Trump's Second and Third year in office
Quote: MrVThen you'd best be damned careful.
A fellow I know killed himself.
Years later, his son told me "People tell me I'm going to kill myself, but I'll prove them wrong."
A year or two later he killed himself.
Once the pattern is set by a parent killing themself it creates a potential black hole / dilemna for their surviving kids, especially if the history of depression gets passed on.
No kidding
That's one of the reasons I don't own a gun
Kennedy saw secret society's everywhere.Quote: SteverinosBreak it down for me.
The Warren Commission was the first to coin the phrase "conspiracy theory" to debunk anyone who questioned their investigation into the assassination.
"the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to greater danger.”
— Herman Goering at the Nuremberg trials"
The right....omg the latinos are coming the latinos are coming.
The left....omg the Russians are coming the Russians are coming.
Petro....omg, the elections are coming
Quote: beachbumbabsQuote: aceofspades
Essential are people providing critical services.
Example.
Air traffic Controllers.
Supervisors who are certified on at least 1 sector/position
Non-essential are people providing routine services.
Example.
Air Traffic Managers.
Administrative Supervisors
Air Traffic Assistants
Training department
Plans and procedures
Secretaries, payroll, hr, janitorial, support staff.
If it goes like it always has, non-essentials will get each day off AND get paid for it, as if it was a federal holiday. Might be months from now, but they will likely get compensated. Doesn't help if you were depending on that paycheck for Christmas, though.
Essentials will NOT get compensated with equivalent time or pay for working their regular schedule. Controller leave arranged more than a year ago is likely to be cancelled, because the support is no longer there. Paychecks may be delayed, since payroll isn't working, even though people will be required to work.
Taxpayers will end up paying billions for work that didn't get performed. It's been on other people in the past. This time it's 100% Trump. What a stupid move.
117 MILLION people are travelling this weekend in America. The most in more than 30 years.
Well if its just an issue because of Christmas trump should just make certain only muslim and Jewish government workers are off
Problem solved
Quote: billryanBecause Christmas is all about celebrating the birth of Jesus, right?
If I remember the joke correctly...
How do Jewish people celebrate Christmas?
They dance around the cash register singing "What a friend we have in Jesus"
Quote: billryanUniformed Border Patrol Officers are essential. The people who dispatch them aren't. The people who service and maintain the cars aren't. The Uniformed Officers are being pulled from Patrol to work dispatch. Repeat this hundreds of times across various agencies.
Exactly. Any controllers who had this week/weekend off are being recalled, paid overtime if required, filling behind lost support positions for 2x/3x their salaries, because God Forbid the planes don't fly.
In 25 years, I think I had Christmas off 3 times. Somewhat self-inflicted, because I would trade with people who had young kids at home. But at least twice I was cancelled out of celebrating for govt shutdowns. Sux when you have plans, probably made a year in advance (how it works most years, bidding for time off.)
Quote: petroglyphChristmas celebrations in Damascus:
They had a lower middle class standard of living in Syria, until Obama and his demon infested coughing gnome sec. of state decided ‘Assad has to go’ in 2011.
Quote: rxwineAnd we thought the Republicans knew who was really dangerous like Saddam Hussein, until you guys started going on about poor and often desperate people as "an invasion" force headed toward the border.
It's modern Americanism. When you have an ant problem, you call a guy with a ghostbuster backpack and enough poison to kill an island nation. He tents your house and you move out for 2 days. He sprays your nooks, your crannies, and sets up a fatal perimeter around your entire living space at a premium. And so long as you keep paying, the man keeps coming and the ants stay out.
Or you could just, ya know, clean your f#$%ing kitchen. You see, ants won't make an effort to go where there is nothing for them. Crazy, right?
Of course, I'm just an idiot hick. I'm sure Bill Hannity-O'Coulter the Orkin Man just has your best interests in mind. There's no way they'd just lead you by the nose, and no way you'd just let them, right? Right?
Quote: beachbumbabsSenate gave up and went home for Christmas. Unless House passes Senate Wall-free bill (and Trump signs it), govt will remain shut down until at least Thurs when the Senate returns.
Trump would rather screw over 300-400k employees for their EOY paychecks and likely their Christmas funds, than restore the govt. What a putz. Especially after he had agreed to the Senate bill before they went ahead to vote on it, then reneged. And after he canceled their raises. And their COLA increases, both budgeted for next year.
As to the wars, I won't pretend to be a military strategist. But I look at Mattis as the best we have. And he resigned over it.
So no, we should not be doing it. We leave our allies in the ditch, the people we were helping unprotected, and the many billions we spent wasted, if we don't finish the job and withdraw in a manner that does not allow ISIS to regroup and prevail.
Not to mention all the Americans killed and wounded. Them most of all, IMO. This is a dishonorable non-resolution that betrays their sacrifice. But I consider that more of a personal bias, since so many here care more about money than honor or integrity of the government.
As often happens, Trump has a good idea, to get us out of the s....... countries that scorn civilization, but he can’t figure out an adult way to do so. Letting our allies know, behind closed doors, that we will be leaving, so they can either join us or do what they want.
Border protection is an admirable goal, but not to the detriment of the rest of the country.
Please SOMEONE offer me a bet on the 2020 Presidential election. I want ABT. (Anyone but Trump)
Quote: darkozIf I remember the joke correctly...
How do Jewish people celebrate Christmas?
They dance around the cash register singing "What a friend we have in Jesus"
Remember, Jesus was a nice Jewish boy. Probably was celebrating Hanukkah around ‘Christmas’ time!
Quote: SOOPOORemember, Jesus was a nice Jewish boy. Probably was celebrating Hanukkah around ‘Christmas’ time!
Yes I know
A nice Jewish boy with Blond hair and Blue eyes
Hmmm, wait a minute, this requires some thinking
Quote: darkoz
Hmmm, wait a minute, this requires some thinking
How dare you. This is politics. We don't do that here.
Quote: FaceHow dare you. This is politics. We don't do that here.
Sorry Face. You are right
Its just the President DON is tying me up in KNOTTS
Quote: aceofspades
They need to not back pay people when it is over. Probably going to back pay $20B in wages for no services rendered to argue about $5B. I think we just gave $10B to South America. People need to wake up and start figuring out that government is not working for their best interests.
Fire up the stills while the revenuers are on vacation.
So you’re saying terrorists are coming from the Middle East? Well then I’m sure you would agree with Trump’s travel ban restricting entry of people from those countries.Quote: darkozSo you believe the terrorists are coming from Mexico and NOT the middle east
Smh
Quote: SandybestdogSo you’re saying terrorists are coming from the Middle East? Well then I’m sure you would agree with Trump’s travel ban restricting entry of people from those countries.
Most of the 9/11 terrorists came from Saudi Arabia. Why do you think they are not included in Trump’s travel ban?
Quote: rxwineEven though Trump said he already owns responsibility for the shutdown, congress already passed a bipartisan budget bill he rejected. Hard to imagine he can own it anymore than he already does short of getting a tattoo about owning it.
Yep a President/Governor owns ANY veto (including "pocket vetoes"). Only 8 veto overrides post-Reagan.
Has Congress actually adjourned?
Last I heard, even though most people had gone home, they were still doing pro forma dailies.
If they did send a bill, and if congress is still in session, the bill will become law.
I don't think they ever sent the bill, though.
Quote: Dalex64Did Congress actually send their bipartisan bill to the white house?
Has Congress actually adjourned?
Last I heard, even though most people had gone home, they were still doing pro forma dailies.
If they did send a bill, and if congress is still in session, the bill will become law.
I don't think they ever sent the bill, though.
I might have this wrong bUT would appreciate correct info.
Senate passed bi-partisan budget bill and adjourned for the year.
House was still in session but in recess til the day after the Senate adjourned, added 5B to the bill.
Senate came back to DC, re-opened the session, but refused to take up the new House bill. McConnell did not have the votes, so he did not put it into consideration, both to save it from losing, and to protect his no votes from the rabid base.
Any bill has to be reconciled (match) before it's given to the President to sign or veto. So at the moment, there's nothing to send.
I think both houses are in recess, but not adjourned for this session. House returns tomorrow or Thursday, Senate returns Thursday.
If Melania doesn't get to touch the orb, she should have given the king bunny ears.Quote: gamerfreakMost of the 9/11 terrorists came from Saudi Arabia. Why do you think they are included in Trump’s travel ban?
Quote: SandybestdogSo you’re saying terrorists are coming from the Middle East? Well then I’m sure you would agree with Trump’s travel ban restricting entry of people from those countries.
No I dont!
Sandy Would you have supported a ban on all people entrring the United States from Ireland in the 1970's because the IRA was a major terrorist group from Ireland?
You dont unilaterally ban an entire nation because there are fringe groups amongst them
Due diligence yes. Banning wholesale no
Did we list them as a terrorist organization?Quote: darkozNo I dont!
Sandy Would you have supported a ban on all people entrring the United States from Ireland in the 1970's because the IRA was a major terrorist group from Ireland?
You dont unilaterally ban an entire nation because there are fringe groups amongst them
Due diligence yes. Banning wholesale no
Quote: AxelWolfDid we list them as a terrorist organization?
Ireland? Yes, at the time, and for decades after, absolutely. There was a big ruckus when the head of Sinn Fein was denied a visitor visa by the State Department back in the 90s because they knew he was coming here to fundraise for them in Boston.
When I traveled to London over NYE 1977-78, there was still a travel advisory on Ireland. And sure enough, we were partying in London that night and an IRA bomb went off down the block, and we all got evacuated onto the street about 11:30 that night. Ironically in hindsight, we were partying with a group of Saudi businessmen in the Playboy Club, then went to a late dinner and midnight show at a nearby cabaret.
So yeah, there was a lot more going on than that with the Irish, but it was very touchy because of the large group of Irish supporters up in the NE US. Now, of course, the Irish are our friends, and the Saudis are harboring the terrorists.
Any of you ever hear of the Christmas Miracle of 1950?
Surging Chinese "volunteers" had over run UN troops in Korea trapping 100,000 troops along with countless refugees in a Korean port, the sea being their only escape. No one had vetted the civilians and a number of infiltrators had already been caught. Some argued the civilians posed too much danger and should all be left behind. Instead they put 205,000 people on boats they estimated would hold a tenth of that. One boat ,built to sleep sixty set sail with 14,000 on board and there were five babies born on the short cruise.
The Korean-American Society estimates some 50,000 of those refugees and their descendants are now American Citizens.
All because the people in charge refused to operate out of fear.
Quote: billryanDo we list entire nation's as terrorist? I'm sure some of you do, but the USofA doesn't....
Iran, Sudan, Syria, NK....
Quote: RSIran, Sudan, Syria, NK....
Why do you think not Saudi Arabia?
Looks like they took all that criticism about Donald never visiting the troops seriously and he’s making an unannounced trip to the Middle East.
Quote: gamerfreakWhy do you think not Saudi Arabia?
They are the good guys.
Where can I find this official list?Quote: beachbumbabsIreland? Yes, at the time, and for decades after, absolutely. There was a big ruckus when the head of Sinn Fein was denied a visitor visa by the State Department back in the 90s because they knew he was coming here to fundraise for them in Boston.
When I traveled to London over NYE 1977-78, there was still a travel advisory on Ireland. And sure enough, we were partying in London that night and an IRA bomb went off down the block, and we all got evacuated onto the street about 11:30 that night. Ironically in hindsight, we were partying with a group of Saudi businessmen in the Playboy Club, then went to a late dinner and midnight show at a nearby cabaret.
So yeah, there was a lot more going on than that with the Irish, but it was very touchy because of the large group of Irish supporters up in the NE US. Now, of course, the Irish are our friends, and the Saudis are harboring the terrorists.
Quote: AxelWolfWhere can I find this official list?
This is one way to access the database:
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/international-travel/International-Travel-Country-Information-Pages.html
You ask about a country or area, it offers you advisories, warnings, and prohibitions, if any.
Mostly country's that don't belong to the central bank.Quote: RSIran, Sudan, Syria, NK....
General Wesley Clark, "7 countries in 5 years"
Does it date back to the 70's?Quote: beachbumbabsThis is one way to access the database:
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/international-travel/International-Travel-Country-Information-Pages.html
You ask about a country or area, it offers you advisories, warnings, and prohibitions, if any.
Quote: AxelWolfDoes it date back to the 70's?
I don't know. I've only ever checked current restrictions.
Then how do you know they were officially listed as a terrorist organization in the USA?Quote: beachbumbabsI don't know. I've only ever checked current restrictions.
Please provide proof.
Quote: AxelWolfThen how do you know they were officially listed as a terrorist organization in the USA?
Please provide proof.
Because when I went over there in 1977, as part of a college 3 week tour, we had to acknowledge a State Department warning about the IRA activities in London.
Heres some proof. Just in case you get stuck behind a paywall, here's an excerpt.
Quote: New York Times
State Department Adds the Real I.R.A. to List of Terror Groups
By MARC LACEY
May 17, 2001
The State Department added the Real Irish Republican Army to the government's official list of terrorist organizations today, blaming the group for a campaign of violence in Northern Ireland and Britain in recent years.
The Real I.R.A. has used bombings and other attacks to try to derail the 1998 peace accord that paved the way for a power-sharing government in Northern Ireland. The group, which as recently as last month vowed to continue its anti-British hostilities, seeks the unification of predominantly Protestant Northern Ireland with the largely Roman Catholic Republic of Ireland.
Designation as a foreign terrorist organization bans the Real I.R.A. from raising money in the United States, freezes any bank holdings it has in this country and restricts entry into the United States for Real I.R.A. leaders and members.
''The group has made clear that its terrorist attacks are motivated by a desire to undermine the Good Friday agreement, which was approved by the major political parties in Northern Ireland in April of 1998 and was overwhelmingly endorsed in a referendum by the people of Northern Ireland and by the Republic of Ireland,'' said the State Department spokesman, Richard Boucher.
More than 20 suspected members have been jailed in recent years, including Michael McKevitt, the organization's reported commander, who was arrested on March 29 and is being held without bail on terrorism charges. The group's most lethal attack was an August 1998 car bombing in Omagh, Northern Ireland, that killed 29 people and wounded hundreds of others.
David Trimble, the Protestant leader of Northern Ireland's coalition government, said the State Department action ''will deny the Real I.R.A. an important source of fund-raising and will refuse their apologists and supporters access to the U.S.A.''
But Gerry Adams, leader of Sinn Fein, the political wing of the Irish Republican Army, said the designation of the more radical Real I.R.A. as a terrorist group would probably increase the dissidents' standing among hard-liners.
They had been on it previously (like when I was over there) but the 1998 Accord had taken them off it as one of the conditions (I think). But this was the first Google evidence I turned up that they had been declared terrorists at any time. So there's some proof for you.
https://www.nytimes.com/2001/05/17/world/state-department-adds-the-real-ira-to-list-of-terror-groups.html
See also the 90s argument with Clinton about Gerry Adams:
https://www.nytimes.com/1995/03/10/world/clinton-to-permit-fund-raising-in-the-us-by-top-ira-figure.html
(This is a digitized photo of the Times from before they archived digital copies of text. If you can't read it, let me know.)
Quote: billryanThey are the good guys.
I think you are being sarcastic.
So It had nothing to do with the holiday shopping reports?Quote: billryanSo Donny leaves the country and stocks soar. When it becomes obvious he isn't defecting and will return, the market drops some 500. Way to go.
Quote: AxelWolfSo It had nothing to do with the holiday shopping reports?
Nope. People briefly thought trump was fleeing the jurisdiction and were rightfully celebrating.
Quote: billryanBesides lying to the troops about a so called ten percent raise, it seems trump broke Operational Security by tweeting a photo with Seal Team members who, shall we say, are not supposed to have their locations or identities revealed. As President, it is his right to declassify anything but there was a good reason why the presence of a SEAL team in Iraq was being kept secret and its members kept secret. Trumps need for a photo shoot evidently is more important than mission security.
File that raise next to the new middle class tax cuts and ending birthright citizenships.
Quote: gamerfreakWhy do you think not Saudi Arabia?
No idea.
I’m not saying I supported the ban. Your previous comment said something about Middle East terrorists coming in through Mexico. I took that to mean you were criticizing the decision to pull out of Syria and were making a sarcastic comment about withdrawing troops from where terrorists are (Syria) and putting them where I’m assuming you are saying there are none (Mexico border). So if that’s what you did mean then that means there are terrorists in the Middle East and I sarcastically said that must mean that you supported the travel ban from these dangerous countries which of course I knew you most likely did not support.Quote: darkozNo I dont!
Sandy Would you have supported a ban on all people entrring the United States from Ireland in the 1970's because the IRA was a major terrorist group from Ireland?
You dont unilaterally ban an entire nation because there are fringe groups amongst them
Due diligence yes. Banning wholesale no
