Vegas shutting down again rumor
Quote: SOOPOOOk. To determine what ‘finishing the season’ means, I’d say they are able to play the Super Bowl. That they had a season of length sufficient enough to have a playoff and then a super bowl? Sounds good, kewlj?
Agreed.
Yeah... Monday... so the casinos can have another weekend.
This is only a guess on my part... but there are no other restrictions left other than a casino shutdown.
Edited to add: the story is now in the Review Journal newspaper.
https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/politics-and-government/clark-county/clark-county-evaluating-if-more-needed-to-control-coronavirus-spread-2075855/
Quote: kewljAgreed.
Ok. We have a bet! One request I have for all these silly bets I make is that YOU remind me of it whether I win or you win! I’m older than you and more forgetful!
How hard would it be to convert the Beer Garden into an outdoor slot parlor?
Quote: billryanOther than logistics, is there a rule against outdoor slots? I don't think I've ever seen them, but casinos generally have a lot of land.
How hard would it be to convert the Beer Garden into an outdoor slot parlor?
If I recall... and it was more than five years ago... a card casino in Los Angeles had an outdoor card gaming area that only had a tent cover. It was called outdoors gaming so that smoking would be allowed.
Red Rock has blackjack tables at its pool... obviously outdoors.
Yeah... I guess slots could easily be moved outdoors BUT could the COMPUTERS operate in the heat?
Harrahs used to have gaming machines on the bar at the Carnival Court but they are long gone. I can't think of any other outdoor machines.
Quote: AlanMendelsonWith the news about a red zone, and another day of lots of new cases, and Clark County saying today the red zone report "included recommendations that could involve further closures and more restrictions" I'm going to guess that Sisolak will announce a new casino shutdown on Monday that will take effect Tuesday night at 11:59pm.
Yeah... Monday... so the casinos can have another weekend.
This is only a guess on my part... but there are no other restrictions left other than a casino shutdown.
Edited to add: the story is now in the Review Journal newspaper.
https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/politics-and-government/clark-county/clark-county-evaluating-if-more-needed-to-control-coronavirus-spread-2075855/
He could simply read them the riot act. Compliance on masks is wonderful at the tables. Even compliance from those walking around is excellent. It’s the slot players who are flaunting the spirit of the mask guideline. Before he shuts them down again...like I said, tell the casino bosses to get on these people. 1 warning and then kick them out.
Frankly I'm surprised the casinos are still open.
Quote: AlanMendelsonHere we are... and all the rumors of a new casino shutdown seem to have vanished from social media even after Vegas and Clark County report some of the highest Covid numbers (cases, hospitalizations, deaths, red zone) just in the past week. And even after the school district says online classes only.
Frankly I'm surprised the casinos are still open.
I too am surprised, Alan. Closing the casinos a second time would be a huge deal. A lot of people are still surprised about how aggressive Sisolak was the first time being that the casino industry IS the Las Vegas economy. You can't keep closing and re-opening them. I think if they close again, it might just be for a good long while (until a vaccine).
On a personal note, I wouldn't mind. At this point I am not playing and plan to re-evaluate at the end of August, and right now I am feeling like, I just am not interested in spending a lot of time in the casino environment. There is a good chance I will decide I am done for the year.
And selfishly, if the casinos were to shutdown again, I would again file for unemployment. I collected for 11 weeks from end of March until June 4 re-opening. When casinos re-opened I stopped filing even though I only briefly went back "to work". I suspect I could have re-opened my claim without much difficulty, but I am not comfortable with that. If the casinos are open, I won't claim unemployment, if they close, I will.
Some restaurants are open in Vegas with various social distancing rules. Not all the big names are. Now, here, they are limiting inside restaurant gathering to small groups. So no big birthday parties or large tables allowed any longer. Though I guess you could split your party up. Capacities limited.
Besides Red Rock, the only outside BJ game I knew used to be at the Trop at their pool but it was closed a long time ago. I guess they could reopen, but it was only one table/concrete station that I recall. Obviously this isn't going to be a revenue source for casinos without some MAJOR rebuilding.
It is NOT normal out there but I think America capitalism is resilient and adaptable. Somehow we will muddle through this until next year I bet.
9. Nevada
> Change in daily avg. new COVID-19 cases week over week: +5.2 per 100,000 people
> Avg. new daily cases for week ending July 19: 31.8 per 100,000 people -- 8th most
> Avg. new daily cases for week ending July 12: 26.6 per 100,000 people -- 6th most
> Cumulative COVID-19 cases as of July 19: 1,179 per 100,000 people -- 17th most (total: 35,765)
> Cumulative COVID-19 deaths as of July 19: 21 per 100,000 people -- 25th fewest (total: 647)
> Population: 3.0 million
> Date of first known case: March 5, 2020
Quote: MJGolfIt is NOT normal out there but I think America capitalism is resilient and adaptable. Somehow we will muddle through this until next year I bet.
I love your optimism, but I don't recommend betting on America's resilient, adaptable capitalism "muddling" through this at the level needed. Most states have performed so poorly that other countries now tell us to stay in our room -- our country -- until we clean up the coronavirus mess we made. We are the world leader in "muddling" this the wrong way.
Capitalism better "muddle" better than the coronavirus effort if it's going to get an business restarted when so much of the economy struggles. I'm noticing various grocery items temporarily unavailable, when that almost never occurred pre-pandemic. I'm also noticing EVERYTHING takes longer. Fewer healthy workers cannot perform the same amount of work and also meet the same deadlines.
Based on data I see, I think things may get a lot worse before they get better. And, they won't get better until we flatten the curve of new cases (or get a vaccine).
I'm really curious regarding Las Vegas. Since the major corporations are interdependent (an outbreak at CET doesn't really help MGM's bottom line), all in one petri dish so to speak, I doubt any bad information will leak unless something really horrendous happens. Plus you have a very conservative paper owned by one of the country's most conservative men. Plus anybody infected in LV who's an out-of-state resident doesn't go on the Nevada tallies.
What I predict you'll see is bad numbers and outbreaks being kept out of public view. The powers that be will just furlough massively, then selectively shut down some properties while trying to avoid a formal, legal shutdown. Whichever places have the most infected workers or have outbreaks will shut first, selectively, in a game of whack-a-mole.
The new infections are most widespread among the young - those of us who have always thought of themselves as immortal. They ride motorcycles, bungee jump and engage in a whole range of more dangerous activities than the rest of us, and the need for social action is far stronger than the need for social distance. This casual attitude to the risks of life, be it drugs, sex, or going bareface, are ingrained in their cultural makeup. "What, me worry" is just as apt a cry of the young as it was when Alfred E. Neuman coined the phrase.
I've heard it called "selfish" to not wear a mask. Damned right. And throughout history, the young are demographically inclined to be selfish.
Shutdowns won't work going forward any more than the fallacy of "self-quarantine". There are thirty states (30! 30!) on the list of locations where, if you have traveled through one on your way somewhere else, you MUST lock yourself away for two weeks. Who is going to do that, and who is going to be able to check that you have?
Both quarantines and lockdowns will only work if the populace as a whole is willing to go along. You cannot lock down a sidewalk or a beach or a park bench. If the local newly-empowered executive order fanatics are going to get their way, to quote my favorite policeman, Chief Brody, "We're going to need a bigger jail."
A significant percentage of the population now believes that it's okay to take items from a store without paying for them, and then... set fire to the store! These people are going to social-distance and wear a mask? If you're not worried about getting arrested, what's the chances that fear of a "civil fine" will limit your options?
The pandemic is going to run its course. And there's not a single bloody thing you or I can do about it.
https://www.rgj.com/story/news/2020/07/22/venetian-palazzo-owner-las-vegas-sands-reports-985-million-q-2-loss/5490024002/
Quote: ChumpChangeYour multi-billionaire owners could hang onto properties with a billion dollar loss each year for 10 years and it probably wouldn't even faze them, but they're greedy.
So Adelson should hold onto his properties but keep them vacant with no employees? Is that what you're suggesting?
Quote: AlanMendelsonSo Adelson should hold onto his properties but keep them vacant with no employees? Is that what you're suggesting?
I should point out that Broadway is shutdown until January (March till January with no guarantees or date set)
Movie theaters, casinos and stadiums in NYS as well.
It can be done because it is being done.
Quote: darkozI should point out that Broadway is shutdown until January (March till January with no guarantees or date set)
Movie theaters, casinos and stadiums in NYS as well.
It can be done because it is being done.
Are you saying that the owners of these businesses are still paying all of the employees? If so, I didnt know that.
What I do know is that the unemployment rates in both New York and Los Angeles are 19% and in Vegas it's now 18%.
Quote: AlanMendelsonAre you saying that the owners of these businesses are still paying all of the employees? If so, I didnt know that.
What I do know is that the unemployment rates in both New York and Los Angeles are 19% and in Vegas it's now 18%.
I wasn't saying that. I was saying that businesses here are shuttered with no employees.
You asked if that's what Adelson should do. I was pointing out it's being done where necessary.
But beyond that, yes, at least casinos have been paying all their employees, although they have just last week decided to change that. They sent out the notices.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.recordonline.com/amp/5425131002
Quote: darkozI wasn't saying that. I was saying that businesses here are shuttered with no employees.
You asked if that's what Adelson should do. I was pointing out it's being done where necessary.
But beyond that, yes, at least casinos have been paying all their employees, although they have just last week decided to change that. They sent out the notices.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.recordonline.com/amp/5425131002
So what good does it do for the community and for the thousands of laid off workers if Las Vegas Sands shuts down? And if Cosmo shuts down? And Tropicana and Circus Circus shut down?
Yeah... companies can shut their casinos. But that's not what was being asked.
What was being asked is why dont casino companies keep paying everyone while they're shut down?
Quote: AlanMendelsonSo what good does it do for the community and for the thousands of laid off workers if Las Vegas Sands shuts down? And if Cosmo shuts down? And Tropicana and Circus Circus shut down?
Yeah... companies can shut their casinos. But that's not what was being asked.
What was being asked is why dont casino companies keep paying everyone while they're shut down?
What good does it to for the community if they remain open and Infection rises and many more are hospitalized?
It's a lesser of two evils situation
Feel free to guess the casino.
Quote: kewljHere is a pic I took at about noon (not a crowded time) of a craps game at a sort of local casino in Vegas. 11 players! 2 without masks.
Feel free to guess the casino.
You actually found a casino in Nevada violating the rule of having more than three players per side?
Quote: kewljHere is a pic I took at about noon (not a crowded time) of a craps game at a sort of local casino in Vegas. 11 players! 2 without masks.
Feel free to guess the casino.
You need a third party hosting site to host the picture (e.g. Imgur).
This site has no picture hosting capability afaik.
Quote: AlanMendelson
You actually found a casino in Nevada violating the rule of having more than three players per side?
Do I detect a note of sarcasm? I am sure there are many. I don't even play craps (don't play anything right now except collect free play) so it is not like I am looking for it. Just stumbled upon this pretty blatant violation.
It was Silverton by the way and zero plastic dividers on blackjack and other games. What happened to THAT? Remember how everyone was going to have these plastic dividers? Lol.
Complacency. That was my point. And if it ends with a second shutdown, casinos (and players) have only themselves to blame.
Quote: kewljDo I detect a note of sarcasm? I am sure there are many. I don't even play craps (don't play anything right now except collect free play) so it is not like I am looking for it. Just stumbled upon this pretty blatant violation.
It was Silverton by the way and zero plastic dividers on blackjack and other games. What happened to THAT? Remember how everyone was going to have these plastic dividers? Lol.
Complacency. That was my point. And if it ends with a second shutdown, casinos (and players) have only themselves to blame.
No sarcasm at all. That casino should be reported to the NGC.
I reported Red Rock to the NGC and in less than half an hour a NGC rep was at Red Rock telling them to obey the law or else. The dealers thanked me; they didnt want to work under those conditions. And I didnt want to play under those conditions.
This was my post on Facebook:
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=184890606302845&id=100043457211637
Quote: kewljDo I detect a note of sarcasm? I am sure there are many. I don't even play craps (don't play anything right now except collect free play) so it is not like I am looking for it. Just stumbled upon this pretty blatant violation.
It was Silverton by the way and zero plastic dividers on blackjack and other games. What happened to THAT? Remember how everyone was going to have these plastic dividers? Lol.
Complacency. That was my point. And if it ends with a second shutdown, casinos (and players) have only themselves to blame.
Plastic dividers were a supply/demand problem. After Bellagio installed them...other casinos suddenly starting contacting vendors “we want those tomorrow”.
They were told no chance. Get in line.
Quote: AlanMendelsonNo sarcasm at all. That casino should be reported to the NGC.
I reported Red Rock to the NGC and in less than half an hour a NGC rep was at Red Rock telling them to obey the law or else. The dealers thanked me; they didnt want to work under those conditions. And I didnt want to play under those conditions.
This was my post on Facebook:
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=184890606302845&id=100043457211637
I don’t actually know what the guideline is for having your mask off while smoking or drinking at slots...but my first couple visits to Red Rock were LOTS of people with the mask on their chin or ear NOT actively smoking or drinking. No one was saying a word.
Now, yesterday at Red a Rock I saw a lady admonished twice for having her mask down. She simply had a drink with her at the slots.
I’m still not sure what the mask interpretation is on the casino floor. Is it supposed to be “mask down, sip or puff, mask up”....or is having a drink or cig/pack/ashtray nearby you enough to leave the mask off?
My guess is the GCB and Sisolak have intentionally left the guideline vague and ambiguous so as not to offend or impede those partaking in a vice.
If you make guidelines ambiguous or open to interpretation...there’s going to be a LOT of abusers of those guidelines.
Second, now at Red Rock if you're at a table game and you want to drink or smoke you must move away from the table. Move. Six feet. Don't like it? Then leave.
I avoid slots because there really is no enforcement of the rules.
Quote: AlanMendelsonFirst, my call to the NGC was because Red Rock had too many players and too many gawkers at the table. Masks weren't even mandated yet.
Second, now at Red Rock if you're at a table game and you want to drink or smoke you must move away from the table. Move. Six feet. Don't like it? Then leave.
I avoid slots because there really is no enforcement of the rules.
My understanding the table rule of stepping back 6 feet was for smoking....drinking as well?
I thought you could merely pull down the mask, sip and pull it up while still staying seated?
Mask rules are useless if they are enforced at the tables but ignored elsewhere...especially as it relates to the health and safety of 100’s of people within a room or area.
Quote: TDVegasMy understanding the table rule of stepping back 6 feet was for smoking....drinking as well?
I thought you could merely pull down the mask, sip and pull it up while still staying seated?
Mask rules are useless if they are enforced at the tables but ignored elsewhere...especially as it relates to the health and safety of 100’s of people within a room or area.
The rule is mouth and nose must be covered. So if you want to take a drink move back.
Hostesses deliver drinks to the table but you can't stand at the table uncovered.
The difference at the tables is that you have dealers to protect. At slots, who do you protect? Also no sitting side by side either.
Quote: AlanMendelsonThe rule is mouth and nose must be covered. So if you want to take a drink move back.
Hostesses deliver drinks to the table but you can't stand at the table uncovered.
Cocktail waitresses must be suffering there if customers must get up and step back to take a sip. I would do without a drink. Realistically, the only time to drink is during a shuffle.
Quote: AlanMendelson
Hostesses deliver drinks to the table but you can't stand at the table uncovered.
The difference at the tables is that you have dealers to protect. At slots, who do you protect? Also no sitting side by side either. [/q
Places are using the social distancing to stop anyone from watching play. Makes backcounting very difficult.
Slot machine social distancing is somewhat of a farce as every other chair may be removed but players just move chairs where they want. Only the ones that truly shut off every other slot machine are doing anything resembling social distancing on slots.
Quote: TDVegasCocktail waitresses must be suffering there if customers must get up and step back to take a sip. I would do without a drink. Realistically, the only time to drink is during a shuffle.
Because the walk up bars are closed...………...at least the vast majority of them (unless serving food), the cocktail waitresses are actually doing better per a friend of mine who is one. They are busier because these bars are closed. HOWEVER Vegas is turning into a weekend town at the moment. Mostly drivein traffic it appears. And these tend to be younger; less affluent kids who want to party and do NOT tip as well as the normal Vegas crowd. Until interstate air traffic gets back to normal for Vegas, it's really not the same and kind of a moving target or experience. At least so far...………...
As soon as the Governor announced cutting hotel and casino occupancy to no more than 50% half of the dealers, floor people, techs, cocktail servers and hotel staff lost their jobs.
At Red Rock there aren't floor supervisors at every craps table anymore. Now one floor person might supervise two tables or even three.
Quote: AlanMendelsonWhy this interest in lost business for cocktail waitresses?
As soon as the Governor announced cutting hotel and casino occupancy to no more than 50% half of the dealers, floor people, techs, cocktail servers and hotel staff lost their jobs.
At Red Rock there aren't floor supervisors at every craps table anymore. Now one floor person might supervise two tables or even three.
From a purely Karmic viewpoint:
My team has been shutdown many times through the years. Every one of my team members knows that any play we do can suddenly come to a grinding screeching halt when casino staffs suddenly become aware of our (legal but advantageous) actions.
Throughout this shutdown my team all noted what total wimps the casinos were when the shoe was on the other foot.
WHEN THEY HAD THEIR BUSINESS SHUT DOWN IN A GRINDING SCREECHING HALT
They got s taste of their own bitter medicine.
Karma is a Beach!
Quote: caralarmDid any casinos go out of business from the coronavirus shutdowns?
Wasn't there a casino in Laughlin that closed permanently? And another in Tahoe?
Since most of the casinos in Vegas are group owned (maybe all of them are?) it's hard to point a finger at a closed casino and say it's out of business.
Quote: AlanMendelsonWasn't there a casino in Laughlin that closed permanently? And another in Tahoe?
Since most of the casinos in Vegas are group owned (maybe all of them are?) it's hard to point a finger at a closed casino and say it's out of business.
Yeah Harrahs Reno called it quits.
Quote: caralarmDid any casinos go out of business from the coronavirus shutdowns?
Yes.
How about restaurants? 60% that were closed from the forced shutdown...have closed permanently. Wow.
“As of July 10, Yelp found 26,160 total restaurant closures, an increase of 2,179 since June 15. Of all the closed restaurants in July, 15,770 have permanently closed (60%).“
Quote: caralarmDid any casinos go out of business from the coronavirus shutdowns?
No casinos that I am aware of announced and went out of business. But a number have yet to open and are rumored to be for sale or not re-opening in their current form.
Specifically, Stations owned casinos Palms, Texas Station and the 2 Fiestas (Rancho and Henderson) have not opened, with all rumored to be for sale or in various stages of agreements with new owners. MGM owned Excalibur and Luxor are rumored to be going to be knocked down with some new themed casino or casinos replacing them.
Quote: kewljNo casinos that I am aware of announced and went out of business. But a number have yet to open and are rumored to be for sale or not re-opening in their current form.
Specifically, Stations owned casinos Palms, Texas Station and the 2 Fiestas (Rancho and Henderson) have not opened, with all rumored to be for sale or in various stages of agreements with new owners. MGM owned Excalibur and Luxor are rumored to be going to be knocked down with some new themed casino or casinos replacing them.
https://www.theunion.com/news/lakeside-inn-and-casino-in-south-lake-tahoe-to-close-permanently/
Quote: kewljI am sorry, TDVegas, I am aware Lakeside and a few others closed. I should have preference my remarks with that I was referring only to Las Vegas, where I live and play (mostly). I sometimes tend to forget that there is a world beyond the paradise that is Las Vegas. My bad.
While I am only aware of 2 that have closed...there is little question that there is a world of hurt going around Vegas casinos. Right now and for the foreseeable future....my guess is they are all bleeding cash here in Vegas. The business model under current capacity limits, no international air travel, no shows, no clubs, no concerts and other restrictions...is not workable.
They haven’t shuttered because they have the capital to stay open and don’t want to fire everyone and lose them forever. Closing means letting employees go....which is what all 4 Station properties did. All those employees have been effectively fired, not furloughed. Any re-open on those properties basically starts them from scratch on the hiring process.
I live in Vegas as well...and from a business perspective, Vegas is anything but a “paradise” right now and the foreseeable future. It’s a terrible situation. How long they can continue to operate under these conditions remains to be seen. I suspect as this drags on...more could close permanently until a buyer is found for the property. My guess is that is what is happening with Fiesta, Texas and Palms, looking for an exit sale.
I’m all for honesty...and I commend this Sands COO for telling it like it is here.
https://www.rgj.com/story/news/2020/07/22/venetian-palazzo-owner-las-vegas-sands-reports-985-million-q-2-loss/5490024002/
