Sorry, you've been overcomped
UgHHHHH
anyone experience this?
Quote: IbeatyouracesThey pulled that "computer error" earlier this summer at MGM Detroit. They're full of $#!&.
Hmmmm, so this is sounding more and more like an MLIFE problem, not an AoS problem (although, ultimately, an MLIFE problem is an AoS problem as it directly affects me) — perhaps time to ramp up my Total Rewards play?
But, the thing is, so what if the computer made an error? Now, I pay for it even though I am a higher tier and playing more now than I did back then? That is not the way to keep loyal players…is it? Maybe it's voodoo economics?
Quote: aceofspades...perhaps time to ramp up my Total Rewards play?
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote: IbeatyouracesNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK, so if MLIFE is out and TotalRewards is out - where…?
Quote: aceofspadesOK, so if MLIFE is out and TotalRewards is out - where…?
Play to win!! Comps are last fiddle.
Quote: IbeatyouracesIn our case, it was everyone that got more express comps and points that they were supposed to. I track my play and found it to be a lie.
and express comps for table players are going the way of the dodo bird on 12/15/2015
Your comps sound very "comparable" to my comps, except mine seem slightly better in some areas. Though nobody's ever sent me $5000 in freeplay, as they did for you last year. Which doesn't make a lot of sense to me, because I'm mostly a red-chip or table minimum player, though I play very long hours compared to you. I average 10 or so hours a day on a gambling trip, and when I'm someplace for some other reason and want a rating, I still give them 3-4 hours/day.
My impression on your past trip reports was that you're not putting in enough consistent time, but also you're working with people (mlife, fox/MS) who are not that generous with RFB. Having said that, I'm also seeing the value of my LV offers go down, though non-LV properties are holding well. You go to the high-profile joints, I go to the middle-tier properties; they may well comp better at lower tier and independent properties than at their top titles. Sands and mlife properties have almost nothing for me, but the others are decent with comps.
Quote: AoS's reply
WHOA WHOA WHOA stop the presses - nobody gave me 5k in FSP -- I earned 1 spin on an MLIFE bonus wheel prize and 5k happened to come up - that was pure luck and unearned
well I was in Vegas in June this year but that was not a reported trip as I had had enough of the Bacc79 drama by then--in the three days I was at an MLIFE property on hat trip I earned ~100k tier points and became a Platinum cardholder -- I most certainly put in 3-5 hours per day $100min.
Once I hit Platinum my offers decreased - when I spoke with a host they informed me that in the past I had been "overcomped" and I was now going to be "undercomped" -- so I asked how could I have been "overcomped" if all I ever did was book the offers contained in my mailers and never had a host per se? They said "maybe the computer made an error"
UGHHHHH!
I never understood where the 5K came from, so thanks for clearing that up. I've never had more than the most general understanding of the mlife comp system, but I've given them several shots at me with heavy Vegas play that would comp well in other systems, and they pretty much ignore me, except for offering to fly me into Beau Rivage several times a year. I think it must be geographic marketing, with them trying to take you to Vegas and me (in Florida) being pushed to Biloxi, but I'm not interested in driving 3 hours, waiting 90 minutes to get wheels-up, flying for 90 minutes, offloading and driving another hour to the property. In another hour or so, I could have driven myself there and had a car to work with on-site. Or I can take their invitation-only Motorcoach, which adds 3-4 hours to the drive (I GO, bay-bee). Bleah either way.
I don't know if you've done anything with the Cosmopolitan, but they started out very well with me. Their property and amenities stack up well against any mlife property, better than most. OTOH, I read somewhere (hmmm, where was it? lol) that they've stopped rating your table play. Haven't confirmed that for myself.
Quote: beachbumbabs(post moved at AoS request)
Your comps sound very "comparable" to my comps, except mine seem slightly better in some areas. Though nobody's ever sent me $5000 in freeplay, as they did for you last year. Which doesn't make a lot of sense to me, because I'm mostly a red-chip or table minimum player, though I play very long hours compared to you. I average 10 or so hours a day on a gambling trip, and when I'm someplace for some other reason and want a rating, I still give them 3-4 hours/day.
My impression on your past trip reports was that you're not putting in enough consistent time, but also you're working with people (mlife, fox/MS) who are not that generous with RFB. Having said that, I'm also seeing the value of my LV offers go down, though non-LV properties are holding well. You go to the high-profile joints, I go to the middle-tier properties; they may well comp better at lower tier and independent properties than at their top titles. Sands and mlife properties have almost nothing for me, but the others are decent with comps.
BBB - what are the middle-tier properties? Should I assume then that you believe the Aria (a staple in my casino rotation) is a "high-profile" joint?
what would you say the differences are in your high and middle rankings and comps therein?
Quote: aceofspadesand express comps for table players are going the way of the dodo bird on 12/15/2015
Right but this from vp. MGM Detroit is $8 for 1 point and 2¢ express comps playing vp. I was pearl at the time so I got the 10% extra. It's very easy to track this. I had over $100 in comps completely wiped out and about 300 points. This happened to a great majority of players. They blamed a computer error. From my records, I had exactly what I was supposed to have so they're full of it.
Quote: IbeatyouracesRight but this from vp. MGM Detroit is $8 for 1 point and 2¢ express comps playing vp. I was pearl at the time so I got the 10% extra. It's very easy to track this. I had over $100 in comps completely wiped out and about 300 points. This happened to a great majority of players. They blamed a computer error. From my records, I had exactly what I was supposed to have so they're full of it.
amazing!
I am still at a loss as to how/why, even if I was "overcomped" that they would now "undercomp" me? retaliation? want me to take my business elsewhere? they hate when I punch the table on a bad beat? lol
Quote: aceofspadesBBB - what are the middle-tier properties? Should I assume then that you believe the Aria (a staple in my casino rotation) is a "high-profile" joint?
what would you say the differences are in your high and middle rankings and comps therein?
My personal list on the Strip: (note: "overrated" means they think more of themselves than I do; "underrated" means they're better than their reputation as I understand it. All roughly ranked within their tier.)
Top-tier:
Bellagio (drawback; snotty dealers)
Cosmopolitan
Wynn/Encore
Aria
Venetian/Palazzo (overrated)
Caesar (overrated except Nobu)
MGM (way overrated unless you get skylofted or mansioned)
Mirage (slightly underrated - I like them but they've let it slide a little)
Mid-tier:
Paris (underrated - my personal favorite)
Mandalay Bay
Planet Hollywood (overrated)
Monte Carlo
Treasure Island
Cromwell (underrated)
Good-tier:
Harrah's (underrated)
Tropicana (recently upgraded from bottom-tier)
Bally's (slightly overrated)
Palms (recently down from middle-tier but still decent)
SLS (haven't stayed there but at least good, may be mid)
NYNY (inconsistent but ok)
Flamingo (slightly overrated)
Bottom-tier:
Linq (upgraded from never-again as IP)
Rio (underrating them, but I don't like that property)
Gold Coast
Ellis Island
Tuscany
Stratosphere
Circus Circus
Excaliber
Never-again:
Golden Nugget (sad to tell: 20 years ago I loved them)
Westgate (stayed there often as the Hilton, but Siegel will never have a dime of mine)
Haven't tried to stay there so can't rate:
Any Boyd properties (Stations - there are several; Orleans)
Anything on Boulder Highway
Red Rock (in Summerlin; beautiful property but a long way away)
Any I didn't mention and most of Downtown.
Also liked:
The D (downtown) - good tier
All JMHO. Anybody who works at one of these properties and wants to discuss their rating, I'd be happy to reply. PM preferred.
Quote: beachbumbabsMy personal list on the Strip: (note: "overrated" means they think more of themselves than I do; "underrated" means they're better than their reputation as I understand it. All roughly ranked within their tier.)
Top-tier:
Bellagio (drawback; snotty dealers)
Cosmopolitan
Wynn/Encore
Aria
Venetian/Palazzo (overrated)
Caesar (overrated except Nobu)
MGM (way overrated unless you get skylofted or mansioned)
Mirage (slightly underrated - I like them but they've let it slide a little)
Mid-tier:
Paris (underrated - my personal favorite)
Mandalay Bay
Planet Hollywood (overrated)
Monte Carlo
Treasure Island
Cromwell (underrated)
Good-tier:
Harrah's (underrated)
Tropicana (recently upgraded from bottom-tier)
Bally's (slightly overrated)
Palms (recently down from middle-tier but still decent)
SLS (haven't stayed there but at least good, may be mid)
NYNY (inconsistent but ok)
Bottom-tier:
Linq (upgraded from never-again as IP)
Rio (underrating them, but I don't like that property)
Gold Coast
Ellis Island
Tuscany
Stratosphere
Circus Circus
Excaliber
Never-again:
Golden Nugget (sad to tell: 20 years ago I loved them)
Haven't tried to stay there so can't rate:
Any Boyd properties (Stations - there are several; Orleans)
Anything on Boulder Highway
Red Rock (in Summerlin; beautiful property but a long way away)
Any I didn't mention and most of Downtown.
Also liked:
The D (downtown) - good tier
All JMHO. Anybody who works at one of these properties and wants to discuss their rating, I'd be happy to reply. PM preferred.
aww why via PM - would love to be part of the discussion (unless you do not wish to share)
what did you like/dislike about Paris? are you Diamond? 7stars?
Attitude of the employees working there. I like polite, enthusiastic, smiling service and genuinely nice people.
Location (layout of property relative to size, convenient to casino/parking/rest of strip/monorail)
Amenities (restaurant hours of operation, selection, valet parking, quality of swimming pool and its hours, non-gaming attractions on-site)
Comps (rates/ease of use/players' club and host attitudes)
Games on-site (table minimums, dealer competency and attitude, selection of carnival games)
Room amenities (size, good elevator distribution, bathroom quality, cleanliness, in-room conveniences)
Predominantly customers I'm comfortable around travelling alone.
Quote: beachbumbabsRating criteria in rough order of importance:
Attitude of the employees working there. I like polite, enthusiastic, smiling service and genuinely nice people.
Location (layout of property relative to size, convenient to casino/parking/rest of strip/monorail)
Amenities (restaurant hours of operation, selection, valet parking, quality of swimming pool and its hours, non-gaming attractions on-site)
Comps (rates/ease of use/players' club and host attitudes)
Games on-site (table minimums, dealer competency and attitude, selection of carnival games)
Room amenities (size, good elevator distribution, bathroom quality, cleanliness, in-room conveniences)
Predominantly customers I'm comfortable around travelling alone.
I've never been a big amenities guy - need a nice clean well appointed room and I'm good - never use the pool or gym (maybe I should?)
Quote: aceofspadesaww why via PM - would love to be part of the discussion (unless you do not wish to share)
what did you like/dislike about Paris? are you Diamond? 7stars?
I meant that for Casino/Resort employees.
Paris pros in no particular order (I'm Diamond for several years now):
Beautiful property, with the sky of Paris overhead in the casino, nice mix of games.
Even basic rooms have great beds, spacious and well decorated rooms, wonderful bathrooms.
Central core of elevators segregated by floors; rooms star out in 5 directions from the elevators, just off casino.
Eiffel tower is fun inside, and the bar on top is great.
Several very good restaurants, though there are 2 I don't like, but choices are around a dozen including a French bakery.
VIP services are extremely prompt and friendly, and they've never said no.
Diamond lounge is good to very good, depending on the night (free food, good selection) and very convenient.
Valet parking is excellent and free.
Central to the Strip but easily reached from behind and from the airport.
Decent minimums on most games, but can accommodate large bets as well.
Mostly excellent dealers with a couple notable exceptions, generally as friendly as you want them to be, but fast and competent.
I always get the room I want, and never get charged for resort fees or wifi or whatever else.
Nice pool, decent exercise area, good business office.
Paris cons in no particular order:
Recently changed their Sugar Shack to something else not nearly as good. I didn't eat their sweets, but they had amazing sandwiches and salads. Now, I don't even know. But I met several from here last year and they were in transition to the new people; might be the worst meal I ever had in Vegas.
Gordon Ramsay steakhouse over-rated, over-noisy, over-full-of-themselves.
I usually lose there and win everywhere else. lol...
Really loud Moulin Rouge (party pit) entrance every night. Fun to watch but the police whistles and noise they make makes my skull vibrate with pain. (It's a lot of hard surfaces, including the plaster ceiling, so it echoes horribly.)
All pretty minor cons.
Quote: aceofspadesI've never been a big amenities guy - need a nice clean well appointed room and I'm good
ace - have you played at Mt Airy or Sands PA?
My understanding is that the PA BJ game is among the best offered,
and at least an hour closer to NYC than CT or AC.
The rooms at both are virtually brand new...nice, clean & well appointed.
Quote: coachbellyace - have you played at Mt Airy or Sands PA?
My understanding is that the PA BJ game is among the best offered,
and at least an hour closer to NYC than CT or AC.
The rooms at both are virtually brand new...nice, clean & well appointed.
I have not played at either - the thing about playing at places I've never played before are the hosts do not know me and therefore the room cost will be out of pocket (wow I just re-read that and realize how cheap I sound lol)
From what I know of you, I really think you would like the Cosmopolitan best of all.
However, no idea what their BJ is like; ask the experts on that.
They definitely have the best vibe, spotlessly clean, hottest women walking around, several great clubs/restaurants, and even a base room is a studio apartment with fantastic bathrooms and amazing amenities, including a walk-out balcony with chairs. Did I mention the hottest women? There is no comparison that I've seen. Beautiful property.
Edit: Well, I've seen an MGM skyloft. But that's a whole other thing. The guy that had it was betting 1K-5K/hand BJ, sometimes more. Won 70K one month, went back and dropped 120K the next. That kind of guy.
Quote: beachbumbabsAoS,
From what I know of you, I really think you would like the Cosmopolitan best of all.
However, no idea what their BJ is like; ask the experts on that.
They definitely have the best vibe, spotlessly clean, hottest women walking around, several great clubs/restaurants, and even a base room is a studio apartment with fantastic bathrooms and amazing amenities, including a walk-out balcony with chairs. Did I mention the hottest women? There is no comparison that I've seen. Beautiful property.
Edit: Well, I've seen an MGM skyloft. But that's a whole other thing. The guy that had it was betting 1K-5K/hand BJ, sometimes more. Won 70K one month, went back and dropped 120K the next. That kind of guy.
BBB do you have a contact for Cosmo?
I've heard they have a secret pizza place--is that true?
you know me I love those nightclubs and can't stop hitting on women on my trips :eye roll:
what is the difference between the skyloft and mansion?
Quote: aceofspadesroom cost will be out of pocket (wow I just re-read that and realize how cheap I sound lol)
Yes...if you are playing black chip blackjack, the cost of the room should not be a big deal.
You are betting more than the cost of the room every 30 seconds.
You are playing BJ to win money...consider the rules, and the proximity to home.
You can take a day trip to PA...hit and run.
Quote: aceofspadesBBB do you have a contact for Cosmo?
I've heard they have a secret pizza place--is that true?
you know me I love those nightclubs and can't stop hitting on women on my trips :eye roll:
what is the difference between the skyloft and mansion?
I have a card with a code on it. I think if you give them the code and tell them you're a Diamond/7star whatever on a referral they'd comp you a couple nights just to get to know you. I'll PM them.
Re: pizza. I've heard the rumor, haven't found one, but the Wizard did a lot of wandering around the place for his report; he may know.
Tell me you don't enjoy eye candy. I don't see you hitting on them, but there's a lot to look at. And yet the place is not vulgar; they make you feel exclusive and part of something, like the whole place is high-roller, but not snotty about it. They're very good at it.
The MGM Skylofts are 2 story high-roller suites with 1 or more br's, a personal valet on duty, private breakfast w/ servers, amazing view, private swimming pools in some, private Jacuzzis in others, private patio.
The Mansions are nicer; detached bungalows behind the MGM with private pools, full-time servants, everything you can think of.
I have a card with a code on it. I think if you give them the code and tell them you're a Diamond/7star whatever on a referral they'd comp you a couple nights just to get to know you. I'll PM them.
Ok, just talked to them. My offer is not transferable. However, you can call the property at 877-893-2076 and ask to speak to a host. They might be able to provide something in advance of your play on an individual basis, but generally they start you as a regular guest and then you ask them to review your play and see what they can do.
Or do what I did. Stay at your regular place, go over and sign up for their card, and give them about 8 hours of play all in 1 day. Ask to be rated on it just in case they're doing something weird about table games like the rumor says. Maybe check in with a host before you leave; I would guess at your usual bet level, you'll get one. Then give them a month and you'll start to see purple envelopes with nice offers for rooms and freeplay in them in the mail, and free concert tickets and stuff in your email. (The room offers seem to only come by snail mail.)
in another thread. 'You're not an AP if
your biggest worry in life is comps.'
Never had a players card, never will.
I like BBB and Ace, but life is too short
to worry about the small stuff.
Of course, free meals and lodging when going to Las Vegas is also a plus.
That's when comps come in handy, to help keep the total costs down.
I really don't shape my play in any way to secure comps, so to me it makes sense to play with a player's card and take advantage of all the complimentaries which the casino deems fit to offer.
Quote: EvenBobThis thread has inspired me for a post
in another thread. 'You're not an AP if
your biggest worry in life is comps.'
Never had a players card, never will.
I like BBB and Ace, but life is too short
to worry about the small stuff.
Bob - I won't speak for BBB, but for me, comps equal convenience -- i.e. I don't have to worry about how much a room will cost, thus freeing me up to choose the trip dates that work for me.
Quote: EvenBobThis thread has inspired me for a post
in another thread. 'You're not an AP if
your biggest worry in life is comps.'
Never had a players card, never will.
I like BBB and Ace, but life is too short
to worry about the small stuff.
Comps have huge value for recreational APs.
Everyone focuses on the pomp and circumstance and not on the watered down rum.
I think we need to have a Florida to Biloxi car pool. gamble together on the final day perhaps but otherwise just a cheaufered trip and gas pooling... and we all make use of our Regional Comps because that is what casinos really want to do...draw in the "less likely to show up" players.
Everywhere comps are being 'trimmed' or else 'computers have the same flu'. Top and middle tier places can be great, otherwise its all early bird stuff or "drawing day" stuff. And the administrative kinks are often making it hell anyway.
The Seminoles are not generous. I have a friend from California who will soon visit and I'd love to trek all the way to Fort Liqourdale for better comps but he doesn't gamble all that much and his wife will probably enjoy the nearby Craps Voyage far more than a lengthy drive in the hot sun.
I disagree. You can still get a good BJ game with good rules (S17, RSA, LS, DAS) at the Caesars Strip casinos. I would try and get in touch with a host at a property you like on the east side of the Strip. I like Paris and Planet Hollywood.Quote: aceofspadesOK, so if MLIFE is out and TotalRewards is out - where…?
I generally have nothing bad to say about CET. They've never tried to screw me and run their promotions really well.
Quote: EvenBobThis thread has inspired me for a post
in another thread. 'You're not an AP if
your biggest worry in life is comps.'
Never had a players card, never will.
I like BBB and Ace, but life is too short
to worry about the small stuff.
Comping is the only reason I'd go. I eat food I normally wouldn't pay to eat. I see shows I normally wouldn't pay to see. I stay in rooms I normally wouldn't pay to stay. I also can bring my close friends and family to enjoy with me. If I can have that at the cost of a casino getting a shot at my bankroll, I'm good with it. I guess it's different for me because I'm not an AP.
Quote: EvenBobThis thread has inspired me for a post
in another thread. 'You're not an AP if
your biggest worry in life is comps.'
Never had a players card, never will.
I like BBB and Ace, but life is too short
to worry about the small stuff.
Exactly why I said "play to win, comps are LAST fiddle."
Wait, I want to know too. This should be public information. At least to members.Quote: aceofspadesaww why via PM - would love to be part of the discussion (unless you do not wish to share)
what did you like/dislike about Paris? are you Diamond? 7stars?
Quote: speedycrapWait, I want to know too. This should be public information. At least to members.
Sssshhhh!
There are people listening ;-)
Quote: AxelWolfExcuse me if someone has already mentioned this(I didn't feel like reading everything) There's a possibility somehow you got pegged as a good player or card counter.
well I think for MLIFE casinos I am way down lifetime
They can have huge value for all AP's. Especially when traveling.Quote: sabreComps have huge value for recreational APs.
Rooms are usually $100 to $240 a night. if you're away for 3 to 7 days and you can get that comped off 4 times a year that's huge. Imagine 2 weeks in AC having to pay for rooms.
Generally comped rooms are nicer.
Let's not forget the free meals. If you're playing something that's +EV already that's all 100% savings.
--------------------------------------------------------
Friends and family love Las Vegas. Getting them suits, show tickets and nice meals makes it affordable and fun for them. They save a significant amount if you can get it comped. The can Doing things they normally wouldn't do. It's a good feeling to be able to get that stuff for them at no cost to anyone. They would feel guilty if you were paying. The savings is great but being able to do that for them is priceless.
Quote: AxelWolfThey can have huge value for all AP's. Especially when traveling.
Rooms are usually $100 to $240 a night. if you're away for 3 to 7 days and you can get that comped off 4 times a year that's huge. Imagine 2 weeks in AC having to pay for rooms.
Generally comped rooms are nicer.
Let's not forget the free meals. If you're playing something that's +EV already that's all 100% savings.
--------------------------------------------------------
Friends and family love Las Vegas. Getting them suits, show tickets and nice meals makes it affordable and fun for them. They save a significant amount if you can get it comped. The can Doing things they normally wouldn't do. It's a good feeling to be able to get that stuff for them at no cost to anyone. They would feel guilty if you were paying. The savings is great but being able to do that for them is priceless.
salient points Axel
Quote: IbeatyouracesOne of the worst things an AP cash have happen is for security to barge in at 3:30am and evict you. Serious high level AP's should not play where they stay!
somehow I don't think anyone will be barging into my room for all of my "AP" winnings lol
Quote: aceofspadessomehow I don't think anyone will be barging into my room for all of my "AP" winnings lol
It wasn't directed at you but something to be weary of, winning or losing.
Quote: IbeatyouracesIt wasn't directed at you but something to be weary of, winning or losing.
duly noted and agreed
Quote: IbeatyouracesExactly why I said "play to win, comps are LAST fiddle."
I don't play long enough to get comps.
In and out is my rule, if I play an hour
that's a really long time. Nobody
comps for 30 min of play.
Maybe coffee shop.
And I understanding that. Unfortunately all it takes is one pit boss to think you're to strong of a player and a note in the computer.Quote: aceofspadeswell I think for MLIFE casinos I am way down lifetime
I don't know what speed counting adds to YOUR game or how religious you are doing it and employing correct strategy. Its to my understanding that under good conditions and perfect computer play there's up to a 1% advantage *rolls eyes*.
Do you know if you should be breaking even or actually have a slight advantage?
If you're certain that you're at least a break even player then think back at all the rooms, limos, food, invites etc. Add it all up and yes you are being over comped.
I'm not sure if you mentioned how much you're up or down lifetime since you started SC.
What's you're estimate on the amount of comps you've received?
Since everyone enjoys and appreciates your trip reports, perhaps you should keep a log of all the comps and extras you get and give a tally at the end.
It's hard to put a price on entertainment and enjoying life. You appear to be blessed with a good life. Meanwhile guys are struggling just to make rent. Don't ever forget that.
Quote: AxelWolf
It's hard to put a price on entertainment and enjoying life. You appear to be blessed with a good life. Meanwhile guys are struggling just to make rent. Don't ever forget that.
I wanted to re-post that statement.
I wanted to think about it some more.
Thanksgiving is coming up.
If you read this, you probably have a reason to give thanks for what you have.
