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ThatDonGuy
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May 18th, 2020 at 8:47:50 AM permalink
Ground has just broken on the new Pinball Hall of Fame site, on the northbound side of the Strip, south of Mandalay Bay and north of the Welcome to Las Vegas sign. It is planned to be about three times as large as the current site on Tropicana between Tamarus and Spencer, just east of UNLV. The plan is for it to be open no later than early next year, although I remember how hard it was to move the machines from the older site (Tropicana and Pecos) to the current one.

Facebook video of the groundbreaking - note that it may be muted by default, but there is sound
billryan
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May 18th, 2020 at 8:57:02 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Ground has just broken on the new Pinball Hall of Fame site, on the northbound side of the Strip, south of Mandalay Bay and north of the Welcome to Las Vegas sign. It is planned to be about three times as large as the current site on Tropicana between Tamarus and Spencer, just east of UNLV. The plan is for it to be open no later than early next year, although I remember how hard it was to move the machines from the older site (Tropicana and Pecos) to the current one.

Facebook video of the groundbreaking - note that it may be muted by default, but there is sound



When I moved to Henderson in 2016, I wanted to open a shop. I thought the shopping center right next to the HOF would be ideal but I was warned the HOF would be leaving soon. I hired a company that did traffic analysis and it determined the HOF was very very under-utilized. I'm not sure how moving to a bigger, more expensive facility will work out for them, but I wish them well.
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Gialmere
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May 18th, 2020 at 9:46:20 AM permalink
Their logic is, as far as tourists are concerned, if you're not on The Strip or the Fremont Experience you don't exist, or are too far away to be bothered with. So they're gambling that they can tap into the tourist market with a more prominent location while still keeping the locals. As a pinball wizard in my youth, I also wish them well.
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IndyJeffrey
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May 18th, 2020 at 11:16:36 AM permalink
I love the current Pinball Hall of Fame. Visit just about every time I am in Las Vegas. I wish them well and hope it works out.
billryan
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May 18th, 2020 at 11:25:54 AM permalink
Quote: IndyJeffrey

I love the current Pinball Hall of Fame. Visit just about every time I am in Las Vegas. I wish them well and hope it works out.



The land costs over four million dollars. That's a chunk of change for a non-profit.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
ThatDonGuy
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May 18th, 2020 at 1:00:28 PM permalink
Quote: billryan

The land costs over four million dollars. That's a chunk of change for a non-profit.


The current location, or the new one?

I think the owner said that the previous owner of the new location kept that land pretty much solely for the billboard that's there. The March 2019 photo on Google Maps has signs for Joe's Seafood/Prime Rib/Steak on one side and a brand of cannabis vaping pens on the other.
JohnnyQ
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May 18th, 2020 at 7:18:20 PM permalink
The off-strip plain jane location had a certain bare bones charm about it, especially when they donated a lot of money to the Salvation Army.
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DRich
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May 18th, 2020 at 7:21:14 PM permalink
Before he had the Hall of Fame, Tim used to have a yearly party at his house where he would let people go in his barn and he would have many of the games up and playable.
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smoothgrh
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May 18th, 2020 at 9:01:31 PM permalink
In the late ‘90s, Tim gave my friends and me a tour of his pinball warehouse and bowling ball pyramid — a bunch of strangers who were pinball enthusiasts and happened to be in town. Such a nice guy. I love supporting the HoF.
billryan
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May 18th, 2020 at 9:22:04 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

The current location, or the new one?

I think the owner said that the previous owner of the new location kept that land pretty much solely for the billboard that's there. The March 2019 photo on Google Maps has signs for Joe's Seafood/Prime Rib/Steak on one side and a brand of cannabis vaping pens on the other.



He paid $4.6 Million for the land at auction for the Strip property. It's pretty big, going very deep. According to the video, the building will be set well back from the strip.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
billryan
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May 18th, 2020 at 9:23:50 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

The current location, or the new one?

I think the owner said that the previous owner of the new location kept that land pretty much solely for the billboard that's there. The March 2019 photo on Google Maps has signs for Joe's Seafood/Prime Rib/Steak on one side and a brand of cannabis vaping pens on the other.



He paid $4.6 Million for the land at auction for the Strip property. It's pretty big, going very deep. According to the video, the building will be set well back from the strip.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
Aussie
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May 19th, 2020 at 5:30:05 PM permalink
Have been a couple of times and while I loved the vast range of machines I was disappointed with how many of them were not maintained well. Here’s hoping that with the new venue comes improved maintenance.
ThatDonGuy
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August 9th, 2020 at 10:40:05 AM permalink
Facebook link to pictures of the new site currently under construction
Video of the owner talking about the new location

They hope to get it finished by the end of the year. Note that it is going to be two stories.

If you want to check out its location on Google Maps, it is on the other side of the Strip from the parking lot entrance to the police station just south of Mandalay Bay.
smoothgrh
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August 9th, 2020 at 6:39:58 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Facebook link to pictures of the new site currently under construction
Video of the owner talking about the new location

They hope to get it finished by the end of the year. Note that it is going to be two stories.



I’m ecstatic! I’m very pleased they’re able to start construction during the pandemic.

Definitely one of my Vegas stops when this thing is over.
ThatDonGuy
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October 3rd, 2020 at 12:12:45 PM permalink
Here's the design for the sign for the new location:
Johnzimbo
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October 3rd, 2020 at 2:04:21 PM permalink
Should they rename it from Hall of Fame to something else? Might get more visitors if they called it Pinball Extravaganza or similar?
AxelWolf
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October 3rd, 2020 at 2:07:42 PM permalink
Strangely enough, I still haven't been to the Pinball Hall of Fame and I have loved pinball every since the day I seen one.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
IndyJeffrey
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October 3rd, 2020 at 6:38:11 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Strangely enough, I still haven't been to the Pinball Hall of Fame and I have loved pinball every since the day I seen one.



I didn't go for the longest time. Of course, after the first time I went, it is a must visit on every trip. Every trip.
smoothgrh
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December 27th, 2020 at 9:32:35 AM permalink
The PHoF posted that they're auditioning food trucks at their current site that will determine which will be at their new site.

So if you are comfortable with pinball AND waiting for good food, you know where to go!
terapined
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December 27th, 2020 at 12:18:25 PM permalink
The game that fascinates me at HOF is Pinball circus
1993, Midway tried a radically different pinball game
they spent 1.5 million and built 2 complete copies of the game
It was all set to go into production. No issues. It was a fun game
They put 1 machine in a Chicago location as a test
It was popular but no more popular then the leading pinball games of the time
Since it was not making more money, the distributor balked at the extra 1k per machine
Midway packed away the games and warehoused them
Company quits the pinball business and the 2 games go home with the high executives of the company
Pinball players heard about and saw pics of these games for years but could never play them
The executives got together and put one of the machines in the PHOF
I've played it recently
Its a fun game as its multi level
Lots of flippers
Get it up one level, use flippers to get up to next level
Very fun and challenging
Its just a forum. Nothing here to get obsessed about.
billryan
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December 27th, 2020 at 1:17:25 PM permalink
When I first saw the plans for the parking lot, I was thinking it would be ideal for food truck events.
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DJTeddyBear
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December 27th, 2020 at 1:42:00 PM permalink
Quote: terapined

The game that fascinates me at HOF is Pinball circus
...
Its a fun game as its multi level
...
Get it up one level, use flippers to get up to next level
Very fun and challenging

This description does not do it justice.
I play it every time I'm there.

Most pinball games have a second level, but it's parallel to the main level, and only about and inch above the main level. The game is almost flat, looking down thru the top glass. They have two sets of 2D thinking.

Pinball Circus has a front glass that it almost vertical, and a very large game space inside. It's a true 3D game.
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Johnzimbo
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December 27th, 2020 at 3:22:40 PM permalink
Is it a dollar per game as the picture shows?
ThatDonGuy
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December 27th, 2020 at 3:25:01 PM permalink
Quote: Johnzimbo

Is it a dollar per game as the picture shows?


Yes, but that's the going rate now for the newest games (with the video screens in the backglass rather than reel or some sort of LED-based displays) as well.
gamerfreak
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December 27th, 2020 at 3:44:07 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Yes, but that's the going rate now for the newest games (with the video screens in the backglass rather than reel or some sort of LED-based displays) as well.


Pinball machines are expensive, and the market has exploded in the last 10 years with boomers who played in the 70’s and 80’s reaching retirement age with disposable income/savings.

New machines start around $6k and can get as high as $14k.

If a pinball circus were to be put on the market, I think it would fetch $30k minimum.

Pinball machines are also labor intensive to maintain with how mechanical they are.

That’s why it costs $1/play. Get good and it’s cheap entertainment.
DRich
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December 27th, 2020 at 3:50:41 PM permalink
What fascinates me is a lot of the pinball designers got into casino gaming in different ways and have been successful.

Joe Kamikow
Larry DeMar
Eugene Jarvis
etc
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
gamerfreak
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December 27th, 2020 at 3:55:57 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

What fascinates me is a lot of the pinball designers got into casino gaming in different ways and have been successful.

Joe Kamikow
Larry DeMar
Eugene Jarvis
etc


I’d think that many of them stayed with Bally/Williams in the late 90’s after they dropped out of the pinball market.
DRich
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December 27th, 2020 at 4:08:17 PM permalink
Quote: gamerfreak

I’d think that many of them stayed with Bally/Williams in the late 90’s after they dropped out of the pinball market.



I think those guys left before that but I am not positive. I know some of them started their own video game companies before moving to casino gaming.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
DJTeddyBear
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December 27th, 2020 at 4:48:47 PM permalink
Quote: Johnzimbo

Is it a dollar per game as the picture shows?

Yes. And worth every penny. It's a damn fun game.

Note I believe $1 was the intended cost when it was first developed.

Many of the games there play for 25¢.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
terapined
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December 27th, 2020 at 8:42:57 PM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

Yes. And worth every penny. It's a damn fun game.

Note I believe $1 was the intended cost when it was first developed.

Many of the games there play for 25¢.


Games cost what they did when they came out
70's and 80's pinball I played still a quarter
Modern set on whatever the cost is
I actually dont really like the system
Outside of Tampa in Tarpon Springs we have the Replay Museum
About 1/3 the size of PHOF so still a lot of machines
Pay one price. I think it was 12 bucks. Give you a wrist band. Good all day. All games set on free play. Great neighborhood to walk around unlike PHOF. Can take a break and walk to a nice restaurant or bar and go back and play.
Its just a forum. Nothing here to get obsessed about.
ThatDonGuy
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December 28th, 2020 at 7:13:21 AM permalink
Quote: terapined

Games cost what they did when they came out
70's and 80's pinball I played still a quarter
Modern set on whatever the cost is
I actually dont really like the system
Outside of Tampa in Tarpon Springs we have the Replay Museum
About 1/3 the size of PHOF so still a lot of machines
Pay one price. I think it was 12 bucks. Give you a wrist band. Good all day. All games set on free play. Great neighborhood to walk around unlike PHOF. Can take a break and walk to a nice restaurant or bar and go back and play.


The problem with the "pay one price" system, which is also used at the Pacific Pinball Museum near Oakland is, whoever gets to the modern games first stay there for a while.

Also, the "going rate" was 10 cents a game (3 for a quarter) in the late '60s/early '70s, then 2 games for a quarter until I think the early '80s, then a quarter a game to match what video games (most of which were a quarter a game from the start, going back to Computer Space and Pong) were charging.
billryan
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December 28th, 2020 at 9:26:02 AM permalink
When I opened my first comic shop, I was given a choice of one pinball game that was two games for a quarter or two video games that took up roughly the same space but were 25 cents per game. At first, I had Asteroids and a moon landing game that were difficult to play and money poured in. Then they rotated in Missle Command and Galaxia(sp?) that let people play much longer for the same quarter. I quickly discovered that the people playing games weren't spending money in my store and often I'd have six kids in a rather small store and it wasn't really good for business. I'd taken a $1,000 advance on my share of profits and as soon as I'd paid it back, I cut it down to one machine and finagled 25 free games a week.
Meanwhile an arcade called Foosball World opened a few blocks away and quickly got a very sordid reputation. Drug dealing, rumbles,
alleged prostitution, and all sorts of bad shit. The town had a meeting and my shop was brought up as another teenage hangout.
I spoke to the local Police Commander who told me it would be better off if I lost the video games. I did, and it was surprisingly painless.
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Gialmere
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June 20th, 2021 at 4:12:04 PM permalink


Evidently the Hall of Fame had a soft opening a month or two back. They're still setting up machines and an official grand opening will take place in July.

The video above gives you the gist of the new layout (albeit from a Raiders fan's pov). I'm looking forward to seeing it when I hit Vegas in August.
Have you tried 22 tonight? I said 22.
ThatDonGuy
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June 20th, 2021 at 4:22:13 PM permalink
Quote: Gialmere

Evidently the Hall of Fame had a soft opening a month or two back. They're still setting up machines and an official grand opening will take place in July.

The video above gives you the gist of the new layout (albeit from a Raiders fan's pov). I'm looking forward to seeing it when I hit Vegas in August.


The (invitation-only) Grand Opening is July 1.
ChumpChange
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June 20th, 2021 at 4:27:25 PM permalink
New pinball machines in the early 70's were about $900 new. So you charge 10 cents per game, you need 9,000 plays to pay for the game. But wait, if you split 50-50, or 60-40 with the shop owner, you need 18,000 plays to pay for the game. On 25 cents per 2 games, same deal. Things changed when Pac-Man came out and vendors had to make service calls on weekends because the coin trays were full and wouldn't accept any more coins. Video games killed the pinball star!
darkoz
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June 20th, 2021 at 5:12:15 PM permalink
Quote: ChumpChange

New pinball machines in the early 70's were about $900 new. So you charge 10 cents per game, you need 9,000 plays to pay for the game. But wait, if you split 50-50, or 60-40 with the shop owner, you need 18,000 plays to pay for the game. On 25 cents per 2 games, same deal. Things changed when Pac-Man came out and vendors had to make service calls on weekends because the coin trays were full and wouldn't accept any more coins. Video games killed the pinball star!



There is a lot missing from that analysis I think.

I'm not certain if the game was purchased outright why a split would be required.

Also, if the venue had paid for the machine then they would have some consideration when they changed up for a new title.

Finally, a lot of Pinball machines were designed with conversion kits so you could get a "new" machine by replacing the guts of the old. Conversion kits were maybe half price but gave a "new" game to the venue.
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ChumpChange
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June 20th, 2021 at 5:44:25 PM permalink
There would be vending companies that had dozens and dozens of machines. They'd put a few in each location (shop, bowling alley, bar, etc,) for miles around (maybe up to 25 miles around). They'd put the machines in locations, take them out of locations, and there'd be a rotation of new machines coming into each location every few months. Sure, some machines might stick around a location for a couple years, but people were either playing them, or the location was so dead putting a bad machine there was no loss. The vending company would fix machines on location. Got a stuck ball or a bad flipper or some other game malfunction, they'd be called in to fix it. I've had a few machines taken out while I was playing them because the store called the vending company complaining that I was playing for hours on a single coin and getting crazy high scores in a free ball state, or the machine just had a malfunction that was giving me a lot of points like the ball getting stuck on a rollover.

I've never heard of conversion kits. I've seen these virtual pinball games which probably cost a lot. No, the vending companies in my area never used conversion kits. The playfield is unique, the backglass is unique, you can't convert that. You can change rules, like change the score needed for a free ball or free game; you could set up a tournament mode in machines from 1976 on. Every machine had identifiable paint jobs on the cabinets, and those were sometimes redone because they needed a new paint job. When the machines were no longer popular, they were either sold or given away, usually after 5-10 years of hard play.
gamerfreak
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June 20th, 2021 at 5:44:43 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

There is a lot missing from that analysis I think.

I'm not certain if the game was purchased outright why a split would be required.

Also, if the venue had paid for the machine then they would have some consideration when they changed up for a new title.

Finally, a lot of Pinball machines were designed with conversion kits so you could get a "new" machine by replacing the guts of the old. Conversion kits were maybe half price but gave a "new" game to the venue.


Venues typically didn't own machines unless they were an arcade. You’ve heard of well used machines being referred to as “routed condition”. Route meaning the route of restaurants, bars, etc the operators placed machines into and split revenue 50-50.

Operators LOVED video arcade cabinets because they took up half the footprint of a pinball machine.

I know there were a few pinball conversion kits but I don’t think they were all that common.
billryan
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June 20th, 2021 at 6:21:48 PM permalink
deleted
Last edited by: billryan on Jun 21, 2021
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
rsactuary
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June 20th, 2021 at 6:35:35 PM permalink
I'm in Vegas from July 5 - 8 and I look forward to visiting for the first time.

So how does this work? Do you pay an entry fee and all games inside are free? Or do you literally have to put quarters in the machines? or both?
ChumpChange
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June 20th, 2021 at 6:42:38 PM permalink
I only had about $10-$20 to feed the machines per week, so I valued getting the most time playing for the lowest cost. In the early 1990's, I could play T-2 for quite awhile in a 4 way game. But play a video game and it's more like the high limit room of losing $12 an hour.
sabre
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June 20th, 2021 at 6:58:55 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

Finally, a lot of Pinball machines were designed with conversion kits so you could get a "new" machine by replacing the guts of the old. Conversion kits were maybe half price but gave a "new" game to the venue.



Can you give some examples? Because I've never heard of this.

I know that was Heighway Pinball's plan in the 2010s that you could turn your Full Throttle into an Aliens, but that went under hard.
DJTeddyBear
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June 20th, 2021 at 7:12:33 PM permalink
Quote: rsactuary

So how does this work? Do you pay an entry fee and all games inside are free? Or do you literally have to put quarters in the machines? or both?

It’s free to enter and they really do play for quarters. Most games are 25¢ per play but some of the newer machines cost more - but the same price as when they were introduced to arcades. Note that they also have some really old games that play for 5¢ or 10¢.

And they have a few change machines scattered about.

It’s a GREAT way to spend an afternoon.
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ ————————————————————————————————————— Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
gamerfreak
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June 21st, 2021 at 5:50:10 AM permalink
Quote: sabre

Can you give some examples? Because I've never heard of this.

I know that was Heighway Pinball's plan in the 2010s that you could turn your Full Throttle into an Aliens, but that went under hard.


It really wasn’t all that common.

Williams sold a kit to convert any WPC95 game into Congo.

I think Gottleib also had some conversion kits for the SYS80 games.

There are more examples of conversion kits with video arcade games.
rsactuary
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June 21st, 2021 at 6:19:23 AM permalink
Quote: gamerfreak

It really wasn’t all that common.

Williams sold a kit to convert any WPC95 game into Congo.

I think Gottleib also had some conversion kits for the SYS80 games.

There are more examples of conversion kits with video arcade games.



Yeah, pinball conversions, I've never heard of. But arcade game conversions happened regularly, with Mr. Do! being the first hugely successful one.
gamerfreak
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June 21st, 2021 at 6:23:20 AM permalink
Quote: rsactuary

Yeah, pinball conversions, I've never heard of. But arcade game conversions happened regularly, with Mr. Do! being the first hugely successful one.


You also might find this interesting. It’s a modern modular pinball platform

https://www.multimorphic.com/p3-pinball-platform/

I have seen a few in the wild but haven’t played
ThatDonGuy
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June 21st, 2021 at 7:00:45 AM permalink
Quote: sabre

Can you give some examples? Because I've never heard of this.

I know that was Heighway Pinball's plan in the 2010s that you could turn your Full Throttle into an Aliens, but that went under hard.


Wasn't pretty much the entire point of Pinball 2000 the ability to switch from one machine (e.g. Revenge from Mars) to another (e.g. Star Wars Episode 1) easily?

I'm a little surprised there's no way to convert a Family Guy to a Shrek (or vice versa).
sabre
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June 21st, 2021 at 8:38:44 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Wasn't pretty much the entire point of Pinball 2000 the ability to switch from one machine (e.g. Revenge from Mars) to another (e.g. Star Wars Episode 1) easily?

I'm a little surprised there's no way to convert a Family Guy to a Shrek (or vice versa).



Yes, I think they even released conversion kits to change from RFM to SW before they shut down.

I really like the Family Guy game. Shrek not so much. That shows the power of theming, since they're essentially the same game.
Gialmere
Gialmere
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Joined: Nov 26, 2018
June 21st, 2021 at 10:03:13 AM permalink
With the warehouse setup, they could easily add a mezzanine level and practically double the floor space (if needed).

Here's a few games I'm looking forward to playing...

The first two-level playing field and first "Magna-Save" game. This came out at the height of the Dungeons & Dragons craze so I dumped a small fortune in quarters in it. "WILL THEE CHALLENGE THE BLACK KNIGHT AGAIN?"


This came out when pinball tables were still the gods of the arcade (a year before Pong would spell doom for the silver ball). As a very young kid I was hooked by the dinosaur theme. It had multi-ball which was practically unheard of in those days, and zipper-flippers which was cool for a player who barely understood what was going on.


Before video games, this was a way two baseball fans could play a simulated game while talking smack to each other. I don't see it on the HoF list of games, but can spot it in a few of the recent youtube videos.


This laserdisc game was once the most popular game in the arcade. It took a lot of quarters but I finished it. I'm skeptical, however, about the HoF version. The photo above is the original cabinet. The HoF game appears to be a remake. This is not surprising since few original games are left. The disc would scratch and wear out. It was notorious for breaking down.


Pinball Hall of Fame Game List
Last edited by: Gialmere on Jun 21, 2021
Have you tried 22 tonight? I said 22.
gamerfreak
gamerfreak
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Joined: Dec 28, 2014
June 21st, 2021 at 10:52:32 AM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Wasn't pretty much the entire point of Pinball 2000 the ability to switch from one machine (e.g. Revenge from Mars) to another (e.g. Star Wars Episode 1) easily?

I'm a little surprised there's no way to convert a Family Guy to a Shrek (or vice versa).


Which unfortunately never came to full fruition.

I don’t think Stern ever did conversion kits. With resale value of machines being so high nowadays, I doubt conversion kits will ever make much sense financially to either the manufacturer or consumer.
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