WOV SPRING FLING May 11 2019-- PLANNING THREAD
Quote: GWAEso anyways back to our regularly scheduled program. I made a post a few days ago asking for opinions on area to have meet and type of venue. Some people would like to keep it to PMs. I asked for PMs to talk about it and I have received ZERO PMs. We only have a little over 6 weeks to get everything planned so we should get to it.
First question: what is the "meet" - lunch? Dinner? Both? Presumably those of us going to the Mob Museum need to meet somewhere first, especially so I can see who I get in on my discount (I can bring four "guests" from outside of Nevada in at the reduced "Nevada resident" rate).
Quote: darkozConsidering how anal the mods are about banning for offensive language I am surprised the only reaction to a bunch of "your sisters anal loves...." which put some very objectionable images in my head gets its own thread.
So describing how other posters sisters get it up the anal is now officially pc here?
Im quite certain I have seen bans for less offensive imagery and if thread hijacking isnt here as well... hmmm!
Thread hijacking
Offensive imagery AND language
Personal insults
Results in your very own thread!?
You get banned for saying you beat your wife and you get your own personal thread for saying your sister likes getting pegged up the whazoo?
Your objection is noted. I'm trying public shaming, because I'm quite tired of all the rude sexual references getting dropped into various threads. It worked in medieval England and America, perhaps it will help around here. Perhaps not. But let's take this back to the topic at hand - further complaints would be better placed in the discussion about suspension list thread.
Don't you have a bus to catch?Quote: darkozConsidering how anal the mods are about banning for offensive language I am surprised the only reaction to a bunch of "your sisters anal loves...." which put some very objectionable images in my head gets its own thread.
So describing how other posters sisters get it up the anal is now officially pc here?
Im quite certain I have seen bans for less offensive imagery and if thread hijacking isnt here as well... hmmm!
Thread hijacking
Offensive imagery AND language
Personal insults
Results in your very own thread!?
You get banned for saying you beat your wife and you get your own personal thread for saying your sister likes getting pegged up the whazoo?
Im pricing greyhound nyc to vegas as we speak :))]
Quote: ThatDonGuyFirst question: what is the "meet" - lunch? Dinner? Both? Presumably those of us going to the Mob Museum need to meet somewhere first, especially so I can see who I get in on my discount (I can bring four "guests" from outside of Nevada in at the reduced "Nevada resident" rate).
I will be doing lunch before mob museum so I think meeting before for lunch would be good.
The main get together is usually dinner. Maybe early lunch or even breakfast, mob museum somewhat early to give time if people need to have some time before dinner. Or could make it do they run into each other. I am up for anything.
Quote: darkoz[/q=AxelWolf]Don't you have a bus to catch? [/q
Im pricing greyhound nyc to vegas as we speak :))]
Amtrak to Kingman, then a regularly scheduled bus into Vegas.
Quote: AxelWolfDon't you have a bus to catch?
Aren't the buses my "gimmick"? Well, except for when I rented a car for a couple of days back in 2014 (in part so I could get to Them - er, The M). Still no bus service there.
Me and my Wife recently got stuck after blowing a head-gasket on my truck(for the 2nd time in a month). No cell service on my phone. Eventually I Had to get the car towed to the nearest town 20 miles away($185). I Missed my court appearance for a ticket I wanted to fight(now ill probably just pay it off) No car rentals were available and there was a waiting list for 2 days to get back to Vegas and it was questionable if they would even let me drop the rental off in Vegas. No Lyft Drivers available, A cab driver said no thanks. I really had no other options than to take a bus at like 5am the next morning. I wasn't all that bad since they had Wifi and a charger available(I still wouldn't want to be running the most feared well known secretive AP team on the east coast via the bus system.) It's going to be a pain in the ass getting my truck back to Vegas. All this forced me to buy another car and get AAA.Quote: ThatDonGuyAren't the buses my "gimmick"? Well, except for when I rented a car for a couple of days back in 2014 (in part so I could get to Them - er, The M). Still no bus service there.
I can only imagine ZK would have thrown himself under that bus if that all had happen to him.
p.s. People need to sit in their assigned seats, we pied extra so we could sit next to each other.
Not that I object to that accurate statement, but I thought I might give a summary as to the variety of activities we have gotten into in the past. These notes are just from my calendar entries. There are multiple threads about each of these spring gatherings, and a search should help you find more details than you need.Quote: GWAEThe main get together is usually dinner.
June 2011
Wednesday 6/15 2:00 PM. WoVCon. Late lunch and trivia at Triple-7 Pub at MSS, followed by low-limit poker at Binions, and a sub-group dinner at DuPar's.
May 2012
Friday 5/11 9:00 PM. WoVCon 1.5. MSS for craps.
Saturday 5/12 Noon. WoVCon][. Lunch and trivia at Chicago Brewing Co. at the Four Queens. Then to El Cortez for craps and blackjack.
Sunday 5/13 7:00 PM. WoVCon][.1 at Fiesta Henderson for craps and Pai Gow Poker, which was being dealt by our own PaiGow Dan.
May 2013
Friday 5/24 2:00PM. WoVCon 2.5. Craps for 2 hours at MSS then ambling the Freemont Street Experience with the WoV group.
Saturday 5/25 Noon. WoVCon///. Lunch at Sugar Factory at Paris (birthday party for the Wizard) followed by craps at Casino Royale.
April 2014
Saturday 4/26 Noon. WoV 2014 Spring Fling. Lunch at the Triple-7 Pub at MSS. Moved to the California for Craps (tables full at MSS). Later moved to Downtown Grand for more craps and a sub-group dinner at Hash House at the Plaza.
May 2015
Friday 5/15 6:00 PM. WoV Pre-meet. Met at the Triple-7 at MSS but went down to the Triple George for dinner and back to MSS for craps.
Saturday 5/16 6:00 PM. WoV 2015 Spring Fling. Dinner at Triple-7 pub at MSS. Returned to Downtown Grand for various gaming after dinner.
Sunday 5/17 7:00 PM. Sub-group for dinner back at the Triple George and more gaming at Downtown Grand.
April 2016
Friday 4/15 5:30 PM. WoV Pre-event. Dinner at Triple-7 pub at MSS then craps at Downtown Grand.
Saturday 4/16 5:00 PM. WoV 2016 Spring Fling. Dinner at Triple-7 pub at MSS. Moved to Binions for gaming, with the group splitting based on interests and space at the tables -- some played poker and others played craps. Sub-group back to MSS for more craps.
Monday 4/18 Noon. PokerGrinder's successful nugget challenge at the McDonalds in the D.
April 2017 (Note: I had a last-moment conflict and missed this gathering. These notes are from my calendar entries of what I expected would happen, not what I saw myself.)
Friday 4/21 7:30 PM. Dinner at Nora's.
Saturday 4/22 6:00 PM. WoV 2017 Spring Fling. Dinner at Triple-7 pub at MSS.
Sunday 4/23 Noon. Nugget challenge #5.
May 2018
Saturday 5/19 6:00 PM. WoV 2018 Spring Fling. Dinner at Pizza Rock downtown. Group split for gaming, with many going for poker on Freemont Street. (I was not feeling well -- kidney stones -- and left the group. Don't know what happened after that.)
Quote: AxelWolfMe and my Wife recently got stuck after blowing a head-gasket on my truck(for the 2nd time in a month). No cell service on my phone. Eventually I Had to get the car towed to the nearest town 20 miles away($185). I Missed my court appearance for a ticket I wanted to fight(now ill probably just pay it off) No car rentals were available and there was a waiting list for 2 days to get back to Vegas and it was questionable if they would even let me drop the rental off in Vegas. No Lyft Drivers available, A cab driver said no thanks. I really had no other options than to take a bus at like 5am the next morning. I wasn't all that bad since they had Wifi and a charger available(I still wouldn't want to be running the most feared well known secretive AP team on the east coast via the bus system.) It's going to be a pain in the ass getting my truck back to Vegas. All this forced me to buy another car and get AAA.
I can only imagine ZK would have thrown himself under that bus if that all had happen to him.
p.s. People need to sit in their assigned seats, we pied extra so we could sit next to each other.
If you drove in nyc or to jersey you would probably change your mind
At any rate if I make it out there for the spring fling I will be flying.
Though not in a helicopter and not first class even though I can afford it. If the object is to get me from A-B I could never stomach paying a couple grand more for a few extra inches to still get me to the same destination
But thats just me
Darkoz - that first class choice is tough. It's pretty much never thousands of dollars on a domestic flight (but that makes the choice easier) . Hard to know the true value. Looks like my flight in May will be $350/$430/$600 for economy/premium economy/first. I'm 6'4" and my knees hit the seat in front of me in regular economy. How much knee pain should I accept on a 3 hour flight? Is less pain worth $80? Is no pain worth $250? If I wasn't on an airplane, I'd probably pay $250 to avoid that feeling so deltas pricing seems about right to me.
Got some great prices so need tk confirm dates and what we are doing
Its a big saving to fly out weds vs Thursday but thats fine. Im sure the kids would prefer the first day be for them exclusively
What are we doing friday?
Saturday? There are some really cheap Saturday evening tickets to LA but if I am going to miss the dinner we will go Sunday. Obviously we are skipping any planned gambling
Is there anything planned for Sunday?
The plan is to fly back from LA on Tuesday so just need to know the best day to skip over to LA from Vegas
Fly??? What, no bus?Quote: darkozIm seriously looking into the tickets as jn ready to buy
Got some great prices so need tk confirm dates and what we are doing
Its a big saving to fly out weds vs Thursday but thats fine. Im sure the kids would prefer the first day be for them exclusively
What are we doing friday?
Saturday? There are some really cheap Saturday evening tickets to LA but if I am going to miss the dinner we will go Sunday. Obviously we are skipping any planned gambling
Is there anything planned for Sunday?
The plan is to fly back from LA on Tuesday so just need to know the best day to skip over to LA from Vegas
Quote: NathanDark Oz, I am wondering why you HAVE to take the Underaged Grandkids with you to the WOV Spring Fling Event? Why not leave them with your ex wife who is the Grandmother of them? Not to be a cynical Debbie Downer, but it seems that having underaged kids with you at the Spring Fling Event would be a major drawback as they wouldn't be able to gamble or drink and in turn you would have to forgo some of your fun time to look after them. I may be missing something here on why you have to take them considering that their Grandmother could stay home and watch them.
I personally dont drink either so not sure how much fun I will be.
Just flying alone will not be enough to get me out to Vegas. If its a family trip with a detour to knotts berry farm then yes I will be coming
On a more grim note the grandmother is into her second year fighting a brain tumor and is in no condition for long stretches of watching children although the 13 year old would probably not be a problem
Quote: billryanYou do realize the first class ticket holders get there faster than the ones in steerage..
Sigh if being Jewish has any faults its being cheap
I'm not sure I'm interested in the various dinners and events, but I would do the hike if that went down.
Quote: GWAESomeone asked to make a thread to start planning and getting a list together. I figured I would take the lead. I can't edit this post but maybe BBB will edit it for me every once in awhile with the list of people. Next posts we can discuss what "events" there shall be. I believe last year the dinner was discussed in PMs or texts. Not sure if that is needed or wanted but we can. This will be my first time coming and I can not remember what type of things were done. I am up for pretty much anything for any amount of time.
The date will be May 11th 2019 and possibly May 12th if people are interested in getting together
If you are planning on attending please post in this thread. If you plan on coming but don't want to make it public maybe send me a PM and I will keep a tally so we know how many are needed for dinner reservations if they are needed.
List of people attending:
GWAE and Mrs GWAE
Pokergrinder
Wizard
ThatDonGuy
Doc and Mrs Doc
Drich
rdw4potus and (maybe)Mrs r
keeneone
happahero
RS
Romes
TomG
Axelwolf
RonC
blick
Ace2
+1 anon
Not sure
BBB ? (Maybe)
Drich ?( moved to yes)
rdw4potus - good possibility, lmao I just realized what your moniker was. Never paid attention until I typed it. (moved to yes)
gordonm888- maybe (moved to no)
darkoz --maybe
Ace2- maybe (moved to yes)
blick- maybe (moved to yes)
Minty- maybe (moved to no)
billryan- maybe
Bruce1 - maybe
No.
SooPoo
FCBLCommissioner
DrawingDead
Nathan
Minty
Gordonm888
AcesandEights
Sorry if I left anyone out. (Lol..were you and I reading the same thread? Though a few folks were vague, so I can see your POV. Thanks for organizing.)
Side activities - please indicate below if you're interested in any of these. We will finalize all lists a week or two ahead of the weekend.
Mob museum list
ThatDonGuy
PokerGrinder
GWAE and Mrs
darkoz
Doc and Mrs
Romes
BBB
Rdw4potus
Romes
Escape room list
Wizard
BBB
GWAE and Mrs.GWAE
Rdw4potus
Romes
Poker Run
billryan
BBB
Romes
Hike
Wizard
gordonm888
Ace2
Romes
(Please update-correct-add below as plans evolve. I will continue to update this post every couple days as needed. - BBB)
Thanks for going to the work of making this list. Put me down as a tentative for the hike.
Thanks!
once you add in all the BS. I would say it's -EV.Quote: GWAEwife might half to stay home. She is requesting that we don't do the LV advisor coupon run. WTF.... thats like free money.
You can could probably make more hustling credits.
Quote: AxelWolfonce you add in all the BS. I would say it's -EV.
You can could probably make more hustling credits.
Or bus bonus rebates
That probably isn't a bad gig assuming you can get enough people each day. I would have tried to organize with the other hustlers in order to keep the going rate low. Then if anyone got out of line ya'll could have... well you know.Quote: darkozOr bus bonus rebates
Quote: AxelWolfonce you add in all the BS. I would say it's -EV.
You can could probably make more hustling credits.
You are too jaded. Coupon runs are fun when they are once a year. Back when the LVA was more social, I went on a couple group runs that were interesting. Just getting away from the strip is +EV.
Quote: AxelWolfThat probably isn't a bad gig assuming you can get enough people each day. I would have tried to organize with the other hustlers in order to keep the going rate low. Then if anyone got out of line ya'll could have... well you know.
Regular people wont do jt. They want the bonus for themselves
I tried a "Homeless Hustle" years ago
Offer 6 homeless people free trip, free food both breakfast and dinner, free alcohol.
Should be a lead-pipe cinch, right?
Hell, it was a terrible nightmare. At the time it was a $600 or $700 a day play and it was never worth all the hassle.
Quote: AxelWolfThat probably isn't a bad gig assuming you can get enough people each day. I would have tried to organize with the other hustlers in order to keep the going rate low. Then if anyone got out of line ya'll could have... well you know.
Talk about being “feared”, having a few examples to show others that think of getting out of line will keep those pesky homeless in line.
I can't argue with that.Quote: billryanYou are too jaded. Coupon runs are fun when they are once a year. Back when the LVA was more social, I went on a couple group runs that were interesting. Just getting away from the strip is +EV.
I do cringe when anyone gets a new players card for only $10 in free play thus making them ineligible for any future new players promotions that could be worth over 50x that.
Jaded= one of my favorite words.
I was thinking more along the lines of keeping the other hustlers from getting out of line and competing, thus pushing up the market value of the free play. I don't recall if it was DO that mentioned it, butQuote: BozTalk about being “feared”, having a few examples to show others that think of getting out of line will keep those pesky homeless in line.
I seem to recall somome said it got to the point where the amount being offered for the free play(CPH) was fairly high. It seemed to me they were cutting the profit margin down to only a few bucks. That triggered me and I wasn't even involved.
I also seem to remember there being a bidding war for AOS's 5K in free play and perhaps some others as well. Next thing you know it's up to 90% of face.(I wonder what Munchkin paid for it?) AP's shouldn't be bidding up the price of this stuff. There may have been a few hundred profit to be had at that point. It would have been better just to make a deal with the other serious interested parties and got it for 50% and then split up the profits.
Quote: AxelWolfI was thinking more along the lines of keeping the other hustlers from getting out of line and competing, thus pushing up the market value of the free play. I don't recall if it was DO that mentioned it, but
I seem to recall somome said it got to the point where the amount being offered for the free play(CPH) was fairly high. It seemed to me they were cutting the profit margin down to only a few bucks. That triggered me and I wasn't even involved.
I also seem to remember there being a bidding war for AOS's 5K in free play and perhaps some others as well. Next thing you know it's up to 90% of face.(I wonder what Munchkin paid for it?) AP's shouldn't be bidding up the price of this stuff. There may have been a few hundred profit to be had at that point. It would have been better just to make a deal with the other serious interested parties and got it for 50% and then split up the profits.
thats now how business works. So in your theory my competitors and I should join together and instead of us each charging 5% there could be 1 company and charge 12%? Isnt that a monopoly and that the FTC tries to prevent from happening?
Quote: billryanYou are too jaded. Coupon runs are fun when they are once a year. Back when the LVA was more social, I went on a couple group runs that were interesting. Just getting away from the strip is +EV.
I actually like doing coupon runs. Last year we went downtown and did all the coupons. It took maybe 3 hours and only made like $100. I didnt keep track so it may have been more, but we also played a few slots that we had never seen before. Anyways. we walked away with a profit over 3 hours and still got to gamble. If we were not doing this we would have probably been playing VP or some crappy slots and lost 200. So it was a $300 swing. But I also had fun doing it. I am still doing the spirit match play offer at the D no matter what she says.
This time on Monday and Sunday morning she wants to get up and go to the pool. blahh
Quote: billryanYou are too jaded. Coupon runs are fun when they are once a year. Back when the LVA was more social, I went on a couple group runs that were interesting. Just getting away from the strip is +EV.
Bill, did you ever participate in any of the LVA get togethers? I met a few good people through those that I still stay in touch with. I met my wife there as well, she was an administrator of the LVA forum and worked for LVA.
Quote: AxelWolfI was thinking more along the lines of keeping the other hustlers from getting out of line and competing, thus pushing up the market value of the free play. I don't recall if it was DO that mentioned it, but
I seem to recall somome said it got to the point where the amount being offered for the free play(CPH) was fairly high. It seemed to me they were cutting the profit margin down to only a few bucks. That triggered me and I wasn't even involved.
I also seem to remember there being a bidding war for AOS's 5K in free play and perhaps some others as well. Next thing you know it's up to 90% of face.(I wonder what Munchkin paid for it?) AP's shouldn't be bidding up the price of this stuff. There may have been a few hundred profit to be had at that point. It would have been better just to make a deal with the other serious interested parties and got it for 50% and then split up the profits.
Yeah that happened at the Sands.
$45 freeplay was being sold for $40.
I think you remember the play though in the wrong direction. The hustlers werent the people buying the fp. Those were customers whose addiction was so bad fhey wanted even a $5 advantage
The hustlers were the bus travelers who were taking a bus for $15 and selling their offers for $40 thereby locking up $25 profit per trip.
When the Sands tightened the games freeplay could be played on (eliminated bj and vp primarily) the price of the fp dropped as the customers wanted more value from the fp purchased
Quote: GWAEI actually like doing coupon runs. Last year we went downtown and did all the coupons. It took maybe 3 hours and only made like $100. I didnt keep track so it may have been more, but we also played a few slots that we had never seen before. Anyways. we walked away with a profit over 3 hours and still got to gamble. If we were not doing this we would have probably been playing VP or some crappy slots and lost 200. So it was a $300 swing. But I also had fun doing it. I am still doing the spirit match play offer at the D no matter what she says.
This time on Monday and Sunday morning she wants to get up and go to the pool. blahh
What’s the spirit match play? I think someone has mentioned that on here before.
Quote: PokerGrinderWhat’s the spirit match play? I think someone has mentioned that on here before.
The D casino was giving a $50 match play if you showed a Spirit Airlines boarding pass.
Quote: DRichThe D casino was giving a $50 match play if you showed a Spirit Airlines boarding pass.
But you have to fly Spirit, so it’s -EV when you consider the hassle of being treated like a Spirit customer.
Easier $50 to be made in the back restroom by check in at 2PM sharp. Of at least it says so in the stall.
Quote: DRichThe D casino was giving a $50 match play if you showed a Spirit Airlines boarding pass.
DAMN IT DRICH. I was going to sell the info to him for a beer
Quote: BozBut you have to fly Spirit, so it’s -EV when you consider the hassle of being treated like a Spirit customer.
Easier $50 to be made in the back restroom by check in at 2PM sharp. Of at least it says so in the stall.
lol that is funny.
On a serious note. I have flown spirit 14 times now and never had a single issue. Planes are normal planes. I like when I hear people say they are using bad planes. They are actually newer than most airlines have since they are a younger company with expansion than some of the other ones. The seats are a little tight but I am a fat guy and have enough room.
My flight in vegas in may is $240 for 2 people round trip from the east coast.
I have never even had bad customer experience on spirit either.
There is definitely an issue though if you need to call them. I once waited on hold for 2 hours to ask a simple question.
I only have 1 concern when flying them and that is not getting cancelled on. After 14 flights I have not had an issue. I have been cancelled on 2 times by Delta and 1 time by United. 1 delta and 1 united I got rescheduled later in the day. The other delta I was on the last flight of the day and had to wait until the next day which sucked. The problem though with Spirit is they usually only have 1 flight a day so if that one gets cancelled there is no other flight to get put onto. They will let you get a refund or rebook on the next day but the flights are usually full and they have 200 people who just got cancelled on trying to get onto the next flight so basically if you get cancelled on you are screwed and will be either paying last min on another flight or you will cancel your plans. I would never fly spirit when going to something important or a cruise.
As for PGs question. The D gives you $50 match play if you show them a boarding pass within 24 hours of the landing. They do not advertise it much but as of last year they were still doing it. Last time I used that plus the $25 LVA match play. Between the 2 of us we had $150 in match play.
Quote: GWAEDAMN IT DRICH. I was going to sell the info to him for a beer
I never fly Spirit so that would have been a tough sell.
As far as crap planes you would all be scared at some of the planes that I’ve flown on overseas lol.
Making a detour to knotts berry farm
I need to know approximately what the schedule is
Are we doing escape room mob museum and dinner? Thats what I am interested in
Need to know days and times so I csn schedule my los Angeles flights
Thx
RE: spring fling - The wife is IN!! Just booked flights. In thurs evening, out tuesday evening.
Quote: darkozIm ready to buy tickets today
Making a detour to knotts berry farm
I need to know approximately what the schedule is
Are we doing escape room mob museum and dinner? Thats what I am interested in
Need to know days and times so I csn schedule my los Angeles flights
Thx
I'd expect most things to happen Saturday. Sounds like the plan is lunch > museum> dinner/meeting > gambling/socializing. Not sure about the hike or escape room. I think you'd be in good shape to plan to leave LV on Sunday - you wouldn't be the only person leaving that day, so most events should be done by then or others would miss them, too...
Have you considered driving to LA? the drive is hardly longer than the shuffle through the airports would be, you can go at any time, and the car would be cheaper than the airfare even with the potential one-way drop fee.
Quote: rdw4potusI'd expect most things to happen Saturday. Sounds like the plan is lunch > museum> dinner/meeting > gambling/socializing. Not sure about the hike or escape room. I think you'd be in good shape to plan to leave LV on Sunday - you wouldn't be the only person leaving that day, so most events should be done by then or others would miss them, too...
Have you considered driving to LA? the drive is hardly longer than the shuffle through the airports would be, you can go at any time, and the car would be cheaper than the airfare even with the potential one-way drop fee.
Neither my daughter nor myself have drivers licenses. We are New Yorkers!
Its one hour flight to vegas. And prices are between $40 and $76 depending on day that weekend.
Quote: rdw4potusRE: Spirit - it's a bargain if you're short and if you either check a bag or travel light. Paying for a carry on is crap, and having the least legroom of any carrier is also crap. I'm 6'4 & I literally can't sit down on some of Spirit's planes.
RE: spring fling - The wife is IN!! Just booked flights. In thurs evening, out tuesday evening.
I flew delta and I believe they were charging for carry ons and seat choices as well. Maybe not a carry on but definitely seat choices. I dont mind paying for a carry on when my flight is only $49. My aunt last year decided against a $34 flight and went with a $179 southwest flight all because of paying for a seat and bag.
On this trip since it is only 4 days we will both bring a back pack and be good with that which is considered a personal item so it is free.
yay that your wife is in. I think that will make 4 woman. They can sit at the end of the table and socialize.
Quote: darkozNeither my daughter nor myself have drivers licenses. We are New Yorkers!
That is such an odd concept to people that live outside of the East coast.
Quote: darkozNeither my daughter nor myself have drivers licenses. We are New Yorkers!
Its one hour flight to vegas. And prices are between $40 and $76 depending on day that weekend.
What borough are you in? I can understand Manhattan, not so much Staten Island without a car.
Quote: PokerGrinderI never fly Spirit so that would have been a tough sell.
well not all of us are baller
Quote: DRichThat is such an odd concept to people that live outside of the East coast.
To New Yorkers, it's an even odder concept that people willingly live west of the Hudson and east of the TMZ.
Quote: MaxPenWhat borough are you in? I can understand Manhattan, not so much Staten Island without a car.
Im queens. My daughter is Brooklyn
The train is 2 blocks from either of our houses.
I can get most anywhere in NYC within an hour at anytime of day
During business hours driving that same distance could take upwards of 3 hours. Its literally bumper to bumper traffic in Manhattan.
Driving thru the Lincoln Tunnel between 5 and 7 pm is usually a 90 minute debacle (about 10 minutes at 2 am for comparison)
Imagine 8 million people all travelled simultaneously... in a city the size of Burbank
Or the distance between the strip and downtown
