discflicker
discflicker
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August 28th, 2015 at 10:47:26 PM permalink
Hidden cameras in card tables:
The idea is not new, but new technology makes it possible for high-tech cheaters to try new methods. I thought up a new way for cheaters to install a hidden camera into poker and black-jack tables. THIS IS ALL THEORETICAL, but possible with today's technology.

An aerosol film made of carbon-nano tubes is applied to the surface of the table. The film is deposited in the pattern of an electronic circuit, and also, each molecule is aligned into a polarization pattern via magnets applied during the deposition. The magnetic polarization causes them to be deposited in "North-South" alignment.

The result is a highly sensitive electro-magnetic field, deposited on the card table in the shape of an electronic circuit. The field can be used as a sensor (a camera) that can read the cards. Part of the circuit is shaped into a two-way antenna that can be powered up by external energy, and the electronic circuit can store the energy in the form of capacitors designed into the circuitry logic, thus powering the electronic circuit functions.

So, the cheat walks by the table, puts his cell-phone down and, in seconds, it sprays out the carbon nono-tube mist and performs the magnetic polarization alignment.

He now has his hidden camera in place. It cannot be seen, or felt, or detected because its only a few billion molecules spread around the table-top.


The "hidden camera" is operated remotely by a device in close-proximity that sends out microwave pulses to power and communicate with it, like a Bluetooth device that looks like his Walkman, his, cell-phone,, his tablet, whatever.

The pulse is the external energy required to power the hidden camera... received by the two-way antenna, it charges up the capacitors which operate the circuit, enabling the magnetic field to sense the cards and return the data back through the two-way antenna.

Of course, the hidden camera need not operate exactly like this, and the idea of it pre-dates my grandfather. The thing is, today's nano-technology makes this "hit and ruin" scenario really possible, so a cheat could just go from table to table, and nobody would be the wiser.

"Quantum Thought Detection"
I personally don't believe it, but I've heard of research describing methods of scanning the brain wherein the future can be seen, 5 seconds in advance, and this is (allegedly) proven by experimentation.

"Small robots"
Can look like roaches and crawl into the cage and steal chips and cash. They can push buttons on keyboards and even hurt or kill someone, if that's your thing.

"Nano-Bots"
Are very small devices that can be made to look like fleas or mites, or even smaller. They can be equipped with cameras, intelligent circuits and two-way communications. They can even be used in swarms that are way more effective. These can be used as"hidden card table cameras", or even to crawl into the card shufflers and slot machine circuits and wreak havoc.


Bottom line: Casinos, which have all of the chips and cash sitting around (that can be moved and stolen), all of the mechanical payout devices (that can be infected and corrupted), and all of the visual information that can be pondered as well, are sitting ducks for high-tech cheats to plunder.

Does anyone else agree, and if so, what can be done to prevent this kind of cheating?


I am aware of detectors of electro-magnetic radiation being used in casinos, but with today's flood of wi-fi and Bluetooth devices everywhere, how can they really "single-out" the signalling from cheating electronics from everything else?
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1. The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
petroglyph
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August 28th, 2015 at 11:15:59 PM permalink
Quote: discflicker

Hidden cameras in card tables:
The idea is not new, but new technology makes it possible for high-tech cheaters to try new methods. I thought up a new way for cheaters to install a hidden camera into poker and black-jack tables. THIS IS ALL THEORETICAL, but possible with today's technology.

An aerosol film made of carbon-nano tubes is applied to the surface of the table. The film is deposited in the pattern of an electronic circuit, and also, each molecule is aligned into a polarization pattern via magnets applied during the deposition. The magnetic polarization causes them to be deposited in "North-South" alignment.

The result is a highly sensitive electro-magnetic field, deposited on the card table in the shape of an electronic circuit. The field can be used as a sensor (a camera) that can read the cards. Part of the circuit is shaped into a two-way antenna that can be powered up by external energy, and the electronic circuit can store the energy in the form of capacitors designed into the circuitry logic, thus powering the electronic circuit functions.

So, the cheat walks by the table, puts his cell-phone down and, in seconds, it sprays out the carbon nono-tube mist and performs the magnetic polarization alignment.

He now has his hidden camera in place. It cannot be seen, or felt, or detected because its only a few billion molecules spread around the table-top.


The "hidden camera" is operated remotely by a device in close-proximity that sends out microwave pulses to power and communicate with it, like a Bluetooth device that looks like his Walkman, his, cell-phone,, his tablet, whatever.

The pulse is the external energy required to power the hidden camera... received by the two-way antenna, it charges up the capacitors which operate the circuit, enabling the magnetic field to sense the cards and return the data back through the two-way antenna.

Of course, the hidden camera need not operate exactly like this, and the idea of it pre-dates my grandfather. The thing is, today's nano-technology makes this "hit and ruin" scenario really possible, so a cheat could just go from table to table, and nobody would be the wiser.

"Quantum Thought Detection"
I personally don't believe it, but I've heard of research describing methods of scanning the brain wherein the future can be seen, 5 seconds in advance, and this is (allegedly) proven by experimentation.

"Small robots"
Can look like roaches and crawl into the cage and steal chips and cash. They can push buttons on keyboards and even hurt or kill someone, if that's your thing.

"Nano-Bots"
Are very small devices that can be made to look like fleas or mites, or even smaller. They can be equipped with cameras, intelligent circuits and two-way communications. They can even be used in swarms that are way more effective. These can be used as"hidden card table cameras", or even to crawl into the card shufflers and slot machine circuits and wreak havoc.


Bottom line: Casinos, which have all of the chips and cash sitting around (that can be moved and stolen), all of the mechanical payout devices (that can be infected and corrupted), and all of the visual information that can be pondered as well, are sitting ducks for high-tech cheats to plunder.

Does anyone else agree, and if so, what can be done to prevent this kind of cheating?


I am aware of detectors of electro-magnetic radiation being used in casinos, but with today's flood of wi-fi and Bluetooth devices everywhere, how can they really "single-out" the signalling from cheating electronics from everything else?

I think when they see you dragging in the extension cord they will get suspicious?
MathExtremist
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August 28th, 2015 at 11:20:28 PM permalink
Quote: discflicker

Bottom line: Casinos, which have all of the chips and cash sitting around (that can be moved and stolen), all of the mechanical payout devices (that can be infected and corrupted), and all of the visual information that can be pondered as well, are sitting ducks for high-tech cheats to plunder.

Does anyone else agree, and if so, what can be done to prevent this kind of cheating?

No, I don't agree. If you had access to the kind of technology you're talking about, deploying it in a casino wouldn't even be remotely close to the most effective way to profit. Think bigger.
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
RS
RS
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August 28th, 2015 at 11:40:24 PM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

Quote: discflicker

Bottom line: Casinos, which have all of the chips and cash sitting around (that can be moved and stolen), all of the mechanical payout devices (that can be infected and corrupted), and all of the visual information that can be pondered as well, are sitting ducks for high-tech cheats to plunder.

Does anyone else agree, and if so, what can be done to prevent this kind of cheating?

No, I don't agree. If you had access to the kind of technology you're talking about, deploying it in a casino wouldn't even be remotely close to the most effective way to profit. Think bigger.



What about a REALLY BIG casino? Heh? No? Hmm, ok. :(



I read a few paragraphs, figured out I had no idea wtf half those words meant, so skipped to the responses. Still quite confused.

Can we get a 100-word TLDR?
rainman
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August 28th, 2015 at 11:56:59 PM permalink
Just like MathExtremist said the technology the op speaks of would be worth billions.
Dieter
Administrator
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August 29th, 2015 at 1:38:34 AM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

Can we get a 100-word TLDR?



Casinos are sitting on a lot of money.

It might be possible to cheat with currently available exotic technology.

Spray on cameras could be installed on card tables, and a cheating scheme could employ them.

On the edge of the technologically possible, a brain scanner might be used to predict someone's future actions.

Small robots could be used to steal things (cash and chips), possibly from the cage.

Smaller robots could be used to manipulate outcomes, put cameras at useful viewing positions, and be used in groups.


87 words. It's still unlawful, and there are still more profitable uses of the technology once you've decided to engage in criminal acts.
May the cards fall in your favor.
discflicker
discflicker
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August 29th, 2015 at 2:33:27 AM permalink
Quote: Dieter

Casinos are sitting on a lot of money.

It might be possible to cheat with currently available exotic technology.

Spray on cameras could be installed on card tables, and a cheating scheme could employ them.

On the edge of the technologically possible, a brain scanner might be used to predict someone's future actions.

Small robots could be used to steal things (cash and chips), possibly from the cage.

Smaller robots could be used to manipulate outcomes, put cameras at useful viewing positions, and be used in groups.


87 words. It's still unlawful, and there are still more profitable uses of the technology once you've decided to engage in criminal acts.



EXACTLY!!

I need a secretary. Damn, I did it again with the word salad.

Thanks for the summary, Dieter.

This technology is like lasers; out of reach back in the 70's, now anyone can buy one or build one, and hit airliners if they "decide to engage in the act".

I'm not saying the crook has to invent the thing, he just needs to operate it. I bet this stuff would sell great on the black market, but honestly, I'm certain that this technology will be available to the general public very very soon, like already now for the robot bugs. Let that be a warning to jewelry and coin shops., and NO, I'm not into this criminal stuff, I'm just daydreaming about the threat to Vegas, because I've been into Carbon-nano tubes, 3-d printing and swarm-technology lately, and my mind tends to wander.

With the advent of 3-d printers, any wanna-be-bad-guy will be able print up anything he wants to, and the "black market" he'll get the specs from will be the world-wide-web.

I thought nothing of computer viruses when I first heard of them, same deal? Why did they build the Tillman bridge again? Threat of a nuke attack of Hoover dam... out of reach in 1945, but now?

I honestly believe the threat is real, just like Y2K was a real threat to computers at midnight, 31-Dec-1999.

If the threat is real, what are the casinos doing to stop it? Not trying to be paranoid, but we need to protect our bread and butter; this could wipe out the gaming industry if left unchecked.

Thanks everyone for the participation, apologies for my diarrhea of words; you don't need to summarize this one, Just read the BOLD parts.

Marty
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1. The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
rudeboyoi
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August 29th, 2015 at 5:07:37 AM permalink
Just wait until someone spills a drink.
Dalex64
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August 29th, 2015 at 7:32:57 AM permalink
A high-res camera and a computer that could read the cards off of the reflection from a person's eyes is a lot closer to reality than nanobots.
discflicker
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August 29th, 2015 at 7:31:34 PM permalink
Quote: Dalex64

A high-res camera and a computer that could read the cards off of the reflection from a person's eyes is a lot closer to reality than nanobots.



Alright then, what are the casinos doing to protect from that?

If anyone doubts that this technology is either already here or will be in the next 10 years or so, I can provide a list of YouTube videos, like the TED talks, that will convince you otherwise.

I'm really kind of surprised at the way WoV is taking this so lightly. In my opinion, the threats are real, and we will lose our livelihood if left unchecked.
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1. The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
Paigowdan
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August 29th, 2015 at 8:07:52 PM permalink
Quote: discflicker

I'm really kind of surprised at the way WoV is taking this so lightly. In my opinion, the threats are real, and we will lose our livelihood if left unchecked.



I think we're all right,
and that games being used are currently defendable to an acceptable level as it stands now.

One of the basic criterion of a viable casino game is that it is offerable, and can operate, and be profitable with existing equipment, - such as cards, dice, floor supervision, and the existing surveillance setups. It really boils down to casino personnel, more than star-wars technology.
Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes - Henry David Thoreau. Like Dealers' uniforms - Dan.
discflicker
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August 29th, 2015 at 9:01:52 PM permalink
Quote: Paigowdan

I think we're all right,
and that games being used are currently defendable to an acceptable level as it stands now.

One of the basic criterion of a viable casino game is that it is offerable, and can operate, and be profitable with existing equipment, - such as cards, dice, floor supervision, and the existing surveillance setups. It really boils down to casino personnel, more than star-wars technology.



Hey Dan, thanks for the reply.

I think perhaps I've misled everyone with my high-tech rant about the aerosol spray-on nano-tube circuit, the quantum brain scanners, and the nano-bots...

EVERYONE, PLEASE, FORGET THE STAR-WARS TECHNOLOGY, OK??

They already have available to the public, small crawling bots that could, for example, push a stack of chips from black to red. What's to stop someone from getting a tiny crawler inside of an automated roulette table and have it control the wheel? Getting inside of an old mechanical slot and having it press the coin releases? Having it crawl into the cage and retrieve some chips?

There are already mini-drones the size of a pack of matches that can fly around and scan sensitive information like bank account numbers and passwords being typed. THIS STUFF IS REAL and anyone can buy it RIGHT NOW!

The biggest problem I foresee, as I said before, now that we're bathed in wi-fi and Bluetooth signalling everywhere, how can they tell the good signals from the bad inside of a live casino?

I came up with a simple suggestion (my "curtain of light" idea) for protecting physical areas from being compromised by crawling mini bots. I think that sort of thing is just a head start if we expect to keep things working as they always have been, in a world of accelerated technological development.

Thanks for your interest, Dan, I hope all is well.
The difference between zero and the smallest possible number? It doesn't matter; once you cross that edge, it might as well be the difference between zero and 1. The difference between infinity and reality? They are mutually exclusive.
boymimbo
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August 30th, 2015 at 4:46:02 AM permalink
A camera will notice an "invisible force" moving stuff around in a casino and figure things out fairly quickly. There would be an incredible amount of programming involved to manipulate a roulette wheel in your favor.

As for the minidrones, this is cool, but you still have the get the minidrone to the right place and transmit the correct information to the person making the bet. In poker the positioning would need to be absolutely correct to get player card information. In other games card protection is already in place but you could position a well placed drone to get hole carding. That drone would have to be at table level and would be subject to being seen and bumped into.

I don't see this happening anytime soon, and by far, it would be easier to exploit dumb people who leave all of their financial information in the open and the banks reluctance to protect them. The are far more doable and lower risk scams out there. No need for the risk of a casino and its layers of security and your physical presence there.
----- You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
AxelWolf
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August 30th, 2015 at 5:51:31 AM permalink
Quote: discflicker

Hey Dan, thanks for the reply.

I think perhaps I've misled everyone with my high-tech rant about the aerosol spray-on nano-tube circuit, the quantum brain scanners, and the nano-bots...

EVERYONE, PLEASE, FORGET THE STAR-WARS TECHNOLOGY, OK??

They already have available to the public, small crawling bots that could, for example, push a stack of chips from black to red. What's to stop someone from getting a tiny crawler inside of an automated roulette table and have it control the wheel? Getting inside of an old mechanical slot and having it press the coin releases? Having it crawl into the cage and retrieve some chips?

There are already mini-drones the size of a pack of matches that can fly around and scan sensitive information like bank account numbers and passwords being typed. THIS STUFF IS REAL and anyone can buy it RIGHT NOW!

The biggest problem I foresee, as I said before, now that we're bathed in wi-fi and Bluetooth signalling everywhere, how can they tell the good signals from the bad inside of a live casino?

I came up with a simple suggestion (my "curtain of light" idea) for protecting physical areas from being compromised by crawling mini bots. I think that sort of thing is just a head start if we expect to keep things working as they always have been, in a world of accelerated technological development.

Thanks for your interest, Dan, I hope all is well.

Crawling mini bots stealing chips and some of the other things may be possible but the seem far fetched and impractical in a casino. There's probably many more, much simpler ideas. things you couldn't possibly think of that are happening as I type this(both very illegal and perfectly legal)
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
ShineyShine
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August 30th, 2015 at 10:46:44 PM permalink
This kind of tech would be worth a fortune, so using it for a casino scam right now is small time. Maybe this kind of stuff will be commonplace in the future, as familiar as a smart phone is at the moment, but right now i don't think its an issue.

I posted the above comment in the Roulette thread the OP started, but its probably more appropriate here.
Dicenor33
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August 31st, 2015 at 3:35:16 AM permalink
25 to life and a bunch of show trials should cure stealing.
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