VP question
As I posted in my thread about my latest visit to Tunica I actually found UX to be enjoyable. I have play a little single line VP and I just don't enjoy it that much. I know playing UX at 10x isn't the greatest return but it's got to beat most, if not all, slots. I've searched for a long time to find something I really enjoyed outside of table games and I think this is it.
I've been playing Wizard's VP iPhone app and making a lot more errors than I realized. I was thinking about this and wondering what most think is a acceptable rate of play.
There's absolutely no reason you shouldn't know the strategy 100%.Quote: Mikey75At what rate should your % of correct play be to be considered acceptable for JOB? Also the strategy wouldn't be any different on multi line machines than single line would it?
As I posted in my thread about my latest visit to Tunica I actually found UX to be enjoyable. I have play a little single line VP and I just don't enjoy it that much. I know playing UX at 10x isn't the greatest return but it's got to beat most, if not all, slots. I've searched for a long time to find something I really enjoyed outside of table games and I think this is it.
I've been playing Wizard's VP iPhone app and making a lot more errors than I realized. I was thinking about this and wondering what most think is a acceptable rate of play.
But even if you know it 100% sometimes you'll miss stuff while actually playing, especially if you're cranking out hads fast.
If you're making an occasional small mistake then it's probably fine, especially when it comes to penalty card hands or something like QK9 SS.
Quote: Mikey75At what rate should your % of correct play be to be considered acceptable for JOB?
All mistakes are not created equal.
If I'm giving up less than a tenth of a percent in return over time, I can live with it. Not happy about it, but can live with it. And that's a game I know "cold". When playing progressives with a constantly moving target, I accept more error.
By the way, JoB should be considered a very easy game to play perfect, with only six strategy adjustments for advanced strat. Assuming it's 9-6, of course. Change the flush pay from 6 to 5 and it's more difficult. Try learning 8-5 Bonus Poker perfectly, that's a challenge.
I have a personal solution to this problem, I try not to play anything that needs to be played optimal in order to have an advantage, unless i'm just messing around for a bit. In that case it's not going to amount to much. It's next to impossible to learn every new game cold and remember old ones you rarely play.Quote: bobbartopAll mistakes are not created equal.
If I'm giving up less than a tenth of a percent in return over time, I can live with it. Not happy about it, but can live with it. And that's a game I know "cold". When playing progressives with a constantly moving target, I accept more error.
By the way, JoB should be considered a very easy game to play perfect, with only six strategy adjustments for advanced strat. Assuming it's 9-6, of course. Change the flush pay from 6 to 5 and it's more difficult. Try learning 8-5 Bonus Poker perfectly, that's a challenge.
Quote: AxelWolfI have a personal solution to this problem, I try not to play anything that needs to be played optional in order to have an advantage, unless i'm just messing around for a bit. In that case it's not going to amount to much. It's next to impossible to learn every new game cold and remember old ones you rarely play.
I assume you meant "optimal". But I hear what you're saying. I'm still usually a quarter player and I can have plays with larger edges. I suppose if I played larger but with a smaller edge I would have to fine tune my game. I like to consistently practice the "basics". I want to know 10-7 DB and 8-5 BP cold. And it's been awhile since I had a play involving JW-2pair, but I would have to study up for that. It's a tough one. My game of choice is a good progressive, one where I have to tune up. Often progressives can be easier to play than the base game. I don't have to play perfect.
Studying some of the fine points for fun is what's going to prevent Alzheimer's in me when I'm 80. At least that's what I hoping.
Play chess and Video games as well.Quote: bobbartopI assume you meant "optimal". But I hear what you're saying. I'm still usually a quarter player and I can have plays with larger edges. I suppose if I played larger but with a smaller edge I would have to fine tune my game. I like to consistently practice the "basics". I want to know 10-7 DB and 8-5 BP cold. And it's been awhile since I had a play involving JW-2pair, but I would have to study up for that. It's a tough one. My game of choice is a good progressive, one where I have to tune up. Often progressives can be easier to play than the base game. I don't have to play perfect.
Studying some of the fine points for fun is what's going to prevent Alzheimer's in me when I'm 80. At least that's what I hoping.
Quote: Mikey75Thanks for all the replies. Greatly appreciated. Now to practice practice practice.
So you are a dice controller?
Quote: Mikey75At what rate should your % of correct play be to be considered acceptable for JOB? Also the strategy wouldn't be any different on multi line machines than single line would it?
As I posted in my thread about my latest visit to Tunica I actually found UX to be enjoyable. I have play a little single line VP and I just don't enjoy it that much. I know playing UX at 10x isn't the greatest return but it's got to beat most, if not all, slots. I've searched for a long time to find something I really enjoyed outside of table games and I think this is it.
I've been playing Wizard's VP iPhone app and making a lot more errors than I realized. I was thinking about this and wondering what most think is a acceptable rate of play.
Keep in mind UX strategy is not the same as regular strategy, unless you're vulturing at 5 coins.
Read this thread for more details.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/video-poker/20663-learning-a-new-game-utx-or-qq/
As for "errors" in standard games, ideally for easier games like JoB, you would prefer not to lose more than 0.1% in "expected return". Ultimate X strategy is more difficult than this though. So missing less than 0.2% by return would take a decent amount of practice. The actual accuracy rate in hands really doesn't matter much.
Quote: DeMangoSo you are a dice controller?
Lol nope not me.
Quote: tringlomaneKeep in mind UX strategy is not the same as regular strategy, unless you're vulturing at 5 coins.
Read this thread for more details.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/video-poker/20663-learning-a-new-game-utx-or-qq/
As for "errors" in standard games, ideally for easier games like JoB, you would prefer not to lose more than 0.1% in "expected return". Ultimate X strategy is more difficult than this though. So missing less than 0.2% by return would take a decent amount of practice. The actual accuracy rate in hands really doesn't matter much.
Thanks for that link!! Good information.
I always make big mistakes on keno.Quote: GWAEI would say 95% correct will get you pretty close to ev as long as you are not making the big mistakes.
Quote: AxelWolfI always make big mistakes on keno.
who doesnt? XD
Quote: cestanlwho doesnt? XD
Me. Never played it.
Quote: IbeatyouracesMe. Never played it.
There are rare occasions in which you should.
Quote: Mission146There are rare occasions in which you should.
I'm certain. But those opportunities aren't around here.
Quote: IbeatyouracesMe. Never played it.
My first ever play of video keno. I was drunk and said, "why not". Exactly 35 months earlier from the AWAK on Friday...weird.
Quote: tringlomane
I hate caveman keno!! Not for the game but for the sound effects. It would drive me nuts as I played the 9/6 JoB STP Spin Poker at Motorcity.
Quote: IbeatyouracesMe. Never played it.
They're being coy and not telling you the progressives can build nicely [on the machines]
If you're playing something with a nice edge, you don't gotta play it perfectly to win. If you're playing something with a small advantage (<1%), then you should pretty much be at 100% on the strategy....errors only coming from when you make a mistake (like not seeing a pair or a button misclick).
Quote: odiousgambitThey're being coy and not telling you the progressives can build nicely [on the machines]
I know that. There are none around me. And when we travel, keno or VP is that last thing on our minds.
Quote: RS9/6 JOB is (IMO) the easiest game to learn perfectly. If I had to play it perfectly (or about 99.999%, since I couldn't ever figure out that damn hand that's like a 3-card SF w/ 2 gaps and 4 high cards....ya know, the one that if you know the deviation it adds 0.000014% to your return), I could probably do it. But, after playing different games, like DW, FPDW, DB, DDB, UX, it's pretty hard to play or remember a strategy perfectly. Then throw in progressives, different paytables (like 7/5 BP or 9/5 JOB)....and you'll quickly realize ya can't learn them all perfectly....and at the end of the day -- WHY? If I can play 100% perfectly, great.
SF all day, Yolo. Hands like KQJTT just don't come around often enough. I'll sometimes put prog strategy adjustments on my phone but I just know I'll be the first one prosecuted for using it while playing.
Quote: RS9/6 JOB is (IMO) the easiest game to learn perfectly. If I had to play it perfectly (or about 99.999%, since I couldn't ever figure out that damn hand that's like a 3-card SF w/ 2 gaps and 4 high cards....ya know, the one that if you know the deviation it adds 0.000014% to your return), I could probably do it.
I wish all decisions were that easy. Just look at the SF3 and if all eight 'gutshot' cards are still available, go for the SF3.
Example: AQ 'KT9'
The Q fits in the gut of KT9, so you instead draw one to AQKT. Sure, it's a close play and not that important, but since it's so easy you might as well incorporate that rule when you come to it.
And you're right, 9-6 JoB is the easiest game to learn perfectly.
Thanks again for all the good info.
It depends on if the pay table changes.Quote: Mikey75I have another question about ux strategy. Wizard has the strategy listed for job 10 line. Would the strategy be the same for 3 line?
Thanks again for all the good info.
Quote: AxelWolfIt depends on if the pay table changes.
I wouldn't be surprised if 7/5 Bonus Strategy would be better for non full pay JoB UX. I unfortunately never cranked out any JoB paytables where the payback of the flush is 5 for 1. Maybe later...
The strategy differences between 3 and 10 line with the same paytable is minimal enough not to care.
Quote: AxelWolfIt depends on if the pay table changes.
I do believe that the multiplier changes between 3 hand and 10 hand. (2x for 4oaK on 3-hand.... 3x for 4oak on 10-hand)
Quote: rsactuaryI do believe that the multiplier changes between 3 hand and 10 hand. (2x for 4oaK on 3-hand.... 3x for 4oak on 10-hand)
The multiplier for 3 line for 4oak is 2x
Quote: rsactuaryI do believe that the multiplier changes between 3 hand and 10 hand. (2x for 4oaK on 3-hand.... 3x for 4oak on 10-hand)
Yeah quad/straight flush/royal flush multipliers increase with more lines, but will do very little to change the strategy vs. lowering the flush payout.
Quote: rsactuaryUnderstood... I just wanted to make sure that there is more than just the paytable to consider.
I was wrong, I did do 7/5 JoB...which is the most common JoB game.
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/strategy/a-1-b-74-c-1-d-0.24156-d-0.98312-d-1.72468-d-2.46624-d-3.69093-d-5.15717-d-6.39873-d-12.98312-d-25.48312-d-400.48312/
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/strategy/a-1-b-74-c-1-d-0.24439-d-0.98879-d-1.73318-d-2.47758-d-3.71076-d-5.18833-d-6.93273-d-12.98879-d-25.48879-d-400.48879/
But if you look at 8/6 JoB you'll find some differences, mainly 3 to a flush becomes lower on the priority list.
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/strategy/ultimate-x/jacks-or-better/
