Resorts World Vegas fires CEO Sibella

Quote: MDawg

And it's just not as luxurious a property as say, Wynn, and might never be.
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Quote: MDawg

How to measure luxury? as in - what is the "most luxurious" resort in Vegas?

Although Resorts World has some NICE suites, including the Crockford's Entertainment Suite we stay in regularly, my wife has been commenting that a lot of the luxury at Resorts World is specious - that the place seems more like a cookie cutter hotel with a lot of gloss over to make it look superior.

I think one way is to consider the cost of the resort versus number of rooms, taking into consideration the date built and the relative value of money from that time.

Resorts Worlds cost 4.6B to build. Cosmopolitan cost 3.9B Encore 2.6B Wynn 2.7B Bellagio 1.6B Venetian 1.5B Palazzo 1.8B

Resorts World has 3506 rooms, completed in 2021, Cosmopolitan 3027 rooms, completed in Dec 2010. Encore has 2034 rooms, completed Dec 2008, Wynn has 2716 rooms completed April 2005.

So, Resorts World per room cost was $1,312,036 per room in 2021, Cosmopolitan $1,288,404. per room in 2010, Encore $1,278,269. per room in 2008, Wynn $994,108. per room in 2005. I believe that if you consider the relative price of construction in say, 2008, that Encore put more money into its structure relative to the number of rooms than Resorts World.

If I had exact square footage sizes of these buildings I could make even better comparisons.
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Quote: 100xOdds

With this conviction, do you think he can get a casino license to work in a Vegas casino again?
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Quote: mcallister3200

Dude got 1!!!!! year of PROBATION….just shrugged their shoulders and couldn’t care less. That’s going to ensure it doesn’t continue to happen as frequently.…if no jail I’m shocked you don’t get like 5 years of probation, I suppose that’s reserved for the low end drug addicts. Why even bother with the cost of prosecution.
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: mcallister3200

Dude got 1!!!!! year of PROBATION….just shrugged their shoulders and couldn’t care less. That’s going to ensure it doesn’t continue to happen as frequently.…if no jail I’m shocked you don’t get like 5 years of probation, I suppose that’s reserved for the low end drug addicts. Why even bother with the cost of prosecution.
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I agree it’s a weak sentence but it was expected. The good thing is that he likely gave the feds tons of info to get rid of the groups that launder money in Nevada.
This is a major problem btw. Go to any strip casino and you’ll see teams of Asians with sacks of cash blatantly laundering money. The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
They take pictures of the machine while they are playing and text I’m assuming their boss with the progress. All they likely get out of it are food comps and rooms to sleep in. Super sad, basically modern day slavery.

Here’s a report on how these groups operate. They target both land based and online casinos to funnel their money.

https://www.unodc.org/roseap/en/2024/casinos-casinos-cryptocurrency-underground-banking/story.html
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Quote: 100xOdds

So the teams play high denom slots and get handpays?
So These w2-g serve as proof of where you got your $.

But how does that help the criminal supplying the illegally gained cash?
The w2-g's are in their employees names.
The criminal still can't prove where his $ came from.

Or do the employees all give the name and social security # of the criminal?
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
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Quote: MDawg

I've pointed this out to others, including to A.Wolf, and D.Oz, but they don't seem to get it either.

If at the end of the day, the player winds up with cash - then not much has been accomplished laundry wise because he still has to get that cash into the bank, into the stream of commerce. Just getting a W-2G along the way isn't enough to explain the source of the funds. And all of that cash inputted into the machines or tables will still be reported as long as the casino isn't asleep at wheel, via CTRs and maybe even SARs.

Which is why money laundering is defined as converting cash into non cash, which is what happens when it is deposited and then able to be withdrawn in a non-currency form. Or when cash is converted into a non-currency form such as check, cashier's check, money order, bank wire. Ideally, too, it needs to be done without a report being made about the input of the cash.

In At Close Range (1986) Christopher Walken is trying to show his son played by Sean Penn, how money laundering works. He buys a car for cash at a used car dealership, drives it across the street to a different dealership, and sells it for cash. Big deal, so he now still has cash, and even less cash than before, in his hands. And it still doesn't explain how he got the cash in the first place, to buy the first car.

In Johnny Handsome (1989), on the other hand, the "laundry service" involves rinsing stolen presumably traceable bills, for "clean" bills with no history. That makes sense, and involves something other than just money laundering. Yes they still end up with cash at the end of the process, but clean untraceable cash. And then - they still have to launder it, get it into the system, ideally without detection.

Now what Scarface (1983) was doing, trying to convert cash to checks made out to his real estate business, or paying the crooked bank/banker a percentage to deposit cash without its being reported - those were classic money laundering.

Casino Anti Money Laundering and Compliance

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Quote: darkoz

That you give bad advice is bad enough but to use movies as your proof of legitimacy puts into question everything you say.

In Rain Man, a point is made that Card Counting is illegal. It's in Rain Man so must be true, SMH!
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Quote: MDawg

Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
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One of the common Asian superstitions is to not change their clothes or shower when they are on a winning run.

Of course, then they start losing, and now they don't eat sleep shower or change clothes because they're obsessed with playing nonstop and desperate to get their money back.

Point being that just because you see that sort of thing does not mean whatsoever that the player is money laundering. Might just be a superstitious or obsessed gambler. Additionally, for whatever reason a lot of the at least Chinese players dress, to put it nicely, very casually, in the casinos. The Japanese when I'd see them high rolling years ago in the Baccarat pits used to dress to the nines, but Chinese would and do wear more like sweats and don't often even have a decent watch on, while throwing down tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars.

I know personally of more than several Asian players who show up regularly, dump hundreds of thousands sometimes cash, and are not money launderers at all, as they withdraw zilch, just lose it all.
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: MDawg

Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
link to original post

One of the common Asian superstitions is to not change their clothes or shower when they are on a winning run.

Of course, then they start losing, and now they don't eat sleep shower or change clothes because they're obsessed with playing nonstop and desperate to get their money back.

Point being that just because you see that sort of thing does not mean whatsoever that the player is money laundering. Might just be a superstitious or obsessed gambler. Additionally, for whatever reason a lot of the at least Chinese players dress, to put it nicely, very casually, in the casinos. The Japanese when I'd see them high rolling years ago in the Baccarat pits used to dress to the nines, but Chinese would and do wear more like sweats and don't often even have a decent watch on, while throwing down tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars.

I know personally of more than several Asian players who show up regularly, dump hundreds of thousands sometimes cash, and are not money launderers at all, as they withdraw zilch, just lose it all.
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They don’t play machines you get taxables on. They play marginal state AP machines with low house advantages.

I do AP and every time I go to Vegas I can spot these people from a mile away. They have unlimited bankrolls, never leave their assigned post (casino). The same people are there every day.

Point is, You’re wrong. All you have to do is watch them. They spend 16 hours a day walking back and forth each worker has their own location. They aren’t gambling for leisure, they all look totally miserable and overworked. Also leisure gamblers don’t take pictures and text their progress on the machine every 15 mins.

Also where did the “hundreds of thousands” you claim they drop come from?

The UN report I provided shows exactly what they do. The fact that the casinos allow it, is beyond me. There are know your customer laws and one would think they would approach someone spending 16 hours a day everyday in their casino putting millions of dollars thru and ask a few questions. Instead casinos turn a blind eye which is what led to Sibella getting prosecuted.
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Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: MDawg

Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
link to original post

One of the common Asian superstitions is to not change their clothes or shower when they are on a winning run.

Of course, then they start losing, and now they don't eat sleep shower or change clothes because they're obsessed with playing nonstop and desperate to get their money back.

Point being that just because you see that sort of thing does not mean whatsoever that the player is money laundering. Might just be a superstitious or obsessed gambler. Additionally, for whatever reason a lot of the at least Chinese players dress, to put it nicely, very casually, in the casinos. The Japanese when I'd see them high rolling years ago in the Baccarat pits used to dress to the nines, but Chinese would and do wear more like sweats and don't often even have a decent watch on, while throwing down tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars.

I know personally of more than several Asian players who show up regularly, dump hundreds of thousands sometimes cash, and are not money launderers at all, as they withdraw zilch, just lose it all.
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They don’t play machines you get taxables on. They play marginal state AP machines with low house advantages.

I do AP and every time I go to Vegas I can spot these people from a mile away. They have unlimited bankrolls, never leave their assigned post (casino). The same people are there every day.

Point is, You’re wrong. All you have to do is watch them. They spend 16 hours a day walking back and forth each worker has their own location. They aren’t gambling for leisure, they all look totally miserable and overworked. Also leisure gamblers don’t take pictures and text their progress on the machine every 15 mins.

Also where did the “hundreds of thousands” you claim they drop come from?

The UN report I provided shows exactly what they do. The fact that the casinos allow it, is beyond me. There are know your customer laws and one would think they would approach someone spending 16 hours a day everyday in their casino putting millions of dollars thru and ask a few questions. Instead casinos turn a blind eye which is what led to Sibella getting prosecuted.
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I take it you meant variable state AP slots, not "marginal" state.

I could see that working to some extent. On Scarab if they used the player's card of who they are laundering only on the 10th spin so a constant win is generated.

Seems an expensive way to launder although I suppose so would high denom jackpots
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Quote: MDawg

I don't hang around slots, just table games.

But if these people are getting CTRs and SARs for their input of cash, which DRich and others have pointed out, as have I - that they likely will get paperwork turned in on them for their cash input, the W2-Gs generated aren't helping them "hide" anything. Anyone with any sense understands that.

I suppose if vast sums need to be laundered and each individual launderer is able to get the CTRs and SARs within levels that don't invoke too much concern, then the job is accomplished to some extent at least for the higher ups. Or maybe the individual spokes in the big wheel are considered expendable.

Bottom line still is that you're just looking from the outside and speculating as to what must be going on. I am a credit player so I don't play for cash buy ins, but I have personal experience with what happens at table games as far as trying to convert chips to casino check absent a verified win - meaning, that at the tables you cannot convert straight cash to casino check, only the portion attributable to a verified win may be "laundered."
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Quote: MDawg

This is the part that someone will have to explain to me - at table games, where there are no W2-Gs issued, and the casino is very strict about issuing cage checks only for verified wins, how do cash table game players launder money? I'd think that they end up worse off, with no government reported wins and stacks of CTRs and SARs for cash input, and CTRs and SARs for cash output too if they don't lose it all.
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: MDawg

Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
link to original post

One of the common Asian superstitions is to not change their clothes or shower when they are on a winning run.

Of course, then they start losing, and now they don't eat sleep shower or change clothes because they're obsessed with playing nonstop and desperate to get their money back.

Point being that just because you see that sort of thing does not mean whatsoever that the player is money laundering. Might just be a superstitious or obsessed gambler. Additionally, for whatever reason a lot of the at least Chinese players dress, to put it nicely, very casually, in the casinos. The Japanese when I'd see them high rolling years ago in the Baccarat pits used to dress to the nines, but Chinese would and do wear more like sweats and don't often even have a decent watch on, while throwing down tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars.

I know personally of more than several Asian players who show up regularly, dump hundreds of thousands sometimes cash, and are not money launderers at all, as they withdraw zilch, just lose it all.
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They don’t play machines you get taxables on. They play marginal state AP machines with low house advantages.

I do AP and every time I go to Vegas I can spot these people from a mile away. They have unlimited bankrolls, never leave their assigned post (casino). The same people are there every day.

Point is, You’re wrong. All you have to do is watch them. They spend 16 hours a day walking back and forth each worker has their own location. They aren’t gambling for leisure, they all look totally miserable and overworked. Also leisure gamblers don’t take pictures and text their progress on the machine every 15 mins.

Also where did the “hundreds of thousands” you claim they drop come from?

The UN report I provided shows exactly what they do. The fact that the casinos allow it, is beyond me. There are know your customer laws and one would think they would approach someone spending 16 hours a day everyday in their casino putting millions of dollars thru and ask a few questions. Instead casinos turn a blind eye which is what led to Sibella getting prosecuted.
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I take it you meant variable state AP slots, not "marginal" state.

I could see that working to some extent. On Scarab if they used the player's card of who they are laundering only on the 10th spin so a constant win is generated.

Seems an expensive way to launder although I suppose so would high denom jackpots
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No I mean marginal state. As in they take plays on advantage machines prior to it actually being a profitable play. The house edge on those is only like 5 percent.

For example you’ll see them take a 75 green major or 100 yellow mega on regal riches which is way early for profit. They get to run a ton of coin in and whatever comes out is now “clean”.
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Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: MDawg

Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
link to original post

One of the common Asian superstitions is to not change their clothes or shower when they are on a winning run.

Of course, then they start losing, and now they don't eat sleep shower or change clothes because they're obsessed with playing nonstop and desperate to get their money back.

Point being that just because you see that sort of thing does not mean whatsoever that the player is money laundering. Might just be a superstitious or obsessed gambler. Additionally, for whatever reason a lot of the at least Chinese players dress, to put it nicely, very casually, in the casinos. The Japanese when I'd see them high rolling years ago in the Baccarat pits used to dress to the nines, but Chinese would and do wear more like sweats and don't often even have a decent watch on, while throwing down tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars.

I know personally of more than several Asian players who show up regularly, dump hundreds of thousands sometimes cash, and are not money launderers at all, as they withdraw zilch, just lose it all.
link to original post

They don’t play machines you get taxables on. They play marginal state AP machines with low house advantages.

I do AP and every time I go to Vegas I can spot these people from a mile away. They have unlimited bankrolls, never leave their assigned post (casino). The same people are there every day.

Point is, You’re wrong. All you have to do is watch them. They spend 16 hours a day walking back and forth each worker has their own location. They aren’t gambling for leisure, they all look totally miserable and overworked. Also leisure gamblers don’t take pictures and text their progress on the machine every 15 mins.

Also where did the “hundreds of thousands” you claim they drop come from?

The UN report I provided shows exactly what they do. The fact that the casinos allow it, is beyond me. There are know your customer laws and one would think they would approach someone spending 16 hours a day everyday in their casino putting millions of dollars thru and ask a few questions. Instead casinos turn a blind eye which is what led to Sibella getting prosecuted.
link to original post

I take it you meant variable state AP slots, not "marginal" state.

I could see that working to some extent. On Scarab if they used the player's card of who they are laundering only on the 10th spin so a constant win is generated.

Seems an expensive way to launder although I suppose so would high denom jackpots
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No I mean marginal state. As in they take plays on advantage machines prior to it actually being a profitable play. The house edge on those is only like 5 percent.

For example you’ll see them take a 75 green major or 100 yellow mega on regal riches which is way early for profit. They get to run a ton of coin in and whatever comes out is now “clean”.
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How does cashing out make it clean?

If it was that easy, just put money into the slot, then go to the redemption machine and save the receipts.

EDIT: Might be an AP play to wait for these money launderers to knock up the regal riches, then grab the seat after they leave prematurely lmao?
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: MDawg

Quote: Slotenthusiast

The people doing this look like they haven’t eaten, bathed or slept in weeks yet have thousands on them to put in the machines.
link to original post

One of the common Asian superstitions is to not change their clothes or shower when they are on a winning run.

Of course, then they start losing, and now they don't eat sleep shower or change clothes because they're obsessed with playing nonstop and desperate to get their money back.

Point being that just because you see that sort of thing does not mean whatsoever that the player is money laundering. Might just be a superstitious or obsessed gambler. Additionally, for whatever reason a lot of the at least Chinese players dress, to put it nicely, very casually, in the casinos. The Japanese when I'd see them high rolling years ago in the Baccarat pits used to dress to the nines, but Chinese would and do wear more like sweats and don't often even have a decent watch on, while throwing down tens or hundreds of thousands or even millions of dollars.

I know personally of more than several Asian players who show up regularly, dump hundreds of thousands sometimes cash, and are not money launderers at all, as they withdraw zilch, just lose it all.
link to original post

They don’t play machines you get taxables on. They play marginal state AP machines with low house advantages.

I do AP and every time I go to Vegas I can spot these people from a mile away. They have unlimited bankrolls, never leave their assigned post (casino). The same people are there every day.

Point is, You’re wrong. All you have to do is watch them. They spend 16 hours a day walking back and forth each worker has their own location. They aren’t gambling for leisure, they all look totally miserable and overworked. Also leisure gamblers don’t take pictures and text their progress on the machine every 15 mins.

Also where did the “hundreds of thousands” you claim they drop come from?

The UN report I provided shows exactly what they do. The fact that the casinos allow it, is beyond me. There are know your customer laws and one would think they would approach someone spending 16 hours a day everyday in their casino putting millions of dollars thru and ask a few questions. Instead casinos turn a blind eye which is what led to Sibella getting prosecuted.
link to original post

I take it you meant variable state AP slots, not "marginal" state.

I could see that working to some extent. On Scarab if they used the player's card of who they are laundering only on the 10th spin so a constant win is generated.

Seems an expensive way to launder although I suppose so would high denom jackpots
link to original post

No I mean marginal state. As in they take plays on advantage machines prior to it actually being a profitable play. The house edge on those is only like 5 percent.

For example you’ll see them take a 75 green major or 100 yellow mega on regal riches which is way early for profit. They get to run a ton of coin in and whatever comes out is now “clean”.
link to original post

How does cashing out make it clean?

If it was that easy, just put money into the slot, then go to the redemption machine and save the receipts.

EDIT: Might be an AP play to wait for these money launderers to knock up the regal riches, then grab the seat after they leave prematurely lmao?
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What they do is take submarginal plays so they get the best ROI for their churn.

As for what makes it clean they are putting in cash then cashing out tickets. They can just claim they won the money or found the tickets.

Explain why day after day they take submarginal plays that will lose 100 percent of the time over the long term? There’s only one answer.

Man you guys would make the worst investigators, lol.
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Quote: MDawg

The article just says that it is done. Doesn't explain at all how it is done.

If you have read the actual report summarize for us exactly how it is done, because everything you've posted above is on par with the article. You could save us all some time by reading the entire report and explaining exactly what it says. So far, you have not.

Particularly, I'm interested in the answer to this,

Quote: MDawg

This is the part that someone will have to explain to me - at table games, where there are no W2-Gs issued, and the casino is very strict about issuing cage checks only for verified wins, how do cash table game players launder money? I'd think that they end up worse off, with no government reported wins and stacks of CTRs and SARs for cash input, and CTRs and SARs for cash output too if they don't lose it all.
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

DarkOz:


As a seasoned AP even you are tricked. Putting $100 in a slot and just cashing it out, is obviously extremely suspicious. Running AP while laundering is probably way less suspicious. Even to you, they look like degen poppies. They ALWAYS finish a play I’ve watched them. Never seen them leave anything ever.

Read the report. A mule can often have millions of dollars cash on them at any given time.

Ploppies don’t spend 16 hours a day in the same casino day after day only playing regal riches, buffalo ascension and scarab.

The only people who do that are AP’s. The difference is AP’s don’t take sub marginal plays 100 percent of the time and still have a bankroll.
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Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

DarkOz:


As a seasoned AP even you are tricked. Putting $100 in a slot and just cashing it out, is obviously extremely suspicious. Running AP while laundering is probably way less suspicious. Even to you, they look like degen poppies. They ALWAYS finish a play I’ve watched them. Never seen them leave anything ever.

Read the report. A mule can often have millions of dollars cash on them at any given time.

Ploppies don’t spend 16 hours a day in the same casino day after day only playing regal riches, buffalo ascension and scarab.

The only people who do that are AP’s. The difference is AP’s don’t take sub marginal plays 100 percent of the time and still have a bankroll.
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Based on your reply to MDawg it is quite possible they are not money laundering but simply doing a large multicarding operation.

It most certainly is likely that AP's will take suboptimal play on the games you mentioned because the real play isn't the gambling at the moment but the comps to come later.

I personally have seen lower level AP's watch me and attempt to mimic what I do and muck it up because they can't fathom my play isn't the variable or marginal state of the slot I am currently playing but the card operation.

And I am personally aware of Asian multicarding operations that dwarf my own. I clocked one that worked for at least 9 hours and must have had about a thousand cards on them.

So it's more likely that's what you're witnessing.

I suppose they could also mix money laundering into that whole endgame. It's not my avenue of expertise but not certain how if other players are getting the recorded action.
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

Quote: darkoz

Quote: Slotenthusiast

DarkOz:


As a seasoned AP even you are tricked. Putting $100 in a slot and just cashing it out, is obviously extremely suspicious. Running AP while laundering is probably way less suspicious. Even to you, they look like degen poppies. They ALWAYS finish a play I’ve watched them. Never seen them leave anything ever.

Read the report. A mule can often have millions of dollars cash on them at any given time.

Ploppies don’t spend 16 hours a day in the same casino day after day only playing regal riches, buffalo ascension and scarab.

The only people who do that are AP’s. The difference is AP’s don’t take sub marginal plays 100 percent of the time and still have a bankroll.
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Based on your reply to MDawg it is quite possible they are not money laundering but simply doing a large multicarding operation.

It most certainly is likely that AP's will take suboptimal play on the games you mentioned because the real play isn't the gambling at the moment but the comps to come later.

I personally have seen lower level AP's watch me and attempt to mimic what I do and muck it up because they can't fathom my play isn't the variable or marginal state of the slot I am currently playing but the card operation.

And I am personally aware of Asian multicarding operations that dwarf my own. I clocked one that worked for at least 9 hours and must have had about a thousand cards on them.

So it's more likely that's what you're witnessing.

I suppose they could also mix money laundering into that whole endgame. It's not my avenue of expertise but not certain how if other players are getting the recorded action.
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Multicarding could be possible, but the losses would surely dwarf any residual future comp offers. Sorry didn’t mean to attack your expertise as an AP. My fault for not explaining myself better. Ya but anyway they never leave anything.

Maybe as you said doing both. It seems like the only feasible answer unless they just enjoy losing.

When I say marginal play I’d say a 187 must hit by 200 would be considered marginal, where 190 is the play, These people would take a 180. And do it over and over. I can’t see the comp value exceeding the offers.
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Quote: Slotenthusiast

Money laundering as I understand it, is taking ill gotten gains and trying to obscure the original source.
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Quote: MDawg

Sometimes D.Oz debates with me only to circle back to make almost the same point. 😅

And, yes, no one has explained to me how cash in cash out, solves the problem when it comes to money laundering.

Quote: Slotenthusiast

Money laundering as I understand it, is taking ill gotten gains and trying to obscure the original source.
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And no, that's not quite what money laundering is about. It is primarily about converting currency to non-currency, ideally without any cash transaction reporting to the government along the way. The guy who buys in for thirty grand cash, plays a table game, and walks with thirty grand cash hasn't accomplished anything money laundering wise, as far as I can see, in fact seems worse off now having received at least CTRs and maybe even a SAR in the process.

Here for example
https://www.lexisnexis.com/en-gb/glossary/money-laundering
the process of money laundering with regards to casinos is described as:

Casinos
On a smaller scale, individuals or groups are known to use casinos to launder illegal funds into bank accounts. These people buy chips with their cash from the casino which they then claim for a check that they deposit into their bank account, turning the cash into clean money inside a financial system.

which is exactly what I am describing has to happen. Cash in cash out doesn't seem to solve anything, money laundering wise.

This was the point of the At Close Range video - you seem to be buying into what that movie is trying to show is money laundering, which is wrong, or at best - imprecise. Imprecision is a lot of what I see on these forums, coming from people who have little or no personal experience with the topic at hand. Not that I'm out there trying to convert cash to non cash regularly, but I do know exactly what works and what does not work at least at table games in this regards.

I also know what generates a report on a currency transaction, and this occurs for over $10K cash in or out in a 24 hour period, or $3000. or more used to purchase a monetary instrument such as a money order or cashier's check. The casinos are supposed to turn in the CTRs for anyone who inputs or withdraws the $10K or more cash in a 24 hour period, no matter what game is being played.
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Quote: darkoz

I'm better than an investigator. I am an AP with knowledge of how the slot TITO's work. What you suggest they are doing makes no sense. They don’t even need to gamble if that's what they do. Just insert cash and cash out titos. Bang I got a tito from gambling.
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Quote: MDawg

It also "makes perfect sense" 😆 that putting cash into machines, getting CTRs and maybe SARs for that input, then getting some W2-Gs suddenly allows the person claim that Voila! all this cash came from a legitimate source.

The only advantage I can see to the W2-G scenario is that the casino could issue a check for the winnings portion, same way they would for a verified win at table games.

What D.Oz is doing has nothing to do with some intended money launderer who has money with no possible legitimate source. He's (allegedly) doing some operation where revenue is generated via his scheme and then is running some of that revenue back into the scheme. Which is what he doesn't get - the difference between running a business where the input of cash is central to the business itself, and the cash is generated by the business itself, and money laundering - where cash is brought to some business (here, a casino) with the sole intent of laundering it through the business.


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Quote: MDawg

You're not understanding the concept of what happens when tons of unreported cash is getting CTRs and SARs. At the end of the day, unless the person has some kind of business that explains where all that cash came from, all that happens is that the government finds out that someone has a ton of unexplained cash.

When you got a million three, undeclared dollars, staring into a video tape camera, honey baby it's hard to convince a jury you found it in a taxicab.
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Quote: TigerWu

I'm just kind of skimming the responses here so maybe I'm missing something, but it sounds like some people are missing the big picture here and getting hung up on technicalities and logistics. It doesn't matter how many W2s you get or what paperwork you have; if there is a pattern of suspicious activity, it's going to be investigated for potential money laundering.
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Quote: MDawg

This is the part that someone will have to explain to me - at table games, where there are no W2-Gs issued,

Quote: DRich

Quote: MDawg

This is the part that someone will have to explain to me - at table games, where there are no W2-Gs issued,

That is not true for all table games. If you win a bet that pays 300-1 or greater you will be issued one.
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Quote: darkoz

Quote: TigerWu

I'm just kind of skimming the responses here so maybe I'm missing something, but it sounds like some people are missing the big picture here and getting hung up on technicalities and logistics. It doesn't matter how many W2s you get or what paperwork you have; if there is a pattern of suspicious activity, it's going to be investigated for potential money laundering.
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Yes but MDawg is asserting that the simple act of winning large amounts of W2-G is suspicious and will get investigated for money laundering.
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Quote: TigerWu

I'm just kind of skimming the responses here so maybe I'm missing something, but it sounds like some people are missing the big picture here and getting hung up on technicalities and logistics. It doesn't matter how many W2s you get or what paperwork you have; if there is a pattern of suspicious activity, it's going to be investigated for potential money laundering.
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Quote: MDawg

Quote: DRich

Quote: MDawg

This is the part that someone will have to explain to me - at table games, where there are no W2-Gs issued,

That is not true for all table games. If you win a bet that pays 300-1 or greater you will be issued one.
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That sort of thing is so rare as to be discounted in this discussion. What are you talking about, something like the fire bets at craps? There certainly are no W2-Gs at the Baccarat and Blackjack I play, where I am King. Or rather Pope.
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Quote: MDawg

Quote: darkoz

Quote: TigerWu

I'm just kind of skimming the responses here so maybe I'm missing something, but it sounds like some people are missing the big picture here and getting hung up on technicalities and logistics. It doesn't matter how many W2s you get or what paperwork you have; if there is a pattern of suspicious activity, it's going to be investigated for potential money laundering.
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Yes but MDawg is asserting that the simple act of winning large amounts of W2-G is suspicious and will get investigated for money laundering.
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I am saying that the CTRs and SARs that would be issued in the process of all those cash inputs will not be absolved by the W2-Gs received at the back end - which is also essentially what TigerWu has said.

Quote: TigerWu

I'm just kind of skimming the responses here so maybe I'm missing something, but it sounds like some people are missing the big picture here and getting hung up on technicalities and logistics. It doesn't matter how many W2s you get or what paperwork you have; if there is a pattern of suspicious activity, it's going to be investigated for potential money laundering.
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