Discussion II about the Suspension List
Quote: SOOPOOBabs--- politically you and JoeS were quite similar. But while you would put down Trump you wouldn't obsessively berate those who would vote for him. You never refer to Trump voters as knuckle draggers. Same with terapined. And Rxwine. And ams. Views close to diametrically opposed to mine. But never have they called me an idiot for my opinions. When I would always point out that I was not a fan of HRC or DJT, that was enough for the non JoeS liberals. But JoeS would label me a Trumper. You would do no such thing.
You and I have had a few back and forths about JoeS. Even though, until now, I never agreed with your decisions, I was always able to follow your reasoning, and it never elevated to rudeness.
In summary....... You are a great moderator.
Well said SOOPOO. I agree.
Quote: AZDuffmanDT was created to be a sort of relief-valve. All the non-vegas talk was to be there by the regulars. DT has ebbed and flowed and more flowed since the sale and split of the boards. Mike graciously kept it open for us, but no real promotion is done for it. DT is sort of a dive bar with a dozen regulars who all like it as it is and while new blood is welcome, nobody has an incentive to find any.
That's a very good way of putting it. As you said, for a while I felt there was a problem with this forum being dominated by talk of politics and current issues. So I created DT and suggested such discussion move there, without requiring it. A lot of people complained the site never reached a critical mass. However, it has slowly picked up. I would prefer to describe it as a small neighborhood bar where you see the same names all the time and the discussion is generally more in depth and civil.
I don't think it is my place to try too hard here to get new members, but will just say that everybody who can behave themselves is welcome.
Regarding a statute of limitations, I don't recall ever setting one in stone but don't like to go backwards more than a week or so. I know I've gone back further in the past, but I'd like to think I learn as I go and make adjustments as needed.
Quote: RonC
Why all the love for someone who, in spite of his appealing positions to some, treated the forum like crap?
His commentary, when focused (as I felt he was after i addressed him) was brilliant, IMO. Maybe I use "brilliant" because the bar had been set so low, but it was nice to see an actual thought and created opinion, instead of what felt like rehashed and repeated talking points I could hear on any single talking head show out there.
His comments engendered some brilliant responses from several members, responses that I do not believe would have happened otherwise.
I, for one, was pleased as punch to see those on "his side" take up arms against him. As a man on the sidelines, it did seem as though it was party before everything, and that no word may be spoken against it, and no man should speak up against like. Yet, I saw lefty after lefty put him down for his behavior. Maybe it's just me, but I found it inspiring.
I enjoy drama.
I found relief that I am not the only bats#$% crazy, hyper pissed, and about to lose control member here.
But for real, I do realize I am in the extreme minority. But some of the stuff he said, or that was said in response to him, gave me a spark. And RonC, I NEED that spark. I KNOW you do not realize, and I cannot possibly communicate, how something as simple and stupid as your simple offer via PM affected my life. Something so bleeding obvious, something I should have just known (but didn't), and it was your oh so very simple comment... it might have saved my life. Perhaps not literally, I may not have died, but who knows where I'd have been or what I'd have done, when in such a spot as I was, and still am. ME has talked a few times about hope, and at least for me, that's really the crux of it all.
Without hope, man suffers. I cannot begin to tell you how many times I've recalled people's comments about "how you make a monster", or wondering how seemingly normal, well off, well to do people snap and commit horrifying acts. I can say I know exactly the f#$% how, because I've been toeing that line for nearly two years now. And oftentimes I feel the only difference between me and my hometown boy McVeigh is hope. When life is rough or tough or impossible, when "good times" are such a distant memory you start to fail to recall what they were like, and a look to the horizon just shows bleak greyness, yeah... good people go bad. I know it because I'm in that fight. And hope, that idea that something may happen, someone may have an out, it all a lot of us have.
The Election thread gave me that. Yes, it was maddening. I was so sick of the intentional ignorance, the rah rah hometeam bulls#$%, the giddy about this, the alpha male that, that I ain't hardly posted at all. But I read it all, because there was gold in them thar ills. In many ways, it was not unlike suffering the myriad suggestions for my income search. So many ideas that just didn't fit, so much frustration over nothing changing, but then, a fleck. A glimmer. A little speck of glimmering gold. That particular speck is now a pile of checks from the Chautauqua County Youth Hockey Association, and in two days they'll turn into payment for medical attention, and for the first time in over a year I might be able to eat a proper meal, relieve myself of the pus and putrescence squirting into my mouth, and may finally get to sleep without crying.
That particular thing happened for no other reason than people kept talking and I put in the effort to listen. The Election thread, including Joesh's demeanor, including the rah-rah, has done the same. Just the simple act of ME stating that he sees that people are left behind and pissed... he needn't even do anything, just the fact that SOMEONE f#$%ing SEES IT, it helps. It gives hope. Like a man adrift on some flotsam, that comment was a glimmer. Rescue? Probably not. But mayyyyybe...
And I really f#$%ing need that "maybe". Even if the rescuers scold me and call me a bigot the whole way home.
Quote: AZDuffmanAt the time, old management thought that WoV had strayed from it's concept, namely being a forum of Vegas in general and casinos in more particular. Like all forums, over a few years a few personalities were dominating and the same personalities had said most of what they had to say about Vegas and casinos. Also, politics was getting to be a main focus.
DT was created to be a sort of relief-valve. All the non-vegas talk was to be there by the regulars. DT has ebbed and flowed and more flowed since the sale and split of the boards. Mike graciously kept it open for us, but no real promotion is done for it. DT is sort of a dive bar with a dozen regulars who all like it as it is and while new blood is welcome, nobody has an incentive to find any.
Stop over if you like for more generalized conversation.
lol. The MacDonalds I'm sitting in is blocking it I think. Do I even want to check it out? Maybe later on my home deck.
Quote: RonCFrom your comment, who really knew what to think you might do.
Basically, Joe said "screw you" to everyone who asked him to calm down and insult less, and did what he did. Some of us tossed an insult or two back at him, but nowhere near his level of bad behavior at all.
Why all the love for someone who, in spite of his appealing positions to some, treated the forum like crap?
In my short reading observation I didn't see a lot of joe directing at individuals explicitly, but his style used the words 'you', 'them' and other vague descriptors where I didn't feel he was aiming at certain people. I've also noticed a phenomenon through the years where regular people would see this style and assume the author was writing about them directly.
I think some of this stress was a little of both in places. I think his my way or highway attitude that seems to come off is a noticeable turn off to many who don't care to take the time to massage his messages.
Just an observation.
And one other thing I find interesting. Is how many people start posting their brand of nasty once someone is nuked, yet few of them attempted any kind of debate with the subject while they had a chance.
Just another observation.
The rules dont allow honest opinions until someone is nuked. I wouldn't even dare call him a jerk beforehand. With him you don't want to be mean, you have to be mean. People were holding their tongues best they could.Quote: sammydv
And one other thing I find interesting. Is how many people start posting their brand of nasty once someone is nuked, yet few of them attempted any kind of debate with the subject while they had a chance.
Just another observation.
Jesus, everyone was a Trumper to him, and being a Trumper meant about you whatever he thought it was and naturally he was right and everybody else was wrong. Who he really emulated, Donald J Trump. Jbot was a jerk, he was defensive, he was offensive, and he babbled on and on.
That's not true at all. The rules here don't allow personal insults, but if someone can't express their honest opinion without a personal insult then, respectfully, they need a better command of the language.Quote: onenickelmiracleThe rules dont allow honest opinions until someone is nuked.
(If the only honest opinion someone has *is* a personal insult, that's a different topic...)
Quote: MathExtremistThat's not true at all. The rules here don't allow personal insults, but if someone can't express their honest opinion without a personal insult then, respectfully, they need a better command of the language.
(If the only honest opinion someone has *is* a personal insult, that's a different topic...)
Quote: Wizard, p. 269, original discussion of the suspension list threadYou can insult non-members, including nuked members. However, forum rules still apply about profanity and generally acting like gentlemen.
Well maybe you learn something new every day. Today you learned you can say what you want about nuked members. This has been the way it is for a long time.
I agree personal insults are not necessary, but sometimes it isn't worth the time and more efficient letting it go. I normally bite my tongue and watch my profanity here and in real life.
One time I stood by an elevator going into a casino waiting to get on. Guy comes out with his girlfriend, yells at me for standing by the door. Somebody being on the elevator leaving at this time is more than unexpected. I explain this, blah, blah, more yelling from him. I am upset as him now, so I decide to tell him **** you buddy and it couldn't have been a better command of the language. We all laughed in the elevator headed to the casino. Someone mentioned he must have lost.
Quote: beachbumbabsThat's a bit ironic.
There's a general agreement among the losing side that "we" didn't listen to "them" and that's why "we" lost.
So you, as one who was not listened to and decided to take action, your first post-election action is to not listen.
That's not true. There is no "general agreement" that the democrats lost because they didn't listen. That's only in your mind, or something you've read in the Washington Post or somewhere. That's not how the state of politics works in this country. The democrats don't listen to republicans. They never do. When democrats say "compromise" it is only when it is on their terms. And we republicans should not expect anything else from democrats. Democrats don't give, they only take. The problem with not listening is that the REPUBLICANS have not listened to THEIR constituency. THAT is what the uproar is about.
And the problem has never been that *I* don't listen. I don't need to listen. I'm not a congressman.
Contrast that with ME and others who I disagree with regularly--there may be some barbs tossed back and forth but the conversations don't generally turn into attacks and personal insults just don't happen very often, if at all.
It is okay to disagree strongly but if your position is that ANYONE AND EVERYONE voting for a certain person makes you a complete babbling, racist, idiot (I could go on)...well, you aren't going to make a point with very many people. It just doesn't work in a real conversation. You'd kick that person out of your house.
...and, Face, if anything I did helped, I am truly glad to have done it. Hope is an important thing. I hope all comes out well with the medical work you are having done.
Funny, I thought Joe was the most talking points oriented guy here. If you don't like Hillary, you hate 100% of women. If you do like Trump, you're a flaming racist. Trump's alleged misbehavior with women was all true, and Bill's was all made up. etc. Just the Huffpost, MSNBC line, but written in an even more tedious fashion. It was pretty obvious to me, he had little substantive knowledge of politcs, e.g. not knowing what right wing and left wing mean. Disingenuous, ignorant hackery is the one thing I'm not interested in.
People probably stopped debating him because he would ignore whatever you said, then make up a position and assign it to you, which makes it pointless to talk. I was kind of amazed that a few people kept engaging him.
AZ, is right, I think. It's not really about politcs, any more than declaring superiority to Baccarat players is about cards, or ridiculing vultures was about video poker. Throw in self-aggrandizing stories that were obviously false, and you have a picture of illness.
He did bring drama and absurdity. Like when he called max a liar, was proven wrong and declared he was the noble victim in the situation. But as AZ says, you should always keep one eye on people who do stuff like that.
Different strokes for different folks.
Quote: sammydvlol. The MacDonalds I'm sitting in is blocking it I think. Do I even want to check it out? Maybe later on my home deck.
Yeah, you want to check it out. From the DIY to the beekeeping to the DIY thread. You will never have seen such an eclectic group. If that is good or bad will be on you.
Anyway I found the right one. Haven't had time to investigate yet.
Thanks.
Quote: beachbumbabsCitrusc77 is nuked, multiple id.
All for one, and one for all.
Waiting to have a Yorick nuked, so I can hold up his metaphorical skull and say the line.
Quote: rxwineAll for one, and one for all.
Waiting to have a Yorick nuked, so I can hold up his metaphorical skull and say the line.
Why would someone deliberately have more than one ID on a discussion forum? Would it be like cheating in online poker and having two of "yourself" at the same table? lol Is the guy agreeing with himself when nobody else will? His own shill? Kinda seems weird to me.
Quote: bobbartopKinda seems weird to me.
Pretty sure there is nothing too weird for the Internet. Almost like an unassailable truth.
Quote: rxwineAll for one, and one for all.
Waiting to have a Yorick nuked, so I can hold up his metaphorical skull and say the line.
It was Buzz, fwiw. I don't doubt he will accommodate you at some point; the humor would appeal to him.
His three day suspension ended a couple days ago, and he's still in red / unable to post.
Quote: MrVWill somebody please reinstate Watchmewin?
His three day suspension ended a couple days ago, and he's still in red / unable to post.
Thanks for the reminder. I just un-suspended him. Let the record show I owe him two days.
Quote: GWAEWhat happened to Joes or Josh or whatever his name is.
Banned for being a troll.
Quote: Wizardofnothingdid anyone really not see that from the start
I think they pretty much saw it, they just let him hang himself with the personal insults he insisted on including in his diatribes.
Supposedly he is a very nice person in "real life" but his persona here was anything but nice.
There are those that say he is a reincarnation of a previously suspended member. I guess I don't care enough to compare writing styles, etc. and see if that is true. I knew he wouldn't stay around long anyway. He came in and started multiple threads all basically saying the same thing. Pretty much the only thread that there needed to be on the election was the election thread; everything went to that issue any way.
It hasn't been updated for weeks: what purpose does it serve?
I assume the mods agree, as their inactions speak loudly.
Tear down the wall.
Quote: MrVTear down the wall.
Trivia time!
Name the song and artist.
Seriously, we don't have a suspension list at DT. However, it has become quite a part of the identity of this site, for better or worse. If Mexico pays for it, I'll remove it.
but no update in the suspension thread.
just curious what he did
Quote: 100xOddsWatchMeWin is red again in this thread: https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/off-topic/28034-aping-life/
but no update in the suspension thread.
just curious what he did
He called another member retarded (by implication).
Quote: beachbumbabsHe called another member retarded (by implication).
I don't think "retarded" is permitted to be used anymore in any context.
"Retarded" and "Advanced" are in common usage in that regard.
Quote: NathanI wonder what Lindaspies did to get suspended/ banned. Just joined and already in red. Her posts seemed normal and reasonable so it just boggles my mind to see her in red.....Hmm.
Fair question, I didn't do it, so I don't know anything about it, but I'll get an answer.
For now, I would speculate that the posts may have contained spam links, and the banning Admin may have deleted the links but otherwise kept the posts. Generally speaking, I would just delete the entire posts (after banning) but everyone has their own way of doing things. If I was going to keep the posts, I would usually mention in the post that a Spam link was deleted just so there is some open record of what happened.
As I've stated before, I do not add spam posters to the Suspension List simply because it is not worth the time it would take to do it. Besides that, they'll never be unbanned, anyway, and are not long-time members.
But, yeah, let me kick out a few PM's and I'll come back with an answer.
Aparently you haven't meet everyone I know.Quote: BozI don't think "retarded" is permitted to be used anymore in any context.
Quote: Mission146Fair question, I didn't do it, so I don't know anything about it, but I'll get an answer.
For now, I would speculate that the posts may have contained spam links, and the banning Admin may have deleted the links but otherwise kept the posts. Generally speaking, I would just delete the entire posts (after banning) but everyone has their own way of doing things. If I was going to keep the posts, I would usually mention in the post that a Spam link was deleted just so there is some open record of what happened.
As I've stated before, I do not add spam posters to the Suspension List simply because it is not worth the time it would take to do it. Besides that, they'll never be unbanned, anyway, and are not long-time members.
But, yeah, let me kick out a few PM's and I'll come back with an answer.
I was the one swinging the banhammer. An appeal has been made, and I have unbanned lindaspies and invited them back, in response to the appeal. We'll see how it goes. I hope the appellant is right.
What offense / infraction?
Oh, tell us more about the appeals process: I didn't see it in the rules anywhere.
Quote: MrVWhy did you ban the poster initially?
What offense / infraction?
Oh, tell us more about the appeals process: I didn't see it in the rules anywhere.
I have seen an Admin unban a poster before on another board after more than 2 years. The admin said that the then banned poster sent him a personal email claiming he is not a troll anymore and had grown up a lot in those more than 2 years and now found trolling stupid, immature, and useless.. The admin made him promise to keep his promise to stop trolling and now he is one of the most valuable posters on that board.
Quote: NathanI have seen an Admin unban a poster before on another board after more than 2 years. The admin said that the then banned poster sent him a personal email claiming he is not a troll anymore and had grown up a lot in those more than 2 years and now found trolling stupid, immature, and useless.. The admin made him promise to keep his promise to stop trolling and now he is one of the most valuable posters on that board.
Was his name Jerry Logan?
Quote: MrVWhy did you ban the poster initially?
What offense / infraction?
Oh, tell us more about the appeals process: I didn't see it in the rules anywhere.
Please, do tell us more. Also, a definition of pornography would be nice as well.
Quote: HullabalooWas his name Jerry Logan?
No.
Pornography is more than horses with hilarious commentary, but less than an R rated scene from Borat. Ask for the link. Tear bursting comedy, the horse voice over.Quote: MaxPenPlease, do tell us more. Also, a definition of pornography would be nice as well.
Quote: Mission146Based on his post content, Statman.
Reeaalllllyyy.....
Wow. That took nerve. He was before my time, but I heard a few things...
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/28330-bad-casino-giveaways/10/#post579521
The length of the ban for first offense Trolling is longer than the usual three days for a first offense due to the fact that the subject matter of the thread itself was trolling, most of Nathan's posts in the thread were some form of trolling, I believe the misinformation espoused in the thread was done as a deliberate attempt to troll and the perpetuation of the thread was done in an effort to troll.
Quite frankly, I would suggest that one week for this is somewhat lenient considering we were dragged on for a few days and ten pages.
Quote: ontariodealernathan 1, wov mods 0
Wow, you got that from this? Please don't ever add up my chips.
