BitCoin
\Quote: GenoDRPhhttps://www.investopedia.com/what-can-you-buy-with-bitcoin-5179592
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Thanks for the link.
Where do the $$$ come from when cashing in. Businesses that accepted Bitcoin for their products and services now need currency to pay employees and buy stuff from entities that will not or do not accept Bitcoin as "legal" tender. There has to be a "roadblock" and somehow someone is going to be left holding an empty bag. Another words, there are no real tangible assets backing any of the transactions.
To put it another way, a $20 one oz. gold coin is legal tender to theoretically purchase $20 of goods and services, but the one oz. coin is actually worth around $1700. So, to spend that coin in a retail experience would not be prudent to say the least. The coin IS an asset unto itself whereas a Bitcoin is not.
tuttigym
"Just think Beanie Babies. Remember those?"
My stance has not changed one bit over the years. You cannot invent money out of thin air and make it work. It has to be grandfathered in over a very long period of time. Crypto will never work because how to rip it off is built into the system. This Bankman-Fried guy is not even sorry for what he did. He admits he lied about everything as far as him being a pro global warming vegan animal lover, he hit all the warm and fuzzy talking points to sucker people in. As I've said all along, it's the newest form of Ponzi scheme. Right now Bitcoin is down $3,400 for the month and I don't even know what the others are doing. What a farce this whole thing has been. I was in the collectible business for years and saw people make and lose fortunes and crypto is no different.
Not all unregulated online gambling venues are shady. Remember, The Wizard was a proud promoter of Bovada for years. But, the fact that there are approximately 10,000 online casinos on the net. there are going to be some rouge ones. Many of the once "shady" online casinos are now running the regulated ones. Were you coming to Vegas when the Mob ran it? Anytime there's money involved, there's going to be shady stuff going on.Quote: SOOPOOIt’s really not relevant that Billy and Wiz and I think Bitcoin is a scam of the ponzi variety. I have seen some 7 figure ‘art’ that to me would be worth less than $1.
I am sure there are some savvy traders that have bought and sold bitcoin depending on factors that I couldn’t figure out. And they are worth millions. A few years back step daughter bought dogecoin at a penny and sold at a nickel. She had real money to spend as a result.
I hate the entire concept of cryptocurrency. I am not unhappy that it has been exposed as riskier than everyone thought. But Axel has posted how it helps him in the shady unregulated online casino world. So it’s useful to him at least.
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Quote: AxelWolfNot all unregulated online gambling venues are shady. Remember, The Wizard was a proud promoter of Bovada for years. But, the fact that there are approximately 10,000 online casinos on the net. there are going to be some rouge ones. Many of the once "shady" online casinos are now running the regulated ones. Were you coming to Vegas when the Mob ran it? Anytime there's money involved, there's going to be shady stuff going on.Quote: SOOPOOIt’s really not relevant that Billy and Wiz and I think Bitcoin is a scam of the ponzi variety. I have seen some 7 figure ‘art’ that to me would be worth less than $1.
I am sure there are some savvy traders that have bought and sold bitcoin depending on factors that I couldn’t figure out. And they are worth millions. A few years back step daughter bought dogecoin at a penny and sold at a nickel. She had real money to spend as a result.
I hate the entire concept of cryptocurrency. I am not unhappy that it has been exposed as riskier than everyone thought. But Axel has posted how it helps him in the shady unregulated online casino world. So it’s useful to him at least.
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A fairly standard swindle is developing trust over time, then reel them in gradually or one big dump if they get bold. You never know for sure without some third-party reviewing action in random checks.
Even that is not perfect, but it's better than not doing it.
Quote: SOOPOOI am sure there are some savvy traders that have bought and sold bitcoin depending on factors that I couldn’t figure out. And they are worth millions. A few years back step daughter bought dogecoin at a penny and sold at a nickel. She had real money to spend as a result.
Sure. However, for penny somebody made, somebody else, eventually, will lose a penny. It's all based on nothing with no new wealth created, as opposed to investing in a legitimate business that actually produces a product or service. Bitcoin is a zero sum game.
Quote:I hate the entire concept of cryptocurrency. I am not unhappy that it has been exposed as riskier than everyone thought. But Axel has posted how it helps him in the shady unregulated online casino world. So it’s useful to him at least.
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It helps me too for the same reason, I'll grant it that.
Quote: Wizard
Sure. However, for penny somebody made, somebody else, eventually, will lose a penny. It's all based on nothing with no new wealth created, as opposed to investing in a legitimate business that actually produces a product or service. Bitcoin is a zero sum game.
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Right now the conservative estimate is Bankman-Fried owes his investors about 3.2 billion dollars. And he set out to do that, I think it went past his wildest expectations but he set out to rip people off because it was so easy. Crypto is a scheme, it's always been a scheme, it will always be a scheme. Back in the late 80s there was a cookie jar collecting craze. All the figural cookie jars made in the 1940s and 50s all of a sudden became extremely collectible. Things like Snow White and cookie jars shaped like giant apples became extremely expensive. So a bunch of manufacturers started making collectible expensive cookie jars and suckered in a whole lot of people. One guy I knew who refinished oak furniture and made a fortune doing it invested all his money in cookie jars. You couldn't talk him out of it and he died at age 57 from smoking 4 packs a day left all those cookie jars to his wife. She had to eventually have an auction and sold them for pennies on the dollar because they were by then worthless. It was a scheme just like crypto is a scheme.
Nope, I'm too lazy for that, but I have been into Bitcoin back when it was fairly low, I have sold off way more than I have ever invested, and traded some for other cryptos. The last time I bought bitcoin for an investment was at 5k, I was fairly confident it was a good buy.Quote: odiousgambitthere are no doubt 15 y.o. multi millionaires due to Bitcoin, on the other hand realize when it was $67,000 there was somebody who sold it at that price and somebody who bought it . Heard on the news somebody thinks 70% of investors have lost money on bitcoin [there has to be a consequence to the current price]Quote: SOOPOOIt’s really not relevant that Billy and Wiz and I think Bitcoin is a scam of the ponzi variety. I have seen some 7 figure ‘art’ that to me would be worth less than $1.
I am sure there are some savvy traders that have bought and sold bitcoin depending on factors that I couldn’t figure out. And they are worth millions. A few years back step daughter bought dogecoin at a penny and sold at a nickel. She had real money to spend as a result.I'd guess Axel buys it as needed and sells it immediatelyQuote:I hate the entire concept of cryptocurrency. I am not unhappy that it has been exposed as riskier than everyone thought. But Axel has posted how it helps him in the shady unregulated online casino world. So it’s useful to him at least.
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I'm just holding and letting the chips fall where they may, I'm gambling because I haven't any clue if BTC and other cryptos will go up or down. Obviously, I'm down a significant amount from my high.
I'm not new to this type of stuff, as I was caught up in the.com bubble as well. I made money on the .com stocks but sold it all way under my high. I just haven't any clue about stocks or crypto.
I remember when I was sitting at my computer on my E-trade account and thinking of buying Amazon right after the IPO. I only knew they sold books, I was thinking to myself, why would anyone want to buy books online when you can get E-books for free? F that, I'm buying more AOL.😅 I just know I haven't any clue what I'm doing when it comes to stocks and things like that, so I only ever invest amounts that won't negatively affect me enough to worry about it.
Quote: AxelWolf
I remember when I was sitting at my computer on my E-trade account and thinking of buying Amazon right after the IPO. I only knew they sold books, I was thinking to myself, why would anyone want to buy books online when you can get E-books for free? F that, I'm buying more AOL.😅 I just know I haven't any clue what I'm doing when it comes to stocks and things like that, so I only ever invest amounts that won't negatively affect me enough to worry about it.
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Don't feel bad, Mark Twain was offered to be an early investor in the telephone by Alexander Graham Bell and Mark Twain could not figure out what anybody would use the phone for other than making a doctor's appointment or ordering groceries. He dismissed it nd wasted all his money on a self type setting printing press for the newspaper business and lost all his money. If he had invested in the telephone he would have been rich beyond his wildest dreams. Bill Gates said in 1992 he could not figure out any use for the internet other than as a curiosity and so he invested nothing in it. In 1997 he said if you had told me in 1992 I would be seeing internet addresses on McDonald's TV commercials I would have called you a liar. So no matter how smart you are it's very hard to predict the future. With crypto all you have to know is that it's always been a scheme, and that tells you everything. No predicting needed. Schemes always eventually fail, 100% of the time.
Quote: AxelWolf
I remember when I was sitting at my computer on my E-trade account and thinking of buying Amazon right after the IPO. I only knew they sold books, I was thinking to myself, why would anyone want to buy books online when you can get E-books for free? F that, I'm buying more AOL.😅 I just know I haven't any clue what I'm doing when it comes to stocks and things like that, so I only ever invest amounts that won't negatively affect me enough to worry about it.
Sorry to hear about your poor stock picking but it makes me feel better than I am not the only one that has been unsuccessful. Now I pretty much just buy mutual funds and let someone else pick the stocks. I do keep an ETrade account for what I call my fun picks. Usually I am buying small amounts of stock and happy I only bought small amounts as most of them go down.
https://www.bankrate.com/investing/how-to-cash-out-crypto-bitcoin/
Say a BC is worth $16,000 and you purchase $1,000 in goods from a merchant. You wouldn't give the merchant a single BC worth $16,000 as you would give a merchant a $20 bill for a pack of gum and she'd give you change back. You would use your bitcoin debit card to give her $1,000, just like using a credit or debit card at a store, and that would come out of your BC wallet..The BC debit card would convert your BC into dollars at the point in time and space of the sale, and deposit that cash into the merchant's account. In this particular case, your wallet would then be lessened by 1/16 of a bitcoin. Where does the cash the BC debit card uses come from? I presume the BC debit card issuer sells this 1/16 of BC on a BC exchange at the time you are using your BC debit card and gives that cash to the merchant. Many BC debit card are prepaid-you give BC on an exchange and load that cash onto the card.
Be advised, this is extent of my bitcoin knowledge, which I have gleened from google. I consider it all a fugazi.
Quote: EvenBobQuote: AxelWolf
I remember when I was sitting at my computer on my E-trade account and thinking of buying Amazon right after the IPO. I only knew they sold books, I was thinking to myself, why would anyone want to buy books online when you can get E-books for free? F that, I'm buying more AOL.😅 I just know I haven't any clue what I'm doing when it comes to stocks and things like that, so I only ever invest amounts that won't negatively affect me enough to worry about it.
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Don't feel bad, Mark Twain was offered to be an early investor in the telephone by Alexander Graham Bell and Mark Twain could not figure out what anybody would use the phone for other than making a doctor's appointment or ordering groceries. He dismissed it nd wasted all his money on a self type setting printing press for the newspaper business and lost all his money. If he had invested in the telephone he would have been rich beyond his wildest dreams. Bill Gates said in 1992 he could not figure out any use for the internet other than as a curiosity and so he invested nothing in it. In 1997 he said if you had told me in 1992 I would be seeing internet addresses on McDonald's TV commercials I would have called you a liar. So no matter how smart you are it's very hard to predict the future. With crypto all you have to know is that it's always been a scheme, and that tells you everything. No predicting needed. Schemes always eventually fail, 100% of the time.
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More people have made money buying crypto currency than have beaten Roulette.
Maybe buying crypto is a scheme but beating roulette is a fantasy.
I can't really complain, I'm up on stocks, investments, and crypto overall, just nowhere near what I could be if I paid more attention or actually knew what I was doing. I do think BTC will go back up, but I'm not willing to buy any, I will just hold whatever I have or get.Quote: DRichQuote: AxelWolf
I remember when I was sitting at my computer on my E-trade account and thinking of buying Amazon right after the IPO. I only knew they sold books, I was thinking to myself, why would anyone want to buy books online when you can get E-books for free? F that, I'm buying more AOL.😅 I just know I haven't any clue what I'm doing when it comes to stocks and things like that, so I only ever invest amounts that won't negatively affect me enough to worry about it.
Sorry to hear about your poor stock picking but it makes me feel better than I am not the only one that has been unsuccessful. Now I pretty much just buy mutual funds and let someone else pick the stocks. I do keep an ETrade account for what I call my fun picks. Usually I am buying small amounts of stock and happy I only bought small amounts as most of them go down.
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Quote: GenoDRPhMultiple ways to convert Bitcoin to cash:
https://www.bankrate.com/investing/how-to-cash-out-crypto-bitcoin/
Say a BC is worth $16,000 and you purchase $1,000 in goods from a merchant. You wouldn't give the merchant a single BC worth $16,000 as you would give a merchant a $20 bill for a pack of gum and she'd give you change back. You would use your bitcoin debit card to give her $1,000, just like using a credit or debit card at a store, and that would come out of your BC wallet..The BC debit card would convert your BC into dollars at the point in time and space of the sale, and deposit that cash into the merchant's account. In this particular case, your wallet would then be lessened by 1/16 of a bitcoin. Where does the cash the BC debit card uses come from? I presume the BC debit card issuer sells this 1/16 of BC on a BC exchange at the time you are using your BC debit card and gives that cash to the merchant. Many BC debit card are prepaid-you give BC on an exchange and load that cash onto the card.
Be advised, this is extent of my bitcoin knowledge, which I have gleened from google. I consider it all a fugazi.
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This is kind of what the lightning network is about. I am still trying to figure it out but the way I see it you post some BTC as collateral then you trade smaller amounts, 1/100 millionth units, for routine transactions. Sort of like posting cash at the casino cage then using cheques. Now, if someone knows this and can explain better please do as I need to learn it more.
The current crypto winter is just one in a series. Next halving in 2024, historically then you get a boom.
Quote: AZDuffmanQuote: GenoDRPhMultiple ways to convert Bitcoin to cash:
https://www.bankrate.com/investing/how-to-cash-out-crypto-bitcoin/
Say a BC is worth $16,000 and you purchase $1,000 in goods from a merchant. You wouldn't give the merchant a single BC worth $16,000 as you would give a merchant a $20 bill for a pack of gum and she'd give you change back. You would use your bitcoin debit card to give her $1,000, just like using a credit or debit card at a store, and that would come out of your BC wallet..The BC debit card would convert your BC into dollars at the point in time and space of the sale, and deposit that cash into the merchant's account. In this particular case, your wallet would then be lessened by 1/16 of a bitcoin. Where does the cash the BC debit card uses come from? I presume the BC debit card issuer sells this 1/16 of BC on a BC exchange at the time you are using your BC debit card and gives that cash to the merchant. Many BC debit card are prepaid-you give BC on an exchange and load that cash onto the card.
Be advised, this is extent of my bitcoin knowledge, which I have gleened from google. I consider it all a fugazi.
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This is kind of what the lightning network is about. I am still trying to figure it out but the way I see it you post some BTC as collateral then you trade smaller amounts, 1/100 millionth units, for routine transactions. Sort of like posting cash at the casino cage then using cheques. Now, if someone knows this and can explain better please do as I need to learn it more.
The current crypto winter is just one in a series. Next halving in 2024, historically then you get a boom.
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So far correct.
And then historically when it halves the naysayers point to the high and exclaim what a beanie baby!
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
Quote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Is Bitcoin a product?
Quote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Up 400% since the virus hit. You must either accept wild swings or just invest elsewhere. The utility is there. Adoption takes time.
Quote: AZDuffmanQuote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Up 400% since the virus hit. You must either accept wild swings or just invest elsewhere. The utility is there. Adoption takes time.
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Exactly.
You gotta love people who only speak up when the price goes down and become eerily silent when it goes up.
Quote: AZDuffmanQuote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Up 400% since the virus hit. You must either accept wild swings or just invest elsewhere. The utility is there. Adoption takes time.
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I'm a fan of bitcoin, I think it's useful for various things. I think it's a good buy right now with the intention of selling it for a profit. What that number is, I haven't a clue, I'm just guessing it will get back to at least 20k.
With that being said: Here are some of my questions, concerns, and thoughts on Bitcoin.
Bitcoin was supposed to give you anonymity, but unless you understand all the details jump through hoops and you're buying and selling on the streets or some complex mixing, it's not.
Bitcoin was supposed to be fast but it's not all that fast.
I think the mass Adoption ship has sailed. Supposedly crypto is still in its infancy, but It's been long enough for BTC, most everyone who was going to embrace bitcoin has done so already. Sure new people will come in but many people will now exit, especially after this FTX debacle.
I remember hearing how everyone was going to be using BitCoin to pay for their daily goods and services with BTC, when that didn't happen people claim it was because people didn't want to spend their BTC since it was more of an investment and store of value.
A few major reasons people were touting as to why BitCoin was a good buy such as "a hedge against inflation" and " A good store of value." That hasn't been the case so far.
Understanding bitcoin for the average person is complicated. Volatility, Hard wallets, cold wallets, hot wallets, Crypto exchanges, crypto apps, hash numbers, blockchains, crypto keys, seed phrases, sending addresses, receiving addresses, tax issues, forks, bitcoin cash, ledgers, multiple receiving addresses, etc, etc.
I understand that people don't need to understand all of that to use or invest in bitcoin since there are apps and exchanges that do all that for you but, try convincing the average person their crypto is safe and it's a good investment. During the hype and run-up that wouldn't be all that hard when you add in FOMO. But now, I think it's a much harder sell.
And then there's the entire non-eco-friendly mining aspect. The dark web stuff, the scams, the 10,000 other crypto coins.
I understand that all other systems have issues with fraud, lots of fees, etc but there are some safeguards in place. When it comes to BTC It doesn't even matter what the truth actually is and if there's a solution, it really only matters what the masses believe to be true.
My questions. What's BTC good for when it comes to the average everyday person, and why would they want to mess with it at this point? Why would someone want to use it as a store of value with all the volatility and problems?
I don't know what will happen with the price of bitcoin, but Bitcoin is definitely not going away.Quote: darkozQuote: AZDuffmanQuote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Up 400% since the virus hit. You must either accept wild swings or just invest elsewhere. The utility is there. Adoption takes time.
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Exactly.
You gotta love people who only speak up when the price goes down and become eerily silent when it goes up.
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Quote: darkozQuote: AZDuffmanQuote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Up 400% since the virus hit. You must either accept wild swings or just invest elsewhere. The utility is there. Adoption takes time.
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Exactly.
You gotta love people who only speak up when the price goes down and become eerily silent when it goes up.
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I completely ignored bitcoin here until you and others started raving about it when it hit $60,000. At that point, I called it a scam and incredibly overpriced. I said it was a bad buy at $60K, was bad at 40K, the same thing at $25,000 and still say it is a horrible investment if it falls below 15K. Can you show me a period that has gone up in the last two years? It's been on a downward spiral, and no one can explain why it won't continue.
The lookie -loos and toe dippers tried bitcoin and didn't care for it.
I find it hilarious that you still keep trying to prop up this dead horse and give grief to the ones who called it correctly.
The next halving is well over a year away. If it loses another 75% next year, what kind of boost can you expect?
Quote: billryanCan you show me a period that has gone up in the last two years?
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Seriously?
I assume you know that two years prior to 2022 is 2020?
Can you explain how Bircoin is a scam in and of itself? I'm not talking about people or companies that use it to scam others. That's done with all major payment systems and anything related to value. I just want to understand how it's a scam. As far as I know it does what it's made to do.Quote: billryanQuote: darkozQuote: AZDuffmanQuote: billryanYou have to love the child-like innocence of people defending a product that has lost 75% of its value in the last year, and has had many of its biggest proponents exposed as frauds.
Better days are coming. Keep hope alive. Better days are coming.
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Up 400% since the virus hit. You must either accept wild swings or just invest elsewhere. The utility is there. Adoption takes time.
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Exactly.
You gotta love people who only speak up when the price goes down and become eerily silent when it goes up.
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I completely ignored bitcoin here until you and others started raving about it when it hit $60,000. At that point, I called it a scam and incredibly overpriced. I said it was a bad buy at $60K, was bad at 40K, the same thing at $25,000 and still say it is a horrible investment if it falls below 15K. Can you show me a period that has gone up in the last two years? It's been on a downward spiral, and no one can explain why it won't continue.
The lookie -loos and toe dippers tried bitcoin and didn't care for it.
I find it hilarious that you still keep trying to prop up this dead horse and give grief to the ones who called it correctly.
The next halving is well over a year away. If it loses another 75% next year, what kind of boost can you expect?
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You wrote earlier that bitcoin was promoted as being a hedge against inflation. If I sold you a product and said it was a hedge against inflation, and it lost 75% of its value, would you feel scammed?
Quote: billryanYou can't separate the two. What bitcoin was created to do is fine. What people have done with it is criminal, or would be if anyone regulated it. There are countless articles by people who write far better and have more technical knowledge that can explain it much better than I can.
You wrote earlier that bitcoin was promoted as being a hedge against inflation. If I sold you a product and said it was a hedge against inflation, and it lost 75% of its value, would you feel scammed?
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If that's your metric then the US dollar is a scam.
Are you suggesting the US dollar hasn't been involved in scams from Ponzi schemes to CC fraud over the two hundred years of its existence?
That you can't separate the scammer from the currency explains why you also can't understand how Bitcoin even works (as you admit when you say you don't have the technical knowledge).
Just to show how ridiculous your question about the 75% drop is I have a close friend who purchased a house for $750,000 right before the housing market crashed. He ended up going through a messy divorce and they couldn't sell the house for more than $250,000.
You feel he got scammed? That whenever prices go down on investment it's a scam?
That's what Bitcoin enthusiasts and bulls have said, that was a theory and what some individuals have said, it's no difference between that and the silver enthusiasts and bulls touting silver would be $50 -$100 an ounce by now. I was buying silver between $17-$19 an ounce when BTC was $720 per coin, which one do you think I wish I bought? I was told silver would go through the roof. It was supposedly extra good because of the pandemic. and bullet rounds would make me rich, but neither happened, Should I feel scammed? BTC did go through the roof during that time, imagine that. None one here has any clue what's going up or down, they are just guessing. YOU ARE LITERALLY ON THE SAME SIDE(with a similar mindset) AS A GUY WHO CLAIMS HE CAN BEAT ROULETTE WITH AN 80% HIT RATE(let that sink in).Quote: billryanYou can't separate the two. What bitcoin was created to do is fine. What people have done with it is criminal, or would be if anyone regulated it. There are countless articles by people who write far better and have more technical knowledge that can explain it much better than I can.
You wrote earlier that bitcoin was promoted as being a hedge against inflation. If I sold you a product and said it was a hedge against inflation, and it lost 75% of its value, would you feel scammed?
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You look at BTC 16,000 as a failure but considering it started a zero and its been around for more than a decade I can't call that a failure or a scam.
Quote: darkozQuote: billryanYou can't separate the two. What bitcoin was created to do is fine. What people have done with it is criminal, or would be if anyone regulated it. There are countless articles by people who write far better and have more technical knowledge that can explain it much better than I can.
You wrote earlier that bitcoin was promoted as being a hedge against inflation. If I sold you a product and said it was a hedge against inflation, and it lost 75% of its value, would you feel scammed?
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If that's your metric then the US dollar is a scam.
Are you suggesting the US dollar hasn't been involved in scams from Ponzi schemes to CC fraud over the two hundred years of its existence?
That you can't separate the scammer from the currency explains why you also can't understand how Bitcoin even works (as you admit when you say you don't have the technical knowledge).
Just to show how ridiculous your question about the 75% drop is I have a close friend who purchased a house for $750,000 right before the housing market crashed. He ended up going through a messy divorce and they couldn't sell the house for more than $250,000.
You feel he got scammed? That whenever prices go down on investment it's a scam?
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You keep posting a lot, yet say nothing. It's an interesting style. It reminds me of Bruce Lees "fighting by not fighting"
You bring up an individual who supposedly lost 75% on a house, compare it to the entire CC market and you wonder why no one takes you seriously.
Quote: AxelWolfThat's what Bitcoin enthusiasts and bulls have said, that was a theory and what some individuals have said, it's no difference between that and the silver enthusiasts and bulls touting silver would be $50 -$100 an ounce by now. I was buying silver between $17-$19 an ounce when BTC was $720 per coin, which one do you think I wish I bought? I was told silver would go through the roof. It was supposedly extra good because of the pandemic. and bullet rounds would make me rich, but neither happened, Should I feel scammed? BTC did go through the roof during that time, imagine that. None one here has any clue what's going up or down, they are just guessing. YOU ARE LITERALLY ON THE SAME SIDE(with a similar mindset) AS A GUY WHO CLAIMS HE CAN BEAT ROULETTE WITH AN 80% HIT RATE(let that sink in).Quote: billryanYou can't separate the two. What bitcoin was created to do is fine. What people have done with it is criminal, or would be if anyone regulated it. There are countless articles by people who write far better and have more technical knowledge that can explain it much better than I can.
You wrote earlier that bitcoin was promoted as being a hedge against inflation. If I sold you a product and said it was a hedge against inflation, and it lost 75% of its value, would you feel scammed?
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You look at BTC 16,000 as a failure but considering it started a zero and its been around for more than a decade I can't call that a failure or a scam.
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I'm looking at an instrument that has lost 75% of its value, lost all of its forward momenta, and whose biggest proponents seem to be facing a lot of scrutiny from the justice department.
Let's reverse the roles. You are the wise old investment counselor, and I come to you for investment advice.
In 100 words of less, explain why you think bitcoin is the place to invest. Help me grasp the fundamentals and
show me fact-based projections.
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
Buy mo' now. Invest with confidence. If it is good enuff for Tom Brady, what could go wrong?
Quote: billryanEuropean officials shut down Polibus Bank after it is revealed to be a front for an almost 600 million-dollar crypto scheme.
Buy mo' now. Invest with confidence. If it is good enuff for Tom Brady, what could go wrong?
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US officials shut down Gina Champions lending company after she did a $350 million US Cash Ponzi scheme
The US dollar is clearly a fraud.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.oxygen.com/crime-news/gina-champion-cain-convicted-of-largest-female-run-ponzi-scheme%3famp
Quote: darkozQuote: billryanEuropean officials shut down Polibus Bank after it is revealed to be a front for an almost 600 million-dollar crypto scheme.
Buy mo' now. Invest with confidence. If it is good enuff for Tom Brady, what could go wrong?
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US officials shut down Gina Champions lending company after she did a $350 million US Cash Ponzi scheme
The US dollar is clearly a fraud.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.oxygen.com/crime-news/gina-champion-cain-convicted-of-largest-female-run-ponzi-scheme%3famp
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The USD lost 2/3 of its value vs the Yen between 1970 and 1995. Must be a fraud!
Quote: billryan
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
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I get the same thing from my wife I try to pull her off the slot machines after she's lost $400. She always says I just saw somebody win $300 5 minutes ago so I can do it too. Faulty logic, bad investment advice. Somebody else somewhere sometime made money doing this so you can too.
Quote: billryanEuropean officials shut down Polibus Bank after it is revealed to be a front for an almost 600 million-dollar crypto scheme.
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The word crypto should always be followed by the word 'scheme' so people know how to put it in perspective and know what they are getting into. For instance the words time sharing should also be followed by the word 'scheme'.
Quote: EvenBobQuote: billryanEuropean officials shut down Polibus Bank after it is revealed to be a front for an almost 600 million-dollar crypto scheme.
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The word crypto should always be followed by the word 'scheme' so people know how to put it in perspective and know what they are getting into. For instance the words time sharing should also be followed by the word 'scheme'.
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Funny thing about timeshares. If done wrong, they suck. Done right, they are great.
I've owned two since 2000 and pay $51 monthly for maintenance. That is supposed to get me a week in any Wyndham, but by avoiding peak times, I can trade it for three weeks in other spots, and for $259 a week, I can stay at the timeshare next to South Point three weeks a month if I wanted.
One deed I got off of eBay for $65 before I knew better, and the second I got for free because the owner didn't want to pay the $20 a month fees anymore. Buy them from Wyndham, and they would run you $25,000, and they'll finance you at 15%.
Quote: AxelWolfMy questions. What's BTC good for when it comes to the average everyday person, and why would they want to mess with it at this point? Why would someone want to use it as a store of value with all the volatility and problems?
These questions should be always asked when there is a conversation about BC. What tangible assets are backing the instruments, and how easily can the instrument be converted to $$$?
tuttigym
Quote: EvenBobQuote: billryan
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
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I get the same thing from my wife I try to pull her off the slot machines after she's lost $400. She always says I just saw somebody win $300 5 minutes ago so I can do it too. Faulty logic, bad investment advice. Somebody else somewhere sometime made money doing this so you can too.
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"Yeah? I just saw a dozen people lose $500."
Quote: DieterQuote: EvenBobQuote: billryan
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
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I get the same thing from my wife I try to pull her off the slot machines after she's lost $400. She always says I just saw somebody win $300 5 minutes ago so I can do it too. Faulty logic, bad investment advice. Somebody else somewhere sometime made money doing this so you can too.
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"Yeah? I just saw a dozen people lose $500."
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And I am still waiting for someone to hit with an 80% success rate.
Perhaps"80% hit rate at roulette" should be followed by the words "scheme" and "fraud" to alert less savvy gamblers what they are reading about
Quote: darkozQuote: DieterQuote: EvenBobQuote: billryan
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
link to original post
I get the same thing from my wife I try to pull her off the slot machines after she's lost $400. She always says I just saw somebody win $300 5 minutes ago so I can do it too. Faulty logic, bad investment advice. Somebody else somewhere sometime made money doing this so you can too.
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"Yeah? I just saw a dozen people lose $500."
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And I am still waiting for someone to hit with an 80% success rate.
Perhaps"80% hit rate at roulette" should be followed by the words "scheme" and "fraud" to alert less savvy gamblers what they are reading about
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Mr Wizard just shut down a 150 plus page thread that did just that.
Quote: billryanQuote: darkozQuote: DieterQuote: EvenBobQuote: billryan
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
link to original post
I get the same thing from my wife I try to pull her off the slot machines after she's lost $400. She always says I just saw somebody win $300 5 minutes ago so I can do it too. Faulty logic, bad investment advice. Somebody else somewhere sometime made money doing this so you can too.
link to original post
"Yeah? I just saw a dozen people lose $500."
link to original post
And I am still waiting for someone to hit with an 80% success rate.
Perhaps"80% hit rate at roulette" should be followed by the words "scheme" and "fraud" to alert less savvy gamblers what they are reading about
link to original post
Mr Wizard just shut down a 150 plus page thread that did just that.
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Bill
You asked for anyone to prove Bitcoin had upwards movement in the last two years.
I posted it and you ignored it.
So here it is again.
Quote: tuttigymQuote: AxelWolfMy questions. What's BTC good for when it comes to the average everyday person, and why would they want to mess with it at this point? Why would someone want to use it as a store of value with all the volatility and problems?
These questions should be always asked when there is a conversation about BC. What tangible assets are backing the instruments, and how easily can the instrument be converted to $$$?
tuttigym
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You know there is no tangible asset that backs up the US dollar now? I don’t own any crypto, and hate the idea of them. But the name ‘Tiger Woods’ is worth tens of millions without including a ‘tangible asset’ backing it up.
If I was selling something for $160k and someone said they will pay but only if I take Bitcoin, and they’d give me 10 BTC (assume BTC last trade was $16.5k) I’d take it. I’m sure it would take me less than a day to have $160k in my bank account, maybe a tad more, because I am not aware of what fees would be involved.
Answering Billy, I HATE crypto, and generally applaud all your posts on the subject. But it’s NOT about you and me. If there enough doofuses that want to buy, for WHATEVER reason, it will go up.
How about a bet? I bet it hits $20k before $12k. $100? You want some action?
DRich asked earlier if I thought bitcoin was a product. That is one of the many problems with bit and any crypto. What is it? It's not currency. It's not a stock, it's not a financial instrument. The best answer is it is a collectible. It's only worth what someone wants to pay for it. What happens in the world of collectibles?
FTX has exposed the industry for what it is. Many knew it ahead of time, but some people needed to learn the hard way. Then there will be those who see the same information everyone else sees, but because they are more clever than us, will see patterns we mortals aren't privy to.
The full faith of the United States backs the US Dollar. You might ask the Kaiser, Hitler, or Saddam Hussien just what that means.
What backs crypto? It appears like the answer might have been SBF, a bunch of paid celebrities and some random internet trolls.
I agree the hype is over and I don't think we are going to see BTC getting back to it's highs anytime soon. The blockchain was supposed to change the world, and perhaps it will, but I haven't seen it and probably won't be around when or if it does.Quote: billryanQuote: AxelWolfThat's what Bitcoin enthusiasts and bulls have said, that was a theory and what some individuals have said, it's no difference between that and the silver enthusiasts and bulls touting silver would be $50 -$100 an ounce by now. I was buying silver between $17-$19 an ounce when BTC was $720 per coin, which one do you think I wish I bought? I was told silver would go through the roof. It was supposedly extra good because of the pandemic. and bullet rounds would make me rich, but neither happened, Should I feel scammed? BTC did go through the roof during that time, imagine that. None one here has any clue what's going up or down, they are just guessing. YOU ARE LITERALLY ON THE SAME SIDE(with a similar mindset) AS A GUY WHO CLAIMS HE CAN BEAT ROULETTE WITH AN 80% HIT RATE(let that sink in).Quote: billryanYou can't separate the two. What bitcoin was created to do is fine. What people have done with it is criminal, or would be if anyone regulated it. There are countless articles by people who write far better and have more technical knowledge that can explain it much better than I can.
You wrote earlier that bitcoin was promoted as being a hedge against inflation. If I sold you a product and said it was a hedge against inflation, and it lost 75% of its value, would you feel scammed?
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You look at BTC 16,000 as a failure but considering it started a zero and its been around for more than a decade I can't call that a failure or a scam.
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I'm looking at an instrument that has lost 75% of its value, lost all of its forward momenta, and whose biggest proponents seem to be facing a lot of scrutiny from the justice department.
Let's reverse the roles. You are the wise old investment counselor, and I come to you for investment advice.
In 100 words of less, explain why you think bitcoin is the place to invest. Help me grasp the fundamentals and
show me fact-based projections.
I've been asking for two years, but all I get is the early speculators all made a fortune, so it must be a solid investment.
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I can't tell you or anyone what's a solid investment, I said this many times. I'm sure we can find a long list of stocks that have fallen 75% or more in recent years. Is Netflix a scam? it's been around for 10 years or so and didn't it lose around 60% of its value in a year?
I did tell my nephew to buy BTC when it dropped to around 4k-5k(He has the money to invest without any issue) IIRC he did well and sold it above 35k. I also suggested someone stop investing their AP bankroll into bitcoin when it was 50k+. They were investing in BTC instead of good plays, I thought that was absolutely retarded. They kept telling me about all the money they were missing out on whenever they used it for AP. ◄◄I can't even...
Whatever the case, I'm just trying to understand how/why it's a scam.
Quote: SOOPOO
You know there is no tangible asset that backs up the US dollar now?
Sure there is and you're surrounded by it every time you leave your house. As you drive down the road look to the left and right you'll see nothing but homes worth hundreds of thousands of dollars or businesses worth millions of dollars. Look at the cars people are driving, most of them valued at tens of thousands of dollars. Look at the infrastructure you're surrounded with, look at the wealth of your average neighborhood in the United States. Then you go to a third world country in Asia or Africa and look at what you see. That's what the value of the dollar comes from, the incredible amount of wealth we aren't even aware of that we're surrounded by. I live in a Township with a small village yet it has 8 banks. Practically a bank on every corner. These are hugely well-known banks, and you'll find this all over the country. You do not realize how much wealth is here until you go somewhere else and see how much wealth they don't have.
Quote: AxelWolf
Whatever the case, I'm just trying to understand how/why it's a scam.
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Right now there are over 4,000 different kinds of crypto, how many of those do you think are scams. I'll tell you how many, all of them. They were all invented with an agenda to make the originator rich. They are all unregulated, need I go on? They have scheme and scam written all over them.
