mpower
mpower
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May 6th, 2026 at 1:45:35 PM permalink
Didn’t Michael Shackleford once calculate blind betting a second box in Ultimate Texas Hold’em ?

Now, what I read now in Wizard of Odds’ site ‘Ultimate Texas Hold ’Em’ is:

1. Average Loss on Ante = -0.165757
2. Average Loss on Blind = -0.314685
3. Average Win on Play = 0.213076 if played optimally
in a normal one hand game with overall house edge of 2.185% per ante bet.

In Swiss casinos it is allowed to play two or more hands if the table is not filled.
One casino requires blind four bets on all but one hand. Another casino requires only one bet on all but one hand.

I looked at different sources in the internet, but only got imprecise information. Even from ChatGPT.

My questions therefore are:

1. Is the bet on Play an even money game, if not looked at the cards ?

2. What Is the overall loss if playing one hand according basic strategy and the others blind ?

3. Does the house edge change, if blind hands played with one bet respectively with four bets.

As an explanation to my inquiry I might add, that in Switzerland all UTH-games have a progressive jackpot for hitting royal flush. In one casino (with a side bet of 5) there is a jackpot of 150’000 to gain. So, playing more than one hand could be advantageous.
odiousgambit
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May 7th, 2026 at 5:12:11 AM permalink
you want to be able to bet 4x behind someone who bets 3x or not anything when 4x is indicated

Your prospective enablers are at least 90% of other players, however, it always sounds easier to do than reality allows. You need to build a relationship and what you see is people coming and going . I do know someone who has been able to do this, don't know if it's still going on
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!”   She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
aceside
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May 7th, 2026 at 6:17:16 AM permalink
This game of UTH is just too complicated for most players to learn. To simplify it, I would get rid of the rule of “dealer must have at least a pair to qualify.” Instead, I would drop the pay table amount on the blind bet.

There is absolutely no need to distinguish ante and blind bets circles. These two can be combine into one circle.

There are two kinds of “blind” here to confuse readers. There is a “blind” bet circle at each seat, but there is also a blind bet on every circle on another seat. There is no point of blind betting. Right?
Last edited by: aceside on May 7, 2026
gordonm888
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May 7th, 2026 at 3:35:55 PM permalink
Quote: aceside

This game of UTH is just too complicated for most players to learn. To simplify it, I would get rid of the rule of “dealer must have at least a pair to qualify.” Instead, I would drop the pay table amount on the blind bet.

There is absolutely no need to distinguish ante and blind bets circles. These two can be combine into one circle.

{snip}
link to original post



The ante bet and blind bet need to be kept distinct, because the rules allowing 4x bets preflop and 2x wagers post-flop are multipliers on the Ante Bet amount. Also the blind bet is paid off according to a paytable that is completely different than the way the Ante Bet is paid off.
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
aceside
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May 7th, 2026 at 7:54:42 PM permalink
You just get rid of the “ante” bet circle, and the game will play the same way.
mpower
mpower
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May 8th, 2026 at 2:14:53 PM permalink
To the administrator: I erroneously put my thread in the blackjack section. Maybe you can swap to the appropriate section.

Isn’t anybody out there to help me by running a few simulations on blind betting in UTH ?

mpower
Hunterhill
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May 8th, 2026 at 2:54:42 PM permalink
Quote: mpower

To the administrator: I erroneously put my thread in the blackjack section. Maybe you can swap to the appropriate section.

Isn’t anybody out there to help me by running a few simulations on blind betting in UTH ?

mpower
link to original post

playing a hand blind in Uth is roughly a 14% house advantage.
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aceside
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May 8th, 2026 at 8:14:06 PM permalink
This is an aggressive way of blind betting (4x) UTH. I also find some players blind bet 1x all the time. What would the house edge be for those more reserved players?
Hunterhill
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May 10th, 2026 at 11:52:31 AM permalink
Quote: aceside

This is an aggressive way of blind betting (4x) UTH. I also find some players blind bet 1x all the time. What would the house edge be for those more reserved players?
link to original post

The 14% might not be correct. There is a post by a poster using the name jet from 2013 on this site that has more information
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Dieter
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May 10th, 2026 at 12:00:43 PM permalink
Quote: mpower

To the administrator: I erroneously put my thread in the blackjack section. Maybe you can swap to the appropriate section.
link to original post



I'll ask him, but don't hold your breath.
May the cards fall in your favor.
mpower
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May 10th, 2026 at 4:04:55 PM permalink
@Hunterhill: I found the post of user ‘jet’ in thread ‘House Edge on Playing a “Blind Hand” on Ultimate Texas Hold’em’ from October 21st, 2013, in this forum.

‘jet’ gives the following house edge numbers for blind play:
1x raise = -44.5212%
3x raise = -47.6456%
4x raise = -49.2079%

From the site ‘Advanced Advantage Play’ I got the following house edge number for blind play:
4x raise = -40.70%

And ChatGPT gives the number of -14% for blind 4x raise.

You see my dilemma ?
aceside
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May 10th, 2026 at 4:10:08 PM permalink
I believe ChatGPT is correct.
Hunterhill
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May 10th, 2026 at 5:11:54 PM permalink
Quote: mpower

@Hunterhill: I found the post of user ‘jet’ in thread ‘House Edge on Playing a “Blind Hand” on Ultimate Texas Hold’em’ from October 21st, 2013, in this forum.

‘jet’ gives the following house edge numbers for blind play:
1x raise = -44.5212%
3x raise = -47.6456%
4x raise = -49.2079%

From the site ‘Advanced Advantage Play’ I got the following house edge number for blind play:
4x raise = -40.70%

And ChatGPT gives the number of -14% for blind 4x raise.

You see my dilemma ?
[link=/forum/gambling/tables/42216-what-is-the-return-if-blind-betting-a-second-deleted

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