Cost of becoming a Seven Stars player with the new TR system
Quote: TIMSPEEDNo, 8/5 BP QQ...
Haven't made it to Biloxi yet. :( Hope next trip to Vegas I can get over to Ellis Island to play 9/6 DDB Quick Quads. I really like the game and got my first royal on one, damn penny machine though for $40. :-\
Quote: djatchttp://www.vpfree2.com/casino/horseshoe-hammond
$1 50 play. only $250 a pop!
Yes, but to remind everyone, on 50 and 100-plays, any number of hands can be played with max credits per hand.
Quote: IbeatyouracesI believe they also have $1, 9/6 JoB STP Spin Poker (99.82%)
That's not listed in VPFree2, but I'll have to take a look next time I am there. They point out regular Spin Poker exists for 9/6 JoB, NSUD, and others.
Quote: SONBP2The choice of good VP games at Caesar's properties is pretty rare in Las Vegas. Which would be better to play, this is a value question I guess, to help me take on the task of becoming a 7 Star Card holder:
1. Bally's $5 JoB Single Line Play (99.54%)
2. Rio $1 Triple Play BP (99.17%)
3. Rio $0.25 Super X Pay 5 or 10 Play BP (98.28%)
I am not real comfortable playing $25 a hand, but if that is the best way to go then I don't have much choice. Anyone else aware of any better games at Caesar's properties in LV?
Personally I dunno if 7 Stars is worth it to me with these choices. And you are looking at some of the best choices. CET VP in Vegas sucks. The best choice still causes a minimum $2300 theoretical loss. And if you miss the Royal in your attempt, you will almost be certainly down 5 digits in your attempt. 8/5 Bonus bumps it up to a $4150 expected loss. Maybe Seven Stars is worth that to you, but it's a pretty big investment gambling.
Quote: tringlomane
Yes, but to remind everyone, on 50 and 100-plays, any number of hands can be played with max credits per hand.
Personally I dunno if 7 Stars is worth it to me with these choices. And you are looking at some of the best choices. CET VP in Vegas sucks. The best choice still causes a minimum $2300 theoretical loss. And if you miss the Royal in your attempt, you will almost be certainly down 5 digits in your attempt. 8/5 Bonus bumps it up to a $4150 expected loss. Maybe Seven Stars is worth that to you, but it's a pretty big investment gambling.
Gotta go hard or go home lol. Actually I probably wouldn't want to stick in $250 a hand and stick to 3 or 5 play.
If you really want 7 star then buying a flight and putting in volume on the highest return machine elsewhere is the cheapest way. Has there ever been a good play at CET properties in Vegas? They have the tightest machines and if you want "true" VP odds you have to pay in higher denominations.
Quote: djatcHas there ever been a good play at CET properties in Vegas?
I read somewhere that this play was found at Caesars Palace in Vegas some years ago:
Quote: ahiromuWhat a horrible machine, so many W2s. You'd have to stop every ten minutes for a hand pay.
They'd probably have a spotter (I think that's the term?). While I've never had or needed one, I did once observe someone who did. There was an employee with a clipboard standing behind the player. Every time the player hit a handpay, the employee would write the time and amount, and the player would sign it. Then the employee would do whatever to the machine to make it pay the win directly into the balance like it does with non-handpay wins, and the player could continue playing. The delay for each handpay was maybe 30 seconds at most.
It was Richard Brodie, the guy who invented Microsoft Word. http://qlbrodie.blogspot.com/search/label/-favorites-Quote: IbeatyouracesQuote: JBI read somewhere that this play was found at Caesars Palace in Vegas some years ago:
There was a story, don't know if its true or not, about a guy being barred from I believe Caesars and from playing in the WSOP ME for playing +EV VP there after hitting many high limit royals.
Quote: teddysIt was Richard Brodie, the guy who invented Microsoft Word. http://qlbrodie.blogspot.com/search/label/-favorites-Quote: IbeatyouracesQuote: JBI read somewhere that this play was found at Caesars Palace in Vegas some years ago:
There was a story, don't know if its true or not, about a guy being barred from I believe Caesars and from playing in the WSOP ME for playing +EV VP there after hitting many high limit royals.
What's the return on that paytable? I don't play VP at all so I don't have any context for the numbers.
Thank you.
Quote: SONBP2I anticipate playing 8/5 Bonus Poker Triple Play $1 machines. If I get 2500 tier credits one day, for the 5000 tier credit bonus, and then 1000 tier credits the next day for another 1000 bonus, giving me a total of approximately 14700 tier credits. Can anyone tell me the expected loss for this attempt?
$35,000 coin-in * 13854040597/1661102543100 house edge = about $290.91
Quote: JB$35,000 coin-in * 13854040597/1661102543100 house edge = about $290.91
Honestly, I love all you math guys, but my reality is far from the expected house edge. Down $300 already (279 tier credits earned) today and it would have been $600 had I not hit 4, 4s with my last $50, and then 4 Queens a few hands later. I project this tasks costing me $2500. I guess we will see.
Quote: JBIn the other thread you mentioned your quest for a 25¢ royal -- I'd like to hear that you hit a $1 one!
Me too. I moved to $1 machines as they offered the best odds at any Harrahs properties in Vegas as that is where I live and work. Further, the $1 8/5 Bonus Poker offers better odds than the $0.25 games I was playing in Laughlin.
I will keep you all updated as the quest for Diamond status and a Royal continues.
Quote: SONBP2Honestly, I love all you math guys, but my reality is far from the expected house edge. Down $300 already (279 tier credits earned) today and it would have been $600 had I not hit 4, 4s with my last $50, and then 4 Queens a few hands later. I project this tasks costing me $2500. I guess we will see.
Man! You're running absolutely TERRIBLE!
Recently, I played 25c triple play 9/6 JoB STP and I put through $10k coin-in (1000 tier credits) and it only cost me $200...
Quote: TIMSPEEDMan! You're running absolutely TERRIBLE!
Recently, I played 25c triple play 9/6 JoB STP and I put through $10k coin-in (1000 tier credits) and it only cost me $200...
It clearly has been a bad run. I believe I stated the other day it cost me nearly $1800, playing Super X Pay 25c JoB five and ten play to earn 1000 tier credits. At the current rate it is costing me more than a $1 per tier credit. That means it will cost me somewhere close to $3500.
DO IT.
Quote: teddysBrandon -- just hit a royal already :)
DO IT.
I AM TRYING!
Recap for April 25: I walked into the Rio this morning around 7:45am with approximately $1050 in my pocket to play for a little while before opening my office at 9:00. As I stated earlier, I was down almost $600, before hitting 4 4s and then a few hands later 4 Queens and then walked out down about $300 (approx. $750 remaining). I worked till about 1:30, and decided to spend my lunch hour back at the Rio trying to earn the 1000 tier credits for the day, the morning session netted me 279 tier credits. I quickly was down $100 and then the machine open the flood gates, 4 2s for $200, then 4 Aces for $400, and then again 4 Aces for another $400. I cashed out a total of almost $1100. I checked my points to see how many I needed to reach 500 tier credits, 32 needed, I then subsequently lost $300 trying to the get the last 32 points. I walked out of the casino with approximately $1500. I thought I was done for the day, but talked the wife into hitting up the Rio buffet, much shorter line when you can use the Platinum entrance. After dinner, we decided to earn the last 500 tier credits. My wife could not hit anything, she was also using my card, and was quickly down almost $300. I was down $100, switched machines, back to machine that was so kind to me earlier and again we fell in love. Two more times I was able to catch 4 Aces for $400 and cashed out just over $1000 and we were able to reach 1000 tier credits. Now, with $1800 in pocket again, I decided now was the best time to go for the other 1500 tier credits to get the 2500 tier credits in one day and the 5000 tier credit bonus. It was rough to say the least, we finally made it to 2500 tier credits, but cashed out with only $140 left in the pocket. Its crazy to think I could hit 4 Aces four different times, several other $200 wins, and a approximately three or four other four of a kinds and be down that much, but that is how it went. Sometime tomorrow I should receive the bonus tier credits, which will put me at approximately 12,500 tier credits. Overall the 2500 tier credits cost me roughly $900; better than $1 for 1 Tier Credit, which I was previously receiving.
Not really. Remember, you are losing at a 0.83% clip, 2.83% without hitting a royal. That's a big downward slide. You should expect to lose, until you hit the royal. Which you will.Quote: SONBP2Its crazy to think I could hit 4 Aces four different times, several other $200 wins, and a approximately three or four other four of a kinds and be down that much, but that is how it went.
In the past, when I was playing for 1000 tier points ONLY, I'd take $1000...and play $ single line 8/5 Aces&Faces...but I'd get real low always, and hit a few quads to come back to like down $100 or down $200...which for $10k coin-in, is not bad at all...
Quote: TIMSPEEDSo, from what I gather...you're playing $1 vP...and I think I remember you said something about triple play...$1000 is BARELY enough for $1 SINGLE LINE...NO WAY IN HELL is it enough for multiplay...
In the past, when I was playing for 1000 tier points ONLY, I'd take $1000...and play $ single line 8/5 Aces&Faces...but I'd get real low always, and hit a few quads to come back to like down $100 or down $200...which for $10k coin-in, is not bad at all...
Yes and No. Its what I had in my pocket, so yes its what I took. No in the sense that I thought it might take me more than $1000 I had with me at the time. Yes, I am playing $1 8/5 BP Triple Play.
Quote: SONBP2Yes and No. Its what I had in my pocket, so yes its what I took. No in the sense that I thought it might take me more than $1000 I had with me at the time. Yes, I am playing $1 8/5 BP Triple Play.
Just so you know, if the daily goal is 2500 Tier, the risk of ruin for $1000 is quite high on a $1 3-play.
What will all of those tier points buy you? Can you cash it out anytime you want or does the casino choose the time, date etc.. that you cash. Because for that amount out of pocket I would want the casino to open the doors 24/7 to me as to when I want to collect my cash, rooms etc...
"quite high" for some is "quite low" for others.Quote: tringlomaneJust so you know, if the daily goal is 2500 Tier, the risk of ruin for $1000 is quite high on a $1 3-play.
VPW shows for a $1k stake to be about a coin toss for ruin: 51.71%
Session loss: 73.1%
$2k stake: ruin at 10.52%
Session loss: 69.49%
$3k stake: ruin at 0.52%
Session loss: 69.23%
Quote: IbeatyouracesI believe they also have $1, 9/6 JoB STP Spin Poker (99.82%)
This just got added in the Hammond VPFree database. Fun game for the high rollers for sure.
Quote: sevenout77So I have to ask...
What will all of those tier points buy you? Can you cash it out anytime you want or does the casino choose the time, date etc.. that you cash. Because for that amount out of pocket I would want the casino to open the doors 24/7 to me as to when I want to collect my cash, rooms etc...
You cannot buy anything with "tier" credits.
You can however spend your "reward" credits.
Tier credits go toward upgrading your player level. When you get a players card, you are Gold level. As you acquire tier credits you are upgraded to Platinum, Diamond and Seven star levels.
Quote: tringlomane
Yes, but to remind everyone, on 50 and 100-plays, any number of hands can be played with max credits per hand.
Are you pretty sure about that. The multi-play games I am used to
seeing are the kind where 1 credit goes to the first line, and the 2nd
credit goes to the 2nd line, etc.
ALSO, do you know if this game has the normal rate of accumulation
for tier credits, it $ 10 coin-in equals 1 point ?
thanks
I'm 100% sure of both those things.Quote: JohnnyQAre you pretty sure about that. The multi-play games I am used to
seeing are the kind where 1 credit goes to the first line, and the 2nd
credit goes to the 2nd line, etc.
ALSO, do you know if this game has the normal rate of accumulation
for tier credits, it $ 10 coin-in equals 1 point ?
thanks
Quote: teddysI'm 100% sure of both those things.
+1
Hammond is the place to be for anyone who wants to pull this off with VP for as cheap as theoretically possible.
Don`t forget, Windsor has full pay pickem 99.95Quote: tringlomane+1
Hammond is the place to be for anyone who wants to pull this off with VP for as cheap as theoretically possible.
Quote: HunterhillDon`t forget, Windsor has full pay pickem 99.95
From the Wiz's other site, it looks like the 5 "coin" Royal Flush is 0.3 % of the
payback.
And I think it may actually have less impact on the payback if you only play
that game for $ 1 per spin instead of 5 x $ 1 per spin.
Does anyone know approx what the payback is if you only play 1 at a time for the
99.95 game ?
NOTE:
But at Windsor, it takes $ 80.00 coin-in to earn 1 tier credit instead of
$ 10 for the 99.95 pickem. The machines have a label on them that
says that. So I don't think Windsor is the place to try and "level up"
your Total Rewards.
Quote: HunterhillPlaying 1 coin on Pickem is 98.95. But since it takes $80.00 coin in I think Hammond is better.
THANKS, I plugged that into the VP Analyzer on Wizard's other site and yep, it is 98.95.
How did you calculate it ?
I think the error in my reasoning EARLIER was that I thought only the RF and StFl had a
bonus for the 5th coin, but I guess the 4ofaKind does also ( and that is 5 % of the total
return ), per:
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/tables/pick-em-poker/
But yeah with the normal Tier point accumulation, playing 99.96% Deuces is the best choice. 99.94% Super Aces Bonus exists on the 50-play as well, but much more swingy, obviously. And now they have 9/6 JoB STP spin poker for dollars too.
I found it in the Bob Dancer guide.Quote: JohnnyQTHANKS, I plugged that into the VP Analyzer on Wizard's other site and yep, it is 98.95.
How did you calculate it ?
I think the error in my reasoning EARLIER was that I thought only the RF and StFl had a
bonus for the 5th coin, but I guess the 4ofaKind does also ( and that is 5 % of the total
return ), per:
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/tables/pick-em-poker/
On a side note, a friend of mine is an exclusive Horse Player at the Rio. He has been a Diamond member for as long as I can remember. Does anyone know how much you have to bet in Horse Racing wagers to receive 1 Tier Credit? I know he is already over 10,000 Tier Credits this year and with the Kentucky Derby coming up I wanted to make sure he took advantage of the Bonus Tier Credit rewards as he usually wagers well over $5,000 on Derby day.
Quote: SONBP2
On a side note, a friend of mine is an exclusive Horse Player at the Rio. He has been a Diamond member for as long as I can remember. Does anyone know how much you have to bet in Horse Racing wagers to receive 1 Tier Credit? I know he is already over 10,000 Tier Credits this year and with the Kentucky Derby coming up I wanted to make sure he took advantage of the Bonus Tier Credit rewards as he usually wagers well over $5,000 on Derby day.
From a sportbetting forum post I found from last year, it looks like 1 Tier Credit per $10 wagered for sportsbets at least. I dunno if they give horse racing more tier (they probably should).
The thread is here: http://www.covers.com/postingforum/post01/showmessage.aspx?spt=216&sub=100939585&page=2
Quote: supermaxhdWhen playing video poker and taking the double up bets, do those count as coin in for reward and tier credits?
No coin is added to double up, and it's free of house edge, so no. At least this is what I think anyway. I don't recall the last time I doubled up on a CET VP machine.
Quote: supermaxhdWhen playing video poker and taking the double up bets, do those count as coin in for reward and tier credits?
coin in wether by the first bet or double counts. If by small chance the machine you are playing doesn't show you the meter going up for the double change machines. I have played VB and VP @ cet properties, If you play slowly and watch the meter you will see the credits for the doubles.
EDIT: Above is refering to wen you add coins to a bet
Quote: whatmecoin in wether by the first bet or double counts. If by small chance the machine you are playing doesn't show you the meter going up for the double change machines. I have played VB and VP @ cet properties, If you play slowly and watch the meter you will see the credits for the doubles.
EDIT: Above is refering to wen you add coins to a bet
Yeah in video poker, you don't wager additional money for a double up. Video BJ, yeah, you would get more Tier Points from your doubling as you should.
Double up poker you add more $. Which is what I was thinking of wen I responded.Quote: tringlomaneYeah in video poker, you don't wager additional money for a double up. Video BJ, yeah, you would get more Tier Points from your doubling as you should.
Quote: whatmeDouble up poker you add more $. Which is what I was thinking of wen I responded.
You mean "No Risk Double Up" poker? Yeah, that would be extra coin-in, but I assumed that's not what supermaxhd was referring to. Either way if you are playing a very good paying machine, I would generally avoid any double up option for variance reasons.
