Suck Outs

Playing cash poker low limit stakes (1/2) i find at one casino i cant get any action on my bets. however at another casino i cant get people out of pots even if i make the pot odds so unfavorable that a call is wrong in any situation other than the absolute nuts. so here is my example.

Me (bb): KJ(sp) preflop I bet 10 with 2 callers. (to me reasonable) during muck player exposes 2h

Flop: 5h-10s-Jc, check, check, I bet 25 - fold, call. (hmm, whats he holding 10 maybe)

Turn: 10c, check, I bet 55 - call (ok, now i know he doesnt have a 10, so whats he holding, J with a small kicker)

River: 5d, player bets 55, I call, turn over my 2 pair. he turns over his full house on the river holding 5s 2d

i dont get what would keep him around after flop witgh 5-2 off with already 2 exposed preflop and low pair with 2 overs.

then on the river ok he has 2 pair, but poor kicker and still 2 over cards

sucks out on river to win the hand.

Maybe his read on your action was a typical BB raise, then a semi-bluff straight draw? From your description, the full house was the small blind, and was getting to see the flop at a small discount. The call on the turn was puzzling though, with the overpair on board. Why did you bet the odd amount?

Did the other player have enough chips to fish? How big was his stack?

Quote: kauboj

Playing cash poker low limit stakes (1/2) i find at one casino i cant get any action on my bets. however at another casino i cant get people out of pots even if i make the pot odds so unfavorable that a call is wrong in any situation other than the absolute nuts. so here is my example.

Me (bb): KJ(sp) preflop I bet 10 with 2 callers. (to me reasonable) during muck player exposes 2h

Flop: 5h-10s-Jc, check, check, I bet 25 - fold, call. (hmm, whats he holding 10 maybe)

Turn: 10c, check, I bet 55 - call (ok, now i know he doesnt have a 10, so whats he holding, J with a small kicker)

River: 5d, player bets 55, I call, turn over my 2 pair. he turns over his full house on the river holding 5s 2d

i dont get what would keep him around after flop witgh 5-2 off with already 2 exposed preflop and low pair with 2 overs.

then on the river ok he has 2 pair, but poor kicker and still 2 over cards

sucks out on river to win the hand.

Actually, the guy did everything wrong starting with his call of your raise preflop. He's a calling station from hell. This time he got away with it. But you want to keep a guy like that in your game. Just grin and bear it.

Quote: mickeycrimm

Actually, the guy did everything wrong starting with his call of your raise preflop. He's a calling station from hell. This time he got away with it. But you want to keep a guy like that in your game. Just grin and bear it.

I agree with mickey. My only criticism of your play is the call on the river. If you already are presuming he stuck around with something, then the board pair on the turn and river killed your hand, and then he led into you. At a 1/2 table, 9 out of 10 (opponent dependent) I'm laying that one down.

well my take on the hand really was i figured at 38 dollars in the pot as the flop is drawn, a i felt sitting with top par and a back door flush draw i wanted action but i didnt want both players in so i went with a 25 bet when he checked the flop. now 88 in the pot and he checks the turn, so i took him off trips which was my initial fear... but i think he would have bet if he had trips, or atleast a check raise was coming so about 2/3 pot raise i though was a good continuation bet if he raised me id be done, but when the 5 hit the river i really didnt think he had the full house.

I like to play poker.
Seen a lot of suck outs.
Been on both ends of suck outs.
I am really entertained by players that get so pissed at a suck out that they yell at the winning hand player saying they suck at poker.
If you play enough , you know the types :-)
Its poker, I'm the type that that has no reaction to losing to a suck out. I've seen to many to really react.

I know its poker, however, i am always trying to learn and improve, so if posting this gets different view points on how other people look at the same situation, it gives me a learning to tool to see where i can adjust play and better understand other players, like how off were my bets, should i have bet more on the turn... what other people think to keep in hands they shouldnt be in. i dont think i was portraying i was mad, other than trying to get a take on why people would stay in a hand they were far behind on other than hoping for mere luck to fall upon them.

Quote: kauboj

I know its poker, however, i am always trying to learn and improve, so if posting this gets different view points on how other people look at the same situation, it gives me a learning to tool to see where i can adjust play and better understand other players, like how off were my bets, should i have bet more on the turn... what other people think to keep in hands they shouldnt be in. i dont think i was portraying i was mad, other than trying to get a take on why people would stay in a hand they were far behind on other than hoping for mere luck to fall upon them.

The guy just sucks, should never have called pre-flop, I'd have probably have bet more after the flop if I'd been you...his post-flop call was probably justifiable (after and given the horrible pre-flop call), but nothing else that he did. The only thing I'd have done differently than you did after the flop was I'd have probably bet pot rounded up to the nearest $10, or $40, in this case, but that might not have gotten him out.

I also agree with what MidwestAP said, maybe would have folded after the River, close call, would have had to observe the player during the hand to decide. In my comment above, I'd mistakenly read it as though you led $55 again.

Quote: kauboj

he turns over his full house on the river holding 5s 2d

i dont get what would keep him around after flop witgh 5-2 off with already 2 exposed preflop and low pair with 2 overs.

then on the river ok he has 2 pair, but poor kicker and still 2 over cards

sucks out on river to win the hand.

I see players like this all the time. They're casual players with no real understanding of the game. He flopped a pair, and that's good enough for him. He isn't thinking about your hand, your position, your play. He's there to gamble for the entertainment value. He got lucky. All you can do is hope he doesn't walk. If he sticks around, he'll give it back. The only dubious play here was calling the river bet. Many of these rec-fish will bet when they hit and check when they miss. I wasn't there, so I don't know if he's that type or the other type of rec-fish who get bluff-itis and hit every river whether they have something or not.

Either way, he's a hideous player. Just because you have that small blind "discount", a (2,5-off) isn't enough to defend. Getting coolered like that is frustrating, but if the fish never won one occasionally, they wouldn't play.