Unbalanced dice researcher arrested in Vegas?
Quote: DanMahoneyEarly Thursday morning I witnessed a remarkable event. One local from Vegas, a well known, crack, unbalanced dice researcher was jerked off of a craps table at Paris (i.e., the first table encountered on the walkway from Ballys). He was searched and made to take off his shoes. When security shook his shoes a die from each of his shoes fell from holes drilled in the bottom soles of each shoes. The unbalanced dice researcher was then hauled away by security. Based on the little I know about Vegas, except what I absorbed from the movie Casino, we should all pray for his well being.
WHAT??? WOW! VERY Interesting. You heard it here first.
PLEASE MORE DETAILS. start from the beginning. Is this a member here? I'm not sure if he is, if that's something you'll be suspended for saying his WOV name. However, if it's just a YouTube name I can't see why you can't.
Can someone explain exactly what he was doing? Sound like when dice flew off the table, he would somehow step on it and wedge it in the hole. But now we have a missing die. Sure, occasionally a die may actually get lost, but if the dice thief could see where the dice went, certainly others could. So unless he was swapping out dice on the floor(do they let customers retrieve dice?) I can't really understand all of this.
It almost sounds like he WAS cheating. Perhaps he was counterfeiting dice, altering the dice and then swapping them? Do they check serial numbers immediately once they hit the floor and return? This may be a serious cheating operation.
Looks like criminal charges either way. If he was just stealing dice and not trying to cheat. I'm wondering what they will go after him for?
How will he prove he wasn't trying to cheat?
Why would someone risk going to jail just to prove biased dice? Is there lots of money in selling the verified dice or something, or in proving this?
The way I read DanMahoney's post makes me think the dice researcher would step on the dice to capture them, so he could take them home and experiment with them....instead of leaning down, picking up a die, and swooping it into his pocket. If this is the case, then he wasn't cheating, but he would be stealing.
Also, the burden is on the casino to prove he was cheating, since he didn't do anything cheat-worthy, he only stole dice (maybe stole dice?). But if he was introducing new dice into the game, then yeah, he was cheating and there's a chocolate cake not being eaten by a fatty's chance he's not going to prison.
How often is it that dice actually get lost? how long or how many tries would it take for a seemingly good opportunity to arise before someone could reasonably attempt this?Quote: RSYes, people retrieve the dice all the time. They just hand it to the dealer and the dealer gives the die to the box person (the floor man). The floor man is supposed to verify the serial # on it, but it seems like oftentimes, they don't look at the serial number. They spin it a few times, move it around a little, then put the die back in play.
The way I read DanMahoney's post makes me think the dice researcher would step on the dice to capture them, so he could take them home and experiment with them....instead of leaning down, picking up a die, and swooping it into his pocket. If this is the case, then he wasn't cheating, but he would be stealing.
Also, the burden is on the casino to prove he was cheating, since he didn't do anything cheat-worthy, he only stole dice (maybe stole dice?). But if he was introducing new dice into the game, then yeah, he was cheating and there's a chocolate cake not being eaten by a fatty's chance he's not going to prison.
You wouldn't notice this yourself easily? I can see how it would, and could work under rare circumstances, but it seems likely you would get caught.
Perhaps its just petty theft, and it was worth the risk to prove something. I still think that an attorney is going to be needed, because they are not going to just believe he was going though all that, just to take dice.
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Now lets assume they search his house and find casino dice that have been altered ("for experimentation") is that considered possession of a cheating device?
PS would be funny if its his first time.
It is weird that he had TWO dice though (if that part is actually true). I'm quite suspicious of the story being true at face value. Something seems very weird, here. Or else, maybe the guy was a total idiot and thought he could swoop up 2 dice, continue hanging around / playing, and wouldn't get caught? Idk...
As far as possession of a cheating device...I don't know the laws in that regard. But I suspect you'd have to be using the device, in the casino, in a way to alter the odds, for it to be illegal. I don't think simply possessing a device or even possessing a cheating device in a casino is illegal.....you'd have to be using the device for it to be illegal.
Quote: DanMahoneyEarly Thursday morning I witnessed a remarkable event.
Good eye! Thanks for the report. I hope to hear from about the incident.
the venetian is the only casino in town that destroys its used dice, everyone else drills them and sells them in the gift shop.
Just an idiot who wanted to get two at a time and didn't think the crew would be suspicious as to where that darned die had actually rolled ... after being near that Jerk twice.
Quote: DeMangoSo is there a police record of this event? LVRJ?
Probably not, no one wants adverse publicity. He was probably stealing two samples to take home with him to test and destroy, not re-use. why would a casino create bad headlines when they can trespass him and have him sign a confession.
If you know his name, anyone in the detention center is available on line.
Quote: DanMahoneyEarly Thursday morning I witnessed a remarkable event. One local from Vegas, a well known, crack, unbalanced dice researcher was jerked off of a craps table at Paris (i.e., the first table encountered on the walkway from Ballys). He was searched and made to take off his shoes. When security shook his shoes a die from each of his shoes fell from holes drilled in the bottom soles of each shoes. The unbalanced dice researcher was then hauled away by security. Based on the little I know about Vegas, except what I absorbed from the movie Casino, we should all pray for his well being.
A couple issues with this report:
How would the OP just happen to know the identity of this "crack, unbalanced dice researcher?"
Would security search a player publicly, e.g. on the casino floor as the OP reports, or would they escort a suspect off the floor and do it privately?
I actually think its illegal to be in possession of a cheating device in Nevada. Order up a light wand or something like that, toss it in you car and test the theory for us.Quote: RSDice get thrown off the table all the time. But it is very rare for a die to actually get lost and never recovered. I remember one time, a die was thrown off the table and ended up (somehow) ending up underneath a slot machine, or something like that. The only other time a die wasn't recovered is because someone walking by grabbed it and put it in his pocket and walked off with it (no one saw it at the time)....surveillance was called, the guy was confronted and told to give up the die he swooped or get 86'd (and arrested?).
It is weird that he had TWO dice though (if that part is actually true). I'm quite suspicious of the story being true at face value. Something seems very weird, here. Or else, maybe the guy was a total idiot and thought he could swoop up 2 dice, continue hanging around / playing, and wouldn't get caught? Idk...
As far as possession of a cheating device...I don't know the laws in that regard. But I suspect you'd have to be using the device, in the casino, in a way to alter the odds, for it to be illegal. I don't think simply possessing a device or even possessing a cheating device in a casino is illegal.....you'd have to be using the device for it to be illegal.
The story seems bizarre but why would someone make this up? I was wondering about open searching myself, but sometimes they don't think, I have seen someone searched in the open. They may be afraid of the evidence disappearing or something.Quote: MrVA couple issues with this report:
How would the OP just happen to know the identity of this "crack, unbalanced dice researcher?"
Would security search a player publicly, e.g. on the casino floor as the OP reports, or would they escort a suspect off the floor and do it privately?
Quote: FleaStiffHeck, he probably was just trying to obtain a pair of dice and then prove to himself that dice as in actual use are not perfect.
the venetian is the only casino in town that destroys its used dice, everyone else drills them and sells them in the gift shop.
But not necessarily in their own gift shop. In past trips, I noticed that Planet Hollywood, Rio, and Cosmopolitan did not sell their own dice ("I went to the gift shop and asked for dice, but it was no dice"), but the gift shop at Them - er, The M - did. Slots O Fun also sold dice from other casinos (MLife ones, I think).
Quote: jeffwarren75Is anyone sure this is not a joke
Nobody's laughing.
The thing about the post that raised my guard is that the OP claims to know little about Las Vegas ("Based on the little I know about Vegas, except what I absorbed from the movie Casino, we should all pray for his well being"), yet somehow he recognizes that the person in question was in fact the "unbalanced dice researcher."
Really?
How could he possibly have determined that?
Answer: he couldn't.
Quote: DeMangoThis is not the first time. I have known about this happening years ago. A friend of a friend of a friend. I mentioned this on the bias thread I believe. Wonder if my mentioning this on the board incited him to try again?
Just for a reference from here
Quote: DeMangoHere is how you do it. You cut a hole in your shoe. You have a friend toss the dice off the table. Your shoe "pockets" the die, it cannot be found. Then do the testing at home. What were the results??
It should also be noted that ANYONE cheating harms EVERYONE (players and casinos alike) by cheating.
Quote: jeffwarren75Is anyone sure this is not a joke
I don't believe it.
ZCore13
It can't be a "joke" technically because it's not funny.
It might be a lie though.
However, if true, I accept the concept of doing the search right there at the scene. Escorting the accused to the back room can give him the time and opportunity to dump the dice along the way.
Quote: AxelWolfThe story seems bizarre but why would someone make this up? I was wondering about open searching myself, but sometimes they don't think, I have seen someone searched in the open. They may be afraid of the evidence disappearing or something.
Because they can, and everybody is eating it up!
Quote: superrickBecause they can, and everybody is eating it up!
The funny thing is nobody believes in bad dice, but everybody believes this story!
Quote: superrickThe funny thing is nobody believes in bad dice, but everybody believes this story!
I wouldn't say "everybody." There's no such thing as a "well-known, crack, unbalanced dice researcher."
There are apparently many anonymous, crackpot, biased dice conspiracy theorists though.
Quote: DJTeddyBearI also question its validity.
However, if true, I accept the concept of doing the search right there at the scene. Escorting the accused to the back room can give him the time and opportunity to dump the dice along the way.
Do you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
Quote: petroglyphDo you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
There is no good reason to visit Canada. Unless you're moose hunting...that's a very good reason to visit Canada.
What consequences for prevarication?
Quote: MrVIt's pretty obvious that the OP, Dan Mahoney (!) made this nonsense up.
What consequences for prevarication?
obvious?
Quote: RSQuote: petroglyphDo you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
There is no good reason to visit Canada. Unless you're moose hunting...that's a very good reason to visit Canada.
I hear they have great bacon, eh?
Quote: MrVIt's pretty obvious that the OP, Dan Mahoney (!) made this nonsense up.
No mention of Bigfoot in the story. Bigfoot with a big shoe on. (not the bigfoot member, but the woodland one).
Everything could be true in the story, in the realm of physics anyway. It's not immediately obvious that it's madeup in that way.
Quote: petroglyphDo you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?Quote: DJTeddyBearHowever, if true, I accept the concept of doing the search right there at the scene. Escorting the accused to the back room can give him the time and opportunity to dump the dice along the way.
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
You misunderstood.
I didn't mean to imply that I there wasn't a violation of the person's rights, but that I accept it as a reason why security personnel (whom are generally over-zealous and clueless about the law) would have done the search as described.
Quote: superrickThe funny thing is nobody believes in bad dice, but everybody believes this story!
I think I'm pretty consistent in my non-belief of claims on this site. :)
ZCore13
Quote: DJTeddyBearQuote: petroglyphDo you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
You misunderstood.
I didn't mean to imply that I there wasn't a violation of the person's rights, but that I accept it as a reason why security personnel (whom are generally over-zealous and clueless about the law) would have done the search as described.
I think the whole story a fabrication. The casino could just permanently ban suspect from all property's.
I guess I will be taking my shoes off here pretty soon at McCarren intn'l, and whatever other indignity's they choose to bestow upon me? friggin bunch of gropers
I sure am. Excellent self-parody. Even including the reactions.Quote: MrVNobody's laughing.
None, except for the outrage of those who endeavor to prove that it is invalid.Quote: MrVWhat consequences for prevarication?
Really, who needs a liar on a gambling message board?
I suppose it could come under "trolling"or be a nukeable offense already.
I think that the moderators decided a long time ago to pass on being the judges of what might be "true" and what might not be. Imagine that applied to, say, the threads on global warming.Quote: MrVConsider adopting a rule banning lying. Really, who needs a liar on a gambling message board? I suppose it could come under "trolling"or be a nukeable offense already.
Such determinations are probably best left to the vagaries of the free market here. That seems to have worked more or less fairly effectively for the vast majority of problems.
IMO it's outrageous to allow someone to make such nonsense up, especially since we can narrow down who he was talking about. One person I suspect he might be talking about certainly would've commented on this by now, however he seems to be MIA.Quote: SanchoPanzaI think that the moderators decided a long time ago to pass on being the judges of what might be "true" and what might not be. Imagine that applied to, say, the threads on global warming.
Such determinations are probably best left to the vagaries of the free market here. That seems to have worked more or less fairly effectively for the vast majority of problems.
The OP seems to know various craps players.
Making up stories and lies is one thing, but leading us to believe you witnessed crime, one that can only can be attributed to a few people should be either proven retracted or deleted. If it's found to be faults then he should be suspended.
This is some serious stuff not some BS TR with over exaggerated high-roller content.
Quote: ThatDonGuyBut not necessarily in their own gift shop. In past trips, I noticed that Planet Hollywood, Rio, and Cosmopolitan did not sell their own dice ("I went to the gift shop and asked for dice, but it was no dice"), but the gift shop at Them - er, The M - did. Slots O Fun also sold dice from other casinos (MLife ones, I think).
The last time I was in Vegas over the Memorial Day weekend this year, the Cosmo had dice now in the shop called the Monogram. They didn't always have them you would see them across the street at the Walgreens along with several other casinos dice that had been punched or branded. The Monogram shop was selling them at double the cost of Walgreens.
Quote: MrVNobody's laughing.
Really? Someone give a definitive meaning of the below reference?
"unbalanced dice researcher."
Quote: rxwineReally? Someone give a definitive meaning of the below reference?
"unbalanced dice researcher."
Maybe it's a wording thing. Perhaps it should be stated as "Researcher investigating improperly balanced dice at casinos" Reading it as it is stated could imply the researcher is possibly crazy or has a problem with his center of gravity. In any case, how would you try to pick up a die with your foot? Even with a hole in the bottom of your shoe, I'm not so sure that is a good way to try and get one. If you aren't missing toes, there wouldn't be any space in the shoe for the die.
Quote: petroglyphQuote: RSQuote: petroglyphDo you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
There is no good reason to visit Canada. Unless you're moose hunting...that's a very good reason to visit Canada.
I hear they have great bacon, eh?
Great hockey and great donuts too.
And plenty of fresh water....
The heel. Some hiking shoes have very thick rubber. Still it seems very hokey.Quote: NYSithMaybe it's a wording thing. Perhaps it should be stated as "Researcher investigating improperly balanced dice at casinos" Reading it as it is stated could imply the researcher is possibly crazy or has a problem with his center of gravity. In any case, how would you try to pick up a die with your foot? Even with a hole in the bottom of your shoe, I'm not so sure that is a good way to try and get one. If you aren't missing toes, there wouldn't be any space in the shoe for the die.
Quote: thecesspitQuote: petroglyphQuote: RSQuote: petroglyphDo you think it is proper for the TSA to make senior citizens remove their diapers in front of everyone as well, because backrooming them might give them a chance to hide an explosive device?
Do you accept anal cavity searches of students on suspicion they may have contraband?
I have had the situation where our dates were forced to sit in a room without their shirts on [dressed on top in only bra's] for over an hour. We were guilty of absolutely nothing, except visiting Canada.
There is no good reason to visit Canada. Unless you're moose hunting...that's a very good reason to visit Canada.
I hear they have great bacon, eh?
Great hockey and great donuts too.
And plenty of fresh water....
And great fishing.
And Labatt Blue.
And money unfamiliar enough that it doesn't hurt to spend.
And a better National Anthem.
And The Metric System.
Pity about the guns.
Quote: rxwineReally? Someone give a definitive meaning of the below reference?
"unbalanced dice researcher."
the mental acuity of anyone who researches dice to determine if they are fair.
Oh, I forgot, they also have ginger ale and tonic water (Canada Dry). Canadian "bacon" isn't bacon....it's ham....hippies.....
I went to Canada, once. It was on accident, my family and I were in Montana and my dad took the wrong turn and somehow we either ended up in Canada or just south of the border. Either way......too close for comfort.
Oh yeah, and Carly Rae Jepsen. She came from Canada.
Not sure about their Canadian national anthem....just youtubed it....nah.
Syrup is disgusting.
But they probably have great fishing and hockey. But, that doesn't say much for their country. (If you're gonna try to brag....do it about something significant...ie: not hockey, syrup, or fishing.)
My condolences if you're from Canada. I wouldn't wish that upon anyone.
AND MONEY SHOULD NOT BE MULTIPLE DIFFERENT COLORS. It should be (primarily) ONE COLOR. Monopoly money has multiple colors.
Last time I had Canadian beer (huge mistake) it tasted like moose p*ss.
