are three important good changes that people should be aware of.

1 - I don't know when they did it, but they stopped serving ice water in glasses and are now serving 10oz Sands brand bottled water. This is GREAT news to water drinkers like myself. Not only did there generally be too much ice and not enough water (in, I think, 8oz cups!), but even when requesting that they don't add a lemon, they often did. Bottled water is a huge improvement.

2 - They are in the middle of re-arranging part of the casino floor. They have removed (or moved) a bunch of slot machines near the poker room, and are expanding the poker room. When I was there, they had 6 new poker tables in the process of being installed. (They had padding but no felt, shuffler, rack, etc.) There was also a bunch of stacked chairs and slot machines, as well as column type decor on it's side, behind ropes.

3 - The poker room is planning on starting tournaments soon, probably shortly after the renovations are complete.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

Niblick

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February 3rd, 2012 at 8:05:58 AM permalink

I was there Wednesday night myself (after my class)--not to play or anything but to observe.

The observing didn't really last all that long and I found myself exploring The Shoppes area. In actual fact, there is a very interesting store at The Shoppes called The Farmer's Almanac...but I also found myself wondering about the viability of these casino mall stores. I mean, it seems that retail stores have a difficult time surviving in an environment where the the major motivation for one to go to a shopping mall is to shop.

Clearly, one's major motivation isn't, I wouldn't think, to go to a casino to shop.

Simply put, when one considers shopping, are they more likely to think, Lehigh Valley Mall, etc. or Bethlehem Sands Casino?

So I wonder what the success rate is for these in casino retail outlets (I'm struggling for the proper vernacular for these stores).

Nemo Omnibus Horis Sapit

DJTeddyBear

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March 23rd, 2012 at 8:27:06 AM permalink

Admin note: removed image www.djteddybear.com/images/sands_steel_stacks.JPG

Gang -

This is a Google satelite shot of the area. The red line is a Google measurement of exactly 1/2 mile.

The hotel front desk is at the left side of the hotel in this photo. The walk from there to the edge of the casino seems dreadfully long.

The walk to Steel Stacks is much longer. They're gonna have to add an enclosed walkway with conveyor belt people movers if they really want to connect it to the casino and/or hotel.

FYI: The name "Steel Stacks" as I understand it, is because the old blast furnace is being used as a backdrop for the main concert venue.

Also, yes, there is a roadway that goes over part of the building. When inside, you'd never know it. There are no visible support columns.

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

pacomartin

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May 18th, 2012 at 8:10:33 PM permalink

Sands Bethlehem Event Center projected to boost casino complex visitors with concerts, meetings

The center opened with Incubus on 16 May 2012. Judging by April's gaming numbers, Sands is now the clear leader in table games in Pennsylvania.

----------------------

Valley Forge's mini-casino seems to be doing very well. The 50 table games still allowed them to beat Presque Isle in table games. PI is the smallest racino in Pennsylvania. Because VF is legally limited to 600 slot machines, slot revenue can't help but be far below the other casinos. Since slot revenue is taxed at 55%, the casino is probably unconcerned.

Valley Forge mini casino is 63 mile drive from PA Sands in Bethlehem.

pacomartin

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May 30th, 2012 at 6:22:23 PM permalink

Pennsylvania has announced that it's gambling tax revenue for last year is higher than Nevada, New Jersey, and Delaware combined. It looks like gambling is now as integral to state revenue as the Liquor Control Board.
They are hoping that by next year, that PA tax revenue will be 6 times higher than that of NJ. I think that really shows you why the state of NJ does not consider it a high priority to rescue the troulbed state business.

pacomartin

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July 24th, 2012 at 4:23:21 AM permalink

PA, as discussed before only pays 14% tax on table games and 55% on slot machines. So the incentive has strongly been to improve table game revenue.
Table Game Revenue for Second Fiscal Year improvement was strongly led by Sands Bethlehem. Sugarhouse in downtown Philadelphia also improved, but that is partly because they were not open for a few months last year. Valley Forge only opened this year.

Overall PA table game revenue went up by 30% this year from $507 million to $664 million.

74.8% SANDS BETHLEHEM
9.0% MOUNT AIRY

29.4% PARX
13.5% HARRAH'S PHILADELPHIA
54.5% SUGARHOUSE (21.2% For Last 9 months comparison when open in 2010-2011)
N/A VALLEYFORGE

11.7% MOHEGAN SUN
12.1% PENN NATIONAL

7.3% PRESQUE ISLE
11.4% THE MEADOWS
21.3% THE RIVERS
30.8% TOTAL

DJTeddyBear

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July 24th, 2012 at 4:59:35 AM permalink

Quote: pacomartin
PA, as discussed before only pays 14% tax on table games and 55% on slot machines. So the incentive has strongly been to improve table game revenue.

I never saw it phrased just that way before.

Any idea what the tax percentages are in other markets?

I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ �� Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁

WongBo

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July 24th, 2012 at 5:12:38 AM permalink

effective casino tax rates(slots) by state, 2008

state casino taxes,2004

2011 american gaming association survey of casino entertainment, state by state economic impact of casinos

i am looking for more current info.

In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.

pacomartin