OneAngryDwarf
OneAngryDwarf
Joined: Dec 17, 2009
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March 24th, 2011 at 8:38:56 AM permalink
So the other day I was playing blackjack at another casino in the Caribbean...in Belize, to be exact. The dealer did not take a hole card, which I, being American, am not really used to, but it's going OK so far. I get dealt a 16 against a dealer 10, and ask the dealer if I can surrender. She says yes and gives me half of my bet.

A few hands later I get a 15 against a 10. The players before me hit their hands, and then I ask to surrender mine. The dealer starts to give me half my bet...but the supervisor stops her. She tells me that if I want to surrender, I have to do it before the next card comes out of the shoe. On the first hand, the players before me both had 20, so it was OK. But since they hit their hands this time, I wasn't allowed and could only hit or stand.

This strikes me as completely ridiculous, for several reasons. For one, the order of the cards does not change regardless of when I decide to surrender. Furthermore, none of the dealers were giving any time between dealing the cards and asking the first player for their action, unless someone had a Blackjack--then they offer even money if they have a 10 showing. So from that point on I had to almost shout at the dealer to get his/her attention when I wanted to surrender, which felt silly and rude at the same time.

For those who are used to European-style blackjack...is this the commonly accepted rule? I sure hope not.
"I believe I've passed the age/of consciousness and righteous rage/I've found that just surviving was a noble fight... I once believed in causes too/I had my pointless point of view/And life went on no matter who was wrong or right..." --Billy Joel
teddys
teddys
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March 24th, 2011 at 9:17:56 AM permalink
That's completely wrong. You should have spoken to a higher supervisor. Belize is an English-speaking country, right?

So, if you had been sitting at first base, it would have been okay for you to surrender, but because you weren't, and other cards came out before your action, you aren't allowed to? That makes absolutely no sense.

And why the heck would you take even money on a blackjack when the dealer has a ten up? What a horrible bet. They shouldn't even offer that.

By the way, the correct strategy is to surrender 14s against a ten as well. So you're going to be surrendering a lot.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
WizardofEngland
WizardofEngland
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March 24th, 2011 at 9:27:55 AM permalink
We dont have a surrender rule here at all, at least I have never seen it used, and I have played a lot of blackjack
http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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March 24th, 2011 at 10:05:27 AM permalink
Verbal declarations are usually not allowed in BJ. So how are you supposed to use a hand signal to surrender if the dealer isn't looking at you?
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
dudestupid
dudestupid
Joined: Sep 11, 2010
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March 24th, 2011 at 11:25:08 AM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

Verbal declarations are usually not allowed in BJ. So how are you supposed to use a hand signal to surrender if the dealer isn't looking at you?



I think it's been discussed in this forum before. I think the general consensus was both hands in the air, or waving a white napkin. :-)

I have always just said "surrender please."
WizardofEngland
WizardofEngland
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March 24th, 2011 at 1:26:14 PM permalink
I am sure this is a pitboss who doesnt know the exact rule and panicked. Its a shame, as it makes him appear like a bit of a moron.
http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
Joined: Mar 8, 2011
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March 24th, 2011 at 1:30:35 PM permalink
Quote: DJTeddyBear

Verbal declarations are usually not allowed in BJ. So how are you supposed to use a hand signal to surrender if the dealer isn't looking at you?



They are not allowed because the eye in the sky can not see or tape a verbal declaration !
DJTeddyBear
DJTeddyBear
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March 24th, 2011 at 1:53:47 PM permalink
Quote: buzzpaff

They are not allowed because the eye in the sky can not see or tape a verbal declaration !

So are you saying that if you did the hand signal, but the dealer didn't see it, that it would be OK?
I invented a few casino games. Info: http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ 覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧 Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
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March 24th, 2011 at 2:27:03 PM permalink
Some casinos in Macau have this same ridiculous rule, where if you want to surrender you have to do it before the first player acts on his hand. Mathematically, it makes no difference.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
teddys
teddys
Joined: Nov 14, 2009
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March 24th, 2011 at 3:46:28 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

Mathematically, it makes no difference.

Negligible removal effect if you see a 10 or A come out before you surrender. But not enough to change the decision whether to surrender or not, unless you're counting.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4

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