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Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
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March 22nd, 2023 at 9:12:49 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

I don't know the actual law however if you picked up free play on someone else's card and they detained you and confiscated the slot tickets I'm fairly sure the casino could keep that and you are not getting it back. Even if you cashed the tickets and they confiscated the money I don't think gaming would force them to give it back. Even if what they did wasn't lawful, good luck in court.
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Yeah, but one of the cards was my own card.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
darkoz
darkoz
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Mission146
March 22nd, 2023 at 9:43:57 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

Quote: DRich

Quote: Mission146



They do nothing when casinos confiscate a player's slot vouchers, so I don't suspect they care. This has been my personal experience.
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I suspect they would care greatly if the casino refused to give you your money.
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The casino did refuse to give me my money. I contacted Gaming. After promising to get back to me after their monthly meeting wherein these things are discussed, they did not do so and subsequently ignored every single one of my phone messages.
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You have to be adamant that gaming comes immediately. In Atlantic City for example you have to state that this is a customer dispute and you want gaming to be involved and to contact the onsite gaming officer which by law they have to do.

Refuse to leave the casino until they give you the money. All they will do is say you are trespassing and call precisely the person you want to come settle the dispute and get you your money.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
Mission146
Mission146
Joined: May 15, 2012
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March 22nd, 2023 at 10:28:54 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz



You have to be adamant that gaming comes immediately. In Atlantic City for example you have to state that this is a customer dispute and you want gaming to be involved and to contact the onsite gaming officer which by law they have to do.

Refuse to leave the casino until they give you the money. All they will do is say you are trespassing and call precisely the person you want to come settle the dispute and get you your money.
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Good deal and thanks for the tips! I have no real plans to multi-card AC, or anywhere else, ever again, but I'll keep that in mind in the unlikely event that I do. Honestly, I just don't find it worth all the hassle and money itself really doesn't mean that much to me, in general terms.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
DRich
DRich
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March 22nd, 2023 at 11:30:53 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz


You have to be adamant that gaming comes immediately. In Atlantic City for example you have to state that this is a customer dispute and you want gaming to be involved and to contact the onsite gaming officer which by law they have to do.



That is exactly what I was going to say. In Nevada if a dispute is over $500 the casino is required to call Nevada Gaming out to the site to try and resolve it. The casinos get very large fines if they don't report a dispute over $500.
At my age, a "Life In Prison" sentence is not much of a deterrent.
darkoz
darkoz
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March 22nd, 2023 at 11:50:56 AM permalink
Quote: DRich

Quote: darkoz


You have to be adamant that gaming comes immediately. In Atlantic City for example you have to state that this is a customer dispute and you want gaming to be involved and to contact the onsite gaming officer which by law they have to do.



That is exactly what I was going to say. In Nevada if a dispute is over $500 the casino is required to call Nevada Gaming out to the site to try and resolve it. The casinos get very large fines if they don't report a dispute over $500.
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Yes it's very similar in AC. They get fined for not calling gaming if a customer requests it due to a payment dispute. I don't know what the minimum amount is.

I suspect it's that way for most territories (aside from Indian gaming) because most states actually study the gaming laws of Nevada with it's history of gaming and try to mimic them

Call it laziness or a reliance on what has come before but most gaming laws are not only very similar but even worded similar from state to state.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
Seedvalue
Seedvalue
Joined: Apr 5, 2022
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Mission146
March 22nd, 2023 at 1:08:10 PM permalink
Quote: darkoz

Resorts world aqueduct installed a system if a voucher was not cashed out but a players card was removed and then a new one inserted then the machine would lock up on the next wager.

When a slot tech would be called he would notify security. Several people were surrounded by security and told either they presented ID (to be expelled from the casino since they already had proof they used someone else's players card) or they would have to forfeit their cash because the slot tech would not repair the machine without the ID of the player (ostensibly for the protection of whoever inserted the money what chutzpah).

From what I heard everyone gave up their ID and got evicted so they could retain their cash. Personally that all sounds illegal and this is circa 2014.

Golden Nugget if you had a voucher over $3000 (and it's probably true for all AC but definitely the nugget) And you took it to the cashier they could tell if it was associated with a players card. They would ask then for ID and why that person was cashing out for someone else. They would refuse to cash the voucher without that person present. I don't believe they confiscated it. Just refused to honor it without the person coming themselves. Once they scanned it the voucher was unplayable in the slots so you had little choice if you wanted your money.

Resorts International in AC will recognize if you won a jackpot using another person's card. If there are offers the card is toast by the next day (however not if significant play is on the card for that day so it seems they take that into account. There are legit players who may win a jackpot and not realize someone else's card was left in.)

Taj Mahal if you downloaded your Freeplay, removed the card and tried to insert someone else's card the machine would lock both player's cards. However they would lift the lock if both people went to customer service with a warning not to do it again.

Other than that I have never seen it. It would become a nightmare in my opinion. Plenty of legit people forget their cards in the slots and someone else plays behind them. They would end up evicting innocent old ladies and have a lot of bad PR just my take.
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The above post is a perfect example of something that should never be posted. You are literally posting something that is currently being used in real time to circumvent different systems.

Just because the process you posted is slightly off and you think itís outdated doesnít mean itís not being used.

You have openly stated that you are not a millionaire after all these years with all these cards and all this knowledge. Why would you continue to post things above ? Are you in on developing software to stop APs or something?

I can understand why the forum owners want everyone to post things. Itís good for businesses. I had comments removed for alluding to a factual play that I know someone is utilizing in Vegas to play backjack. Without giving the knowledge of what the play is and I would never out the play she, he, they, or them is using. I find it amusing. More evidence that these sites donít really have active players. Mostly retired guys talking shop about past plays. Most never achieving their full potential, and using the information to data base real players. Thatís my opinion of these forums. No real loyalty to the game against the casino Industry.

All these sites are Fantastic honey traps for the other side.

Please deactivate my account wizard thanks
darkoz
darkoz
Joined: Dec 22, 2009
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Mission146
March 22nd, 2023 at 1:26:28 PM permalink
Quote: Seedvalue

Quote: darkoz

Resorts world aqueduct installed a system if a voucher was not cashed out but a players card was removed and then a new one inserted then the machine would lock up on the next wager.

When a slot tech would be called he would notify security. Several people were surrounded by security and told either they presented ID (to be expelled from the casino since they already had proof they used someone else's players card) or they would have to forfeit their cash because the slot tech would not repair the machine without the ID of the player (ostensibly for the protection of whoever inserted the money what chutzpah).

From what I heard everyone gave up their ID and got evicted so they could retain their cash. Personally that all sounds illegal and this is circa 2014.

Golden Nugget if you had a voucher over $3000 (and it's probably true for all AC but definitely the nugget) And you took it to the cashier they could tell if it was associated with a players card. They would ask then for ID and why that person was cashing out for someone else. They would refuse to cash the voucher without that person present. I don't believe they confiscated it. Just refused to honor it without the person coming themselves. Once they scanned it the voucher was unplayable in the slots so you had little choice if you wanted your money.

Resorts International in AC will recognize if you won a jackpot using another person's card. If there are offers the card is toast by the next day (however not if significant play is on the card for that day so it seems they take that into account. There are legit players who may win a jackpot and not realize someone else's card was left in.)

Taj Mahal if you downloaded your Freeplay, removed the card and tried to insert someone else's card the machine would lock both player's cards. However they would lift the lock if both people went to customer service with a warning not to do it again.

Other than that I have never seen it. It would become a nightmare in my opinion. Plenty of legit people forget their cards in the slots and someone else plays behind them. They would end up evicting innocent old ladies and have a lot of bad PR just my take.
link to original post




The above post is a perfect example of something that should never be posted. You are literally posting something that is currently being used in real time to circumvent different systems.

Just because the process you posted is slightly off and you think itís outdated doesnít mean itís not being used.

You have openly stated that you are not a millionaire after all these years with all these cards and all this knowledge. Why would you continue to post things above ? Are you in on developing software to stop APs or something?

I can understand why the forum owners want everyone to post things. Itís good for businesses. I had comments removed for alluding to a factual play that I know someone is utilizing in Vegas to play backjack. Without giving the knowledge of what the play is and I would never out the play she, he, they, or them is using. I find it amusing. More evidence that these sites donít really have active players. Mostly retired guys talking shop about past plays. Most never achieving their full potential, and using the information to data base real players. Thatís my opinion of these forums. No real loyalty to the game against the casino Industry.

All these sites are Fantastic honey traps for the other side.

Please deactivate my account wizard thanks
link to original post



Lol makes no sense to me. The systems by the casinos are being used but let's not let the casinos know about their own systems.

Sorry to see you go.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
SOOPOO
SOOPOO
Joined: Aug 8, 2010
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Mission146
March 22nd, 2023 at 1:30:59 PM permalink
Quote: Seedvalue

Quote: darkoz

Resorts world aqueduct installed a system if a voucher was not cashed out but a players card was removed and then a new one inserted then the machine would lock up on the next wager.

When a slot tech would be called he would notify security. Several people were surrounded by security and told either they presented ID (to be expelled from the casino since they already had proof they used someone else's players card) or they would have to forfeit their cash because the slot tech would not repair the machine without the ID of the player (ostensibly for the protection of whoever inserted the money what chutzpah).

From what I heard everyone gave up their ID and got evicted so they could retain their cash. Personally that all sounds illegal and this is circa 2014.

Golden Nugget if you had a voucher over $3000 (and it's probably true for all AC but definitely the nugget) And you took it to the cashier they could tell if it was associated with a players card. They would ask then for ID and why that person was cashing out for someone else. They would refuse to cash the voucher without that person present. I don't believe they confiscated it. Just refused to honor it without the person coming themselves. Once they scanned it the voucher was unplayable in the slots so you had little choice if you wanted your money.

Resorts International in AC will recognize if you won a jackpot using another person's card. If there are offers the card is toast by the next day (however not if significant play is on the card for that day so it seems they take that into account. There are legit players who may win a jackpot and not realize someone else's card was left in.)

Taj Mahal if you downloaded your Freeplay, removed the card and tried to insert someone else's card the machine would lock both player's cards. However they would lift the lock if both people went to customer service with a warning not to do it again.

Other than that I have never seen it. It would become a nightmare in my opinion. Plenty of legit people forget their cards in the slots and someone else plays behind them. They would end up evicting innocent old ladies and have a lot of bad PR just my take.
link to original post




The above post is a perfect example of something that should never be posted. You are literally posting something that is currently being used in real time to circumvent different systems.

Just because the process you posted is slightly off and you think itís outdated doesnít mean itís not being used.

You have openly stated that you are not a millionaire after all these years with all these cards and all this knowledge. Why would you continue to post things above ? Are you in on developing software to stop APs or something?

I can understand why the forum owners want everyone to post things. Itís good for businesses. I had comments removed for alluding to a factual play that I know someone is utilizing in Vegas to play backjack. Without giving the knowledge of what the play is and I would never out the play she, he, they, or them is using. I find it amusing. More evidence that these sites donít really have active players. Mostly retired guys talking shop about past plays. Most never achieving their full potential, and using the information to data base real players. Thatís my opinion of these forums. No real loyalty to the game against the casino Industry.

All these sites are Fantastic honey traps for the other side.

Please deactivate my account wizard thanks
link to original post



If you are still hereÖ. Why would you possibly need the Wizard to deactivate your account? You canít just not click on Wizardofvegas.com ?
I think you added to the forum. Sorry to see you go. Good luck!
McSweeney
McSweeney
Joined: Oct 24, 2021
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April 8th, 2023 at 5:45:08 PM permalink
This lawyer has some interesting info about a player's right to cash out chips, the legality of being back-roomed, etc. He says that even though the chips are owned by the casino, the issue is who currently has the right to possession of them. And the player has the right to possession unless the casino has reasonable suspicion he has gotten them through dishonest means, and in order to regain possession, the casino must pay the player for the value.

(Starting at 13:55)

WABJ11
WABJ11
Joined: Dec 26, 2020
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April 12th, 2023 at 4:11:08 PM permalink
Iím just commenting on AC because I had a card counting dispute where they backed me off without backing me off. They use to have a gaming agent on the floor of every AC casino. But when Governor Christie made cuts to the budget they got rid of that (rightfully so).

The process for Atlantic City is you go to security desk and tell them you want to make a ďGaming Complaint.Ē Then they decide if they should call the NJ gaming enforcement division/state police. If itís not urgent itíll get forwarded to the NJ Gaming Control board and they will follow up with you.

FWIW my complaint wasnít deemed urgent, but it did makes its way to a gaming agent who called me and was attentive.
Last edited by: WABJ11 on Apr 12, 2023

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